César Azpilicueta

[Vesper 29,022]

2 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Yeah, when it comes to performance it should be Kovacic because even if we play shit, Kova performs.
Rüdiger could be Captain and I think he will be the one because he is always shouting to the guys. Jorgi would be the other one shouting at the players.

Any of those three would be fine, but this only matters if Azpi gets benched

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Azpi, AC, Mount (his goal aside) Zouma, and Kepa have been disasterclass lately

super troubling all have chosen the same time to collapse

and Willian (who otherwise has been playing great IMHO) picked a fucked up game to all of a sudden go trigger-scared and not shoot

the West Ham and now Everton games have left me more frustrated than I have been in ages

I detest losing to shit teams and even more so, I detest having a shit defence

to be honest

we are playing just like Derby did, score a tonne, but give up more

Lamps so far looks fairly clueless on how to organise a defence 

FOUR clean sheets in 25 games. more goals conceded after 16 league games than any previous Chels EPL side

that is fucked up

[Jase 43,479]

15 hours ago, Atomiswave said:

Sadly he is spent.......has been a great servant though. But he is spent and not much of a leader either. Kova should be the real captain of this team or Rudi when he is back.

Kovacic as the captain? Do people just go with the flavor of the month when it comes to picking the captain? 

I know modern footballers are now different from the previous decade but just listen to what Mourinho said here on 'Captains vs Leaders'. Kovacic most certainly doesn't come close to that. 

 

[Jase 43,479]

39 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

Rüdiger could be Captain and I think he will be the one because he is always shouting to the guys. Jorgi would be the other one shouting at the players.

So if someone is shouting at others, he is considered captain material?  

[Jase 43,479]

14 hours ago, Vesper said:

SELL HIM THIS SUMMER

he is DONE

SPENT

SHOT

he is even worse as a LB than Alonso is

If we sell Azpi this summer, then who is the backup? Zappacosta!?

I'm all for Azpi to be benched but there's only so many players we can sell and buy in the summer. It's certainly not possible to revamp the squad entirely in one transfer window. Sort out the issue at LB and I'm sure Azpi will be 2nd choice to James and be used occasionally. 

[Vesper 29,022]

19 minutes ago, Jason said:

If we sell Azpi this summer, then who is the backup? Zappacosta!?

I'm all for Azpi to be benched but there's only so many players we can sell and buy in the summer. It's certainly not possible to revamp the squad entirely in one transfer window. Sort out the issue at LB and I'm sure Azpi will be 2nd choice to James and be used occasionally. 

I already listed my targets for that over and over

main one being

Timothy Castagne from Atalanta

or then

Nordi Mukiele from RB Leipzig

[Jase 43,479]

3 minutes ago, Vesper said:

I already listed my targets for that over and over

main one being

Timothy Castagne from Atalanta

or then

Nordi Mukiele from RB Leipzig

Sure but this isn't a Football Manager or FIFA world we're living in. 

[Vesper 29,022]

14 minutes ago, Jason said:

Sure but this isn't a Football Manager or FIFA world we're living in. 

well then we are committing to geting nothing (or near nothing for him) and getting either of those 2 I listed will not be insanely hard

if not this summer then surely next

but if Recce goes down we are more or less fucked at every single option at both fullbacks next year as it stands (Emerson, as I stated  in other posts is an ok backup LB but who knows what we do with him, and I did lay out an option where he would able to be sold in the summer IF we brought in Telles this January (£33.5m release clause and only 18 months left on his Porto contract) then dump Emerson (Alonso is surely gone either way) to Juve to partially fund a Chilwell buy in the summer

I absolutely think that this summer we still could sell Azpi for enough to basically fund or get damn near the cost of either Castagne or Mukiele

Spanish and Italian sides covet him still

all that said, I am not convinced we do shit, and we all will be having the same damn convos this time next year

hell I can so see us bollocking up LB if we miss out on Chilwell

finally I do have to add that RB is being looked at, there are too many rumours about other RB's for that not to be the case, at least in theory

[Jase 43,479]

5 minutes ago, Vesper said:

well then we are committing to geting nothing (or near nothing for him) and getting either of those 2 I listed will not be insanely hard

if not this summer then surely next

but if Recce goes down we are more or less fucked at every single option at both fullbacks next year as it stands (Emerson, as I stated  in other posts is an ok backup LB but who knows what we do with him, and I did lay out an option where he would able to be sold in the summer IF we brought in Telles this January (£33.5m release clause and only 18 months left on his Porto contract) then dump Emerson (Alonso is surely gone either way) to Juve to partially fund a Chilwell buy in the summer

I absolutely think that this summer we still could sell Azpi for enough to basically fund or get damn near the cost of either Castagne or Mukiele

Spanish and Italian sides covet him still

all that said, I am not convinced we do shit, and we all will be having the same damn convos thsi time next year

hell I can so see us bollocking up LB if we miss out on Chilwell

It's not possible to be revamping the entire squad in one window. As it stands, we're already looking to improve CB, LB, RW and ST. We may even need to buy 2 players for each of the last 2 positions. They're already gonna cost a lot. And god knows what's gonna happen with Kepa. If his form continues to be inconsistent, then we're also looking at a potential replacement. Even if not, we also need to replace Caballero. 

5 minutes ago, Vesper said:

finally I do have to add that RB is being looked at, there are too many rumours about other RB's for that not to be the case, at least in theory

The only solid rumors of late are that we're looking to sign a LB, ST, RW and likely a CB. Nothing about RB. 

[Superblue 6,372]

15 minutes ago, Vesper said:

well then we are committing to geting nothing (or near nothing for him) and getting either of those 2 I listed will not be insanely hard

if not this summer then surely next

but if Recce goes down we are more or less fucked at every single option at both fullbacks next year as it stands (Emerson, as I stated  in other posts is an ok backup LB but who knows what we do with him, and I did lay out an option where he would able to be sold in the summer IF we brought in Telles this January (£33.5m release clause and only 18 months left on his Porto contract) then dump Emerson (Alonso is surely gone either way) to Juve to partially fund a Chilwell buy in the summer

I absolutely think that this summer we still could sell Azpi for enough to basically fund or get damn near the cost of either Castagne or Mukiele

Spanish and Italian sides covet him still

all that said, I am not convinced we do shit, and we all will be having the same damn convos this time next year

hell I can so see us bollocking up LB if we miss out on Chilwell

finally I do have to add that RB is being looked at, there are too many rumours about other RB's for that not to be the case, at least in theory

How much would either of these two go for if we went in for them? Bearing in mind we had to spend in excess of £20m to buy somebody like Zappacosta. 

I find it pointless to buy squad players for millions and eat into our transfer budget. As an example, just say we have £100m as a budget would you rather for example buy someone like Sancho and keep Azpi backup or would you rather spread those funds over Zaha and one of the above.

It's the problem we've had in recent years dealing with people like Conte and Mourinho who are never pleased and just want more and more players in their squads. It's meant our budgets have been spread thinly and we've ended up buying lower quality. 

The young players coming through are a godsend and in James, Tomori, Mount, CHO and Tammy we have 5 young players who will make up part of our squad for years to come and has essentially saved us a couple of hundred million in new signings. We have a great opportunity to be clinical and bring in 3 or 4 top drawer players to the group and improve us dramatically. Unless Lampard see's an alternative position for Reece James in the future, I just don't see the point in spending in this position. Let Reece develop with Azpi as his backup.

He won't be wanted by the very top clubs and everything below the top bracket in Spain have little money and Italian clubs always want a loan deal with option to buy. The only one possibly willing to pay some money would be Bilbao as he's Basque qualified, but I cannot see him commanding much as a transfer fee.

[killer1257 3,282]

Azpi, AC, Mount (his goal aside) Zouma, and Kepa have been disasterclass lately
super troubling all have chosen the same time to collapse
and Willian (who otherwise has been playing great IMHO) picked a fucked up game to all of a sudden go trigger-scared and not shoot
the West Ham and now Everton games have left me more frustrated than I have been in ages
I detest losing to shit teams and even more so, I detest having a shit defence
to be honest
we are playing just like Derby did, score a tonne, but give up more
Lamps so far looks fairly clueless on how to organise a defence [emoji20]
FOUR clean sheets in 25 games. more goals conceded after 16 league games than any previous Chels EPL side
that is fucked up

we are playing just like Derby did, score a tonne, but give up more
Lamps so far looks fairly clueless on how to organise a defence [emoji20]
FOUR clean sheets in 25 games. more goals conceded after 16 league games than any previous Chels EPL side
that is fucked up

When you look at Klopps first Season, they conceded only 4 goals less than us right now and the Quality of PL was pretty bad back then. PL Quality right now is completely different. Klopp needed a new goalkeeper and a top Cb til he got them. Difference between Liverpool and Chelsea is that they Think long term and gave Klopp time and money. Fans loved Klopp, Liverpools Board loved Klopp and then he did what he did. Chelsea fans and Chelseas Board don't think long term, sadly

You can't make AC, Azpi or Zouma into Nesta. Lamps also had many injuries in his team and maybe post injury Rüdiger is better than Zouma or AC and he will solve some Things. Some players just are not good enough. Lamps needs a World class CB and RW to get the to the Next step. And Please bench Azpi... Reminds me of Iva

Guardiola's Defense is also in a mess. Nobody thinks that he is a bad Coach.

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[Vesper 29,022]

5 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

How much would either of these two go for if we went in for them? Bearing in mind we had to spend in excess of £20m to buy somebody like Zappacosta. 

I find it pointless to buy squad players for millions and eat into our transfer budget. As an example, just say we have £100m as a budget would you rather for example buy someone like Sancho and keep Azpi backup or would you rather spread those funds over Zaha and one of the above.

It's the problem we've had in recent years dealing with people like Conte and Mourinho who are never pleased and just want more and more players in their squads. It's meant our budgets have been spread thinly and we've ended up buying lower quality. 

The young players coming through are a godsend and in James, Tomori, Mount, CHO and Tammy we have 5 young players who will make up part of our squad for years to come and has essentially saved us a couple of hundred million in new signings. We have a great opportunity to be clinical and bring in 3 or 4 top drawer players to the group and improve us dramatically. Unless Lampard see's an alternative position for Reece James in the future, I just don't see the point in spending in this position. Let Reece develop with Azpi as his backup.

He won't be wanted by the very top clubs and everything below the top bracket in Spain have little money and Italian clubs always want a loan deal with option to buy. The only one possibly willing to pay some money would be Bilbao as he's Basque qualified, but I cannot see him commanding much as a transfer fee.

neither one would cost a fortune (and it isnt like we would get nothing for Azpi) and

there is this

Chelsea captain Cesar Azpilicueta to be offered return to Spain if youngster replaces him

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/chelsea-captain-cesar-azpilicueta-offered-19540958

[Superblue 6,372]

1 minute ago, Vesper said:

neither one would cost a fortune (and it isnt like we would get nothing for Azpi) and

there is this

Chelsea captain Cesar Azpilicueta to be offered return to Spain if youngster replaces him

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/chelsea-captain-cesar-azpilicueta-offered-19540958

Neither of those would pay big money for him though and would Azpi want to take a 'step down' to play there?

I don't see the need this summer, we have far more important and pressing needs and our budget needs to be spent wisely.

It's easy to say lets sell player's A & B and buy player C with the funds but it's too simplistic.

Barely any clubs pay a transfer fee up front, most are staggered over 3 - 5 years for smaller clubs but some of the larger clubs such as ours will be negotiated down to pay more up front, it's just the reality of the situation.

And then you have so many extras on both sides of buying and selling - agent's fees, player's signing bonuses, possible wages supplements, sell-on clauses and fees, development club payments, etc. Clubs will very, very rarely oversee a transfer window with ridiculous player turnover, even more rare from a top club. 

Those on the fringes at the moment will likely go because Lampard doesn't want them clearly (Alonso, Pedro, Giroud) but we're not going to get rid of masses of players in my opinion. It will be 4 or 5 in and 4 or 5 out across January and the summer max I feel.

[Jase 43,479]

26 minutes ago, Vesper said:

there is this

Chelsea captain Cesar Azpilicueta to be offered return to Spain if youngster replaces him

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/transfer-news/chelsea-captain-cesar-azpilicueta-offered-19540958

There is no substance to that report, is it? All it basically says is Azpi may look to leave if he wants to play week in week out, when James becomes the first choice RB. Nothing on that he will actually do it and heck, Azpi may even be happy to play back-up going forward. 

[Vesper 29,022]

6 minutes ago, killer1257 said:

 

 

 

 

When you look at Klopps first Season, they conceded only 4 goals less than us right now and the Quality of PL was pretty bad back then. PL Quality right now is completely different. Klopp needed a new goalkeeper and a top Cb til he got them. Difference between Liverpool and Chelsea is that they Think long term and gave Klopp time and money. Fans loved Klopp, Liverpools Board loved Klopp and then he did what he did. Chelsea fans and Chelseas Board don't think long term, sadly

You can't make AC, Azpi or Zouma into Nesta. Lamps also had many injuries in his team and maybe post injury Rüdiger is better than Zouma or AC and he will solve some Things. Some players just are not good enough. Lamps needs a World class CB and RW to get the to the Next step. And Please bench Azpi... Reminds me of Iva

Guardiola's Defense is also in a mess. Nobody thinks that he is a bad Coach.

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I have said over and over for months that Pep is arrogant and insane to not buy a CB to replace Kompany, and now, AFTER a top 5 in the world or so CB (Laporte) goes down, he STILL says nope, we need no one

that is so foolish and he will pay the price, much to my pleasure

he is far too stubborn when he is left with little options

it is a joke to think that a soon to be 35yo DMF is an adequate CB on a team that s trying to be the best on the planet for the past 3 years

as for Azpi and all the conversations atm,

none of thsi would be going on IF Lampard had not trotted him out at LB

I mean, yes, I look log term and try to posit moves (my targets are RB are far from super costly and are more than doable) where we can fix shit long term, but but now that he is being played at LB, it just ramps it up more

the only thing I can safely say is that IF we do nothing much overall, miss out on all our main targets in all positions of true need, then next year is going to 65% (or higher) more than likely going to see Lampard sacked before the season ends or at its conclusion

will we do nothing? I also doubt that, but it is a possibilty that we do miss out on most, as all the other giant teams are going to be stocking up as well

there is zero to say that we have a dead lock on Chilwell or any other great LB, zero to say we have a dead lock on Sancho or any other great winger (there just are not that many great RWers out there atm who are available or worth the gamble) there is zero to say we will even try to buy a truly WC CB and may just settle for grabbing Ake and shipping out AC

there is zero to say we have a lock on Werner (odds are high high high against us) and I have no clue if we even try for the ludicrously low priced (less than £17m release clause) Håland. No guarantees on Dembele the striker, both in terms of getting him and then even IF he is up to a sutibale EPL level.

Even less guarantees that we even move for a true DMF or even a hybrid type like Camavinga. Sander Berge may or may not be the answer, but we do not even know if he wants to come here, and other teams seem to want him more.

So yes, I could see us missing out on many if not all of those.

I also see, when we go down to literally a player by player level, many on here make a case that we should NOT sell any of them (when you go one by one) other than Pedro, Alonso (and I am NOT convinced we sell HIM ffs, grrrr, as he so seems to be a board favourite) and Barkley (and even Barkley, I think, has been defended as needing to stay by a few). Giroud has been defended as needing to stay. Bats too. Willian (I myself have said this, that he should stay, as we will NOT buy two new RWers as it stands, IMHO)

Every CB we have now has been defended as a must keep, even AC (albeit by very few),

I see no plan B for LB if we miss out on Chilwell, other than what some of us put up here on this board.

The main plan B I see if we miss out on Sancho (and again, I am somewhat doubtful that we can pull him) is the turgid Zaha (I so strongly suggest people watch his game yesterday against the dreadfully poor Watford side to see him in action, he was beyond useless in a horrid nil nil draw)

Ake is now injured (hamstring, waiting to see how bad, (Eddie Howe said it looked bad) so he might be out util mid January or so)

We got really lucky with Kovacic and probably Pulisic and fairly lucky with Jorginho (and the last two cost almost £120m so it wasn't like they were on the cheap as well and Pulisic took around (per the board) TWO YEARS to sort out). Going even further back, Rudiger and Kante were great buys (as long as Rudiger recovers and stays healthy from now on).

Other than that, our transfers (and lack of sales and mis-timed forced sales) have been SHIT lately. Kepa truly is starting to worry me, and pretty much every other move has been a bust. We completely have mismanaged contracts and refused to sell dregs when clubs have came calling.

So, no, I am not confident at all that we can sort out our current issues this January and then in Summer, all I can do is keep putting up targets and plans. I (because I am not afraid to go out on a limb) will say that IF the nightmare does happen, and we completely fuck up most everything transfer wise, that we will be in dire straights by this time next year, as the definition of insanity is repeating the same mistakes over and over and over, yet each time expecting a different result. The same goes for normalcy bias, where people simply refuse to think it can get worse, and that there is no real need to change things at all.

 

 

 

 

[Atomiswave 6,072]

2 hours ago, Jason said:

Kovacic as the captain? Do people just go with the flavor of the month when it comes to picking the captain? 

I know modern footballers are now different from the previous decade but just listen to what Mourinho said here on 'Captains vs Leaders'. Kovacic most certainly doesn't come close to that. 

 

Falvour of the month? Nothing to do with that at all. We are basically leaderless, so we have to make do with the best that we have and Kova for me is the one that keep on running and keeps on doing his best, an example so far for us. Him and Rudi and Jorgo are the best for captaincy.....This is not the old Chelsea where we had like 7 leaders, so you have to pick the best one. I take KOva any day over Azpi, I know its nowhere near what we used to have in abundance but hey thats the hand the board has dealt.

[Vesper 29,022]

23 minutes ago, Jason said:

There is no substance to that report, is it? All it basically says is Azpi may look to leave if he wants to play week in week out, when James becomes the first choice RB. Nothing on that he will actually do it and heck, Azpi may even be happy to play back-up going forward. 

oh, I am sure he will probably not be sold, and will be kept here for years to come

and it will finally get to the point where he is just released.

I also have no doubts that if that is indeed the route we go down, he will cost us plenty of games over the next 3 or so years (and many will scream to the heavens that I am wrong and a just a hater, even as he does it)

 

[Jase 43,479]

44 minutes ago, Atomiswave said:

Falvour of the month? Nothing to do with that at all. We are basically leaderless, so we have to make do with the best that we have and Kova for me is the one that keep on running and keeps on doing his best, an example so far for us. Him and Rudi and Jorgo are the best for captaincy.....This is not the old Chelsea where we had like 7 leaders, so you have to pick the best one. I take KOva any day over Azpi, I know its nowhere near what we used to have in abundance but hey thats the hand the board has dealt.

Is Kovacic not the flavor of the month? Were people even suggesting him a month or two ago? Jorginho as captain is kinda funny when he's contributing to our defensive flaws with his poor defensive game in midfield. 

[Jase 43,479]

40 minutes ago, Vesper said:

oh, I am sure he will probably not be sold, and will be kept here for years to come

and it will finally get to the point where he is just released.

I also have no doubts that if that is indeed the route we go down, he will cost us plenty of games over the next 3 or so years (and many will scream to the heavens that I am wrong and a just a hater, even as he does it)

You can look into the future...congrats!