The European Leagues & Competitions Thread V2

[Rmpr 8,977]

I said it then, and I won't walk away from what I've said when he was appointed. Pep is going to destroy this Bayern team. The entertainment is all gone. Bundesliga is a big joke and while I think they're still very, very competitive and one of the best teams in the world, that's what they are, one of the best. Last season they were absolutely the best by a fair lead and a thrilling team to watch.

If he played a more challenging league, I don't think Bayern would be doing that well. Champions League is a completely different matter, but imo he's already destroyed part of the aura Bayern had. No one looks to Bayern now the way they did last season, unless the bandwagoners and the fans.

Although you are entitled to your opinion, I completely disagree!

Pep is an amazing coach and Bayern is playin better than they were last season. He is indeed adding a bit of his tik-taka mentality, but he still maintains some of Bayern's previous style. He is not dumb, he is mixing the best of both world!

Whether people admit it or not, Barcelona's poor form after he left just proves he wasnt just a nobody in the middle of spetacular players. He did a brilliant job there (much better than Jose at Real tbh).

It is impossible to predict what's going to happen, but if I were to bet I would bet on Bayern winning the treble again and continue to be extremely good for years to come...

[LAB 1,030]

Pepe is actually smart, regardless if the game is enjoyable or not (because that really depends on everyone's taste), his system is very strong and has proven it can get the club a lot of championships. I guess for a fan that is all what matters. It is a different matter for neutrals, they are interested in enjoying a competitive match. But for a Barca fan or a Bayern fan, it is a great system.

Very good point there that thing you said about the fan's way of thinking

[Barbara 15,149]

i kind of find it ironic people are slating pep's football when we have Jose Mourinho.

And so what?

If Mourinho decides to play tiki taka tomorrow I'll hate it just the same. I hate the STYLE, not the guy.

I'm no Guardiola's fan, but I only hate the FSW

I don't like parking the bus either, but Mourinho's pragmatic style mixed with objectiveness is something I actually like.

I'll never forget a line I heard about tiki taka football: it's too much sex for too few orgasms.

In that case, no thanks.

Although you are entitled to your opinion, I completely disagree!

Pep is an amazing coach and Bayern is playin better than they were last season. He is indeed adding a bit of his tik-taka mentality, but he still maintains some of Bayern's previous style. He is not dumb, he is mixing the best of both world!

Whether people admit it or not, Barcelona's poor form after he left just proves he wasnt just a nobody in the middle of spetacular players. He did a brilliant job there (much better than Jose at Real tbh).

It is impossible to predict what's going to happen, but if I were to bet I would bet on Bayern winning the treble again and continue to be extremely good for years to come...

I don't think Barcelona poor form has that much to do with that. Of course they felt his absence, but they were still a top team two years ago. The thing is the form of their players. Xavi, Iniesta and especially Messi had physical issues in the last couple of years and they've always been the core of their team.

I'm not saying Pep isn't a top manager (nor am I now saying he is, as I'm one of those people who would like to see him work with not a super team and see what he gets from that), but imo his Bayern doesn't play anywhere close Heynckes'. That team was a machine, the way they played while not my fave style of football was exciting. Pep's boring, just like his Barcelona was boring (then again, it's my personal taste). They seem better simply because there was an incredible drop from other german sides - especially Dortmund. I've watched their matches against Arsenal and ManCity and imo that team doesn't compare to Jupp's, but as you said, it's about opinion (and I guess also taste).

That doesn't mean I don't think Bayern isn't one of the faves. They just don't have the large gap they had last season compared to others. Nobody came close to them, now there are teams that can play against them equally imo.

But I wonder what any of the good managers in Europe wouldn't do with the best squads in the world of football at their disposal. I'm not dismissing Pep's work, I'm just not totally convinced he's that great when the two works he's done he did it with the best teams in the world squad wise... I'd just like to see him managing a club that while one of the top, not the best. He would have convinced me of anything if he accepted United, for example, and had them leading EPL.

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

And so what?

If Mourinho decides to play tiki taka tomorrow I'll hate it just the same. I hate the STYLE, not the guy.

I'm no Guardiola's fan, but I only hate the FSW

I don't like parking the bus either, but Mourinho's pragmatic style mixed with objectiveness is something I actually like.

I'll never forget a line I heard about tiki taka football: it's too much sex for too few orgasms.

In that case, no thanks.

I don't think Barcelona poor form has that much to do with that. Of course they felt his absence, but they were still a top team two years ago. The thing is the form of their players. Xavi, Iniesta and especially Messi had physical issues in the last couple of years and they've always been the core of their team.

I'm not saying Pep isn't a top manager (nor am I now saying he is, as I'm one of those people who would like to see him work with not a super team and see what he gets from that), but imo his Bayern doesn't play anywhere close Heynckes'. That team was a machine, the way they played while not my fave style of football was exciting. Pep's boring, just like his Barcelona was boring (then again, it's my personal taste). They seem better simply because there was an incredible drop from other german sides - especially Dortmund. I've watched their matches against Arsenal and ManCity and imo that team doesn't compare to Jupp's, but as you said, it's about opinion (and I guess also taste).

That doesn't mean I don't think Bayern isn't one of the faves. They just don't have the large gap they had last season compared to others. Nobody came close to them, now there are teams that can play against them equally imo.

But I wonder what any of the good managers in Europe wouldn't do with the best squads in the world of football at their disposal. I'm not dismissing Pep's work, I'm just not totally convinced he's that great when the two works he's done he did it with the best teams in the world squad wise... I'd just like to see him managing a club that while one of the top, not the best. He would have convinced me of anything if he accepted United, for example, and had them leading EPL.

Real Madrid have had the best squad for years, and top mangers took over and the results were really poor. If you take Bayern's squad and analyze them individually, I don't think they have the greatest individuals. they sure have some amongst the best but for sure not the majority of the starters. The system that he uses depends really on the team working together as a unit and constantly dominating the midfield are. Creativity is done through players moving without the ball. Ofcourse it helps when you have individual dribbling skills to spice it up but never the less it mainly focuses on team work. I don't disagree with you when you say it is boring cause that is every individual's taste. But I don't see their dominance is entirely because Dortmund dropped ( maybe partially). This system has always proven efficiency under Pepe and they have proven it this year against top European teams. Most likely he would dominate the EPL if he was managing a good club that can buy players ( not the best players but the ones that would fit his system). The only manager I have seen who can counter his strategy is Mourinho who has proved it with Chelsea, Barcelona and Madrid

[Eligius 121]

And so what?

If Mourinho decides to play tiki taka tomorrow I'll hate it just the same. I hate the STYLE, not the guy.

I'm no Guardiola's fan, but I only hate the FSW

I don't like parking the bus either, but Mourinho's pragmatic style mixed with objectiveness is something I actually like.

I'll never forget a line I heard about tiki taka football: it's too much sex for too few orgasms.

In that case, no thanks.

I don't think Barcelona poor form has that much to do with that. Of course they felt his absence, but they were still a top team two years ago. The thing is the form of their players. Xavi, Iniesta and especially Messi had physical issues in the last couple of years and they've always been the core of their team.

I'm not saying Pep isn't a top manager (nor am I now saying he is, as I'm one of those people who would like to see him work with not a super team and see what he gets from that), but imo his Bayern doesn't play anywhere close Heynckes'. That team was a machine, the way they played while not my fave style of football was exciting. Pep's boring, just like his Barcelona was boring (then again, it's my personal taste). They seem better simply because there was an incredible drop from other german sides - especially Dortmund. I've watched their matches against Arsenal and ManCity and imo that team doesn't compare to Jupp's, but as you said, it's about opinion (and I guess also taste).

That doesn't mean I don't think Bayern isn't one of the faves. They just don't have the large gap they had last season compared to others. Nobody came close to them, now there are teams that can play against them equally imo.

But I wonder what any of the good managers in Europe wouldn't do with the best squads in the world of football at their disposal. I'm not dismissing Pep's work, I'm just not totally convinced he's that great when the two works he's done he did it with the best teams in the world squad wise... I'd just like to see him managing a club that while one of the top, not the best. He would have convinced me of anything if he accepted United, for example, and had them leading EPL.

Pep has done a fantastic job with Bayern this season. They are undefeated in their domestic league, qualified to the next round of the champs league and won the supercup +club world cup. He has taken Philip Lahm to another level and brought Rafinha into relevancy. He has both their cm injured for most of the season, sold Gustavo/loaned kirkoff and still able to flourished without any proper cm.

He gave julian green and weiser some game time and pierre a few games.

Last year, they won the treble, however, dortmund was on their level even without gotze (and the Champs league final). This season, bayern has absolutely destroyed BVB minus the one preseason game.

Pep has done far better than what I imagine. To be undefeated in any domestic league is a superior accomplishment.

The only thing I will ever slate Pep on is his dumb transfers.

[Eligius 121]

Real Madrid have had the best squad for years, and top mangers took over and the results were really poor. If you take Bayern's squad and analyze them individually, I don't think they have the greatest individuals. they sure have some amongst the best but for sure not the majority of the starters. The system that he uses depends really on the team working together as a unit and constantly dominating the midfield are. Creativity is done through players moving without the ball. Ofcourse it helps when you have individual dribbling skills to spice it up but never the less it mainly focuses on team work. I don't disagree with you when you say it is boring cause that is every individual's taste. But I don't see their dominance is entirely because Dortmund dropped ( maybe partially). This system has always proven efficiency under Pepe and they have proven it this year against top European teams. Most likely he would dominate the EPL if he was managing a good club that can buy players ( not the best players but the ones that would fit his system). The only manager I have seen who can counter his strategy is Mourinho who has proved it with Chelsea, Barcelona and Madrid

I disagree with only your first point.

Bayern Munich has the best team overall and the best team individually.

Next season, their team will be better.

In: Robert Lewandowski, Sebastian Rode and I can bet pep will bring one player at least.

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

I disagree with only your first point.

Bayern Munich has the best team overall and the best team individually.

You think the defensive line of Bayern is the best individually? with the exception of Lahm ofcourse

[Barbara 15,149]

Real Madrid have had the best squad for years, and top mangers took over and the results were really poor. If you take Bayern's squad and analyze them individually, I don't think they have the greatest individuals. they sure have some amongst the best but for sure not the majority of the starters. The system that he uses depends really on the team working together as a unit and constantly dominating the midfield are. Creativity is done through players moving without the ball. Ofcourse it helps when you have individual dribbling skills to spice it up but never the less it mainly focuses on team work. I don't disagree with you when you say it is boring cause that is every individual's taste. But I don't see their dominance is entirely because Dortmund dropped ( maybe partially). This system has always proven efficiency under Pepe and they have proven it this year against top European teams. Most likely he would dominate the EPL if he was managing a good club that can buy players ( not the best players but the ones that would fit his system). The only manager I have seen who can counter his strategy is Mourinho who has proved it with Chelsea, Barcelona and Madrid

I'm not saying they're bad under Pep, just that they were more overwhelming with Jupp. I felt like they were more feared and teams had less hope of beating them because they were brutal. This Pep team isn't by any means weak, poor, bad, or even only good. They're great, but the style will always afford a good opposition to gamble with a result especially in UCL knock-outs.

I just think last year Bayern >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this year's Bayern, both performance and excitement levels. They're still a great team, one that is hard to beat, but I think they were nearly unbeatable under Jupp, I don't feel that as much under Pep.

Now @Eligius does have relevant points about a few players. Lahm is one of my fave players in the world and is a pleasure to watch him. I'm not sure if Pep improved him. I don't know, I'll always see him as a FB... but yeah, he did a great job with Rafinha, that's for sure.

You think the defensive line of Bayern is the best individually? with the exception of Lahm ofcourse

if we consider RM the second best squad in the world (or the best as you do) I think Bayern's defense is better than Pepe + Ramos. it doesn't need much to be better than Pepe + Ramos. Marcelo isn't that amazing defending (although he improved 300% working under Mourinho) and Carbajal still has to prove a few things imo. And that comes from someone who dislikes Dante.

[Rmpr 8,977]

You think the defensive line of Bayern is the best individually? with the exception of Lahm ofcourse

I agree. I think Bayern's defensive line took a major blow after Demichelis left!

[Eligius 121]

You think the defensive line of Bayern is the best individually? with the exception of Lahm ofcourse

Lahm and Alaba are the best in their position along with manuel Neuer.

Boateng and Dante are good (at the min). However, like David Luiz, Dante does tend to make mistakes quite a bit.

However, I'm not really sure what defensive line I would take over Bayern (+ gk). Maybe Roma.

[Billy. 2,739]

Surly we want City to turn this around so they have two more games to play

[Rmpr 8,977]

Lahm and Alaba are the best in their position

Alaba is just a little above average, sorry!

He is a product of an amazing team and I believe he'd fail anywhere else. Marcelo is light years ahead of him...

[bushman 2,043]

Come on Citeh, whip these dwarfs tonight.

[Milan 17,835]

This stadium will always bring those memories of us defending like lions and then celebrating like mad

[bushman 2,043]

I already like the way Citeh started. Just get at them.

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

I'm not saying they're bad under Pep, just that they were more overwhelming with Jupp. I felt like they were more feared and teams had less hope of beating them because they were brutal. This Pep team isn't by any means weak, poor, bad, or even only good. They're great, but the style will always afford a good opposition to gamble with a result especially in UCL knock-outs.

I just think last year Bayern >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this year's Bayern, both performance and excitement levels. They're still a great team, one that is hard to beat, but I think they were nearly unbeatable under Jupp, I don't feel that as much under Pep.

Now @Eligius does have relevant points about a few players. Lahm is one of my fave players in the world and is a pleasure to watch him. I'm not sure if Pep improved him. I don't know, I'll always see him as a FB... but yeah, he did a great job with Rafinha, that's for sure.

if we consider RM the second best squad in the world (or the best as you do) I think Bayern's defense is better than Pepe + Ramos. it doesn't need much to be better than Pepe + Ramos. Marcelo isn't that amazing defending (although he improved 300% working under Mourinho) and Carbajal still has to prove a few things imo. And that comes from someone who dislikes Dante.

I guess I explained it poorly with regards to Real Madrid. I was referring to Madrid when they had Zidane, Roberto Carlos, Figo, Ronaldo, Raul, Cannavaro and the rest of the team. Individually they were the best squad at the time. To me a dream team, however they failed with every coach they had, no matter the name of the coach and experience. Barca dominated them. My point is that a great squad with poor management most likel will bring no results because of the players' major ego and expectation that the rest of their teammates would adapt to their style.

Lahm is my was always my second favor RB after Micon. I agree with you he hasn't improved under Pepe but again he is a well established player.

I don't know if Bayern is less threatening. City and Arsenal suffered in all of their first games against them. When the results didn't mean much in the group stage, Bayern was relaxed and even last night they got what they wanted with minimal effort

[Jase 43,479]

Couldn't watch the game yesterday but judging from what I've read, seems that Arsenal were pretty negative with their approach yesterday against Bayern and were so outpowered that they could have easily lost, no? Yet, have seen the media seem to praise them for their brave and resilient display while we were ridiculed when our games in the Champions League were similar in the last few season.

[Mohammed Seif 1,451]

Lahm and Alaba are the best in their position along with manuel Neuer.

Boateng and Dante are good (at the min). However, like David Luiz, Dante does tend to make mistakes quite a bit.

However, I'm not really sure what defensive line I would take over Bayern (+ gk). Maybe Roma.

I don't think Boeteng, Dante and Alaba are the best individually. But as far as team work is concerned they have great chemistry and are tactically aware of each others' position.