Politics & Stuff

[Spike 12,049]

3 hours ago, Stingray said:

 

 

Hey Spike,

 

I guess the frame of reference matters. We would call him a social democrat here. Indeed very center a little left - which is very standard in a European context. In the European parliamant they have 162 of the 736 seats. So it is both national as European a big fraction.

 

In an american context he would be fucking Karl Marx .

Ps: calling him a socialist (which americans connect more with communism than we do - but this has McCarthy reasons for that kind of bias) would be a bit of a stretch for socialists here. Lol.

Thanks I was looking at this to get a better frame of my mind after I read your post.

http://www.politicalcompass.org/uselection2016

So yes, Sanders is left centre. In comparison to the others though he is very leftist.

[kellzfresh 7,226]

 

Quote

 

At least 65 dead after suicide attack in Lahore park

LAHORE: At least 65 people were killed in a suicide attack in Gulshan-i-Iqbal Park of Iqbal Town on Sunday evening, rescue sources said. Hospital sources added that over 200 were injured.

The attack was claimed by the Tehreek-i-Taliban Pakistan Jamaatul Ahrar.

Iqbal Town Superintendent Police Dr Muhammad Iqbal confirmed this was a suicide attack that took place at a children's park, where a large number of families, especially women and children, were present.

The area is a renowned residential area of Lahore. The blast was just outside the exit gate and a few feet (metres) away from the children's swings.

DCO Captain (Retd) Muhammad Usman said the head of the suicide bomber was recovered. Ball bearings were also found at the site.

Eye witnesses said there were pools of blood and scattered body parts spread across the site of the attack.

"We took the injured to hospitals on rickshaws and taxis," one eye witness said.

He added that the crowd was "unusually large" because of Easter.

"The roads were also jammed and queues of vehicles could be seen till Moon Market."

'No security'

Many eyewitnesses said there was no security present in and around the park.

An eye witness, talking to DawnNews, said:

"The park is huge and has many entrance gates. There were almost no security personnel present there."

A Rescue 1122 spokesman confirmed that an emergency call was received at around 6:44pm and that over 20 ambulances had been sent to the site at the time.

An emergency was declared at all government hospitals in the city.

The Punjab government announced three days of mourning. 

The cowards are targeting children, damn.

[Yeboii 1,844]

17 hours ago, Kieran. said:

sanders being "extreme left" lol

Shows how much "left" the world is when Sanders isn't considered "extreme left" lol

[iseah100 5,612]

Fantastic response lol

Instead of just 'lol', why don't you actually try post something with substance so I can understand why I'm wrong? I actually don't mind being wrong and admitting so, it means I can learn something new. 

 

In my defence he is certainly extremely left by American standards from what I can tell, I don't claim to be a political expert at all.

 

Snarky spike[emoji13] [emoji13] [emoji13] . He is left, but not extreme. It's sad that extreme left in the states is considered healthcare for everyone and less money in politics. I think he's a leftist, but in the big scheme of things he's not far left.

Shows how much "left" the world is when Sanders isn't considered "extreme left" lol

Is that a bad thing?

[Spike 12,049]

15 minutes ago, iseah100 said:

Snarky spike . He is left, but not extreme. It's sad that extreme left in the states is considered healthcare for everyone and less money in politics. I think he's a leftist, but in the big scheme of things he's not far left.

 

Is that a bad thing?

Snarky? Maybe. I spend enough time on other websites with enough responses that are summed up with one acronym that I have no tolerance for it here. If I wanted people to 'lol' at me, I'd just go to 4chan were some jackass is expected to respond with that. I don't care on that site, because it is what it is, but here I expect a little more from the members.

The other day, I posted something on another site. I was downvoted for it, I asked the user why and s/he simply responded 'because I disagree with you'. Well what do you disagree with? Why? I like to know these things, for it creates engaging dialect.

[Yeboii 1,844]

1 hour ago, iseah100 said:

Is that a bad thing?

That depends on your political views, of course.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

4 hours ago, Yeboii said:

That depends on your political views, of course.

No it doesn't. Or at least it shouldn't. Basic healthcare, money out of politics and free education, the things you are calling Sanders extreme left wing for, are objectively good things and considered by most of the globe to be basic citizens rights. It shouldn't depend on your political views whether or not you want to stop thousands of people from dying because they can't afford treatment...

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,738]

4 hours ago, CHOULO19 said:

No it doesn't. Or at least it shouldn't. Basic healthcare, money out of politics and free education, the things you are calling Sanders extreme left wing for, are objectively good things and considered by most of the globe to be basic citizens rights. It shouldn't depend on your political views whether or not you want to stop thousands of people from dying because they can't afford treatment...

 

We already have tax-subsidized education, even in the k-12 which provides free lunch/breakfast for low income families. That is a common good, that I,as a childless guy taxed at a higher rate, am happy to support. The issue is the populist appeal Sanders is making to get urgent college kids on his side. Why should my money also go to subsidize some kids college education when I had to(and still) are paying for my own? That is not seen as objectively good by everyone.

 

He is engaging in simple populism, but people learn that there is no such thing as free when they see it taken out of their paycheck.

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

15 hours ago, kellzfresh said:

 

The cowards are targeting children, damn.

 

Deliberately targeting kids and still they pretend they have some kind of message. Sick fucking bastards. I'm not religious, but I hope for these guy's sakes there is an afterlife, so they can suffer in some sort of anal raping devil hell for the rest of time. 

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

25 minutes ago, Sir Mikel OBE said:

 

Why should my money also go to subsidize some kids college education when I had to(and still) are paying for my own? That is not seen as objectively good by everyone.

 

 

Because the fucked up system as it is now, has to stop someday. "Why can they have good stuff while I didn't have it?" would have stopped certain forms of progress every time...

[iseah100 5,612]

That depends on your political views, of course.

Not really. Healthcare should be provided by the government, not multibillion dollar corporations. Drug companies are turning profits in the billions, while 35 million Americans can't afford to fill their prescriptions each year.

No it doesn't. Or at least it shouldn't. Basic healthcare, money out of politics and free education, the things you are calling Sanders extreme left wing for, are objectively good things and considered by most of the globe to be basic citizens rights. It shouldn't depend on your political views whether or not you want to stop thousands of people from dying because they can't afford treatment...

Couldn't have said it better myself. If the government can't provide the basic needs what do we need them for?

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,738]

9 minutes ago, johnnythefirst said:

Because the fucked up system as it is now, has to stop someday. "Why can they have good stuff while I didn't have it?" would have stopped certain forms of progress every time...

 

The argument is not really "Why can they have good stuff while I didnt have it" and more of "why should I pay for their education when mine wasn't, and I am still paying mine?"

 

The former is easy to answer for the common good, the latter is a much tougher sell. Is it progress that I pay for another person's expensive choices when I was responsible in my own? People have a choice when leaving school to attend affordable, or at least not life crushing, schools in terms of debt load. If they choose to take the high debt load choice I shouldn't be forced to pay more to subsidize that choice. 

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

Just now, Sir Mikel OBE said:

 

The argument is not really "Why can they have good stuff while I didnt have it" and more of "why should I pay for their education when mine wasn't, and I am still paying mine?"

 

The former is easy to answer for the common good, the latter is a much tougher sell. Is it progress that I pay for another person's expensive choices when I was responsible in my own? People have a choice when leaving school to attend affordable, or at least not life crushing, schools in terms of debt load. If they choose to take the high debt load choice I shouldn't be forced to pay more to subsidize that choice. 

Essentially it's the same question, someone is always going to be fucked.

This said, I paid exactly €590 for a year of college in Belgium. Fuck socialism right.

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,738]

1 minute ago, johnnythefirst said:

Essentially it's the same question, someone is always going to be fucked.

This said, I paid exactly €590 for a year of college in Belgium. Fuck socialism right.

 

To be honest though isn't that just life? There is nothing that will ever be completely fair, we just have to work to get to a point where everybody has at least the idea of a chance at it. 

 

I am sure Belgium's system serves them well, and I have no issue with socialism. I consider myself far left. 

[manpe 10,855]

We have free higher education for all

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

1 minute ago, manpe said:

We have free higher education for all

As it ideally should be everywhere. 

[Sir Mikel OBE 4,738]

Isn't it very hard to go to University in Europe though? Like i know in Germany they separate the University and trade school kids very early in life. A teacher deems you slow and that door is already closed.....

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Even in Lebanon, basically a failed state, we have 'free' higher education (about $200 per year iirc)

 

@Sir Mikel OBE the question about free colleges goes down to whether or not you see higher education as a luxury or a right and necessity. Most of the world views it as the latter and I think if you are concerned about the advancement of your nation and communities you have to see it that way as well.

The argument about your tax money is a valid concern, but honestly lacks perspective. More than half of your tax money goes to imperialistic wars, billions go into 'corporate welfare', not to mention foreign 'aid' to some of the most hideous regimes on the planet. In worrying about where your tax money, you might want to stat there...