Should we put our faith in the youth?

[Peace. 4,352]

On the other side people are nuts to think Lukaku and Ba alone would be good enough for next season. We definitely need to buy a proven striker.

Word up.

We won't get anywhere with Lukaku and Ba as our striking force. That's not good enough for a team which want to compete in the Premier League and Champions League. And please, don't come and tell me that we should undergo a season of transition and lower our aims. We should put aside that fairy tail, it won't happen. Roman won't change his mind regarding that matter overnight.

Ba was brought in as a stop gap. That means what it means. He is good, but not good enough to carry a team of the "top four". Furthermore it seems that he cannot play more than once per week — that means he will be available for roughly 50% of the season. Asking Lukaku to handle the 50% remaining is just too much.

A great club has to have a great striking department to win. If take a look to the previous Champions League winners, all of them had a striker who was very important in their victory, and/or had a great striking force : Chelsea (Drogba) ; Barcelona (Messi) ; Inter (Milito) ; Barcelona (Eto'o) ; ManU (Rooney/Tevez/Ronaldo). That's the same with league winners : ManCity (Aguero, Tevez, Dzeko, Balotelli) ; ManU (Rooney, Own Goal (such a shame he couln't keep it up)) ; Chelsea (Drogba, Anelka) ; ManU (Ronaldo, Roney, Tevez) ; etc... Madrid (Ronaldo, Benzema, Higuain) ; Barça (Messi... Eto'o), etc, etc, etc... I am not saying that we should win the CL or PL, but I am just stressing the importance of a great striking force. That's something we have lacked since the second season with Ancelotti (at the exception of the CL, where Didier was sublime).

That's why I think that we should buy a proven striker, someone of the caliber of Cavani.

[zolayes 14,489]

Word up.

We won't get anywhere with Lukaku and Ba as our striking force. That's not good enough for a team which want to compete in the Premier League and Champions League. And please, don't come and tell me that we should undergo a season of transition and lower our aims. We should put aside that fairy tail, it won't happen. Roman won't change his mind regarding that matter overnight.

Ba was brought in as a stop gap. That means what it means. He is good, but not good enough to carry a team of the "top four". Furthermore it seems that he cannot play more than once per week — that means he will be available for roughly 50% of the season. Asking Lukaku to handle the 50% remaining is just too much.

A great club has to have a great striking department to win. If take a look to the previous Champions League winners, all of them had a striker who was very important in their victory, and/or had a great striking force : Chelsea (Drogba) ; Barcelona (Messi) ; Inter (Milito) ; Barcelona (Eto'o) ; ManU (Rooney/Tevez/Ronaldo). That's the same with league winners : ManCity (Aguero, Tevez, Dzeko, Balotelli) ; ManU (Rooney, Own Goal (such a shame he couln't keep it up)) ; Chelsea (Drogba, Anelka) ; ManU (Ronaldo, Roney, Tevez) ; etc... Madrid (Ronaldo, Benzema, Higuain) ; Barça (Messi... Eto'o), etc, etc, etc... I am not saying that we should win the CL or PL, but I am just stressing the importance of a great striking force. That's something we have lacked since the second season with Ancelotti (at the exception of the CL, where Didier was sublime).

That's why I think that we should buy a proven striker, someone of the caliber of Cavani.

agree we have had 3 transition years how many more are we going to have .,,Ba is merely a stop gap ,,a top striker is needed

[The only place to be 11,313]

Word up.

We won't get anywhere with Lukaku and Ba as our striking force. That's not good enough for a team which want to compete in the Premier League and Champions League. And please, don't come and tell me that we should undergo a season of transition and lower our aims. We should put aside that fairy tail, it won't happen. Roman won't change his mind regarding that matter overnight.

Ba was brought in as a stop gap. That means what it means. He is good, but not good enough to carry a team of the "top four". Furthermore it seems that he cannot play more than once per week — that means he will be available for roughly 50% of the season. Asking Lukaku to handle the 50% remaining is just too much.

A great club has to have a great striking department to win. If take a look to the previous Champions League winners, all of them had a striker who was very important in their victory, and/or had a great striking force : Chelsea (Drogba) ; Barcelona (Messi) ; Inter (Milito) ; Barcelona (Eto'o) ; ManU (Rooney/Tevez/Ronaldo). That's the same with league winners : ManCity (Aguero, Tevez, Dzeko, Balotelli) ; ManU (Rooney, Own Goal (such a shame he couln't keep it up)) ; Chelsea (Drogba, Anelka) ; ManU (Ronaldo, Roney, Tevez) ; etc... Madrid (Ronaldo, Benzema, Higuain) ; Barça (Messi... Eto'o), etc, etc, etc... I am not saying that we should win the CL or PL, but I am just stressing the importance of a great striking force. That's something we have lacked since the second season with Ancelotti (at the exception of the CL, where Didier was sublime).

That's why I think that we should buy a proven striker, someone of the caliber of Cavani.

How many Premier League goals has Cavani scored?

Ba is a stop gap who has scored 15 league goals this season. Lukaku has scored 12. The truth is you don't know how good this kid could be, but right now he's surpassing everyone's expectations and we have other areas we need to fill. But you may have a point that Roman won't be willing to change his ways. Yay.

There was this other successful team by the way - Chelsea 2005. Drogba scored 16 goals that season but he was a facilitator - he brought other players into the game because we had goals from the likes of Lamps and Duff. We could have that next season with Mata, Hazard and Oscar getting goals elsewhere whilst Lukaku creates space and chances for them.

It's very easy to say we should spend £50 million on a striker like Cavani because he's proven but he's still a risk. We did that before when we signed someone called Fernando Torres and Lukaku has done everything asked of him.

People willing to write him off using jaundiced logic when they won't apply it to their own suggestions really does piss me off.

[The only place to be 11,313]

agree we have had 3 transition years how many more are we going to have .,,Ba is merely a stop gap ,,a top striker is needed

So signing an expensive striker is going to be the solution? Lukaku did cost £18 million by the way. We've seen what happened with Torres - the price tage guarantees him TWO FUCKING YEARS in the starting line-up whilst we sell promising youngsters.

Discussions like this add validity to your signature.

[Rmpr 8,977]

Ba is only 27 or 28, thats someone in their prime, not an old player. The injury prone thing is also overstated, he hasn't had a lengthy injury in the PL yet. There was a stat flying about that he hadn't missed a game in like 6 years due to injury before he signed for us.

LOOOL, I honestly thought he was 29 and was turning 30 soon. WOOOOW, way out of line!

Thanks and I agree!

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

I will write something longer next time. But few things:

People information on this forum on Kakuta and PVA are still behind. Both players have played really well this season, and Kakuta attitude has significantly improved. Piet De Visser on numerous occasions has praised them for their development this season at Vitesse.

On Lukaku- I definitely agree we need to buy a superb and proven striker in the summer, but that doesn't mean that Lukaku should go on loan. If there is something to take away from United and City success over the years is the abundance of strikers they have at the club. People on numerous occasion here have said "City and United got lucky again with a late winner/equalizer." Its not luck that on numerous occasion one of Chicharito, Welback, Rooney, or RVP steps up. Lets not forget United is a flawed team in midfield and defense(less so now that Vidic is back), they would not be first if it was not for their strikers. Same thing with Shitty.

The decision to keep Lukaku is a easy one, because without a doubt he would make us a better team. I like the prospect of him coming in the 70-80 minute when we need a goal. His speed and strength is no doubt going to be an asset.

On the other side people are nuts to think Lukaku and Ba alone would be good enough for next season. We definitely need to buy a proven striker.

Feruz? lol he needs to go on loan, forget about him getting minutes at Chelsea, he would not even get a loan spell at any PL team let alone get playing time at Chelsea.

Ake? A loan spell he definitely needs, after that lets reevaluate.

I will write something later on my philosophy how to integrate youths another time.

The problem is that you can't integrate three strikers into a one-striker system. ManU and City play with 2 or even three strikers at a tim. 4 strikers for 2 spots is very different than 3 strikers for 1 spot. Let's say we play 60 games next year and we buy a Cavani or a Falcao or some other proven striker. They would rightly expect to start 40-45 matches. That gives 15-20 starts for Lukaku and Ba combined, mostly in domestic cups which is simply not enough to develop Lukaku or to keep either him or Ba happy. Ba can play on the wing, but we have Hazard, Mata, Oscar, De Bruyne, and Moses for attacking midfielder so any time he sees there would take away from their game-time.

[OneMoSalah 8,887]

LOOOL, I honestly though he was 29 and was turning 30 soon. WOOOOW, way out of line!

Thanks and I agree!

He does look a bit older haha

[The only place to be 11,313]

That's the same with league winners : ManCity (Aguero, Tevez, Dzeko, Balotelli) ; ManU (Rooney, Own Goal (such a shame he couln't keep it up)) ; Chelsea (Drogba, Anelka) ;

Lukaku has scored 13 league goals this season.

When we won the League in 2005, Drogba scored 10 league goals.

When we won the League in 2006, Drogba scored 12 league goals.

Now he did score 29 in 2010, but that was only the second time in 8 seasons at this club that he got more than the 13 league goals Lukaku has already scored this season.

And let's also remember Demba Ba has scored 15 or more goals in both of his last two seasons in the Premier League which isn't bad for a stop-gap.

[Santiago. 1,500]

I've said this before, but if we kept Sturridge we would've been better off - Ba, Lukaku and Sturridge next season would've been a great strikeforce IMO.

No, that is not just an opinion. That is the most objective statement here

[Muzchap 8,966]

We need to do it!

The Board + Roman need to grow some balls and play these lads.

I would start with:

Courtious

Chalobah (DM replace Mikel)

KdB - try him as DLP - he's got a great range of passing

Piazon - definitely impact Sub

Lukaku - bring him home now! He should be starting every game...

And fuck this 4-2-3-1 formation - with those players we could easily do 4-4-2 or 4-4-3 !!!

Fucking sick of 4-2-3-1

Josh - not ready, unlikely will ever be

Marin - needs more games a consistent run FFS - he's ending up like Sturridge, wasted on the bench...

The rest no idea - need to gen up on them

[Peace. 4,352]

Lukaku has scored 13 league goals this season.

When we won the League in 2005, Drogba scored 10 league goals.

When we won the League in 2006, Drogba scored 12 league goals.

Now he did score 29 in 2010, but that was only the second time in 8 seasons at this club that he got more than the 13 league goals Lukaku has already scored this season.

And let's also remember Demba Ba has scored 15 or more goals in both of his last two seasons in the Premier League which isn't bad for a stop-gap.

You didn't understand what I was saying (or I might have badly explained it).

What I was saying :

Manchester United 2012-13 : Van Persie (19), Rooney (11)

Manchester City 2011-12 : Aguero (23), Dzeko (14), Balotelli (13)

Manchester United 2010-11 : Berbatov (21), Own Goal (I don't remember the figure), Rooney (11), Hernandez (13)

Chelsea 2009-10 : Drogba (29), Anelka (11)

Manchester United 2008-09 : Rooney (12), Ronaldo (18), Tevez (5)

Manchester United 2007-08 : Ronaldo (31), Tevez (14), Rooney (13)

...

I was not talking about Chelsea when we had Mourinho. I was just looking at the five previous seasons (plus this one) to work out what was the current tendency in football. And from the stats, and my opinion, I can say that the striking force of the club which have recently won the Premier League has taken an important role in those victories — and this both regarding the goals scored and the work done (and I stress that I don't base my judgment solely on the goal record).

The same goes for the Liga. Though I don't really know for the Bundesliga and the Calcio.

And that is exactly the same for the Champions League. When Milan won in 2007, Kakà (who was played as a striker/Second striker), was instrumental in their victory (especially against United). And Super Pipo scored the two goals in the final. In 2008, the striking force Ronaldo/Tevez/Rooney was instrumental. In 2009, Eto'o was instrumental (in the CL and the league as well — he scored about 1/3 of Barcelona first goals). In 2010, Milito was instrumental (scored the two goals in the final). 2011, Messi was instrumental. 2012, Drogba was instrumental.

I am just saying that, to my understanding, the majority of the successful teams of the recent years had a powerful striking force. To my mind, a great striking force is required to be succesfull.

That's why I believe we shouldn't understimate the importance of the striking force. That's why I believe that it's presumptuous and unwise to give the key of our attack to "only" a kid — yes, ready or not, he is still a "kid" — and a stop-gap — yes, Ba is a stop-gap, but don't jump on me, I will explain latter why in my mind he is so, please.

Look, did you see what happens to Barça when Messi — for X ou Y reason — is not playing good ? The catalans struggle to score, they lack penetration, and they also have hard times to creat any goal-scoring chance. How many times this season Manchester United were saved by RvP ? How comes last year Arsenal managed to get the third spot ? The dutchman carried them there. How comes that ever sonce the summer 2010, we are in shambles ? Our striking force is average ! They aren't there to get in goals when it matters. They aren't there to cause havocs in defences, etc...

My point here, is that without a very good (not good, but very good) striking force, you will find it hard to lift some important trophies at the end of the season.

[zolayes 14,489]

So signing an expensive striker is going to be the solution? Lukaku did cost £18 million by the way. We've seen what happened with Torres - the price tage guarantees him TWO FUCKING YEARS in the starting line-up whilst we sell promising youngsters.

Discussions like this add validity to your signature.

you just argue for the sake of arguing ..really you are little more than a troll

[The Skipper 20,609]

No, that is not just an opinion. That is the most objective statement here

Hence why I said, "IMO".

[English Freak 456]

The problem is that you can't integrate three strikers into a one-striker system. ManU and City play with 2 or even three strikers at a time. 4 strikers for 2 spots is very different than 3 strikers for 1 spot. Let's say we play 60 games next year and we buy a Cavani or a Falcao or some other proven striker. They would rightly expect to start 40-45 matches. That gives 15-20 starts for Lukaku and Ba combined, mostly in domestic cups which is simply not enough to develop Lukaku or to keep either him or Ba happy. Ba can play on the wing, but we have Hazard, Mata, Oscar, De Bruyne, and Moses for attacking midfielder so any time he sees there would take away from their game-time.

Exactly.

City have strikers that can play multiple positions (eg. Aguero, Tevez)

United have strikers that can play multiple positions (eg. Rooney, Welbeck, RvP)

At Chelsea, we don't have that...Fernando is just past it...and Ba is only effective through the middle.

We need that Anelka type of player..someone that can play CF/SS as well as slot him on the wings when required...

[Blue Armour 4,459]

You didn't understand what I was saying (or I might have badly explained it).

What I was saying :

Manchester United 2012-13 : Van Persie (19), Rooney (11)

Manchester City 2011-12 : Aguero (23), Dzeko (14), Balotelli (13)

Manchester United 2010-11 : Berbatov (21), Own Goal (I don't remember the figure), Rooney (11), Hernandez (13)

Chelsea 2009-10 : Drogba (29), Anelka (11)

Manchester United 2008-09 : Rooney (12), Ronaldo (18), Tevez (5)

Manchester United 2007-08 : Ronaldo (31), Tevez (14), Rooney (13)

...

I was not talking about Chelsea when we had Mourinho. I was just looking at the five previous seasons (plus this one) to work out what was the current tendency in football. And from the stats, and my opinion, I can say that the striking force of the club which have recently won the Premier League has taken an important role in those victories — and this both regarding the goals scored and the work done (and I stress that I don't base my judgment solely on the goal record).

The same goes for the Liga. Though I don't really know for the Bundesliga and the Calcio.

And that is exactly the same for the Champions League. When Milan won in 2007, Kakà (who was played as a striker/Second striker), was instrumental in their victory (especially against United). And Super Pipo scored the two goals in the final. In 2008, the striking force Ronaldo/Tevez/Rooney was instrumental. In 2009, Eto'o was instrumental (in the CL and the league as well — he scored about 1/3 of Barcelona first goals). In 2010, Milito was instrumental (scored the two goals in the final). 2011, Messi was instrumental. 2012, Drogba was instrumental.

I am just saying that, to my understanding, the majority of the successful teams of the recent years had a powerful striking force. To my mind, a great striking force is required to be succesfull.

That's why I believe we shouldn't understimate the importance of the striking force. That's why I believe that it's presumptuous and unwise to give the key of our attack to "only" a kid — yes, ready or not, he is still a "kid" — and a stop-gap — yes, Ba is a stop-gap, but don't jump on me, I will explain latter why in my mind he is so, please.

Look, did you see what happens to Barça when Messi — for X ou Y reason — is not playing good ? The catalans struggle to score, they lack penetration, and they also have hard times to creat any goal-scoring chance. How many times this season Manchester United were saved by RvP ? How comes last year Arsenal managed to get the third spot ? The dutchman carried them there. How comes that ever sonce the summer 2010, we are in shambles ? Our striking force is average ! They aren't there to get in goals when it matters. They aren't there to cause havocs in defences, etc...

My point here, is that without a very good (not good, but very good) striking force, you will find it hard to lift some important trophies at the end of the season.

Absolutely agree...a good strikeforce is absolutely vital for any trophy-winning team.

Its not like the days of Mourinho when we had a watertight defense and we could sit back for most of the game. These days teams play more open football and in-form strikers are top priority.

[Santiago. 1,500]

Hence why I said, "IMO".

Hence me saying that your opinion is actually factual?

I'm agreeing with you if couldn't comprehend what I was saying

[Peace. 4,352]

It's very easy to say we should spend £50 million on a striker like Cavani because he's proven but he's still a risk. We did that before when we signed someone called Fernando Torres and Lukaku has done everything asked of him.

The price has never been the problem with our two Flops. The problem is that it was two stupid transferts. For them two, it was written all over the place that it would fail. That's all.

Andriy Chevtchenko was already 30 years-old when he came here. He was already on the bad side of his career peak. Furthemore, he seemed more concerned with his golf career than with football ("As the first team prepared for their final pre-season friendly against Danish side Brondby, Shevchenko declared himself unfit with a back problem. [...] but Mourinho was bemused to discover that Shevchenko's bad back had not prevented him from enjoying a round of golf at Sunningdale that day.'). And finally Mourinho didn't want him.

Roman Abramovich merely brought in at his club a friend of his. Considering all these facts, even before the deal being done there was a high probability that this story would be a failure.

And don't get me started with the ladyboy. Had he not been playing for Loserpool (the medias' darling) and had he not had this "kid" face, we wouldn't even have considered to buy him, in the first place. Seriously, that poor excuse of a footballer was overrated. What the hell passed through Ancelotti's mind... That dude was a two-seasons-wonder. It was well knew that he had problems with his knees and that the skinny one ran him down to the ground. He was average for the last 12 months (and poor for the last 6 months) before we bought him. He had a shoking WC. It was more a panic buy than anything else, if you ask me.

This two deals were ill advised.

No, I tell you my friend. Stamford Bridge isn't built on an old indian graveyard. There's no curse saying that any players bought for more than £XX will become the laughing stock of the League.

Chevtchenko cost us £30m. Hazard cost us £32m. I know that with money inflation, £30m back then is more than £32m now. But still, Hazard is a big-money signing. Does he look lie a failure at this point ? Not at all. Essien was bought for £24,4m. At that time, it was our record. The ukrainian was bought one year later for "only" £6 millions more. Did Essien flopped ? He was a success.

The problem is not how much money is spent. It's for what it's spent. Our two flops were two luxury and fantasy buys. They were two pieces of meat, which were past their sell-by date, on which the seller put golden tag so the moldy couldn't be seen.

[The Skipper 20,609]

Hence me saying that your opinion is actually factual?

I'm agreeing with you if couldn't comprehend what I was saying

Hehe, misread your post

[TorontoChelsea 4,064]

Exactly.

City have strikers that can play multiple positions (eg. Aguero, Tevez)

United have strikers that can play multiple positions (eg. Rooney, Welbeck, RvP)

At Chelsea, we don't have that...Fernando is just past it...and Ba is only effective through the middle.

We need that Anelka type of player..someone that can play CF/SS as well as slot him on the wings when required...

The problem with even that is that we're already stacked at attacking midfielder. Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Moses, and De Bruyne are all best suited there and will all demand consistent playing time so even getting someone flexible (like Jovetic) wouldn't mean much, because we are so attack-heavy already.

[JDY 1,290]

The problem with even that is that we're already stacked at attacking midfielder. Mata, Hazard, Oscar, Moses, and De Bruyne are all best suited there and will all demand consistent playing time so even getting someone flexible (like Jovetic) wouldn't mean much, because we are so attack-heavy already.

If anything it would be ideal if one of our attacking midfielder's was adept as a forward, not the other way around. I don't know how good Moses is upfront.