Asier Illaramendi

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

The kid has a release clause of around 30 million i believe, but he could very well be worth almost every cent.

You have a young much more mobile Xabi Alonso type player.

Watching Busquets and Illaramendi in the spanish NT will be orgasmic.

DLP's are my favorite players, their tactical nous, their defensive ability, and their long balls are what id like to have been able to do if i were a professional footballer lol.

Pirlo,Sahin,Alonso, Illaramendi, etc.

[Toli 977]

  On 27/06/2013 at 23:15, The Madrid One said:

The kid has a release clause of around 30 million i believe, but he could very well be worth almost every cent.

You have a young much more mobile Xabi Alonso type player.

Watching Busquets and Illaramendi in the spanish NT will be orgasmic.

DLP's are my favorite players, their tactical nous, their defensive ability, and their long balls are what id like to have been able to do if i were a professional footballer lol.

Pirlo,Sahin,Alonso, Illaramendi, etc.

illaramendi is not really a DLP. and he isnt playing that for Real Sociedad neither. he is more a DM/B2B for Real Sociedad but not a DLP....also he is definelty no long-range passer. so comparisons between xabi and him are non-existable. he is a good player though, but no "next xabi"- because he plays different than him.

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

WRONG.

Look I've seen that you really have problems with defining Player Roles.

You have even come to call Modric a DM lol.

You have to get your facts straight.

Illaramendi first of all is not a DM. He doesn't have the complete traits or abilities a (DM!) Has so please do not call him this.

A DM is a Makalele, Lassana Diarra, De Rossi, THESE ARE DM'S.

He is not a B2B either, just because you see him progress forwards along the pitch sometimes doesnt mean hes a B2B.

He has NOTHING of a B2B, specially not the mobility.

A B2B is Yaya Toure, Khedira(he doesnt either but this is what he is, a jack of all trades master of none, and he should not be playing for a Top Club as a starter, this guys is irrelevant), Paulinho.

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/87094

http://www.whoscored.com/Players/4961

(edit) ( Also who scored can sometimes be a bit simplistic about their terms when looking at the positioning map, if it refers to Alonso as a defensive midfielder it does so because he has defensive capabilities, it also adds that he is a centre midfielder, who scored its a good website but it doesnt coin the correct terms, they dont make the contextual errors that you do though. )

Please compare every bit of statistic.

He is a CDM with DLP Capabilities such as Alonso.

Time and Time you have tried to argument with me about many things like about Di Maria, Khedira, Isco, Modric, and Now Illarramendi

I appreciate the wanting to discuss, but you are horribly wrong each and every time, and never bother to reply with any valid or resourceful arguments.

So get your facts straight before you try to argument with me as you never start correctly, and make tremendous mistakes.

Learn your player roles too.

Modric a DM?

Illarramendi a DM/B2B?

Illarramendi not a long range passer?

Dear lord now.

Ill even give you some videos so that you educate your self about the individual capabilities he posseses.

I suggest you never try to argument with me or anyone about tactics as you could confuse others that just want to read others opinions. I have no idea what it is you watch when trying to talk about players.

Calling Modric a DM is like saying Ferrari makes jet fighters. Its horribly wrong lol. i cant take you seriously if you make arguments the way you do, and i say this because you try to reply against what i say, and its laughably wrong each and every time.

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

Also, about DLP's.

Here's a masterful description about what a DLP is.

Illarramendi certainly has the CDM and DLP capabilities. (When thinking about CDM's thing about players like Gonalons and the Bender Twins, or CM's with defensive capabilities. CDM's are basically defensive midfielders with good passing capabilities that help link him to the middle of the spectrum between a DM and A CM, while there are also other CDM's like Alonso, Gundogan (yes indeed), and Illarramendi, who are the same but with more playmaking and game controlling mechanics along with defensive abilities.)

(Some players prefer to set up an attack from a withdrawn position, and are often coined deep-lying playmakers, mainly because of their ability to spread play and dictate the game from a withdrawn position. Despite their deep role, they are not classed as defensive midfielders as tackling and defence are not the main function of their roles, and they may have to be supported by a holding midfielder.

Deep-lying playmakers are typically given a moderate amount of defensive responsibilities, but are granted freedom positionally to dictate the play as it evolves, as well as a license to attempt long, riskier passes to the forwards. Examples of these kinds of players include Andrea Pirlo, Bastian Schweinsteiger, Paul Scholes, and Xabi Alonso.

The essential attributes of a deep-lying playmaker include:

• Good long passing ability, to play balls towards forwards and wingers. Crossfield wangers are typically attempted from deep when the opposing full back is drawn towards the middle and there is an open channel in the flank for the on rushing winger.
• Short passing ability. Although many deep-lying playmakers have natural talent and creativity, they are expected to play short simple passes when deep in their half to avoid the possibility of a counter-attack. They are however given some degree of freedom in playing long passes deep into opposition territory.
• Creativity/Vision. The deep-lying playmaker needs to spot openings and opportunities to build up play.
• A good and sure first touch to control the ball when receiving passes under sustained opposition pressure.

In Italy, the Deep-lying playmaker is commonly referred to as the regista.

Also, this excerpt talks about Mr Bastian Schweinsteiger...this man is a complete package, B2B,CDM,CM,DLP. All qualify the man. But hes not strictly a CDM/DLP like Sahin, Alonso, Pirlo, which are my favorite styles.

[Toli 977]

"

I appreciate the wanting to discuss, but you are horribly wrong each and every time, and never bother to reply with any valid or resourceful arguments."

so because you are saying Di Maria is shit (which he obviously isnt) my argumetns are "invalid"? go and watch the first 2 seasons about Di Maria

And no Khedira isnt SHIT either. but I assume, Joachim Löw and Jose Mourinho are idiots comparing to yourself, you tactical genius, arent they?!

And no, Illara IS NOT a long-range passer. he neither plays it for Spain and not even for Real Sociedad. how many games do you have watched from Illara? all the games from the U-21 and thats it I assume. he is more a DM with strong technique and ability to go forward- but he is NO DLP as Schweinsteiger, Pirlo, Xabi, Modric and who else you want to call. if you cant get this, go back playing Fifa or whatever you got your opinions from

and he HASNT GOT the capabilties of Alonso. THEY ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PLAYERS. But you know: he is a basque, playing for the same club in a similiar position as Alonso = next Xabi Alonso. only because the media is assuming something, it isnt always right. as if robinho is the next pele or neymar or others. they tend to overhype players really fast so calm down, wathc some games and then come back discussing about things, you obviously dont have a clue about. beside the fact, that sociedad are playing a more direct, short-passing style without a lot of long balls. but Illara is definetly not a DLP with long-range passes over 40, 50 metres, like Alonso can do them.

with DM as Modric I meant playing behind the AMF..i didnt mean playing him as a destroyer like Lass or Gravesen or these type of players. it was just the position on the pitch I meant, NOT HIS ROLE. I know that he is not A DESTROYER but a creative player, or mostly a DLP.

i am from Germany so DM here means something different than in England sometimes. its the problem with the clear position-naming..but of course I know that Luka is not a destroyer. in english you just have a lot of position names...regista, DM, holding midfielder, anchor midfielder etc etc.

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

What happened to Romeu?

No need for a young, up and coming DM when we have Romeu. What we need is someone like De Rossi, older and in their prime.

[yuvala 2,167]

  On 28/06/2013 at 12:05, KonohasOrangeFlash said:

What happened to Romeu?

No need for a young, up and coming DM when we have Romeu. What we need is someone like De Rossi, older and in their prime.

Honestly, I really don't rate Romeu that high... haven't seen too much brilliance from him.

We really do need someone like De Rossi though..

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

  On 28/06/2013 at 11:19, Toli said:

"

I appreciate the wanting to discuss, but you are horribly wrong each and every time, and never bother to reply with any valid or resourceful arguments."

so because you are saying Di Maria is shit (which he obviously isnt) my argumetns are "invalid"? go and watch the first 2 seasons about Di Maria

And no Khedira isnt SHIT either. but I assume, Joachim Löw and Jose Mourinho are idiots comparing to yourself, you tactical genius, arent they?!

And no, Illara IS NOT a long-range passer. he neither plays it for Spain and not even for Real Sociedad. how many games do you have watched from Illara? all the games from the U-21 and thats it I assume. he is more a DM with strong technique and ability to go forward- but he is NO DLP as Schweinsteiger, Pirlo, Xabi, Modric and who else you want to call. if you cant get this, go back playing Fifa or whatever you got your opinions from

and he HASNT GOT the capabilties of Alonso. THEY ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PLAYERS. But you know: he is a basque, playing for the same club in a similiar position as Alonso = next Xabi Alonso. only because the media is assuming something, it isnt always right. as if robinho is the next pele or neymar or others. they tend to overhype players really fast so calm down, wathc some games and then come back discussing about things, you obviously dont have a clue about. beside the fact, that sociedad are playing a more direct, short-passing style without a lot of long balls. but Illara is definetly not a DLP with long-range passes over 40, 50 metres, like Alonso can do them.

with DM as Modric I meant playing behind the AMF..i didnt mean playing him as a destroyer like Lass or Gravesen or these type of players. it was just the position on the pitch I meant, NOT HIS ROLE. I know that he is not A DESTROYER but a creative player, or mostly a DLP.

i am from Germany so DM here means something different than in England sometimes. its the problem with the clear position-naming..but of course I know that Luka is not a destroyer. in english you just have a lot of position names...regista, DM, holding midfielder, anchor midfielder etc etc.

No your arguments are invalid because you arent resourceful with your arguments as well.

Khedira and Di Maria are horse piss and you have never been able to set up an argument against it other than saying...

"what how can you say that!"

Please....

COMPLETELY DIFFERENT PLAYERS!?? Dear Lord....llarramendi is a CDM with DLP capabilities its clear even on the spanish videos, again your comments are irrelevant when they are wrong like this.

Oh and just becuase a system have a player playing a certain way doesnt mean he doesnt have other capabilities.

Please come back to me when you learn your terms and learn how to classify players.

Saying Illarramendi isnt a cdm and doesnt have dlp capabilities is kinda sad really.

(Also learn how to read ahaha, i said hes an alonso type player but only more mobile because thats what he is, read up on your terms, you envision DLP's as only spraying balls all over the place and thats a very narrow minded understanding of the term.) Not only are you confused and uneducated, but also narrow minded!!!!

My stats and the number of long balls per game also prove me right..ahahah take a walk toli. And watch the videos that make you look like a fraud.

[Toli 977]

"

Khedira and Di Maria are horse piss and you have never been able to set up an argument against it other than saying..."

> nuff said. go play fifa and think illaramendi is the next xabi alonso..have fun with it .

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

You failed to reply to me in a coherent or relevant way again.

I have explained my self time and time again, so you have no logical argument.

Illarramendi is a CDM with DLP capabilities, start watching games and analyzing players and learn your roles.(Read up on DLP's as i doubt you should be giving opinions if you are as uneducated as you show )

Khedira is an immobile piece of shit with no real relevant capabilities in any way. Never capable of helping win a midfield battle against relevant opposition and it showed now for 3 years.

Di Maria is much of the same as showed against real opposition. Doesn't know how and when to pass the ball efficiently, hence a 70 percent passing rate compared to Robben who many compare him to, with an 84 percentile.

No coincidence that no one wants Di Maria in Madrid, he has one foot out the door, and khedira wont start unless ancelotti has a tumor in his brain hence the look for a DM, and the quire reliable reports that Kondogbia will be Real Madrid property soon.

As far as im concerned you are an uninformed poser as your arguments have no substance, your terms are wrong, and you run away to easily, this being the only time you have really replied to me, and thats because i called you out.

Illarramendi is a CDM,with DLP capabilities(you can even see it on the videos i posted, and explanation, LOL). Do your research, novice.

[The Skipper 20,593]

How can he argue with you when you say each and everyone of his arguments are invalid?

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

He can't and thats because they are invalid.

And i proved it by giving relevant information and statistics.

He's pulling incorrect assertions and ideas that are far from the mark.

The Kid has play making abilities and the defensive abilities to be classified as a CDM, and a DLP. He will be laughed at by anyone with a tactical Nous if he refers to him as a DM or B2B. :tophat:

Look at all my proof including the videos that i have posted.

Toli has gotten his terms wrong, and jumped to assertions without any reliable proof, while i have conclusively shown that hes wrong.

With all due respect are you not reading the entire argument? LOL.

I wont take him seriously if he tells me im wrong by (metaphorically) stating how ferrari makes the best army tanks and jet fighters in the world. And it's his inability to confront me with any tactical nous that makes him comment with comments such as the last one btw

One of his biggest errors is his understanding of terms, by DLP he thinks its being AS far as alonso and only spraying balls, but it is very different as shown by the definition of the term on the last page, and also the videos, OH and the STATS, the beautiful stats...

[Toli 977]

stats arent everything in football. you cant assess everything with stats. how can I discuss with you, when you are saying khedira and di maria are piss horse? players who are playing for germany and argentina AS STARTERS, when both team have loads of players, who could substitute them? well, clearly, you are more a tactical genius than löw, mourinho and co.

you have said illara plays similiar to alonso and i have said it is BS. go and ask any real sociedad fan and he will confirm it to you. he is playing different than xabi, and this completely. he is more mobile, more attacking-forward, but he isnt spraying 40 m long passes or gettnig the ball in front of the back 4 and organizing it...THATS NOT his playing style. So he is NOT A next Xabi Alonso. and neither he is a DLP like Modric. for spain U-20 he is playing very deep yes, because they have isco, thiago and all their attacking players...he is the deepst of the Midfielders, but he doesnt really sprays long balls, he mostly gives the ball to Thiago or anyone other and lets them organize the play. or, when koke gets more behind, he joins forward and moves more upfront. its hard to define his role. he is neither a clear DM, nor a clear B2B...he is more of a hybrid type player, who combines something of this roles in one and can fulfill different duties when asked. he is tactically very well educated, as you can see from his roles at Sociedad and Spain. so its hard for me define clearly a role for him, but me personally, I dont see him as a DLP at all.

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

I never said that stats are everything, dont use this as an argument implying, that i implied that, as i named it as one of several different factors that i brought in along with term definitions and videos of him playing.

Modric is no DLP because he doesnt have the defensive attributes to be marked as one. He's a CM/ACM.

Using logic such as "di maria" and "khedira" are starters is bad logic, and this simple answer of yours is what i reflect when i talk about tactical nous. You are not giving me an actual tactical opinion when in fact i have watched these players fail for years.

Just because Mourinho and Low do something, it doesnt justify its correctness. Low has never convinced me, and his inability to cope well with his resources is a good example. Same case with mourinho.

How Mourinho thought he could pose well enough systems with khedira and di maria in his team is beyond me.

I have loads of tactical analysis from others as well such as Michael Cox which do a good job at pointing how Madrid got gang banged in too many instances to count, in big part due to the overall deficiencies of khedira and di maria.

Perhaps my apparent harshness towards them is confusing you a little bit, but when i call them irrelevant, i mean that they are irrelevant when it comes to forming a good enough team of very composed and complete footballers like bayern munich for example. Along with the players them selves being below par and overrated.

In fact Low should be paying attention to Bayern and Dortmund

Bender Scweinsteiger

Kroos/Gotze

Managers could have their own reasons but the results and tactical reasoning of the results show they are mistakes.

Khedira is either too average or below average in everything. Thats putting it simply.

Di Maria is not smart enough, hes consistently bad, and has very bad passing, and is predictable.

The results, stats, and just looking at them prove me right.

Alonso is a CDM/DLP. So is Illarramendi. You are confused probably because of how you have seen him play in Sociedad but he is neither a B2B, or DM as you tried to say, he is a CDM, DLP.

Read the description i put there last page.

Its even on the videos. He has very good defensive mobility and awareness, and also playmaking abilities and long balls. The stats back up all of this along with his quite visible traits.

I think ive said enough at this point.

[Eggman 118]

  On 28/06/2013 at 00:14, The Madrid One said:

Also, about DLP's.

Here's a masterful description about what a DLP is.

Illarramendi certainly has the CDM and DLP capabilities. (When thinking about CDM's thing about players like Gonalons and the Bender Twins, or CM's with defensive capabilities. CDM's are basically defensive midfielders with good passing capabilities that help link him to the middle of the spectrum between a DM and A CM, while there are also other CDM's like Alonso, Gundogan (yes indeed), and Illarramendi, who are the same but with more playmaking and game controlling mechanics along with defensive abilities.)

(Some players prefer to set up an attack from a withdrawn position, and are often coined deep-lying playmakers, mainly because of their ability to spread play and dictate the game from a withdrawn position. Despite their deep role, they are not classed as defensive midfielders as tackling and defence are not the main function of their roles, and they may have to be supported by a holding midfielder.

Deep-lying playmakers are typically given a moderate amount of defensive responsibilities, but are granted freedom positionally to dictate the play as it evolves, as well as a license to attempt long, riskier passes to the forwards. Examples of these kinds of players include Andrea Pirlo, Bastian Schweinsteiger, Paul Scholes, and Xabi Alonso.

The essential attributes of a deep-lying playmaker include:

• Good long passing ability, to play balls towards forwards and wingers. Crossfield wangers are typically attempted from deep when the opposing full back is drawn towards the middle and there is an open channel in the flank for the on rushing winger.
• Short passing ability. Although many deep-lying playmakers have natural talent and creativity, they are expected to play short simple passes when deep in their half to avoid the possibility of a counter-attack. They are however given some degree of freedom in playing long passes deep into opposition territory.
• Creativity/Vision. The deep-lying playmaker needs to spot openings and opportunities to build up play.
• A good and sure first touch to control the ball when receiving passes under sustained opposition pressure.

In Italy, the Deep-lying playmaker is commonly referred to as the regista.

Also, this excerpt talks about Mr Bastian Schweinsteiger...this man is a complete package, B2B,CDM,CM,DLP. All qualify the man. But hes not strictly a CDM/DLP like Sahin, Alonso, Pirlo, which are my favorite styles.

When I read this about DLP, it really makes me think about De Bruyne, who has all these required skills, but isn't that apt defensively (but as you say it, that isn't really an issue). Hopefully he can develop into this role.

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

If anything De Bruyne has the traits to play as an ACM, i dont think anyone should use their time to develop him to play farther up the pitch, doesnt make much sense really.

ACM will be marked as x and would work like the following.

DM

CM X

CDM CDM

ACM

Etc...It would be like asking oscar to become a CDM, irrelevant and too late. De Bruyne should work on maximizing his potential in the area he is experienced in. going farther up the pitch is too much of a stretch imo.

[Beepu 1,714]

  On 28/06/2013 at 17:09, Zinedine Iniesco said:

You failed to reply to me in a coherent or relevant way again.

I have explained my self time and time again, so you have no logical argument.

Illarramendi is a CDM with DLP capabilities, start watching games and analyzing players and learn your roles.(Read up on DLP's as i doubt you should be giving opinions if you are as uneducated as you show )

Khedira is an immobile piece of shit with no real relevant capabilities in any way. Never capable of helping win a midfield battle against relevant opposition and it showed now for 3 years.

Di Maria is much of the same as showed against real opposition. Doesn't know how and when to pass the ball efficiently, hence a 70 percent passing rate compared to Robben who many compare him to, with an 84 percentile.

No coincidence that no one wants Di Maria in Madrid, he has one foot out the door, and khedira wont start unless ancelotti has a tumor in his brain hence the look for a DM, and the quire reliable reports that Kondogbia will be Real Madrid property soon.

As far as im concerned you are an uninformed poser as your arguments have no substance, your terms are wrong, and you run away to easily, this being the only time you have really replied to me, and thats because i called you out.

Illarramendi is a CDM,with DLP capabilities(you can even see it on the videos i posted, and explanation, LOL). Do your research, novice.

This is the problem with the arguments you make, you do it not for the sake of discussion but to 'win' and look down on people who disagrees with you. Everything you dont agree with is 'invalid' and that poster is uneducated. I kinda felt bad for you when you got bashed quite hard by people like konohas previously, but now that ive read more of your posts I can start to see why.

Hey we all welcome arguments and discussions, but not if you just look down on people and close your ears and go 'nanana im right youre wrong!'

[Zinedine Iniesco 172]

  On 29/06/2013 at 00:32, Korea Beepu said:

This is the problem with the arguments you make, you do it not for the sake of discussion but to 'win' and look down on people who disagrees with you. Everything you dont agree with is 'invalid' and that poster is uneducated. I kinda felt bad for you when you got bashed quite hard by people like konohas previously, but now that ive read more of your posts I can start to see why.

Hey we all welcome arguments and discussions, but not if you just look down on people and close your ears and go 'nanana im right youre wrong!'

Wrong, im just not going to be told im wrong with non existant arguments as back up.