The Benitez Thread

[didierforever 7,349]

Great post for taking everything out of context. I'm bored of arguing with you. We both have nothing new to say to eachother, quite repetitive. Our new signings are all great, but they lack experience in PL. They are young enough not to be mature even as people. Regarding Moses, we are missing him dearly atm but saying things like he has been regular in EPL for 2 seasons, so what? He hasn't been in a big club like Chelsea fighting to win every game, every competition - he lacks that winner's mentality and know-how how to perform week in week out, grind results.. Besides, Titus Bramble is a PL veteran, can't say I'd trust him in our defense regardless. Sacking AVB ?- no FFP, this time another story.

I'm really surprised with your last line - I've been posting fucking essays to this thread in reply to you driving home a point that what's going on atm is not ONLY his fault but a more complex situation that involves the players, the fans, the board. However, still you go on stating that every person, who can see a wider picture here, is somehow a torres fan and benitez suck up. To make a point clear, I hate Torres and Benitez doesn't belong to this club. The way I was raised up , though, doesn't allow me to sink as low as start insulting others whenever things go sour.

"I'm bored of arguing with you" the feeling is mutual.

"We both have nothing new to say to eachother, quite repetitive" totally agree.

"Regarding Moses, we are missing him dearly atm but saying things like he

has been regular in EPL for 2 seasons, so what? He hasn't been in a big

club like Chelsea fighting to win every game, every competition - he

lacks that winner's mentality and know-how how to perform week in week

out, grind results." this is the comment tat would probably kill moses' soul if he ever read it. the guy has been quite consistent. has performed really well wenever he has got a chance. the only really poor performance would be cwc final.

the last line seems to have hurt u so sorry for that. but i still hold on to some beliefs no matter what. all u need to do is read some of the posts from posters like rafafan etc or a lot of them in torres' thread to know what they put first, chelsea or the blondie and FSW.

[MetsajCFC 1,255]

"i think its the players fault" saying that over and over again, is that not repetitive when in my last to last post i have already said y it cant be the players' mistake because this is not the firt 2-0 lead we have given away this season. neither is it the first time that a team has got 2 shots on goals and 2 goals for it. even the qpr match was 1 shot i goal. it is way more deep than "the player not marking their men perfectly"... so its not my fault tht i keeping saying the same thing again and again when he keeps giving the same argument again and again.

azpi is a gem of a player, so is oscar, so is moses and so is hazard, expecting them to perform and a consistent leve is deluded???? how can u say that? what team are they playing for? the fucking european champions? what do u think they were bought for? to play 5 good games this season. this "young players so cant do much" argument is lame. do i need to tell u that by no means do u have a young squad. cahill,luiz,rambo,mikel in 25s. lamps, JT, cole, cech in 30s. iva-28/29. torres and ba both over 27. we have squad with a proper range of age.

this group of people maybe "unmanagable" even though i dont really understand what u mean by that because jose won us 2 pl, carlo got a double, rdm won fa and ucl, gus won fa andi can bet anythin that any manager dint have as bad a record as FSW. the point is we dont look like winning any thing at the moment and we dont look like finishing 4th at the moment if any team behind us hits form.

3 of them sacked, 1 didn't want to keep managing us even after leaving the Russian post, opting for Turkey

Never said it is player's fault. It's a mix of rubbish performance by most of the squad, questionable tactics/subs and most of the fans not helping the cause by acting like twats. You make it sound as if managers control the player on the field as it was FIFA or something, it's not. Just look at the second Reading goal, someone from the defence fucked up and rather than taking his position was caught up and cost us. Just like Ivanovic, who threw away the semi finals (not blaming him for it, he made two schoolboy errors but who of us doesn't from time to time?)

And about the young players we've got. They're doing fine, in fact better than most of us hoped for. But they're young. No matter how talented you are as a footballer, growing up as a person mentally takes time. Just look at the Hazard situation with the ball boy, I'm sure more experienced and older players would have perhaps dealt with it some other way, especially looking at the situation we were in. So yes, it's deluded to put pressure on them to constantly put in world class performances. They need time and not pressure. Plus in Terry we've lost a leader on the pitch (hasn't played that much recently). Lampard of course is an icon in the club but he comes across more mild and even abit shy at times, which is totally fine but not a trait of a natural leader. Not everyone who is in the club for a long time automatically become leaders and captain material. I'd never see Mata being a captain for the same reason. He comes across as a great lad but a leader not only comforts and supports his mates but also pushes them and demands. Not many like that.

[SinineUltra 1,170]

"I'm bored of arguing with you" the feeling is mutual.

"We both have nothing new to say to eachother, quite repetitive" totally agree.

"Regarding Moses, we are missing him dearly atm but saying things like he

has been regular in EPL for 2 seasons, so what? He hasn't been in a big

club like Chelsea fighting to win every game, every competition - he

lacks that winner's mentality and know-how how to perform week in week

out, grind results." this is the comment tat would probably kill moses' soul if he ever read it. the guy has been quite consistent. has performed really well wenever he has got a chance. the only really poor performance would be cwc final.

the last line seems to have hurt u so sorry for that. but i still hold on to some beliefs no matter what. all u need to do is read some of the posts from posters like rafafan etc or a lot of them in torres' thread to know what they put first, chelsea or the blondie and FSW.

Fair enough. I think Rafafan and Rupert are extreme on their views on Benitez - I don't agree with them. I think our views aren't as far away from eachother as we might think. Only difference is that I'm a bit more reserved saying out lines like Rafa out etc, I'm not entirely sure if the positives in sacking him would overweigh the negatives.

Edit: Regarding Moses: perhaps the part, where I said that he lack winner's mentality is wrong. Though, rest of it I stand by, because you can't actually know something untill you've experienced it.

[bushman 2,043]

Anyone who constantly bash Rafa only should look at the team much closer & then judge, I feel.

There is hardly anyone here who likes what Rafa´s doing. Still there is no reason to blame him only for the sad shape this club is in.

[didierforever 7,349]

3 of them sacked, 1 didn't want to keep managing us even after leaving the Russian post, opting for Turkey

Never said it is player's fault. It's a mix of rubbish performance by most of the squad, questionable tactics/subs and most of the fans not helping the cause by acting like twats. You make it sound as if managers control the player on the field as it was FIFA or something, it's not. Just look at the second Reading goal, someone from the defence fucked up and rather than taking his position was caught up and cost us. Just like Ivanovic, who threw away the semi finals (not blaming him for it, he made two schoolboy errors but who of us doesn't from time to time?)

And about the young players we've got. They're doing fine, in fact better than most of us hoped for. But they're young. No matter how talented you are as a footballer, growing up as a person mentally takes time. Just look at the Hazard situation with the ball boy, I'm sure more experienced and older players would have perhaps dealt with it some other way, especially looking at the situation we were in. So yes, it's deluded to put pressure on them to constantly put in world class performances. They need time and not pressure. Plus in Terry we've lost a leader on the pitch. Lampard of course is a icon in the club but he comes across more mild and even abit shy at times, which is totally fine but not a trait of a natural leader. Not everyone who is in the club for a long time automatically become leaders and captain material. I'd never see Mata being a captain for the same reason. He comes across as a great lad but a leader not only comforts and supports his mates but also pushes them and demands. Not many like that.

the point was they won even if they got sacked plus all of them will have a better record than fsw does at this moment while managing a much egotistical group of players (remember DD, ballack, anelka, JT lamps). yet this guy has proven the worst of the lot and with some light years to spare.

your argument of a natural leader makes perfect sense in big matches but we are not struggling in those mathces (atleast in pl). we won away to everton, stoke and at home against arsenal but could not manage a win against qpr,soton, reading,swansea and brentford. it does not go down on captaincy and leadersgip because that is needed most in big and important matches.

as for your young player argument, i think its lame and even senseless. u dont need a "world class performance"as u put it , in every match u play. no one is expecting them to play every match like the way we played against barca. your argument of "pressure" would hold true if we were performing poorly against big teams. but we seem to win most of our important games or games against "good" teams like everton, arsenal, tottenham, even united, stoke, but suprisingly fail to do so against qpr,swansea,soton and reading? how is there more "pressure" on these players to perform in those matches rather than the more difficult ones.

[didierforever 7,349]

Fair enough. I think Rafafan and Rupert are extreme on their views on Benitez - I don't agree with them. I think our views aren't as far away from eachother as we might think. Only difference is that I'm a bit more reserved saying out lines like Rafa out etc, I'm not entirely sure if the positives in sacking him would overweigh the negatives.

Edit: Regarding Moses: perhaps the part, where I said that he lack winner's mentality is wrong. Though, rest of it I stand by, because you can't actually know something untill you've experienced it.

this is where we differ.

[SinineUltra 1,170]

this is where we differ.

Yep, and by sacking him I mean right away or should he stay till the end of the season and then leave.

[MetsajCFC 1,255]

the point was they won even if they got sacked plus all of them will have a better record than fsw does at this moment while managing a much egotistical group of players (remember DD, ballack, anelka, JT lamps). yet this guy has proven the worst of the lot and with some light years to spare.

your argument of a natural leader makes perfect sense in big matches but we are not struggling in those mathces (atleast in pl). we won away to everton, stoke and at home against arsenal but could not manage a win against qpr,soton, reading,swansea and brentford. it does not go down on captaincy and leadersgip because that is needed most in big and important matches.

as for your young player argument, i think its lame and even senseless. u dont need a "world class performance"as u put it , in every match u play. no one is expecting them to play every match like the way we played against barca. your argument of "pressure" would hold true if we were performing poorly against big teams. but we seem to win most of our important games or games against "good" teams like everton, arsenal, tottenham, even united, stoke, but suprisingly fail to do so against qpr,swansea,soton and reading? how is there more "pressure" on these players to perform in those matches rather than the more difficult ones.

We've both gone to the extremes with our examples and comparisons but I feel both of us get the point both of us are trying to make. I'm all for sacking Rafa but the argument I've read so much in this thread that "anyone can do better job than Rafa" isn't cutting it for me. I just want some consistency. If you look at the top teams (with the exception of some teams), they've had one manager in for so long time and he has had time to insert his authority and game plan, plus getting in the players he needs to implement it. I'm only supporting sacking him right now if we get a proper replacement in that will stay for years rather than 4 months only for this manager saga to continue.

Playing against "weaker" teams is as important as playing against the top clubs. They all give the same amount of points. Doesn't it show maturity and professionalism of a player if he takes every game seriously. It's like high school students saying "oh, I don't need to study this or that, I'll won't need it after I graduate" while good students force themselves to get the results needed in any subject. Winning against top teams won't make you a champion. Taking every game seriously and winning regardless of the opposition or magnitude of the game makes champions. It's a lame excuse to say that it's Rafa's job to make them want to play or show up for the game. It's their job and frankly earning 100k a week should be a boost as well to give your everything 90 minutes a week.

[didierforever 7,349]

We've both gone to the extremes with our examples and comparisons but I feel both of us get the point both of us are trying to make. I'm all for sacking Rafa but the argument I've read so much in this thread that "anyone can do better job than Rafa" isn't cutting it for me. I just want some consistency. If you look at the top teams (with the exception of some teams), they've had one manager in for so long time and he has had time to insert his authority and game plan, plus getting in the players he needs to implement it. I'm only supporting sacking him right now if we get a proper replacement in that will stay for years rather than 4 months only for this manager saga to continue.

Playing against "weaker" teams is as important as playing against the top clubs. They all give the same amount of points. Doesn't it show maturity and professionalism of a player if he takes every game seriously. It's like high school students saying "oh, I don't need to study this or that, I'll won't need it after I graduate" while good students force themselves to get the results needed in any subject. Winning against top teams won't make you a champion. Taking every game seriously and winning regardless of the opposition or magnitude of the game makes champions. It's a lame excuse to say that it's Rafa's job to make them want to play or show up for the game. It's their job and frankly earning 100k a week should be a boost as well to give your everything 90 minutes a week.

answering to your first para would be repetitive as u say. but i do feel any1 can do a better job and if employing a new manager for 4 months gets us CL spot then do it because i cant see any big name manager (and by that i mean "the special one'") coming back if we dont get CL football.

as for your 2nd para, this is more like it. players would tend to take those "easy" games lightly and whose responsibility do u think it is to make sure that does not happen. i mean look at cleverly, rafael, welbexk... thats man management of youth or young players because earning high wages and all would give a certain extent of responsibilty which our players are able to fulfil but turning up for each and every match has to be the manager's responsibilty at that age.

[bushman 2,043]

Moreover you too....?

[nadavTKL 1,787]

Benitez: "Hopefully, in the next couple of months we can maintain our consistency"

[zolayes 14,489]

does he mean consistently FUCKING UP ?

TWO NIL oops TWO TWO

[xPetrCechx 13,582]

does he mean consistently FUCKING UP ?

TWO NIL oops TWO TWO

LOL!!!

[bushman 2,043]

When players score Rafa is one happy coach, I read.

[xPetrCechx 13,582]

[Stingray 9,441]

Moehahahahahahahahahahahaha :-) FSH :-)

[xPetrCechx 13,582]

Moehahahahahahahahahahahaha :-) FSH :-)

Yeah... He is Killing Chelsea...

[different level 1,056]

I have the feeling if the team doesn't start delivering the results we may endure a second managerial change for the season. Even I, when I promised myself I'm going to give Rafa a chance, am running out of patience, especially after he managed not to win a couple of already won games, his late reactions for substitutions when it was obvious things are not going our way.

[Muzchap 8,966]

I have the feeling if the team doesn't start delivering the results we may endure a second managerial change for the season. Even I, when I promised myself I'm going to give Rafa a chance, am running out of patience, especially after he managed not to win a couple of already won games, his late reactions for substitutions when it was obvious things are not going our way.

Yup sadly that's happening to most people - I also said give him a chance - I hoped for the guy that got Valencia winning, instead, like Torres - we have a washed up lunatic with the decision making prowess of a person consuming their body weight in LSD...

Honestly, he must be seeing Unicorns vs Dragons on the pitch - because he's not watching the same game as us...

Just hope today goes well!

[bushman 2,043]

Rafa is not liked at Chelsea now or before. Whether he is doing well or not that´s debatable.

However, constant abuses, boos do not help the team at all.

Perhaps, it´s time to shut up & support the team, instead ?