nadavTKL

I mean, what does it mean that a manager is not suited for a certain club? does Chelsea have a certain style that it needs to protect?

What does it mean "Not suited for Chelsea", which Chelsea are we talking about?

Mourinho out - Klopp in. As fast as possible. Coming from a "Mourinho lover" (although i never thought he's anywhere near perfect). He just lost it. Tbh i dont think he "had it" for about 3 years. Never liked his Real Madrid team, they were always very fragile (and still are), though they were one of the 2-4 best teams in the world for all his time there. Had the squad for it i guess. The first two seasons since he came back to Chelsea went right result-wise, an ok "transition season" (title chalenge and CL semi-final) and then a title, football-wise i think it also went ok until January last season, but this was his make or break season. Results+football+making that push for Europes elite group, and its a compliment to call it a "break". Its a disaster. He failed big time, he doesnt have any ideas, and he has to go.

We just met a pathetic team, like us, this draw is nothing. Mourinho has to go, the team is hopeless.

Like I said, Maccabi are without a doubt the worst team Chelsea faced in Europe in years... But it's nice to have a big win. Maccabi fans were incredible.

Maccabi is by far the worst team Chelsea played in the last few years...

Less than 2-0 win would be very bad.

In the last seasons PSG are in the same position as us and above City, showed nothing in CL to suggest they are strong enough. Maybe this season. Obviously they are a lot better than us right now though.

Premier League.. god.. 5 top clubs who just cant make the rigtht moves with all there money (not just transfer-wise). Its not only Bayern, Real and Barcelona above all PL clubs in Europe competetions, its also Atletico and Juventus.

Terrible performance tonight, really bad. I have a special relationship with Pogba. I like him, I like watching the things he can do, every time im not watching him for a while (like this summer) I'm dying to see him in Chelaea, but then I watch him in full 90 minuets 2-3 times and I'm like "wow, he's going to be the biggest flop ever when he makes that switch". It's like the 3rd time this cycle happend. It's like im a victim of all the hype around him. He has to improve, he's not really concentrating on the pitch, his actions rarely contirbute anything, and he doesn't seem very connected to his team, something about his game screams "Individual". But the problem is that he's a midfielder, you can't play like that when you're a midfielder, when you're a winger who scores lots of goals you can. Still young though, but I want to see something real from him. I seriously think Oscar can end this season as the better player, it's not far at all.

Awful, such a special talent. But he can come back just as strong im sure.. Still very young.

1) So because we dont know him we should just assume that he cant do better than our own CBs? did you knew Abdennour before he arrived to Monaco? did you knew Benatia before he arrived to Roma? I didnt knew Djilobodji as well, but the important thing is that the club knew him, they thought he's in the right profile to what Jose wanted from his new CB. Thats why they signed him. Mourinho can give them some kind of credit and put him in the squad before a player that he knows he wont play. 2) lol making assumptions about our defense? those "assumptions" comes from watching every minute of this team, and seeing what the club is trying to do in the transfer window. I dont think they'll continue to defend badly as they did till now, no, but i think Cahill-Terry cant get us to where we want to be, it was never the case. They are slow, they need protection, and we cant make the next step with them as a CB pair, thats MY opinion based on me watching every game. Zouma got to be the first name on the team sheet because he's fast and athletic, thats why Djilobodji came, because he's in the right profile for our future defense. This future has to be this season, its Mourinho's 3rd season here and some people want to see improvement, progress. With Zouma we have only one CB who fits the bill. So, those "assumptions" are very different from your assumptions about me, i dont know how and why did you make this connection.

Why would you say he's a squad player at best? you dont know him. Right now our central defense is a huge question mark - we have one ageing and super slow CB, we have a slow CB who's IMO very average, and a very young talent. Jose wanted a CB for a reason, the minimum is the put him in the CL squad instead of one of those wingers. There's no way we'll need both Kenedy and Traore when we have Hazard, Pedro and Willian. There is absolutly no need to make this decision. Jose gets nothing from it and the team gets nothing from it. Maybe he gets to show the club he's the boss and they should listen to him more, but thats helping no one right now.

You're making the assumption that im one of those "people" that you're talking about here. 1) I didnt moan about signing an unknown CB. I know that an "unknown" CB can be considered to be "World Class" in one year, it happnes every season. 2) I dont care as much as others here about integrate youth players, especially when they just came from Brazil or they're not even from Chelsea's academy. I dont see a difference between them and Papy

Got to be said that Pelegrini came to CIty when they already had a game plan. I dont think he changed that much from the good moments of the Mancini era. And needless to say City were much better than Chelsea in 11/12 and 12/13. We were a mess. So Jose had a lot more work than him. Of course its not an excuse right now after 2 years Jose is with us, just saying. I agree about the general point, but PSG's game (even against mid-table sides in France and lower) isnt that fluid and impressive as you would think they should play. You elaborated the good things about their game, but in actual attacking, actually creating chances one after another, they have a lot of work to do. They look very limited in that aspect while they have the players to do better. It was the same case for years, but their league is so easy so its good enough to win it. Add that to the horrible performances against Barcelona along the years... they're far from perfect with Blanc as manager.

This is just an horrible decision. One of the things i dislike in Mourinho is how he loves adding more and more fuel to the fire, and he just did it again. Why both Kenedy and Traore? Porque Jose? we have 3 wingers (Pedro, Willian, Hazard) who are way above those two in our hierarchy. No way that both Kenedy and Traore going to get significant amount of minutes. In central defense however we have serious issues. Right now we dont have a clear CB pair, Jose wanted a CB for a reason. So first it says he dont know Papy which we already knew, but Jose wanted a CB and the club gave him one, so ffs give the player a chance before you lower his status to "non-relevant", before he kicked a ball! if it was Stones or Abdennour, you think Traore would have made the CL squad? no way. Im sure the club dont like it, Jose is just starting wars in the most horrible moments.

Im thinking a lot about this transfer window, my conclusion on it is that the board, the club, does have a view, they look into the future and they're trying to stay on a very specific road. Its the academy and also the transfers. The question is if Mourinho is in the same mind as the board, and if he's the right manager to lead us in this road. The primary targets we had this summer - Stones, Pogba, Baba - shows that the club want to be based on the young players who will become top players. Rob Beasley (who is an annoying bastard but he was right about everything he said this summer), said it like one-two months ago - the club wants more of the Hazard, Oscar and Courtois signings. And i think the club is very specific about those type of targets, which makes the market so limited for us. The club doesnt want to spend too much on stop-gap signings, and until now it happend only when we were in some kind of pressure - (1) we wanted to win the title, didnt find a young player for an important role and had a special opportunity (Fabregas. And i think the main target for this position was Koke), (2) we were in a situation that we dont have any depth in the middle of a season (Cuadrado), and (3) when we started the season badly and Mourinho was no longer happy (Pedro, Djilobodji who was supposed to be Abdennour. Although he didnt chose to bring a stop-gap CM). Mourinho said this summer "When i came back to Chelsea, Abramovich told me you have to compete for trophis, he didnt say i have to win them". The fact he chose to say that means something about the club imo. I think the club is not as obsessed to win trophies as we may think, its just that we have a manager who is obsessed to win at all cost. This quote above is not the only one, Jose talked a lot this summer about the board and 'what we want to do as a club', and from those quotes you can easily understand its not a usual approach for him to work under, and its not easy for him. But, he says he's happy with this approach. Now we'll see, according to the way he picks his line-ups, according to the way of playing, if he really can and should lead this project. For example, there is no excuses for not giving RLC a lot of playing time (if he's really that talented, i dont know) when he competes with Mikel and Ramires, and there is no excuses to keep Ivanovic on the field when we have Baba.

I dont think its true that the club strategy is to only win in the short run. I think its completely the opposite. Off the field, our primary targets this season were very young - Baba, Pogba and Stones. And we looked like not wanting stopgap signings. The club is looking for the future, the question is if Mourinho can do the same and if he's the rigt man. He need to show it this season.

Modric wasnt a starter for him though, thats a big difference. And i dont think Ozil made things on his own, both him and Di Maria were very inconsistent. I never rated Mourinho's RM that much, i always thought its not the real deal, its almost. It was a better and more balanced side than the one we have now though, i agree about that.

I can agree with this description of a "perfect Mourinho side", but you could see a change in his views since he joined Real Madrid. He spent 3 seasons in Real and i dont think your description fits to the side he had there. And im talking about the midfield. In Porto, Chelsea 04-07 and Inter he played 4-3-3, in Real Madrid and now in Chelsea he plays 4-2-3-1. And its not just the formation, its the actual midfield players, he went from having Lampard/Sneijder - central midfilders, to Ozil - actual #10 who cant tackle. Also Khedira is not a quality box to box, i always saw him as a german Ramires. In current Chelsea his midfield is a mess - Fabregas is obviously not the DLP he wished to have, he had to settle for it becasue we couldnt get anyone else. Because of that he uses Ramires in the big games. Oscar is the odd man, is he a #10? a "Lampard/Sneijder"? We cant really tell because Cesc-Matic pivot doesnt fit Oscar. I think by changing from 4-3-3 to 4-2-3-1 with 3 AMs, Jose tried to match his sides to the more attacking minded football we see today in Europe. He had to do it in Madrid to win the La Liga but also to please the fans. In the last few years i heard him a few times saying "The formation i like in my teams is 4-2-3-1", something has changed. But him going after Pogba this summer might means he wanted to go back to 4-3-3. Tbh, Jose's targets for the summer - Pogba, Pedro, Baba, Stones - would've made us a "perfect Mourinho side" for years if we got all of them. Maybe thats what the club wants, a side that would go for a decade with little changes. And thats why they hesitate so much about getting stopgaps.

Exactly! same happend with Stones, it didnt looked like we want a CB, we only wanted Stones. But in the final week we started to look for other CB, shame we didnt do the same with CM. Maybe its because of the numbers in the squad? we had 3 CBs so Jose wanted the 4th one, and he already had enough CMs. Maybe thats the case. Miranda and Allan would've been perfect stopgaps until we get that specific CB and CM. Btw, "top quality young players" - thats what Rob Beasly said like a month ago, he said we only want those kind of players. Pedro is also a stopgap, and so is Djilobodji, but those are panic buys in the final 10 days.

If they tied Jose's hands, how come we were after a 21 year old CB "worth" 30m pounds since July? And if we showed interest in Pogba since the beginning of the summer (as reported, if anyone forgot), Mourinho thought we need some kind of reinforcement in midfield. Did the board told him "No, you cant sell Mikel and get a replacement"? i very much doubt it. We could have gone for a different CB who isnt inferior to Stones + CM who's better than Mikel/Ramires - in the region of those 30m pounds, maybe 40m max. I am sure that something changed since our bad start with all those late bidding, and im sure the board wasnt the most willing to spend the all summer until this last week, but i think that something was lacking with Mourinho's targets list as well. No real plan if the 1st targets for CB and CM cant come. If Everton are difficult, try different CBs at the same time, its not rocket science. When people say the market was awful, it sounds like something very big, but in reality it isnt - we only needed a good CB and a CM to make this summer from "awful" to "very good". Its little details and with slightly better desicions it would have happend. Thats why i think that the first one at fault is Mourinho. If we got that CM and sold Mikel we'd be talking very differently about this summer. IMO he just didnt see the need in this area, Mikel and Ramires are fine for him. Fact is that in July-Augost, i dont recall exactly, Mikel was interviewed saying Jose wants him to stay and transfer talk is not true.

The timing of the bids for those specific players (Pogba and Marquinhos) is not important, they werent availble the all summer. The important thing is to have alternatives. For CM it looks like we didnt have any, imo Mourinho is for some reason ok with Ramires and Mikel as squad options. As for CB, two options: 1) They were so sure about getting Stones that it caught them by surprise. 2) It was Stones or nothing, and then they saw how bad we're defending atm so they made some late panic bids. I dont know how this Djilobodji guy will turn out to be, CB is a position with lots of surprises compared to other positions, unknown CBs can be considered "Top Class" after one good season (Benatia, Abdennour), but getting a CM (even someone like Witsel or even Song) was a must, and it was expected from the board to bring at least a more known CB.

Those late approches for Pogba and Marquinhos just annoys me right now, makes me think of "what could have been" (although i know we had no chance to get either). Two players who would've made our squad perfect. Have to get a CB and CM of this calibre next summer, unless Oscar is exploding this season and Cesc also improving his consistency, and those two will make a good partnership.

Bizzare from the club to even try that. PSG wouldnt have sold him in May, July or 1st of September. Although i think the bids came in couple of days ago, french media reported about it. Sky are just late i think.