Isco

[Special Juan 27,439]

Ive said it before, I'm not bothered if Eden goes to RM, he won't improve them to the level they need, he won't improve anymore, even if he stayed with us.

As long as we get big money for him then fine.

[Vesper 28,993]

8 minutes ago, Special Juan said:

Ive said it before, I'm not bothered if Eden goes to RM, he won't improve them to the level they need, he won't improve anymore, even if he stayed with us.

As long as we get big money for him then fine.

or those players I listed

LW Vinícius Júnior

RB Achraf Hakimi

b/u CF Mariano Díaz

b/u GK Keylor Navas

 

 

if we keep CHO and buy Lozano

our wingers

LW Vinícius Júnior

LW CHO

RW Pulisic

RW Hirving Lozano

LW or RW  b/u Pedro

 

sell Willian

 

that's massive and all but Pedro are so young

so exciting

Sarri can make it work

too much talent to fail

[!Hazard! 3,394]

2 hours ago, Vesper said:

each game I see

IF they offer players

for Eden

I say go for Vinícius Júnior as part of it

he looks clearly the best RM player last 3 games I have seen

far better in potential and play atm than Asensio

I could so live with

Eden swapped for

LW Vinícius Júnior

RB Achraf Hakimi (will perhaps be close to the best RB in world someday, already top 10 IMHO)

CF Mariano Díaz (perfect back up or 3rd striker)

b/u GK Keylor Navas

that would be superb business

Real is just collectively so bad you can't make any conclusions about any of their players right now. Vinicius might be doing what Willian was doing in 2015/2016 when we were shit and he was bossing it

[Vybz Kartel 1,613]

10 minutes ago, !Hazard! said:

Real is just collectively so bad you can't make any conclusions about any of their players right now. Vinicius might be doing what Willian was doing in 2015/2016 when we were shit and he was bossing it

Worst part is Real Madris have been bad for 2 seasons now. Last season they just managed to get their act together for the 2nd half of the season mainly in part to having Ronaldo a hungry goal scorer main reason why he should have won the Ballon Dor. The need a complete refresh like in 2009, only problem now is most teams now have money to ward off any interest from them. Most of their players right now looked better because of Ronaldo and the system they had. Eden should be careful he will potentially end up being a scale goat for upper management failings rather than failings of his own. Eden will never be a 25 plus goal scorer and that's what Maddis need right now 

[Vesper 28,993]

11 minutes ago, !Hazard! said:

Real is just collectively so bad you can't make any conclusions about any of their players right now. Vinicius might be doing what Willian was doing in 2015/2016 when we were shit and he was bossing it

valid point, time will tell

Real would NEVER give up all four for Eden in the summer anyway, maybe now in January IF they hit the panic button fully (and big problem with one for January, a make or break part for me, Achraf Hakimi. Out on loan to Dortmund.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

3 hours ago, Special Juan said:

Ive said it before, I'm not bothered if Eden goes to RM, he won't improve them to the level they need, he won't improve anymore, even if he stayed with us.

As long as we get big money for him then fine.

This isnt 2007 when we could sell Robben and not miss anything because we still had Lampard and Drogba.

Do people even watch Chelsea? Hazard is still the only attacker that is actualy reliable. Sure we can go game or two without, but who will take the lead in this team in attack if there is no Hazard? Who is reliable enough? No one. Even new signing(s) will have to be near perfect to replace him. Odds for that are small. 

I mean sure if Eden is nailed to leave, then lets get as much cash for him as possible. But thats a problem for us still. 

Its no "as long we get big money its fine". We have been spending big money on completely wrong players. Bakayko, Drinks, Morata,...

People werent bothered when Costa left. We didnt replace him yet despite splasing alot of cash. 

Money in chelsea bank for us fans means nothing. It means nothing in sport competitions. Its all about winning. And we can win easier with Eden than with bunch of cash in the bank.

If anyone thinks we will be fine if Eden leaves, they are naive. It might happen if he wants to leave, but hopefuly people realise its going to hurt us like a motherf*cker. There is zero chance the board gets equaly good replacement.

[Superblue 6,370]

30 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

This isnt 2007 when we could sell Robben and not miss anything because we still had Lampard and Drogba.

Do people even watch Chelsea? Hazard is still the only attacker that is actualy reliable. Sure we can go game or two without, but who will take the lead in this team in attack if there is no Hazard? Who is reliable enough? No one. Even new signing(s) will have to be near perfect to replace him. Odds for that are small. 

I mean sure if Eden is nailed to leave, then lets get as much cash for him as possible. But thats a problem for us still. 

Its no "as long we get big money its fine". We have been spending big money on completely wrong players. Bakayko, Drinks, Morata,...

People werent bothered when Costa left. We didnt replace him yet despite splasing alot of cash. 

Money in chelsea bank for us fans means nothing. It means nothing in sport competitions. Its all about winning. And we can win easier with Eden than with bunch of cash in the bank.

If anyone thinks we will be fine if Eden leaves, they are naive. It might happen if he wants to leave, but hopefuly people realise its going to hurt us like a motherf*cker. There is zero chance the board gets equaly good replacement.

I agree that losing Hazard would be a huge loss, he's the best player and our one attacking player of true world class talent.

I think if he left, it would take time, possibly a season or so to recover from losing him.

However a couple of things I would point out. The first is I think not just the club places an over-reliance on Hazard at present, but our players do too. Even when he's being marked out of a game or not playing well, he's the first person the rest of our team looks for to give the ball to. It's an easy option, give it to our best player. I do think at times players end up playing within themselves as a result. It's only a very small example considering how many games Hazard has performed for us this season, but in my opinion our best and most complete performance this season was away at Burnley when Hazard was unavailable. We dominated from start to finish, created chances, finished chances and looked fantastic. Most attacking players play better when they are needed and being relied upon and I feel at times the over-reliance on Hazard possibly hinders other players a little.

The other point is the club will always move on from every player. How would we replace Drogba up front (especially as we had Torres at the time) - it may have taken some time but we got Costa, and I'm sure we'll replace Costa properly sooner rather than later too.

Lampard was always the one for me, we were never going to replace his midfield goals in the same way as we'll probably not replace Hazard with someone as naturally talented. But we replaced Lampard with Fabregas who was a completely different player and kicked on again and have won major trophies since. We probably won't replace Hazard like for like but perhaps we'll find a player in that position that isn't as skillful and creative but is more of a direct, goalscoring threat? Who knows, but if Hazard does leave Chelsea will move on from him.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

19 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

I agree that losing Hazard would be a huge loss, he's the best player and our one attacking player of true world class talent.

I think if he left, it would take time, possibly a season or so to recover from losing him.

However a couple of things I would point out. The first is I think not just the club places an over-reliance on Hazard at present, but our players do too. Even when he's being marked out of a game or not playing well, he's the first person the rest of our team looks for to give the ball to. It's an easy option, give it to our best player. I do think at times players end up playing within themselves as a result. It's only a very small example considering how many games Hazard has performed for us this season, but in my opinion our best and most complete performance this season was away at Burnley when Hazard was unavailable. We dominated from start to finish, created chances, finished chances and looked fantastic. Most attacking players play better when they are needed and being relied upon and I feel at times the over-reliance on Hazard possibly hinders other players a little.

The other point is the club will always move on from every player. How would we replace Drogba up front (especially as we had Torres at the time) - it may have taken some time but we got Costa, and I'm sure we'll replace Costa properly sooner rather than later too.

Lampard was always the one for me, we were never going to replace his midfield goals in the same way as we'll probably not replace Hazard with someone as naturally talented. But we replaced Lampard with Fabregas who was a completely different player and kicked on again and have won major trophies since. We probably won't replace Hazard like for like but perhaps we'll find a player in that position that isn't as skillful and creative but is more of a direct, goalscoring threat? Who knows, but if Hazard does leave Chelsea will move on from him.

The club has been in decline when it comes to replacing players with each season though.

Obviously chelsea will move on, but I dont think we will be as competitive. 

Either we do best, keep Eden and sign another star player or sell Hazard, buy someone else and have another 2 year transition period. Its all about showing intent how competitive we want to be. 

Because when it comes to replacing best players we realy suck in recent years. Tottenham moved nicely after losing Bale and Modric. But who knows how good they would be with them, see the point? Same with Liverpool and Suarez. Who says they wouldnt have Mane, Firmino, Salah and Suarez in line up right now, tearing the europe apart. But at least they managed to continue just fine. I doubt we can do the same. We just dont have the project idea or clear future plan like they did. Its more make it or break it with us. Some deals come good and some end up disaster. But there is no consistency.

Barca didnt manage to replace Neymar either.

[Superblue 6,370]

54 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

The club has been in decline when it comes to replacing players with each season though.

Obviously chelsea will move on, but I dont think we will be as competitive. 

Either we do best, keep Eden and sign another star player or sell Hazard, buy someone else and have another 2 year transition period. Its all about showing intent how competitive we want to be. 

Because when it comes to replacing best players we realy suck in recent years. Tottenham moved nicely after losing Bale and Modric. But who knows how good they would be with them, see the point? Same with Liverpool and Suarez. Who says they wouldnt have Mane, Firmino, Salah and Suarez in line up right now, tearing the europe apart. But at least they managed to continue just fine. I doubt we can do the same. We just dont have the project idea or clear future plan like they did. Its more make it or break it with us. Some deals come good and some end up disaster. But there is no consistency.

Barca didnt manage to replace Neymar either.

Summer 2017 was horrendous, there's no getting away from that. We tried to fill our squad out and it backfired massively. We also failed to replace Costa and Matic adequately.

However the 2016 summer was very good looking back now. Kante was a phenomenal purchase, Luiz proved to be a very good signing and whilst Alonso has his critics he has proven overall to be a pretty decent buy. This summer and signing Pulisic this January looks like we're moving back to identifying 2 or 3 positions and properly buying for them rather than stretching our budget out over 5 or 6 players. Time will tell, but the club moved to do its best to replace Courtois in the summer and Kepa so far has been a very good buy. Until something happens with Hazard its difficult to speculate but I would bet on Chelsea going again as opposed to fading away.

You're right some deals end up good and some end in disaster but that's with all clubs, especially big clubs where transfers are under the microscope. Liverpool are on a bit of a roll at present with their signings but they've had times in recent years buying a fair amount of dross too. Tottenham paid big money on Jansen and before that some of their players brought with the Bale money didn't succeed. No one hits a home run every time.

You can't really compare Tottenham and Liverpool to us because a number of key parts of their teams were made by selling those players. If Tottenham didn't sell Bale, they probably wouldn't have brought the likes of Lloris and Eriksen. Liverpool may not have got Firmino if they had kept hold of Suarez and probably wouldn't have gone in so high for Van Dijk and Alisson if they hadn't sold Coutinho. Those teams have evolved as a direct result of selling some of those players. I know we try to operate a one in one out policy at the club but I don't think we necessarily need to sell a big player to fund other big signings.

 

[Unionjack 7,531]

1 hour ago, BlueLyon said:

Obviously chelsea will move on, but I dont think we will be as competitive. 

We never know do we?

We have always been paranoid over losing players thinking the world will come to an end. But we are still here. Might need some work but still fighting.

Who is to say that losing and replacing players who fans like might turn into getting a team together that plays better as a unit?

Speaking solely about Eden as it seems peeps are the most concerned about is how or what can the club do to stop him bar tieing him up and sticking him in a broom cupboard if he is determined to do one? This doesn't just happen to us. It happens to all clubs everywhere.

If he goes the Blue world wont stop spinning. What really does piss me off and should everyone is we havent planned for it. We are in the process right now of potentially losing 7 of our 1st team in the next 4/5 months and right now only have 1 replacement. Its not hard to recover from losing 1 player IF the money is used to replace him with the right player but its going to be sodding hard replacing another 6 specially the way our board operates.

The time has come for us to stand back and take a proper loo at ourselves without no rose tinted specs!

We need a complete onerhaul. From the directos, to the scouts, A DOF, how we use the academy,the direction we see the team playing - get a character and make sure we hire managers to suit it instead of keep altering the team to suit the manager. We need to look at the psychology of the team and how we get them prepared, how we utilize our legends, and finally of course the lads. Its a fuckin big job.

And we need to get a squad of players together to gel and grow together and be together for some time. It's time to get organized.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

3 hours ago, Unionjack said:

We never know do we?

We have always been paranoid over losing players thinking the world will come to an end. But we are still here. Might need some work but still fighting.

Who is to say that losing and replacing players who fans like might turn into getting a team together that plays better as a unit?

Speaking solely about Eden as it seems peeps are the most concerned about is how or what can the club do to stop him bar tieing him up and sticking him in a broom cupboard if he is determined to do one? This doesn't just happen to us. It happens to all clubs everywhere.

If he goes the Blue world wont stop spinning. What really does piss me off and should everyone is we havent planned for it. We are in the process right now of potentially losing 7 of our 1st team in the next 4/5 months and right now only have 1 replacement. Its not hard to recover from losing 1 player IF the money is used to replace him with the right player but its going to be sodding hard replacing another 6 specially the way our board operates.

The time has come for us to stand back and take a proper loo at ourselves without no rose tinted specs!

We need a complete onerhaul. From the directos, to the scouts, A DOF, how we use the academy,the direction we see the team playing - get a character and make sure we hire managers to suit it instead of keep altering the team to suit the manager. We need to look at the psychology of the team and how we get them prepared, how we utilize our legends, and finally of course the lads. Its a fuckin big job.

And we need to get a squad of players together to gel and grow together and be together for some time. It's time to get organized.

Well tbh we are far cry from 2005-2010 generation. 

Back then english football was on top and not only that, we were on top of english football too. Sure we didnt have that star squad as some other teams, but we had perhaps the most efficient one. Anyone who came to SB knew its going to be incredibly hard.

IMO we have slowly drifted away. We got two pl titles recently, but then again no CL twice too. We dont have that consistency anymore, even if there were some good results. 

Spurs and Liverpool operate differently than us. They managed to create top teams with Poch and Klopp. Sarri isnt one to build squads, he just works with what we have. Conte or Mou didnt get the backing. And our board doesnt have dof. So some sort of project is definately off the table because there is no person to drive it unlike with Poch or Klopp. Thats why I dont think we can just replace Hazard. Even if we do, what difference will it make? Player for player policy wont make us stronger.

The club has to start investing in another star player, regardless of Hazard situation. 

Kepa was great buy indeed. Morata was a flop. That said we are losing star players and if we lose Hazard and have another Morata fiasco its going to be giant problem. 

We should bring someone on Hazard level before Hazard leaves. That will make the transition acceptable. But right now, we dont have anyone and playing with fire that we can get replacement easily could backfire big time. 

[communicate 2,703]

1 hour ago, BlueLyon said:

Well tbh we are far cry from 2005-2010 generation. 

Back then english football was on top and not only that, we were on top of english football too. Sure we didnt have that star squad as some other teams, but we had perhaps the most efficient one. Anyone who came to SB knew its going to be incredibly hard.

IMO we have slowly drifted away. We got two pl titles recently, but then again no CL twice too. We dont have that consistency anymore, even if there were some good results. 

Spurs and Liverpool operate differently than us. They managed to create top teams with Poch and Klopp. Sarri isnt one to build squads, he just works with what we have. Conte or Mou didnt get the backing. And our board doesnt have dof. So some sort of project is definately off the table because there is no person to drive it unlike with Poch or Klopp. Thats why I dont think we can just replace Hazard. Even if we do, what difference will it make? Player for player policy wont make us stronger.

The club has to start investing in another star player, regardless of Hazard situation. 

Kepa was great buy indeed. Morata was a flop. That said we are losing star players and if we lose Hazard and have another Morata fiasco its going to be giant problem. 

We should bring someone on Hazard level before Hazard leaves. That will make the transition acceptable. But right now, we dont have anyone and playing with fire that we can get replacement easily could backfire big time. 

Are you talking about early Abrahhomvich era where we outspend everybody, of course we are not going to be as good as that team.

Having said that, we actually have done extremely well replacing those team. we had salah, kdb,lukaku and hazard in the same team but Mou didn't want them. 

So now we need to rebuild again, you said Sarri is not the one, I don't get this. If this year instead of singning Jorginho,Kepa, kovacic and pulisic, we signed another destroyer like Bakayoko, then Sarri is not the one. It is very simple, under sarri he want to play certain way, you get player that fit his system. The same with Klopp, the same with Pep. Pool signed player to suit klopp ,same with Guardiola.

You are talking about we should start investing in another star, better question is who ? We signed pulisic for big money hoping he will be a star for us, that is a start.

 

 

[Antonio8 736]

this would be a real Abram's buy

but those times are gone

[Vesper 28,993]

36 minutes ago, Antonio8 said:

this would be a real Abram's buy

but those times are gone

Isco is the one player that UJ and I really disagree on. I think he is overrated. If his knees are oki, would much rather go for Fekir.

My number one AMF target is Kai Havertz, but Bayern (cunts) have him 90% in the bag, ffs.

I also would go for Pablo Sarabia over Isco. Much more production for lower price.

Its not that I dislike Isco, I just think that at around £80m to £100m or more, he is too costly for what we would get.

£60m? Sign him up! No way RM drops that low I think.

[Antonio8 736]

7 minutes ago, Vesper said:

Isco is the one player that UJ and I really disagree on. I think he is overrated. If his knees are oki, would much rather go for Fekir.

My number one AMF target is Kai Havertz, but Bayern (cunts) have him 90% in the bag, ffs.

I also would go for Pablo Sarabia over Isco. Much more production for lower price.

Its not that I dislike Isco, I just think that at around £80m to £100m or more, he is too costly for what we would get.

£60m? Sign him up! No way RM drops that low I think.

i respect your opinion mate, but imho he is a real crack

in plus, during his career, sarri always uses the 4312 system (except in napoli), and with isco,  he could surely apply that system 

OT Bayern 

OT imho Sarri should try the 4312 system, with hazard morata and giroud, considering that hazard is not a real winger or striker, and morata is a second striker

 

[Vesper 28,993]

41 minutes ago, Antonio8 said:

i respect your opinion mate, but imho he is a real crack

in plus, during his career, sarri always uses the 4312 system (except in napoli), and with isco,  he could surely apply that system 

OT Bayern 

OT imho Sarri should try the 4312 system, with hazard morata and giroud, considering that hazard is not a real winger or striker, and morata is a second striker

 

what do you think if of a 4 2 3 1 system, IF we had a great striker?

the 4 defensive backs

then a double pivot of Jorginho and Kante

then Eden  on left Isco or Fekir or Sarabia ( in the number 10 role) as central playmaker  and Pulisic on the right

topped off by Icardi or Jovic or Piatek

[Vesper 28,993]

47 minutes ago, Antonio8 said:

i respect your opinion mate, but imho he is a real crack

in plus, during his career, sarri always uses the 4312 system (except in napoli), and with isco,  he could surely apply that system 

OT Bayern 

OT imho Sarri should try the 4312 system, with hazard morata and giroud, considering that hazard is not a real winger or striker, and morata is a second striker

 

 4 3 1 2

 

IF Eden leaves

yielding

4 backs

then

Kante Jorginho  Barella

then

Isco or Fekir or Sarabia

then

Jovic and Piatek as striker duo

THAT sounds great too!

I like the sound of that

[Antonio8 736]

1 hour ago, Vesper said:

what do you think if of a 4 2 3 1 system, IF we had a great striker?

the 4 defensive backs

then a double pivot of Jorginho and Kante

then Eden  on left Isco or Fekir or Sarabia ( in the number 10 role) as central playmaker  and Pulisic on the right

topped off by Icardi or Jovic or Piatek

imho jorginho would have troubles in a 2-mildfield,

hazard is not an ideal winger, because he wants ball on feet instead of in space (the same for willian) 

but a squad like this could be very dangerous:  kante jorginho barkley

                                                                                        isco (hazard) 

                                                                                 morata higuain 

just a dream