Should we trade off the average height and physical approach of the squad?

[Rubber bullets 1,183]

I did a calculation of the mean average height of our squad and compared it to that of Manchester Unitd (as a variable). I decided to use the first choice 11 team that was used for Chelsea's win against Portsmouth in the 2010 FA Cup final while doing the same for the first 11 of Manchester United's team that lost to Barcelona in the 2011 Champions. The average height for the Chelsea starting eleven was an average of 6ft 1inches, compared to Manachester United's first 11 which the average height was a mere 5ft 8inches tall.

It was well known that under Jose Mourinho, he prefered to have a squad that was full of tall, strong physical players, such as Drogba, Essien, Ballack, Lampard, Terry, Mikel ect. Who were either over 6ft tall or who had a large amount of physical strenght in order to use power and drive to win games and less on free flowing football.. Since the core of the team has remained after Jose left we still depend on power. Helped by the fact that we keep buying players like Anelka, Ivanovic and Ramires, who are also either over 6ft tall or are more known for their drive rather then creativity.

However we face an ageing squad where they are in decline, but still used tactics last season that relied on trying to ram opposition teams down even thought a lot of the players seemed to have no strenght in them. Meaning we played bland, gridlocked football. There is a growing number of fans that are crying out for use to use players that have a more creative approach to football. However creative players like Xavi, Modric, Nasri, Moutinho and Ozil are not as strong like a Mikel or Drogba and often are 5ft 8inches to 5ft 10inches tall. Yet with Chelsea apparently wanting to buy players like Lukaku on the basis that "he reminds us of Drogba" we seem to hit a dilemma. Do we try and keep the physicality and strength that we have been known for for the last few years or do we sacrifice that and play more football that is akin to a free flowing style like Barcelona or Arsanal? Will AVB try and sell off the more physical players and bring in players that are shorter and weaker, but also more creative or stick with the status quo?

[Spike 12,049]

I think given that the Core of the club is still very physically dominating, that we will end up as sort of a fusion between Chelsea and Barcelona under AVB.

[BLionheart 516]

I did a calculation of the mean average height of our squad and compared it to that of Manchester Unitd (as a variable). I decided to use the first choice 11 team that was used for Chelsea's win against Portsmouth in the 2010 FA Cup final while doing the same for the first 11 of Manchester United's team that lost to Barcelona in the 2011 Champions. The average height for the Chelsea starting eleven was an average of 6ft 1inches, compared to Manachester United's first 11 which the average height was a mere 5ft 8inches tall.

It was well known that under Jose Mourinho, he prefered to have a squad that was full of tall, strong physical players, such as Drogba, Essien, Ballack, Lampard, Terry, Mikel ect. Who were either over 6ft tall or who had a large amount of physical strenght in order to use power and drive to win games and less on free flowing football.. Since the core of the team has remained after Jose left we still depend on power. Helped by the fact that we keep buying players like Anelka, Ivanovic and Ramires, who are also either over 6ft tall or are more known for their drive rather then creativity.

However we face an aging squad where they are in decline, but still used tactics last season that relied on trying to ram opposition teams down even thought a lot of the players seemed to have no strength in them. Meaning we played bland, gridlocked football. There is a growing number of fans that are crying out for use to use players that have a more creative approach to football. However creative players like Xavi, Modric, Nasri, Moutinho and Ozil are not as strong like a Mikel or Drogba and often are 5ft 8inches to 5ft 10inches tall. Yet with Chelsea apparently wanting to buy players like Lukaku on the basis that "he reminds us of Drogba" we seem to hit a dilemma. Do we try and keep the physicality and strength that we have been known for for the last few years or do we sacrifice that and play more football that is akin to a free flowing style like Barcelona or Arsanal? Will AVB try and sell off the more physical players and bring in players that are shorter and weaker, but also more creative or stick with the status quo?

If the answer is No , then roman would have kept Mourinho and we would have been playing defensive football as this criteria of players are great at defending but they have problems in terms of creativity and attacking.

But it' well known that roman want Attacking football , so i don't expect that approach to be kept at the club specially under AVB

However i think the best option will be to keep those tall , tough guys do what they are best at , which is defending and bring new creative players to be able to you know .. attack !!

So simply the back-line should be very strong , tall and tough guys , while forwards must have creativity .

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Good thread.

It will depend on transfers made to judge if we are taking a new approach however the interest in Modric made me think perhaps we are. As BLionheart said, the defence should always be full of strong guy, since they'll be most effective. The holding should be strong, regardless of height. So you had Essien who wasn't the tallest, but certainly the strongest. Now we have Mikel who's taller and not as stronger (in terms of weight).

The midfield should be slightly shorter imo. Shorter players are better with pace and control and they are much more effective when it comes to playmakers. Examples; Modric, Nasri, Xavi, Ozil ect. Most people argue that they'd be bullied around in the PL but the good thing about them is they can simply outpace and play their way around this problem.

As for the forwards. I like the idea of having a target man supported by a natural goal scoring forward, i.e. Torres. Even though there's an argument tactics might change to "boot it up and hope for the best" with a target man, I think a manager can use a target man without using such tactics. Because you have the likes of Sturridge & Torres supporting the target man. I use Heskey as an example.. Not he himself, but his type of player. He's designed to give the strikers support when it comes to going through defence and making those powerful runs to start/carry on a movement. We can use Lukaku because he's also got good pace and technique to dribble around defenders using his strength.

[Tomo 21,733]

Pretty much agree with blionheart, keep the solid defense and defensive midfield and flair attack, play great football but keep a strong core because if we play Barca (especially at the Camp Nou) we won't be able to play open attacking football for 19 minutes without getting pumped.

[Blue Armour 4,289]

To add more creativity, flair and speed to our team yes there will be a reduction in average height, because you need smaller, more agile players that can move in tight spaces and have good close control...

If we were playing 4-3-3(the most likely formation) I would prefer:

1.Two attacking mids and one holding. Of the two attacking mids, I would prefer at least one to be a short, quick and pacy player of the Modric/Iniesta mould who can play quick, accurate passes

to set up good attacks. As for the second one its most likely Lampard, and that's great because he can still deliver the goals needed from midfield and play the crucial final pass.

The holding mid as Ldn_blue said should be strong irregardless of height. There should always be some steel in midfield. he should be able to good tackles, read the game well and launch the ball forward from defense as quickly as possible.,,either by quick long passes or charging forward fast

2. For the front three I would like one quick, pacy winger and the other winger to have decent physical strength (ideally we could have a winger who has both these qualities), to tackle any kind of defense. One of these has to be a good goalscorer as well. The striker can be physical or not (I prefer someone with height), but he should be good in the air and have a good eye for goal. Speed is definitely a must, and Torres and Drogba both have these qualities.

3. Defence: The two centre halves, should obviously have a fair amount of height, and for the EPL, yes they need to be physical. For the full-backs, I'm okay if only one of them is good in attack(there's rarely any use in both full-backs charging forward at the same time), but should be solid in defense..

Thus, I would like a combination of flair and physicality, and of course speed.

[Duppy Conqueror 1,494]

as pretty much all have said..we need a blend of steel and creativity..if we went all out flair and took away our hard edge completely we would become like Arsanal.

we shouldn`t completely follow the blue print of any team anyway..not even the all conquering Barcelona! to be the best we can by all means use some of what they do,but will have to add something else to become better than them,if we just copy them we will always be behind them.

good topic to bring up for discussion tho Sam..a whole lot more worthwhile than getting involved in some of these wild never gonna happen anyway, transfer speculation from those never heard of before websites.

[Styles 9,790]

I did a calculation of the mean average height of our squad and compared it to that of Manchester Unitd (as a variable). I decided to use the first choice 11 team that was used for Chelsea's win against Portsmouth in the 2010 FA Cup final while doing the same for the first 11 of Manchester United's team that lost to Barcelona in the 2011 Champions. The average height for the Chelsea starting eleven was an average of 6ft 1inches, compared to Manachester United's first 11 which the average height was a mere 5ft 8inches tall.

It was well known that under Jose Mourinho, he prefered to have a squad that was full of tall, strong physical players, such as Drogba, Essien, Ballack, Lampard, Terry, Mikel ect. Who were either over 6ft tall or who had a large amount of physical strenght in order to use power and drive to win games and less on free flowing football.. Since the core of the team has remained after Jose left we still depend on power. Helped by the fact that we keep buying players like Anelka, Ivanovic and Ramires, who are also either over 6ft tall or are more known for their drive rather then creativity.

However we face an ageing squad where they are in decline, but still used tactics last season that relied on trying to ram opposition teams down even thought a lot of the players seemed to have no strenght in them. Meaning we played bland, gridlocked football. There is a growing number of fans that are crying out for use to use players that have a more creative approach to football. However creative players like Xavi, Modric, Nasri, Moutinho and Ozil are not as strong like a Mikel or Drogba and often are 5ft 8inches to 5ft 10inches tall. Yet with Chelsea apparently wanting to buy players like Lukaku on the basis that "he reminds us of Drogba" we seem to hit a dilemma. Do we try and keep the physicality and strength that we have been known for for the last few years or do we sacrifice that and play more football that is akin to a free flowing style like Barcelona or Arsanal? Will AVB try and sell off the more physical players and bring in players that are shorter and weaker, but also more creative or stick with the status quo?

Football requires you to be mobile, agile and have dexterity to your play. You tend to find these qualities in shorter players that have a lower sense of gravity than taller, more robust footballers. But then you also have exceptions like Didier Drogba, Cristiano Ronaldo and Zlatan Ibrahimovic that have outstanding technical ability and balance despite being built like cruiserweights.

I think the success of Barcelona and the Spanish national team has influenced a lot of people to believe that small is the way to go. But simply being small is no good. Xavi, Messi and Iniesta are some of the greatest players to have every played the game. Say we did decide to change our approach, where are we going to find smaller players as good as them? You're not going to emulate their success just by downsizing from a more athletic approach.

[Henrique 9,133]

Actually football right now also means physical power.

Look at Barça. Those guys are strong. Dont get fooled, Messi is a strong guy. Its not easy for a guy like Terry win the ball based only in the physical power.

Barça also has guys like Puyol, Mascherano, Xavi, all strong guys.

The problem with Chelsea is not the physical power, but that our game is based in physical power. If you are playing a team like Barcelona, who has the physical power but also has the skills, of course that we will lose.

Our strongest mid in last years was with Ballack, Makelele and Lampard. Really strong but not the most creative in the world.

So, you dont need to change the physical approach, you only need to get better players and a manager who has the balls to play a more attacking football.

A pragmatic football might give you many league glories, but for a CL trophy you need to be more aggressive and less passive. Thats why in last 3 years Guardiola won 2 CL, while Mourinho got the same 8 years, despite many league glories and all the money he had to spend in Chelsea, Inter and Real...

[zolayes 14,489]

I did a calculation of the mean average height of our squad and compared it to that of Manchester Unitd (as a variable). I decided to use the first choice 11 team that was used for Chelsea's win against Portsmouth in the 2010 FA Cup final while doing the same for the first 11 of Manchester United's team that lost to Barcelona in the 2011 Champions. The average height for the Chelsea starting eleven was an average of 6ft 1inches, compared to Manachester United's first 11 which the average height was a mere 5ft 8inches tall.

It was well known that under Jose Mourinho, he prefered to have a squad that was full of tall, strong physical players, such as Drogba, Essien, Ballack, Lampard, Terry, Mikel ect. Who were either over 6ft tall or who had a large amount of physical strenght in order to use power and drive to win games and less on free flowing football.. Since the core of the team has remained after Jose left we still depend on power. Helped by the fact that we keep buying players like Anelka, Ivanovic and Ramires, who are also either over 6ft tall or are more known for their drive rather then creativity.

However we face an ageing squad where they are in decline, but still used tactics last season that relied on trying to ram opposition teams down even thought a lot of the players seemed to have no strenght in them. Meaning we played bland, gridlocked football. There is a growing number of fans that are crying out for use to use players that have a more creative approach to football. However creative players like Xavi, Modric, Nasri, Moutinho and Ozil are not as strong like a Mikel or Drogba and often are 5ft 8inches to 5ft 10inches tall. Yet with Chelsea apparently wanting to buy players like Lukaku on the basis that "he reminds us of Drogba" we seem to hit a dilemma. Do we try and keep the physicality and strength that we have been known for for the last few years or do we sacrifice that and play more football that is akin to a free flowing style like Barcelona or Arsanal? Will AVB try and sell off the more physical players and bring in players that are shorter and weaker, but also more creative or stick with the status quo?

suggest you redo your calculations on Man Utd ...their average is much higher than you quote.using data from Sky NONE of Uniteds players were less than...1.73m or 5 '8

Edited July 3, 2011 by zolayes

[zolayes 14,489]

since I was bored checked the average height of Barca in that game it was 1.77m or 5' 10"

[ulsterchelsea 3,221]

I dont think height or weight matters outside of the defence but i think you need a big solid bunch of defenders

[Henri 115]

Seriously?, what are we talking about!. Starting calculation of height is in my point of view ridiculous.

Your using a player because of his skills, whatever they may be and blend them. ( include ageing).

[Henri 115]

Actually football right now also means physical power.

Look at Barça. Those guys are strong. Dont get fooled, Messi is a strong guy. Its not easy for a guy like Terry win the ball based only in the physical power.

Barça also has guys like Puyol, Mascherano, Xavi, all strong guys.

The problem with Chelsea is not the physical power, but that our game is based in physical power. If you are playing a team like Barcelona, who has the physical power but also has the skills, of course that we will lose.

Our strongest mid in last years was with Ballack, Makelele and Lampard. Really strong but not the most creative in the world.

So, you dont need to change the physical approach, you only need to get better players and a manager who has the balls to play a more attacking football.

A pragmatic football might give you many league glories, but for a CL trophy you need to be more aggressive and less passive. Thats why in last 3 years Guardiola won 2 CL, while Mourinho got the same 8 years, despite many league glories and all the money he had to spend in Chelsea, Inter and Real...

[Henri 115]

Actually football right now also means physical power.

Look at Barça. Those guys are strong. Dont get fooled, Messi is a strong guy. Its not easy for a guy like Terry win the ball based only in the physical power.

Barça also has guys like Puyol, Mascherano, Xavi, all strong guys.

The problem with Chelsea is not the physical power, but that our game is based in physical power. If you are playing a team like Barcelona, who has the physical power but also has the skills, of course that we will lose.

Our strongest mid in last years was with Ballack, Makelele and Lampard. Really strong but not the most creative in the world.

So, you dont need to change the physical approach, you only need to get better players and a manager who has the balls to play a more attacking football.

A pragmatic football might give you many league glories, but for a CL trophy you need to be more aggressive and less passive. Thats why in last 3 years Guardiola won 2 CL, while Mourinho got the same 8 years, despite many league glories and all the money he had to spend in Chelsea, Inter and Real...

NO!. Messi wouldnt survive one month in the premier league. Puyol is old and tired.Xavi a ball player not that strong. Ballack was known for his creativity which made him "the head" of Germany team in many years, thats why we bought him!.

[Blue In Green 86]

I think AVB will put his own imprint on the team, and that will dictate their style of play. It's a good, logical question when boiled down - how should a player compensate for his physical aging? The answer should be use of increased football I.Q. gained from years of play. Getting the best results out of the current Chelsea side would dictate putting a system allowing that in place.

[Duppy Conqueror 1,494]

one thing i`ve not seen yet when talking about us and Barcelona is that when they lose the ball they hussle to get it straight back...in recent years that is something we have been lacking..too often have we let teams stroll into our half before we challenge them..we should hussle for the ball wherever on the field it is.

[neel 257]

Our strongest mid in last years was with Ballack, Makelele and Lampard. Really strong but not the most creative in the world.

Ballack was creative playmaker when he was at Leverkushen and bayern . Mourinho used him as an uncreative player whose primary job was to disrupt opponent's play.