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The on form forward


Tomo

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Its been said you need atleast one on form forward to win trophies but with us since Roman has came, bar 2 Didier Drogba unbelievable season's, we have never had a forward bang on top his game week in week out season after season, like Henry or Van Nisseroy.

Press say we are over reliant on Drogba but our record without him has been pretty impressive, its only really Arsenal for obvious reason's we feel his loss to a great extent. Infact in 2009/2010 we had a 100% record in games he did not play in and spanning between January 2009 and October 2010 we infact were without Drogba for 20 games, winning 18 and averaging 3 goals a game in those matches. Infact our last day defeat at Everton last season was the first time we got beat in a match Drogba was not involved in since Arsenal beat us 2-1 at The Bridge back in 2008. Don't get me wrong Drogba has been a fantastic player for us and a club legend but we have not rellied on him as much as the press would like us to believe.

But reading some guys comment on youtube got me thinking, he said basically every-one is a forward in this team (not litrally but you get his point) but thiking about that he has a point, during the years we have been lucky enough to rely on near enough the whole team to chip in with goals.The main thing is the group.

Jose's back to back winning title season's we did not really have a fully firing forward while Arsenal and Manchester United still had Theirry Henry and Ruud Van Nisseroy getting 25 plus goals in the season, more often that not that would show but unlike those 2 teams we had goals all over the pitch. John Terry, William Gallas and Ricardo Carvalho were chipping in with over the average number of goals for a centre half, Frank Lampard as usual was getting 20 goals from centre midfield and Arjen Robben, Damien Duff and Joe Cole were scoring often from the wing. Didier Drogba, Eidur Gudjohnsen and Hernan Crepso (Crespo was only here for one of those season's) while were chipping in with a good number of goals it's fair to say they were not challenging Henry or Van Nisseroy for the golden boot but did they care when they were lifting the title at SB? not a chance.

Since then our ability to get goals all over the pitch has always made up for not having a 30 goal every season forward, infact the only season there wasn't frequent goals across the pitch (06/07) Drogba had one of his two unbelievable season's and got us 33 goals and when the two (on form forward and goals all over the pitch) both happened in the same season it resulted in a record breaking goal haul in Carlo's first season. Last season none of our forward were on form but goals from all over the pitch saved our season to a extent and got us second place.

Our ability to get goals from anywhere on the pitch has always been a key strengh off ours that has not been mentioned enough, and i don't see that ending any time soon. Here are our players that will chip in with goals and i have even missed out our forwards.

- Sturridge even as a winger will chip in with goals and Mata has already shown us he will get his fair share.

- Frank Lampard for all his knockers will get atleast 10 goals for the next 2-3 seasons even if he gets his role lessered, we should do well to remember that despite having his worse season with us last year and being injured for 4 months he still got us 13 goals.

- Malouda and Kalou despite their critics should still get around 8-10 goals and i fully expect Raul Meireles to do the same.

- Terry has a great tally for a defender and also David Luiz and Ivanovic will score a few this season aswell.

- Ash on a good season will chip in with about 5 and Bosingwa has the potential to do the same.

If we can get Torres and/or Drogba firing then this season then great but having on form forward's is not as vital for us as it is for City and United who's forwards will be their main source of goals this season, we have much more goals in other position's than they do. Even with Torres's goal drought we still have a pretty good win record when he has played and i think we have got more points than any-one else since Torres has arrived in the prem and only 4 of our league goals since then have came from Torres (1), Drogba (2) and Anelka (1).

Look at City only 2 of their goals have came from any-one other than Aguero and Dzeko, so they will have to be on form all season.

Only 6 of United 19 goals have came from a position other than forward.

8 of our goals already have came from positions other than forward and we have not hit top form like them two teams, 9 if you count Anelka as a winger.

It would be great if we can get Drogba back on form, Torres firing or even Lukaku hitting the ground running but unlike any other team in the country we have more than enough goals around the rest of the team to compensate if they don't, something United and City do not have to near the same extent as we do, to cut a story short they need their forward on form all season where we can get away with not having a on form forward due to the goals in the rest of our team, bar Drogba in 2009/2010 and 2006/2007 we have not had a truly on top form forward in the Roman era but have been succesful. The complete opposite to the Torres reliant Liverpool in the Rafa era for example, i bet Torres is happy that he can be off form yet still the results remain good.

Goals from all over is a key under-rated strength for us and long may it continue.

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I am stilla firm believer Torres can find some kind of form and start knocking the goals in. His confidence has to blossoming after the CL game, and maybe he can finally be able to step up to the plate. Drogba hasn't been the beast he has been reknowned for, for a while for me - including last season. But, i believe, he can be another threat. The statistics might be alarming, but we have to also acknowledge it is still early days for the season and the new system that AvB is trying to incorporate - which we have slowly shown to be filling in!

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Every time Torres has anything better than a 5/10 performance suddenly we think his confidence is blossoming and he will surely start scoring goals left, right and centre.

I've not seen anything to suggest a turn in his fortunes is just around the corner, and I'm yet to be convinced his performances are any better than they were anyway!

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Every time Torres has anything better than a 5/10 performance suddenly we think his confidence is blossoming and he will surely start scoring goals left, right and centre.

I've not seen anything to suggest a turn in his fortunes is just around the corner, and I'm yet to be convinced his performances are any better than they were anyway!

He actually scored against Leverkusen, would have counted if Meireles wasn't in an offside position.

And surely having a game with 2 assists is better than what he's done in any game this season, except Stoke away?

Anyway you're probably right Tomo, would be far far better if we can get our CF's scoring though :)

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He actually scored against Leverkusen, would have counted if Meireles wasn't in an offside position.

And surely having a game with 2 assists is better than what he's done in any game this season, except Stoke away?

Anyway you're probably right Tomo, would be far far better if we can get our CF's scoring though :)

He didn't score against Leverkusen. It was him who assisted to Meireles and then Meireles scored.

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Every time Torres has anything better than a 5/10 performance suddenly we think his confidence is blossoming and he will surely start scoring goals left, right and centre.

I've not seen anything to suggest a turn in his fortunes is just around the corner, and I'm yet to be convinced his performances are any better than they were anyway!

Exactly!

He hasn't be consistent enough in all his match performances. We understand that there is some pressure hanging on his head.. However, I think that's starting to be relieved slightly because goals are coming from other places (like Mata & Sturridge).

He's capable of scoring. We've seen him get in positions where he can, and we've seen service provided to him. Eventually he'll find the back of the net, and while I don't believe he'll find that deadly form of before, he's still a striker who looks like he can get you 10+ goals a season.

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Every time Torres has anything better than a 5/10 performance suddenly we think his confidence is blossoming and he will surely start scoring goals left, right and centre.

I've not seen anything to suggest a turn in his fortunes is just around the corner, and I'm yet to be convinced his performances are any better than they were anyway!

This ^.

And what is funny, is that when you dare say that Torres is a flop, or is poor, people tell you "it is too early to determine this, he is only at the club since seven month blablabla...". Though, as soon as he makes a decent game, people are like "whoo, the old Torres is back !!!"

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Exactly!

He hasn't be consistent enough in all his match performances. We understand that there is some pressure hanging on his head.. However, I think that's starting to be relieved slightly because goals are coming from other places (like Mata & Sturridge).

He's capable of scoring. We've seen him get in positions where he can, and we've seen service provided to him. Eventually he'll find the back of the net, and while I don't believe he'll find that deadly form of before, he's still a striker who looks like he can get you 10+ goals a season.

Of course there is pressure, but there is pressure on every player to succeed. If he didn't cost £50 million he wouldn't even be on the bench. If Kalou, Anelka or even Drogba were on a similar run without scoring, people would be baying for blood. But because we are so desperate to see him succeed we're clinging on to any microcosm of hope that he will suddenly turn it around.

At least Shevchenko scored a goal every three matches!

The startling reality is he'll have another shocker tomorrow and be hauled off after 65 minutes with Anelka coming on.

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We have enough "why torres isn't scoring" threads so please don't turn this thread into another one.

Returning to the intended topic. I think that our midfield is still our strongest point despite all the criticism to Lampard and Mikel...etc

Great stats by the way Tomo.

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If he didn't cost £50 million he wouldn't even be on the bench. If Kalou, Anelka or even Drogba were on a similar run without scoring, people would be baying for blood. .

To be fair Drogba has only scored 3 times since then and that was in the same week and Anelka has only scored 3 times.

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And both have had half the game-time that Torres had had. Anelka has probably had even less than that - truth is both players have double the productivity, whether it is scoring or creating chances.

@Super-Frank - Torres will either start and be marked out of the game again, or he will come on and ramble around aimlessly for the last 20 minutes. Because whilst I support the player, I find it hilarious how people find another sub-par showing against Leverkusen where he missed a sitter or two constitutes a spark in form.

There is no difference between this Torres and the one who scored once in 18 games last season.

I'm waiting for Torres to prove me wrong now, and to silence the press as well. I'm just being realistic when I say I don't think there is going to be some instantaneous change in fortune.

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The startling reality is he'll have another shocker tomorrow and be hauled off after 65 minutes with Anelka coming on.

lol its hardly a shocker anymore. This just shows that Roman seriously needs to get out of our transfer dealings in future. Carlo did not want Torres he even said in January i am not bothered if he comes. I have already faced the reality that we have been done over in this deal and if Drogba was fit today he would start at least he offers a distraction for others to find space.

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@Super-Frank - Torres will either start and be marked out of the game again, or he will come on and ramble around aimlessly for the last 20 minutes. Because whilst I support the player, I find it hilarious how people find another sub-par showing against Leverkusen where he missed a sitter or two constitutes a spark in form.

There is no difference between this Torres and the one who scored once in 18 games last season.

I'm waiting for Torres to prove me wrong now, and to silence the press as well. I'm just being realistic when I say I don't think there is going to be some instantaneous change in fortune.

Think that was mainly 'cos of the assists.

I personally was happy, because at least he did something positive in this game, compared to others where not only did he not score, but was hardly involved at all.

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There is no difference between this Torres and the one who scored once in 18 games last season.

:o This conclusion seems to me aberrant

You don't see the difference of form between the Torres of last season and the Torres of the first games ? Last season he lacked both fitness (but neither Roman nor Torres are to blame for, just Losepool) and support behind him. He is a player who used to shine in a team featuring Gerrard and Xabi Alonso on the top of their form, when you replace them by a Lampard lower on the pitch and far from his best level and Mikel who has not the vertical play of Alonso, it's the result you get.

Nonetheless Torres was pretty good at Copenhagen with a support player behind him whereas he wasn't at his best form.

This season he lacks only support, I am not making anything, the fact is that he had to leave his position to touch the ball against WBA or Norwich and was lonesome on the top of the team because Lampard and Bosingwa were too far. I don't think I'm the only one to see that Torres' performance at Stoke is an irrefutable evidence that's the day & night compared to last season ?!

Against Leverkusen, one must be in bad faith if he says that there's still the crap Torres from last season, I think (for me it seems obvious) that Torres has to adapt to the playing style of Chelsea. If Carlo did play that much Torres last season, it's not because of rubbish reasons that Roman did put pressure or threatened him with a gun ; Ancelotti just wanted Torres to adapt the more quicky to the settings of the play of the team even if he wasn't in the best fitness form, he wanted him to be used to the kind of deliveries the players around him could provide him. Not particulary specifically to him because of the 58m blabla, it’s the same with all other strikers in the world, you want them to know the playing style of the team the more quickly then to perform as quickly as possible.

Liverpool’s way of playing used massively long balls on the entire width of the pitch ; Torres’ ability to call the ball through the defense was enhanced by the quality of the deliveries of Alonso or Gerrard.

The point where I’m coming is what I said to Badboy on another topic:

But Ramires is also a great counter-attacking player, but it does not prevent him to be usefull in another domains such as the defensive aspect, cut the transmissions and cover the runs upfield of Bosingwa.

Torres is perfectly able to play relays on the width of the pitch, he is a mobile striker and at the top of his form one of the most complete #9 in the world, he is a clinical finisher and he is able to score smart goals that can bring an extra 10 or 15 points in a season when he unlocks a situation, thing we lacked last season, our struggles in the box in front of the goal were obvious at several moments such as at Wolverhampton.

He is a generous striker and can really be the first player to rely on in the new philosophy to press higher and smarter. Kevin Davies would agree with me, strikers are the first defenders on the pitch

Against Leverkusen, it was very clear that Torres has shown the will to adapt to the playing style of Chelsea: he did not start a lot from behind the defenders but instead of that, played relays and made himself available on the width of the pitch. A huge contrast with the lower 4-5-1 of Liverpool and his numerous runs in the depth. I would end my point with the same thing that I said somewhere else:

So yes, some people may say that for £58m we can expect more, but that fee was interdependent of the situation where we did buy Torres. I don't especially see him as a player with a limited palette or playing style, he is not Drogba but he is not totally useless. The 15-20 goals he will score this season (and more than 20 considering the other tournaments) will be fully enough for what we need from THE player who scores the goals, thing that was not that clear or defined the last 3 seasons and was dependent of the form or the role of the several players able to provide these goals (Drogba, Lampard, Malouda, Anelka...)

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