No.10 Role

[didierforever 7,349]

But of course, one position in which both players are good is the only reason to why we're losing our games. Mata or Oscar is not our only problem.

goal keeper - same

defense - same

pivot midfield - same

striker - same (or as efficient as last year)

the main thing that has changed is the coach and the way he is playing oscar over mata. so while they might not be our ONLY problem, they are defintely one of the main problems.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

Has Mourinho been watching us last season? how idiotic can you be to put your best player in this club for the last 2 years on the bench? Oscar is nowhere close to Mata in terms of creativity/passing/finishing. Oscar has speed/work rate/stamina but the better player is Mata. Mata is a natural. he's not fast enough to play on the wings, he's no Di Maria/Bale. a no10 is a no10, and right now Mou is asking Mata to change his game? wtf is wrong with you Jose? Oscar should be playing deep in CM next to Ramires/Mikel. he's definitely leaving next year. the most idiotic thing Mou has ever done, that's what you get when you buy useless players like Schurrle/Willian. we have to see these amateurs fighting for a place vs our best player. laughable.

Both of those amateurs are making our team better and actually giving us wingers.

I'm sorry, but whether or not we had them Mata is in no way good enough to be a winger for us.

[Ainsley Harriott 2,732]

goal keeper - same

defense - same

pivot midfield - same

striker - same (or as efficient as last year)

the main thing that has changed is the coach and the way he is playing oscar over mata. so while they might not be our ONLY problem, they are defintely one of the main problems.

If Mata was in form I would understand your argument

[didierforever 7,349]

Both of those amateurs are making our team better and actually giving us wingers.

I'm sorry, but whether or not we had them Mata is in no way good enough to be a winger for us.

true. because when mata played on the wings for us, we just won the CL and FA cup, so he is definitely not good enough.

[didierforever 7,349]

If Mata was in form I would understand your argument

u dont get back form by playing some1 just for 2 games in 6 matches. moreover, in mata's case class triumphs forms. i mean lets take everton game for an example. we might not have scored in the 55 minutes but we created ample oppurtunities. we were in control of the ball and the game, but as soon as mata was taken off, everything went downhill.

and even though mata was the main culprit in conceding the winner to basel, i still feel we would not have been in that situation if he had started.

the point is - we play better with mata.

[Symbol123 175]

Mata's always played a free role during his time here. If he can't adjust to Mourinho's rigid system then there isn't a place for him at Chelsea. Simple as that

I'd love for him to prove me wrong though. Seems like such a genuine guy

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

true. because when mata played on the wings for us, we just won the CL and FA cup, so he is definitely not good enough.

That champions league where, if you didnt read the teamsheet, you wouldnt have known he was playing?

Come on let us be honest with ourselves here. Schurlle and Willian are hardly amateurs, and much better on the wing than him.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Depends what you want from your number 10.

I don't like Mourinho's quotes though. We'll see how the season pans but if he's being turned into a bit part player he should leave for his own sake. Mata isn't anywhere near as effective on the wings as he is as a number 10.

[didierforever 7,349]

That champions league where, if you didnt read the teamsheet, you wouldnt have known he was playing?

Come on let us be honest with ourselves here. Schurlle and Willian are hardly amateurs, and much better on the wing than him.

first things first, calling schurlle and willian as amatuers is a slap on their faces. and i dint do that. so dont include me in that part of the argument.

secondly, if u dint read the teamsheet then u would not have known any chelsea player was on the pitch except for DD and CECH. we played that way but we won.

thirdly, i dont see how schurlle and willian are better wingers than mata at this moment. none of them stick to the wing. keep cutting in and the end story that happens is that the midfield gets too crowd, defending becomes easier for the opposition team. and so far schurlle has not shown any moment of magic that would make him extraordinary. as for willian i hope he does create magic in the chances he gets. so if u dont provide natural width, and if u dont have that extra flair that hazard has, and if u simply keep getting central and make us narrow, then i dont see how they are better. sure, they do provide brilliant work-rates and are much better defensively but right now,with a striker force which has an ideal target of 5 goals this season, we need goals from the midfield. and mata provides us with those.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

first things first, calling schurlle and willian as amatuers is a slap on their faces. and i dint do that. so dont include me in that part of the argument.

secondly, if u dint read the teamsheet then u would not have known any chelsea player was on the pitch except for DD and CECH. we played that way but we won.

thirdly, i dont see how schurlle and willian are better wingers than mata at this moment. none of them stick to the wing. keep cutting in and the end story that happens is that the midfield gets too crowd, defending becomes easier for the opposition team. and so far schurlle has not shown any moment of magic that would make him extraordinary. as for willian i hope he does create magic in the chances he gets. so if u dont provide natural width, and if u dont have that extra flair that hazard has, and if u simply keep getting central and make us narrow, then i dont see how they are better. sure, they do provide brilliant work-rates and are much better defensively but right now,with a striker force which has an ideal target of 5 goals this season, we need goals from the midfield. and mata provides us with those.

They are better because they are faster and have a higher work rate. That is why they were bought. This is also why Oscar is getting chosen above Mata. The comment by Mourinho was clear in terms of "Specific tasks"

Mata will get plenty of minutes this season though. We are in a ton of competitions, and he should be the first name on the teamsheet for the capital one cup, and maybe even the FA cup when the schedule gets packed.

[Jcar92 66]

goal keeper - same

defense - same

pivot midfield - same

striker - same (or as efficient as last year)

the main thing that has changed is the coach and the way he is playing oscar over mata. so while they might not be our ONLY problem, they are defintely one of the main problems.

Dude, the players are the same... So what? I already saw teams that didnt change anything in the starter eleven and still had completely different ways of play. I'm sure that even you can remeber of situations like that, this without mention that our players are getting older and may not be in the same state of mind and physic like before. The national team of brazil is one example of this. The team that was with Felipão is not that different from what Mano Menezes tried... And everyone saw the difference.

Main problem? For me is most like trying to put both together. And even if this is a problem, i still believe that is not what is making we lose... Let alone be one of our main problems.

[didierforever 7,349]

They are better because they are faster and have a higher work rate. That is why they were bought. This is also why Oscar is getting chosen above Mata. The comment by Mourinho was clear in terms of "Specific tasks"

Mata will get plenty of minutes this season though. We are in a ton of competitions, and he should be the first name on the teamsheet for the capital one cup, and maybe even the FA cup when the schedule gets packed.

better workrates and faster does not make them BETTER. mata scores goals and makes oppurtunities for the goals. something which neither willian nor schurlle have been able to do. as for jose's statement, taking off willian whose workrate is awesome and put in mata who is kept out due to his defensive frivolities, when we are 1-0 up, i dont think mata should be the first one to be blamed. it was a poor substitution.

so if mata starts fa and carling cup games, then atleast we ll win some trophies this season. while we would be losing to a team like BASEL at STAMFORD FUCKING BRIDGE (kindly tell me when was our last home defeat in europe, about 3 -4 years ago against united) and be fighting to get into europe and playing catch up. good deal!!!

[Jcar92 66]

u dont get back form by playing some1 just for 2 games in 6 matches. moreover, in mata's case class triumphs forms. i mean lets take everton game for an example. we might not have scored in the 55 minutes but we created ample oppurtunities. we were in control of the ball and the game, but as soon as mata was taken off, everything went downhill.

and even though mata was the main culprit in conceding the winner to basel, i still feel we would not have been in that situation if he had started.

the point is - we play better with mata.

LOL, you say that Everton game alone is a example that we play better with him, with the argument that everything went down after his substitution... And then later want to say that Basel game is a example that we should start him????? And WTF? We would not be in that situatution? When he came on we were winning!

Anyway, i agree, i also think that Mata must be our playmaker and the man behind the striker(I would like to see Hazard, Mata, Willian and Lampard[Oscar DLP] changing position... but, meh, the coach is mourinho not me hahaha), Oscar is not ready to play there... for now(Because he is a DLP).

[didierforever 7,349]

Dude, the players are the same... So what? I already saw teams that didnt change anything in the starter eleven and still had completely different ways of play. I'm sure that even you can remeber of situations like that, this without mention that our players are getting older and may not be in the same state of mind and physic like before. The national team of brazil is one example of this. The team that was with Felipão is not that different from what Mano Menezes tried... And everyone saw the difference.

Main problem? For me is most like trying to put both together. And even if this is a problem, i still believe that is not what is making we lose... Let alone be one of our main problems.

the players are getting older and wiser, more experienced. hazard-22, oscar-21, mata-25, willian-25, schurlle-22, kdb-21, mikel-26, rambo-26 so on and so forth. i mean these players should be at the top of their physical prowess at this age otherwise there is something really wrong with our training and fitness staff.

we are playing a different way - accepted. but that is clearly not working. also we have been so hopelessly depended on mata for the last 2 years that we simply CAN NOT keep him on the bench and expect to play well. the style we played, the link-up play, the attack everythin was set up by juan. he was our heart and soul and you simply can not discard THAT. if u watched the last match, u could actually see how clueless our attack was. no one knew what their role was. for me oscar played too deep, hence their were times when lamps had to go ahead into the holes. but u could see it dint work and the same thing happened when we played against everton without mata too. hence the point is, should we simply continue to discard mata (because jose has already told that oscar will be his no.10) or include mata and then phase him out. for me the answer has to be the latter one.

and yes, it is one of our main problems. because the style of football we play with mata as no.10 is totally and completely different from what we play with oscar as no.10. it changes the total dynamics of the team.

[didierforever 7,349]

LOL, you say that Everton game alone is a example that we play better with him, with the argument that everything went down after his substitution... And then later want to say that Basel game is a example that we should start him????? And WTF? We would not be in that situatution? When he came on we were winning!

Anyway, i agree, i also think that Mata must be our playmaker and the man behind the striker(I would like to see Hazard, Mata, Willian and Lampard[Oscar DLP] changing position... but, meh, the coach is mourinho not me hahaha), Oscar is not ready to play there... for now(Because he is a DLP).

basel game was one of the most pathetic performances i have seen from chelsea. we had no penetration, we had no chance and the goal was one where the basel center-back simply switched off. we were lucky to be 1-0 up. salah could have put basel up twice in the first half itself. and hence i said we would not have been in that position. we would have been easily controlling the game like we always do with mata. that is what i meant to say.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

better workrates and faster does not make them BETTER. mata scores goals and makes oppurtunities for the goals. something which neither willian nor schurlle have been able to do. as for jose's statement, taking off willian whose workrate is awesome and put in mata who is kept out due to his defensive frivolities, when we are 1-0 up, i dont think mata should be the first one to be blamed. it was a poor substitution.

so if mata starts fa and carling cup games, then atleast we ll win some trophies this season. while we would be losing to a team like BASEL at STAMFORD FUCKING BRIDGE (kindly tell me when was our last home defeat in europe, about 3 -4 years ago against united) and be fighting to get into europe and playing catch up. good deal!!!

I have no doubt in my mind that Mata and Mourinho worked on that during the international break. What happened during the game should never happen, and hopefully it wont happen again.

Creating and scoring goals is nice and all, but what does it matter if you leave the team wide open? What does it matter if you do not defend as a team? It may be good enough for Rafa but it isnt good enough for the style he is trying to make. We might as well be down a man when he doesnt have the ball.

[didierforever 7,349]

I have no doubt in my mind that Mata and Mourinho worked on that during the international break. What happened during the game should never happen, and hopefully it wont happen again.

Creating and scoring goals is nice and all, but what does it matter if you leave the team wide open? What does it matter if you do not defend as a team? It may be good enough for Rafa but it isnt good enough for the style he is trying to make. We might as well be down a man when he doesnt have the ball.

we are CHELSEA not everton. a 0-0 draw for us against say fulham would be as bad as 2-3 defeat. we are expected to win every game we play and how do u expect that to happen when

a) we dont have a prolific goal-scorer. wait scratch that, we dont have a goal-scorer itself, forget prolific

we are not playing our best creative midfielder

c) our most lethal weapon (eden hazard) plays about 50 times better with mata than without him.

d) with not scoring goals, we are inviting pressure, which lead to stupid mistakes like cech trying to force the play at 45 minutes just to get a counter going.

e) oscar playing does not guarantee a clean sheet, he is not that good defensively, but it does screw us up big time in the creativity.

also where is this notion of the team being WIDE OPEN coming from. mata played in almost every game we played last year. i dont remember us conceding 3-4 goals in every game, did we? infact we kept a clean sheet against a team like united at OT while mata scored the winner.

so tell me how is playing mata not viable. as i said before, HE IS STILL OUR MAIN MAN.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,920]

we are CHELSEA not everton. a 0-0 draw for us against say fulham would be as bad as 2-3 defeat. we are expected to win every game we play and how do u expect that to happen when

a) we dont have a prolific goal-scorer. wait scratch that, we dont have a goal-scorer itself, forget prolific

we are not playing our best creative midfielder

c) our most lethal weapon (eden hazard) plays about 50 times better with mata than without him.

d) with not scoring goals, we are inviting pressure, which lead to stupid mistakes like cech trying to force the play at 45 minutes just to get a counter going.

e) oscar playing does not guarantee a clean sheet, he is not that good defensively, but it does screw us up big time in the creativity.

so tell me how is playing mata not viable. as i said before, HE IS STILL OUR MAIN MAN.

As a team we dont have a main man. We are very much a squad in transition. Plenty new players, and a new manager to boot. We are weeks, maybe even months, removed from actually having a main man.

a) Fair point. We'll see how Eto'o settles.

b ) He has not adapted yet.

c) Perhaps, but he has played well enough so far. Still attracts 3 players at any given moment.

d) This is true, and this needs to be fixed. We dont need him doing that.

e) Nothing guarantees a clean sheet, it makes it a lot more probable though. It also keeps circulation flowing from the back to the attack as he is always available.