Wishlist Cristiano Ronaldo

[Nike 373]

Hasen't been the case in years, Barca fans will tell you how lazy Messi has become on the pitch. One of the greatest asset Barca had in their prime was their pressing game, Messi lack of pressing has really tarnished that aspect of their game.

Messi is better slightly over Ronaldo, i give him the advantage because of his overall game.

not just Messi, its their whole team from Messi/iniesta/xavi down to their alves/pique.....

Messi is not better slightly, but signficantly over Cristiano.

[Joker10 946]

He hasn't been the same since 2012 but that comment is quite a poor one considering the amount of times he has won Barca games by the stretch of his fingers, whether individually or involving everyone. Against Real Madrid for example, assists and scores bag loads against them these past couple years.

Barca fans will also tell you how no body else presses like they used to, not just Messi. And the fact that Xavi has declined tremendously after Pep has left and the defense has turned to shit.

This season however isn't the case, Messi looks to be coming to his regular best and the team is ticking together.

ugh

First of nowhere did i say he has not won Barca games single handedly, he is a great goal scorer and creator.

Secondly nowhere did i say that Barca downfall was only attributed to their pressing game. Read my post again

When Messi was out injured last season Barca pressed so much better it was no coincidence. We also saw in the World Cup how nonchalantly he was strolling on the pitch when the opposition had the ball. The current Messi would have never gotten away with it under Pep, he has lost discipline in that aspect of the game.

Xavi decline has nothing to do with Pep, not sure if you are concluding that or using Pep departure as a timeline. Xavi decline it was inevitable just like any great player when they age. It was always been my opinion that Barca decline is mainly attributed with Xavi own decline. Beside their pressing, Barca is nowhere near as dominant on the ball as they used to be. Possession % will not show that, but it is clear they are not enjoying meaningful possession as they used to.

Their defense has always been shit, it just happens that their pressing and ability to keep the ball masked that for too long.

[Nike 373]

Messi is a fantastic team player who will perform the individual action when needed, but will always look for a nice combination.

Ronaldo is a fantastic player who plays for Ronaldo. He will always go for individual success.

He's the better athlete but there's no competition in who's been the bigger player looking at their careers. Messi doesn't even have to win the WC to probably be considered the greatest ever when he retires. Difference between him and Pele/Cruyff (in a lesser extent Maradona) is that he's getting to their numbers or more playing against athletic defenders that would fucking eat the hearts of every player from before the 90s. Pele was playing amateurs for most of his career. Messi and Ronaldo (and every great player from this era or the one before) get zero space.

I wouldnt really call the generation of Messi/Cristiano to be elite defenders.........

[RoyalBlues 4,050]

Why it is turn out to be Messi - Ronaldo comparison here? It is eternal topic, that will gonna last forever.

[Nike 373]

People talk about Cristiano and Messi being the greatest in the era, but Philip Lahm to me will be remembered as one of the best full backs/players ever....

TBF, I would take lahm over Messi and Cristiano on my team.

[Kieran. 6,317]

People talk about Cristiano and Messi being the greatest in the era, but Philip Lahm to me will be remembered as one of the best full backs/players ever....

TBF, I would take lahm over Messi and Cristiano on my team.

Why

[Nike 373]

Why

Lahm is the perfect team player, the perfect fullback.

Amazing going forward and amazing defending.

His crossing, sliding, passing and overlapping is the best in the business.

And has amazing stamina and speed/agility/quickness.

[nadavTKL 1,787]

People talk about Cristiano and Messi being the greatest in the era, but Philip Lahm to me will be remembered as one of the best full backs/players ever....

TBF, I would take lahm over Messi and Cristiano on my team.

It's good you're not a manager... They will sack you faster than abramovich.

[Nike 373]

It's good you're not a manager... They will sack you faster than abramovich.

Go ask Jose who he would take out of the 3.

[iseah100 5,612]

Go ask Jose who he would take out of the 3.

He said they are all good, but he wouldn't take any of them over any of his current players.

[HD3D 1,038]

This is one of the shittiest arguments ever. If that was true, everyone would be Pele/Cruyff in those times, if the defenders were shitty and not athletic why didn't every attacking player shit on them like Pele/Cruyff? Were the other attacking players facing different and better defenders? I don't think so. Also, if Pele/Cruyff were athletic when others weren't or if they took it more seriously than other professional players, kudos to them, they understood what it took to win better than the others.

According to your logic, let's say in some years from now everyone is born from genetic selection, people are then gonna say Messi wasn't actually that good because he played against natural born people who weren't the best genetic composition their parents or the human race could offer? Gimme a break - Pele, Cruyff and Messi were playing under the same conditions as everybody else from their respective professional times, if they stood out from everybody is because they were incredible, they were ahead of the bunch. That's what makes them legends of the game.

His argument is actually valid. Pele, for example, played before the tactical revolution of total football. He played at a time where small teams were cannon fodder to be beaten 10-0 in a lot of games. Not unlike today where it's not uncommon for a small team to beat a big one (e.g. Leicester vs United) if the managers do a good job. Football is much more tactical and organized. Today players like Messi and Cristiano are given a very specific list of instructions whereas back then, the star of the team was just told to get in there and try to score goals.

Besides, today the very best players from all continents are concentrated in Europe. Even small teams have players from all over the world. Which means players like Messi and Cristiano are competing at a level that Pele, for example, never had to deal with. Not even close.

I do believe the top players today are much better than the ones from past generations. And certainly football will continue to evolve and 50 years from now those generations will be even better than the ones from today.

[Dion 2,476]

His argument is actually valid. Pele, for example, played before the tactical revolution of total football. He played at a time where small teams were cannon fodder to be beaten 10-0 in a lot of games. Not unlike today where it's not uncommon for a small team to beat a big one (e.g. Leicester vs United) if the managers do a good job. Football is much more tactical and organized. Today players like Messi and Cristiano are given a very specific list of instructions whereas back then, the star of the team was just told to get in there and try to score goals.

Besides, today the very best players from all continents are concentrated in Europe. Even small teams have players from all over the world. Which means players like Messi and Cristiano are competing at a level that Pele, for example, never had to deal with. Not even close.

I do believe the top players today are much better than the ones from past generations. And certainly football will continue to evolve and 50 years from now those generations will be even better than the ones from today.

Nothing from what you said goes against my argument - the cannon fodder were there for everyone, not just for the greats of football. It's the same to the tactical side, everyone was lacking, it was not like Pele's team (Santos) had it any better than anyone else tactically speaking. And besides, there is still a lot of cannon fodder today - it's just that Leicester is a good team in the EPL, the most balanced from the top european leagues (and even then there's quite a gap, it's more about Man Utd struggling than Leicester being a super team). But look at the La Liga or Bundesliga, the small teams rarely ever beat the top teams and it's not uncommon for them to get thrashed really hard - RM and Barça have just thrashed some teams in their last games. And if anything, it's the opposite, you got it backwards, today the smaller teams have bigger gaps to close than in those times, just look at England, the domestic league winners used to vary a lot but now the gap between the best teams and the weaker ones is such that you know the teams who have a chance to win from the very beginning. Just look at the time frame from 50 to 70 which is close to the same as Pele's professional carreer - there were 11 different teams winning the most important domestic league in England. Do you reckon there will be 11 different teams winning the major leagues in the next years? I don't think so. For example, in the last 20 years only 5 have won it and just because Blackburn has managed a title, otherwise only Chelsea, Manchester Utd, Manchester City and Arsenal would have won it.

One could even say the fact it was more amateurish and less tactical made it more even and fair to every player back then, whereas now, the stellar squads the top teams have leave little room for anyone else to have a shot at the championships, these top teams have better players and usually also better managers - so they're on top in every regard. The only valid argument against past legends is about their numbers, because of differences between football ages, some ages had higher average goals scored and things like that, but I don't think I have seen people comparing stars from different timeframes with the argument that X is better than Y because X has 1000 goals and Y has 500.

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

Go ask Jose who he would take out of the 3.

Haha, like he wouldn't buy Messi if he had the chance.

[johnnythefirst 1,076]

His argument is actually valid. Pele, for example, played before the tactical revolution of total football. He played at a time where small teams were cannon fodder to be beaten 10-0 in a lot of games. Not unlike today where it's not uncommon for a small team to beat a big one (e.g. Leicester vs United) if the managers do a good job. Football is much more tactical and organized. Today players like Messi and Cristiano are given a very specific list of instructions whereas back then, the star of the team was just told to get in there and try to score goals.

Besides, today the very best players from all continents are concentrated in Europe. Even small teams have players from all over the world. Which means players like Messi and Cristiano are competing at a level that Pele, for example, never had to deal with. Not even close.

I do believe the top players today are much better than the ones from past generations. And certainly football will continue to evolve and 50 years from now those generations will be even better than the ones from today.

Thanks!

Just look at the current world cup and at how hard it is to beat the smaller teams once they've learned how to organise their defense. Remember for example Algeria? All of the major countries would have eaten a small African one like them up 40 years ago.

Although it is kind of unfair to compare generations, there's no doubt professional football players have to work much, much harder to get to a decent level today. No slackers allowed. The fact that Messi and Ronaldo can get Pele-like stats (ok, playing for the best teams of the era) in a period where the average defender is an athlete and has more technical qualities than the average No 10 in the seventies (Kompany, to name just one), in a period where nearly every smaller team parks the bus against them, in a period where almost every manager is a decent tactician, is insane.

Look at matches from earlier eras, look how the defenders just stand there, like it's some kind of magician they're playing against. I'm not saying Pele wouldn't have turned out as good if he was born in 1990, but we'll never know.

[Special Juan 28,104]

Just an insane scoring record, not even funny that he's scored 25 hatricks.