robsblubot

I could not care less about sarri myself, but what's in for him? How does Odoi's being so "promising" help him right now? What does he get by developing Odoi? that's the root problem with the club, not this particular manager. Have a feeling sarri is not really working "long term" at the moment.

8/10 as a footballer and 4/10 as a striker against Norway.

Usually when a regular has as bad of a game as alonso did (and I'm not even talking about the PK, which happens), he starts the next game. Just saying that's usually how it goes. Regarding Odoi, what's in for Sarri to start him? Will he outperform Pedro and Willian for sure? Or is he still a promising prospect (all agree on that)? If the latter why would a very much under pressure manager ever bother with him?

it's the nouveau riche effect...

Alonso might run like a turtle, but Eden is the only who looks the part.

please get back on topic It's been a long time since we last talked about alonso and he might be missing us dearly. We need to remind him how slow and tall he is, as well how much a liability in defense he can be... yes, he forgets.

Agreed, but they can't break the laws when the laws are written by them and for them, can they? Can you have democracy when billionaires (includes companies and groups) exert far more influence in the political system than the voting population?

The systems I know that worked well, with 4 in the back and attacking FBs, seamlessly switched between 4 and 3 in the back. So, Alonso or another attacking FB would not have to drop back that much -- possibly improving his attacking output -- while Azpi would not have to go up much, prob also improving his defense (less useless running). That's why Azpi did better as a 3rd CB... same with alonso as a wingback. There is also an option of adding DMs for cover, but it limits the midfield. I'm sure his system can work, but not sure with the players at his disposal.

the system Sarri is trying to implement relies on possession to defend. This is the same as Guardiola. That's why he has Jorginho as a DLP as opposed to a DM. It's a different way of thinking about defending. Now to your point, as soon as Everton started pressing our passing went down the drain. And you still need all of our players pressing the opposition when we don't have the ball... Eden does not do that at all, and others not enough...

disagree. A fullback is only a defender in very specific systems and formations: say in the very English and outdated 2-lines 442/4411. real won everything with the worst defender as a left back. Half the fbs listed here as options are attacking ones like telles. attacking fbs are not a new thing. I cannot go past the manager on this one: Seen about 10 different successful systems with 4 in the back and one very attacking fullback. Never w/ 2 attacking fullbacks tho. he plays Alonso and relies on him to defend: his own fault

Because it’s recurring with this club... Not mutually exclusive: he may be a bad manager and the players exert too much power.to your point, while the players may not believe in the manager, it’s also the managers job to sell his ideas to the players. regarding the post above, football would be a far less interesting game to me if formation and tactics were that static. while I agree that alonso is poor at defending — sample on Emerson is still small — the only one forcing him to defend is the current manager. a better manager would either produce a system in which Alonso does not have to defend, change formation, or play a better defender.

Yes, can’t imagine him being around next season. Player power and they are not playing for him. thats why I think squad discussions are premature esp around the ban.

Heh If he’s going to replace Marcelo, don’t think he will need to defend at all. btw, we don’t know how the next manager will play (here or there). We might go back to 3 in the back, which might be a better choice considering we have no fullback in the roster.

with a cooler head after that forgettable second half at everton... Even when I myself did not like the low intensity displayed by players in the second half, I think it's largely tactical issues that are making great players look good, good players mediocre, and mediocre players look bad. That's very typical when the system is not working. The team is unbalanced between the right and the left: one side is super defensive and offers little to nothing up front, while the other is completely exposed without cover. Even the player who could provide that cover, plays on the right side of the midfield (kante). Because of the above unbalance, I was expecting Sarri to play a 4 defense line only on paper. Since the previous seasons showed how to better utilize the players at his disposal: Alonso close to the opposition goal and Azpi close to our goal. Yet, when I watch the team play, the defense line is fairly flat and high. This makes every counter attack a freaking nightmare. In the end, it seems like it's the manager trying really hard to fit several round pegs in square holes... and many times over.

I think exactly the opposite. Back in the 90s (or even worse before) very few players would be able to play at a high level past their 30s. Nowadays we see a lot more players doing that, even attackers, which was unheard of back then. This is certainly due to advancements in physical preparation, nutrition, and science in general. Of course there are individual factors that will affect their longevity... can’t see eden playing until 35 for ex. in other words, this analysis has to be done in a case by case bases and scientifically. They have the numbers, from routine physical tests, lung capacity, power, etc. they can see the decline if any. point being that when the team fails as spectacularly as we have, it is difficult for fans to assess individual performances, because all players will be exposed and look inneffective. While I do undertand you may think he’s spent, I’d rather wait for the next manager with a new system and perhaps formation to have a better idea.

Perhaps, but 30yo CB is only starting his prime years... That would also open the RWB to a midfielder type, say Pedro/Moses for ex. Considering the transfer ban, they are not going anywhere, so it's really up to the manager to use them in their best position. If that means switching to 3 in the back, so be it.

He was doing great in a 3cb system... so were Luiz and Alonso.... perhaps manager is forcing the wrong system for the players he’s got?

The most glaring defensive error was made by luiz actually. Ball watching again and allowed a free header by the player he was marking. No pressure no nothing. I don’t think we have a choice now with the ban tho and he will sign a new deal. @DDA agreed... the lack of movement is worrying. Did they give up by mid second half?

Fair enough, but I don’t care about that. he did really well once and is not able now. It happens... seen a 1000x before. now if you think that sort of performance in the second half was down to one player... it was a terrible collective second half performance. From Eden to azpi. kante was really poor btw.

Alonso is indeed in terrible form. Even the things he used to do well, he can’t do anymore. The prob is the other lb does not ever try to do those things. now, he was just the worst of the bunch. There were really poor performances to go around in the second half. It’s like the players simply did not understand the change imposed by Everton. not the right attitude and esp intensity. Passing was all over the place when Everton started pressing. RLC did well when on and that’s about it. the better team won.

exactly! When Eden plays, which is most of the time, we already have a winger who does not track back or defend. Our left side will always be a bit more vulnerable because of that. So, for Odoi to get regular playing time he must help defensively. I could almost hear the/any manager saying as Odoi is about to to in, "I want you to do what Willian/Pedro is doing. Same movement and defending... once you have the ball, then you do your own thing!"

Usually knowing the turf and facilities so well helps a lot, despite pressure from the crowd.

He does seem to lack power, but he's young enough to fix that and looks pretty good on the ball. That's to be expected of any of the many young prospects we list as potential targets, esp coming from bundesliga. Composure, esp in defending, is really not abundant in bundesliga matches, which makes it a bit hard for me to enjoy them. There are usually a lot of sloppy plays and passing to go around... players end up with a too much space and time on the ball. No wonder they struggle in CL.

agreed. Against wolves, the same backward passes esp coming from the back. Particularly culpable in Wolves goal: while his pace allowed him to tackle the player carrying the ball in the counter, the tackle was too weak and did not stop the play. It was time to stop the play and pick up a yellow (poor awareness). Perhaps he will improve as he gets games, but it's not like he's a youngster.

Mbappe was without a doubt. Rashford was about the same level, and it was just as hard for him to get minutes until he started delivering on the pitch. Whether Odoi might have be getting more minutes, which is prob true esp in cup games, the mistake here is to simplify things with the word "better." It really does not mean much at this level.