🇧🇷 Oscar

[Jase 43,479]

As discussed in the Fabregas thread, Fabregas actually covers the most distance in this team so the stamina and work rate issue is pretty void.

How is it void? That 'covers the most distance' stat can be pretty misleading - like he has that stat because he goes forward a lot, stays in defensive position a lot OR both? Even if it's the latter two, it doesn't mean he has good workrate defensively or high stamina. Not saying Fabregas is one but you could have a headless chicken running up and down the pitch in the entire game, doing nothing, and say 'oh he has strong workrate etc...' even when that is not the case.

My main point however is that our number 10 wouldn't even need to run around or press as much if he had Koke and Matic behind him...

I doubt that'll be the case as long as Mourinho is still our manager. Granted the partnership of Mikel and Matic might not be the best but we have played Fabregas in front of those two before and he's still required to press, even if it has been slightly non-existent.

[didierforever 7,349]

Not too sure about that. Can Fabregas really do what Mourinho wants with his No.10 in that position? He doesn't have the stamina, workrate and mobility to be moving around the pitch for 90 minutes, like Oscar and Willian. That is why those two are often played in the No.10 position more often than not. Mourinho has played Fabregas in that role a few times this season but has never really convinced and our pressing game tends to suffer from it. Sometimes, one can see Costa going a bit mad when he's doing the all the pressing from the front and no one else really helping him.

Totally disagree with this.

Cesc as a no.10 has been pretty impressive. His pressing is way better than oscar's. Our best away performance defensively woild have been stoke when cesc started as a no.10.

Also, there is a massive difference with cesc and oscar. Oscar loses the ball, cesc doesn't. Or atleast not half as much as osvar. Oscar has to make it up with the extra running and workrate, which to be fair to him he does. With cesc we get a much better control of them and the number of turnovers making us so suspect to counters are less.

So it just is not right to say that cesc would not be as good a no.10 as oscar cos oscar has a better stamina.

[didierforever 7,349]

Relax. All Robguima said was that he thinks they have a similar "style of play". No mention was made of the performance factor until you brought it up. There is no comparison between the two in that regard, and Robguima wasn't making one.

I'm sure Oscar aspires to one day be half the player that Lamps has been for Chelsea, but for obvious reasons is nowhere near that yet, and nor is it fair to expect him to be.

But that is a "nothing" argument. Its like saying adel taraabt and ben arfa have a similar style of play as messi as they are all dribblers.

And I think that is what robguima was trying to do. Taking the minutest similarity and exagearting it to the max.

[Jase 43,479]

Totally disagree with this.

Cesc as a no.10 has been pretty impressive. His pressing is way better than oscar's. Our best away performance defensively woild have been stoke when cesc started as a no.10.

Also, there is a massive difference with cesc and oscar. Oscar loses the ball, cesc doesn't. Or atleast not half as much as osvar. Oscar has to make it up with the extra running and workrate, which to be fair to him he does. With cesc we get a much better control of them and the number of turnovers making us so suspect to counters are less.

And yet one could easily point to the Liverpool game at Anfield recently where playing Fabregas in the No.10 role didn't exactly work.

[didierforever 7,349]

And yet one could easily point to the Liverpool game at Anfield recently where playing Fabregas in the No.10 role didn't exactly work.

And then we can argue abiut the second leg where we played oscar in the no.10 role and should have been 2-0/3-0 down if not for courtois. Also your argument about costa getting frustrated with only him pressing was most visible in that match too where he dint get any support from oscar.

Or for that matter the city match too. In which oscar's supposed defensive nuance was no where to be seen and his overall contribition to that match was as mich as mine or yours who were sitting at hone shouting at the TV while sipping beer.

We can take soton as an example for this. Ankther gane where we had total control of the proceedings. Yes, we dint get the desired result, but cesc as the no.10 was great that day too.

[Jase 43,479]

And then we can argue abiut the second leg where we played oscar in the no.10 role and should have been 2-0/3-0 down if not for courtois. Also your argument about costa getting frustrated with only him pressing was most visible in that match too where he dint get any support from oscar.

Or for that matter the city match too. In which oscar's supposed defensive nuance was no where to be seen and his overall contribition to that match was as mich as mine or yours who were sitting at hone shouting at the TV while sipping beer.

We can take soton as an example for this. Ankther gane where we had total control of the proceedings. Yes, we dint get the desired result, but cesc as the no.10 was great that day too.

Think we could easily point out games where Oscar and Fabregas succeeded and failed in the No.10 role. With Oscar, he has proven that he can do the job in that position under Mourinho since last season. Just needs a bit more consistency. As for Fabregas, well, I'll remain unconvinced in him playing in that position until he's been given a run there and see how he performs because there have been matches where he did well and not so well.

[CFC888 219]

His pressing is way better than oscar's.

Really? Our pressing with a front two of Costa and Oscar has been immense this season.

Think we could easily point out games where Oscar and Fabregas succeeded and failed in the No.10 role. With Oscar, he has proven that he can do the job in that position under Mourinho since last season. Just needs a bit more consistency. As for Fabregas, well, I'll remain unconvinced in him playing in that position until he's been given a run there and see how he performs because there have been matches where he did well and not so well.

Yes. I think it's hard to judge Fabregas' true No.10 output when he is only playing it sporadically when Oscar isn't there, which is rarely more than 1 or 2 games in succession.

I like the concept of Cesc at No.10, but like Jason has said throughout the last couple of pages, I'm yet to be convinced that it works in a Mourinho team. We just seem to lack a bit of punch when Cesc is there over Oscar.

[DH1988 1,348]

Do we even have a number ten in this team? Not as in players the way the midfield interchanges and shifts position can we equally say we have a designated number ten role?

Oscar provides balance and work ethic which I've previously commended.

[The Skipper 20,609]

How is it void? That 'covers the most distance' stat can be pretty misleading - like he has that stat because he goes forward a lot, stays in defensive position a lot OR both? Even if it's the latter two, it doesn't mean he has good workrate defensively or high stamina. Not saying Fabregas is one but you could have a headless chicken running up and down the pitch in the entire game, doing nothing, and say 'oh he has strong workrate etc...' even when that is not the case.

I doubt that'll be the case as long as Mourinho is still our manager. Granted the partnership of Mikel and Matic might not be the best but we have played Fabregas in front of those two before and he's still required to press, even if it has been slightly non-existent.

Fabregas does press though. He's nowhere near as bad as you're trying to make him seem. He just wouldn't have to as heavily if he has Koke and Matic behind him. Mikel almost adds nothing to our press game either so I don't really get your analogy. It's not really comparable.

[CFC888 219]

Do we even have a number ten in this team? Not as in players the way the midfield interchanges and shifts position can we equally say we have a designated number ten role?

Oscar provides balance and work ethic which I've previously commended.

It was interesting to see on the weekend that right from kick off Oscar didn't seem to be anywhere near as far forward as usual. Quite often he would be positioned the deepest in defence out of all of Remy, Hazard, Willian, Ramires and even Matic. As a consequence he was nowhere near as prominent in our attacking moves.

Maybe one aspect of this could be the 300 minutes in 8 days that he's played taking its toll, because at times he looked like he simply couldn't muster the energy to run forward and attack. He may have made a conscious decision that it would be better to not be able to run forward and attack than to not be able to run back and defend because we know Jose's philosophy on everyone defending. However, I believe there was a definite instruction from Jose for Oscar to play deeper on Saturday right from the off.

[Oscar 441]

with rambo coming back to fitness, Jose could try Hazard-cesc-Willian with ramires and matic behind them, however, Cesc has been one of the best players in the league because he has sufficient time to spray the ball around...

I guess it wouldn't hurt to try, however, I have my doubts on Cesc as the n10 under Mourinho.

[MrBlueGuy 1,552]

Fucking boss with the last part LOL

[kellzfresh 7,229]

Lmao

[LAM09 7,054]

Oscar knows how it is.

[Jase 43,479]

Fabregas does press though. He's nowhere near as bad as you're trying to make him seem. He just wouldn't have to as heavily if he has Koke and Matic behind him. Mikel almost adds nothing to our press game either so I don't really get your analogy. It's not really comparable.

Never said Fabregas doesn't press but compare to Oscar and Willian at their best, he's nowhere near as good as them especially in the manner that Mourinho wants from the No.10. Also, I mentioned Mikel (with Matic) previously because Mourinho has always played the two behind Fabregas as the DM and allowed the latter to play a freer role attacking wise but defensive wise, we have tended to suffer a bit from that.

[robdog 2,084]

Fucking boss with the last part LOL

Not sure if you noticed or not, but it's a new slogan for Addias & it's associated w/ CFC. Did you see the ad w/ Diego Costa & the new boots? Still I like it, but I wonder if this is The Real Oscar

[CurlyHairLikeLuiz 1,625]

Cesc's preferred role is as a CM. As others have said, Fab looks great because he has time on the ball which the deeper role affords him without getting bullied by the defenders. In the #10 he simply has no space to work with the ball. Of course, he still looks great at #10 but something tells me that when Cuadrado comes Oscar will become 2nd choice and Willian will start there, where he can give more end product. Never know, though,

[AndersonBLUE 819]

He is so hit and miss it's nauseating.

[Reddish-Blue 2,507]

It was interesting to see on the weekend that right from kick off Oscar didn't seem to be anywhere near as far forward as usual. Quite often he would be positioned the deepest in defence out of all of Remy, Hazard, Willian, Ramires and even Matic. As a consequence he was nowhere near as prominent in our attacking moves.

Maybe one aspect of this could be the 300 minutes in 8 days that he's played taking its toll, because at times he looked like he simply couldn't muster the energy to run forward and attack. He may have made a conscious decision that it would be better to not be able to run forward and attack than to not be able to run back and defend because we know Jose's philosophy on everyone defending. However, I believe there was a definite instruction from Jose for Oscar to play deeper on Saturday right from the off.

Fair point about Oscar being instructed to play deeper against City...but I don't think that was the case. He generally goes missing in big games/physical opposition and this match was no different

[CFC888 219]

Fair point about Oscar being instructed to play deeper against City...but I don't think that was the case. He generally goes missing in big games/physical opposition and this match was no different

Indeed he does, I think we can all agree on that. I'm not for one minute excusing his performance, I'm just saying that through either fatigue, lack of workrate, an instruction from the manager, or a combination of these, Oscar wasn't playing as far forward as usual against City.