Romelu Lukaku

[The Skipper 20,593]

6 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

Eden is talking about Real almost every week.

Now you're making up stuff just to back up Costa. Not ONCE has Eden said that he wants to go to Real while he's been here, whereas Costa has SEVERAL times said he wants to go back to ATM, nonetheless his little fit in January. You can't compare the two.

[The Skipper 20,593]

5 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

I just prefer Morata, for who I vouche he will be better striker than Lukaku over next 5 years, if both play regular football. Im certain to a point, anyone can save this post and quote me in few years if Im wrong.

We shall see indeed. IMO you don't have the right image of Lukaku in your head, just like I did a few months back, but he's become much more refined as a player. I'm sure he's going to have a better career than Morata who just happens to be part of some of the greatest teams in modern football.

Morata is nothing but the new Soldado/Negredo to me. A good, solid Spanish striker.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

6 minutes ago, The Skipper said:

Now you're making up stuff just to back up Costa. Not ONCE has Eden said that he wants to go to Real, whereas Costa has SEVERAL times said he wants to go back to ATM, nonetheless his little fit in January. You can't compare the two.

But he is keeping the options open, no?  Its the point of commitment. If he was commited to Chelsea, he would shoot straight he wants to stay like Azpi and be done. No maybes, ifs,...

Its same with Diego, but the later actualy said straight he would like to return. And even after he didnt leave, he put great shift till february.

Im just pointing that out as someone said Diego is not commited. Then in that case neither is Eden. But everybody treats him with respect.

Actualy, last season, most were crapping on him too, right. After he had dip in form. So, If Diego puts good shift again, most people will love him again. Fickle.

[The Skipper 20,593]

4 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

But he is keeping the options open, no?  Its the point of commitment. If he was commited to Chelsea, he would shoot straight he wants to stay like Azpi and be done. No maybes, ifs,...

Its same with Diego, but the later actualy said straight he would like to return. And even after he didnt leave, he put great shift till february.

Im just pointing that out as someone said Diego is not commited. Then in that case neither is Eden. But everybody treats him with respect.

Actualy, last season, most were crapping on him too, right. After he had dip in form. So, If Diego puts good shift again, most people will love him again. Fickle.

There is a difference in keeping your options open and whoring yourself to some other club. The problem with Diego is that he has probably had less than 5 good performances since that China rumour, and he has been wanting to go back to Atletico for years, that's why people are questioning his commitment. Diego won't be loved anywhere near as much as he was loved before unless he has a proper world class season. I was one of Costa's defenders on here actually, but I'm not going to overlook the fact that he's not settled at CFC.

You can't compare what Hazard says to that. Hazard is settled. Costa isn't. Besides, Eden literally said a few days ago that he can see himself staying at Chelsea for years.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

2 minutes ago, The Skipper said:

There is a difference in keeping your options open and whoring yourself to some other club. The problem with Diego is that he has probably had less than 5 good performances since that China rumour, and he has been wanting to go back to Atletico for years. Diego won't be loved anywhere near as much as he was loved before unless he has a proper world class season. I was one of Costa's defenders on here actually, but I'm not going to overlook the fact that he's not settled at CFC.

You can't compare what Hazard says to that. Hazard is settled. Costa isn't. Besides, Eden literally said a few days ago that he can see himself staying at Chelsea for years.

Yes indeed.

Thing is as soon someone isnt playing well and mixed with some rumours makes people here call those players cunts too soon.

The SAME thing was happening with Eden thread last year.

But you cant say Diego isnt commited. He was about to leave, but in the end he stayed and gave 100%. Its not like he didnt give a shit. 

Poor form doesnt equal not giving shit. And people here made too quick conclusions on that china rumours that might aswell be bullshit. 

Another thing, it was well known past august Diego wanted to leave. But i dont see these comments that he is cunt and should fuck off when he was banging goals in autmn, were there? 

It only happend AFTER those china rumours that might be bollocks and fact he played worse. This is what I hate. People who acted like dicks afterwards and slated Costa. 

Diego said recently China was not option because he wants to play in world cup. He said he is happy at chelsea, but if chelsea no longer wants him, only option for him is Atletico. It gives different perspective to things.

I dont mind seeing Costa leave as long we get proper replacement, but I will always like what he achieved here and for club. But the attitude of some people here pisses me off. 

But its pointless, Im done posting on that matter anymore. 

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

40 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

Drogba performed at international level. Villa did. Van Nistelrooy did. Ronaldo did. etc. I dont want to put international career as example, but just point out that players like Eden or KDB dont improve Lukaku much.

He also scored 24 and left a bunch of poor performances against top teams.

Lukaku got outmuscled by Lovren fyi. Morata is not slow at all if you saw him play and Lukaku aint THAT quick. Maybe top speed yes, but certanly not acceleration.

Im evaluating performances as whole, where is Lukaku in bigger games if he is soo better than Morata?

Actualy, being good on ball is very good thing. It can make a striker very important player if opponent parks the bus or cuts off striker. Without good control, striker is just a donkey unless he scores that odd goal. And with Lukaku, is he that harrassing type of striker that will punish you for every mistake? No, he is too lazy.

It makes many people wonder. Maybe not you, but Im not the only one lol. Funny, Morata was actualy brilliant for Juve in CL.

You cant point out who Morata scored against. Thats literaly one thing you cant do lol. Morata was brilliant against teams like Real, Barca, Bayern,...Lukaku is known to choke in big games.

If Lukaku was a chelsea lad, he wouldnt leave and moan three years of how good he is and how he is bigger than West Brom and everton.

Eden is talking about Real almost every week. Many players were looking to go to other clubs in past. I dont recall them being called cunts. He also said he loves chelsea and if chelsea doesnt want him, he will only return to Atletico, but if not, then he prefers to stay here because he is happy.

 

Yes Drogba performed internationally LATER ON IN HIS CAREER. Van Nistelrooy when he was 25! Villa when he was 28! Your sample size is hardly big enough to make a statement like Hazard and DeBruyne don't/won't improve Lukaku... Makes you sound silly when you say that.

He scored 25 in the hardest competition in the world and did it with absolutely no support, why does that not resonate with you? When they play against top sides link up play is paramount! Who does Everton have to initiate counters or to link the play from defense to offense? Ross Barkley? Idriss Gueye? Tom Davies? Gareth Barry? Don't make me laugh. Football is a fcuking team game! Strikers who don't get service are ineffectual almost all the time! I figured a guy who watches as much football as you claim to would know that.

Wait a minute, are you making the argument that Lukaku isn't a powerful CF? LOL... And nowhere did I say Morata is slow but come on now Lukaku is faster than him, I thought that was widely accepted as a fact? Morata may have better acceleration.

You're stating the obvious, of course I'd rather a guy who can control the ball and link up play while scoring boatloads of goals but Suarez and Lewandowski aren't available. If I had my choice between a donkey who scores 25 goals or a guy with good touch and link up ability, I'd take the goals 90 times out of 100.

Yes I remember Morata scoring against Madrid in the champions league too, and while that is a huge accomplishment... guess what? THAT WAS THREE SEASONS AGO! Two years ago he scored on matchday 1 and 2 and never scored again... Imagine if that were Lukaku?

And yes I can point out his goal scoring record since what we are looking at is a goalscorer. You keep on citing games from 3 years ago... in 2015 Charlie Austin scored more premier league goals than Alexis Sanchez, who would you rather have?

I think leaving to go on loan made him the player he is now, a guy capable of scoring 25 goals largely on his own and one of 4 players to reach 85 goals before turning 24.

 

 

[BlueLyon 9,359]

7 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

Yes Drogba performed internationally LATER ON IN HIS CAREER. Van Nistelrooy when he was 25! Villa when he was 28! Your sample size is hardly big enough to make a statement like Hazard and DeBruyne don't/won't improve Lukaku... Makes you sound silly when you say that.

He scored 25 in the hardest competition in the world and did it with absolutely no support, why does that not resonate with you? When they play against top sides link up play is paramount! Who does Everton have to initiate counters or to link the play from defense to offense? Ross Barkley? Idriss Gueye? Tom Davies? Gareth Barry? Don't make me laugh. Football is a fcuking team game! Strikers who don't get service are ineffectual almost all the time! I figured a guy who watches as much football as you claim to would know that.

Wait a minute, are you making the argument that Lukaku isn't a powerful CF? LOL... And nowhere did I say Morata is slow but come on now Lukaku is faster than him, I thought that was widely accepted as a fact? Morata may have better acceleration.

You're stating the obvious, of course I'd rather a guy who can control the ball and link up play while scoring boatloads of goals but Suarez and Lewandowski aren't available. If I had my choice between a donkey who scores 25 goals or a guy with good touch and link up ability, I'd take the goals 90 times out of 100.

Yes I remember Morata scoring against Madrid in the champions league too, and while that is a huge accomplishment... guess what? THAT WAS THREE SEASONS AGO! Two years ago he scored on matchday 1 and 2 and never scored again... Imagine if that were Lukaku?

And yes I can point out his goal scoring record since what we are looking at is a goalscorer. You keep on citing games from 3 years ago... in 2015 Charlie Austin scored more premier league goals than Alexis Sanchez, who would you rather have?

I think leaving to go on loan made him the player he is now, a guy capable of scoring 25 goals largely on his own and one of 4 players to reach 85 goals before turning 24.

 

 

A powerful striker would bully the defences, not vice versa. I saw Lukaku blocked against every better defence, hence I put Lovren example. For someone of his size, he sure isnt taking most advantage of it.  

You only look at goals. Lukaku 24 goals this season, 20 last season etc etc. He could be top striker, he can bang 4 against west brom or Bournemouth. 

Cool. I look his overall play in strikers. I rather stick to Diego or get someone who is much better technical player. Someone who can make others tick better and improve the whole squad. Someone who can be the leading guy in toughest games. Not just someone who needs the service. 

Obviously service is important and no doubt Lukaku would improve here, but he wouldnt turn into world beater individualy. He would still have same limitations as he has now. And since he couldnt do much on his own, he would need all the service from teammates. And if he doesnt score, then he is basicaly useless like Costa in some games. 

While if you have technical striker, you can count on his individual skill and Morata for a striker (at least of those available) is brilliant brilliant choice. 

If you saw Juve bayern last year, you can see how juve got shit after Morata was subbed for Mandzukic. He had huge impact. 

Morata is also twice as hard worker than Lukaku.

 And like you said, every striker can improve goal record later in career. Drogba started banging at 24 in france I think (then he left for Marseille one season and Chelsea at 26). 

Im pretty sure Conte prefers Morata all day long. But the board will end up with Lukaku. I hope you are right he will improve as much you say because in current state, he doesnt offer enough to lead us in CL. But maybe his goals will be enough to retain PL, I give you that. Bar against top 6, we would have a striker very capable of scoring in every game.

[LAM09 6,744]

Yes Drogba performed internationally LATER ON IN HIS CAREER. Van Nistelrooy when he was 25! Villa when he was 28! Your sample size is hardly big enough to make a statement like Hazard and DeBruyne don't/won't improve Lukaku... Makes you sound silly when you say that.
He scored 25 in the hardest competition in the world and did it with absolutely no support, why does that not resonate with you? When they play against top sides link up play is paramount! Who does Everton have to initiate counters or to link the play from defense to offense? Ross Barkley? Idriss Gueye? Tom Davies? Gareth Barry? Don't make me laugh. Football is a fcuking team game! Strikers who don't get service are ineffectual almost all the time! I figured a guy who watches as much football as you claim to would know that.
Wait a minute, are you making the argument that Lukaku isn't a powerful CF? LOL... And nowhere did I say Morata is slow but come on now Lukaku is faster than him, I thought that was widely accepted as a fact? Morata may have better acceleration.
You're stating the obvious, of course I'd rather a guy who can control the ball and link up play while scoring boatloads of goals but Suarez and Lewandowski aren't available. If I had my choice between a donkey who scores 25 goals or a guy with good touch and link up ability, I'd take the goals 90 times out of 100.
Yes I remember Morata scoring against Madrid in the champions league too, and while that is a huge accomplishment... guess what? THAT WAS THREE SEASONS AGO! Two years ago he scored on matchday 1 and 2 and never scored again... Imagine if that were Lukaku?
And yes I can point out his goal scoring record since what we are looking at is a goalscorer. You keep on citing games from 3 years ago... in 2015 Charlie Austin scored more premier league goals than Alexis Sanchez, who would you rather have?
I think leaving to go on loan made him the player he is now, a guy capable of scoring 25 goals largely on his own and one of 4 players to reach 85 goals before turning 24.

 
 

Drogba was part of an average Ivorian side whilst Lukaku is part of arguably the most talented NT right now. He's a striker that needs 5 chances before tucking one away.

We need a 3 or 2 in 1 type of CF for us to be a major threat.

[The Skipper 20,593]

26 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

Im pretty sure Conte prefers Morata all day long.

If Morata is so good, and if Conte really prefers him (I would love to know how you know), why is he going to AC Milan? Why aren't the likes of PSG, Chelsea, United, City all pushing for him?

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

5 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

A powerful striker would bully the defences, not vice versa. I saw Lukaku blocked against every better defence, hence I put Lovren example. For someone of his size, he sure isnt taking most advantage of it.  

You only look at goals. Lukaku 24 goals this season, 20 last season etc etc. He could be top striker, he can bang 4 against west brom or Bournemouth. 

Cool. I look his overall play in strikers. I rather stick to Diego or get someone who is much better technical player. Someone who can make others tick better and improve the whole squad. Someone who can be the leading guy in toughest games. Not just someone who needs the service. 

Obviously service is important and no doubt Lukaku would improve here, but he wouldnt turn into world beater individualy. He would still have same limitations as he has now. And since he couldnt do much on his own, he would need all the service from teammates. And if he doesnt score, then he is basicaly useless like Costa in some games. 

While if you have technical striker, you can count on his individual skill and Morata for a striker (at least of those available) is brilliant brilliant choice. 

If you saw Juve bayern last year, you can see how juve got shit after Morata was subbed for Mandzukic. He had huge impact. 

Morata is also twice as hard worker than Lukaku.

 And like you said, every striker can improve goal record later in career. Drogba started banging at 24 in france I think (then he left for Marseille one season and Chelsea at 26). 

Im pretty sure Conte prefers Morata all day long. But the board will end up with Lukaku. I hope you are right he will improve as much you say because in current state, he doesnt offer enough to lead us in CL. But maybe his goals will be enough to retain PL, I give you that. Bar against top 6, we would have a striker very capable of scoring in every game.

SO let me get this straight, is Lukaku a powerful striker in your mind or not?

Yes I want my striker to be a goalscorer first. That is the MOST important part of a strikers make up... GOALSCORING.

And you think that guy is Morata??? Based on what exactly?

You have no way of knowing what Lukaku can be in our system, if he can score 25 for Everton there's no reason to believe he can't replicate that at Chelsea for years to come. Even with his limitations he's scoring boatloads of goals because he has that strikers mentality; he's always where he needs to be to score. Special gift.

We're still talking about Morata, right? Not Messi. Morata makes the ball stick, but he doesn't really dribble past anyone or use slick movement to beat men. For is ENTIRE career he's averaged less than 0.8 dribble a game(On par with Defoe and Benteke). For as terrible as Lukaku is technically, he averages 1.2 dribbles a game for his career and just last season was at 1.7. Morata is probably better at keeping the ball but where is the hard evidence that he is better using it? Lukaku had 1.3 key passes a game this season...Dele Alli and Kane both had 1.4 Costa 1.2.... Morata 0.7 PLAYING FOR REAL MADRID!

I think how you work is based on the assignment you're given in a specific system.

Yes, strikers can improve especially in teams like Juventus and Madrid. Don't you find it odd that we are aspiring to emulate those teams and they don't want Morata? 

I don't know who Conte or the board prefer and to be quite frank I'm willing to go with whoever they deem is a better fit for us, I just get worked up when you shit on a guy who's scored 85 goals already just because he can't link play yet. If there is anything I've seen is Lukaku is an extremely hard worker who comes back every season better than the one before, can you say the same about Morata given what you've seen? 

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

7 minutes ago, LAM09 said:

 

Drogba was part of an average Ivorian side whilst Lukaku is part of arguably the most talented NT right now. He's a striker that needs 5 chances before tucking one away.

We need a 3 or 2 in 1 type of CF for us to be a major threat.

 

Who is that?

[The Skipper 20,593]

1 minute ago, LAM09 said:

He's a striker that needs 5 chances before tucking one away.

No he isn't. He's one of the most clinical strikers in the league. Are you sure you're not talking about Diego? Lukaku shoots 64% of his shots on target per 90 mins, whilst Costa is at 53% (Premier League). Lukaku (3.03 attemps per game) has also scored more goals with less shots than Diego (3.24 attempts per game) so...

[LAM09 6,744]

Who is that?

I'd say Belotti COULD be that in terms of what's attainable. The majority of us here have seen Lukaku on a weekly basis to know he isn't really an upgrade on what we have. Need to put the age factor away, as he isn't an 18 yr old we'll be signing.

[The Skipper 20,593]

4 minutes ago, Chelsea Legend 11 said:

SO let me get this straight, is Lukaku a powerful striker in your mind or not?

Yes I want my striker to be a goalscorer first. That is the MOST important part of a strikers make up... GOALSCORING.

And you think that guy is Morata??? Based on what exactly?

You have no way of knowing what Lukaku can be in our system, if he can score 25 for Everton there's no reason to believe he can't replicate that at Chelsea for years to come. Even with his limitations he's scoring boatloads of goals because he has that strikers mentality; he's always where he needs to be to score. Special gift.

We're still talking about Morata, right? Not Messi. Morata makes the ball stick, but he doesn't really dribble past anyone or use slick movement to beat men. For is ENTIRE career he's averaged less than 0.8 dribble a game(On par with Defoe and Benteke). For as terrible as Lukaku is technically, he averages 1.2 dribbles a game for his career and just last season was at 1.7. Morata is probably better at keeping the ball but where is the hard evidence that he is better using it? Lukaku had 1.3 key passes a game this season...Dele Alli and Kane both had 1.4 Costa 1.2.... Morata 0.7 PLAYING FOR REAL MADRID!

I think how you work is based on the assignment you're given in a specific system.

Yes, strikers can improve especially in teams like Juventus and Madrid. Don't you find it odd that we are aspiring to emulate those teams and they don't want Morata? 

I don't know who Conte or the board prefer and to be quite frank I'm willing to go with whoever they deem is a better fit for us, I just get worked up when you shit on a guy who's scored 85 goals already just because he can't link play yet. If there is anything I've seen is Lukaku is an extremely hard worker who comes back every season better than the one before, can you say the same about Morata given what you've seen? 

Top post for the 'Morata > Lukaku' gang. The evidence is there. Y'all trying to make Morata sound like prime R9.

[LAM09 6,744]

No he isn't. He's one of the most clinical strikers in the league. Are you sure you're not talking about Diego? Lukaku shoots 64% of his shots on target per 90 mins, whilst Costa is at 53% (Premier League). Lukaku (3.03 attemps per game) has also scored more goals with less shots than Diego (3.24 attempts per game) so...

Conversation rate isn't what I'm getting at when he best performances have come against the bottom six. Seen him plenty of times waste chances.

Tell me his stats against the big teams to begin with?

[The Skipper 20,593]

2 minutes ago, LAM09 said:

Conversation rate isn't what I'm getting at when he best performances have come against the bottom six. Seen him plenty of times waste chances.

Tell me his stats against the big teams to begin with?

There isn't enough evidence for that. Ian Wright explains excellently here why Lukaku doesn't score much against big teams (starts at 14:30):

Now, what I would like to see from you is all these big chances that Romelu misses against big teams, when he rarely gets the opportunities to score in these games. I've seen a recurring theme from Everton in big games - they sit back far too much and literally take no initiative in the game. Their record against the top 6 is poor this season, and you can quite easily see why Romelu struggles there. 

[Clockwork 1,794]

Juventus wanted to keep Morata, Madrid exercised their buy back clause. Stop lying.

[LAM09 6,744]

There isn't enough evidence for that. Ian Wright explains excellently here why Lukaku doesn't score much against big teams (starts at 14:30):
Now, what I would like to see from you is all these big chances that Romelu misses against big teams, when he rarely gets the opportunities to score in these games. I've seen a recurring theme from Everton in big games - they sit back far too much and literally take no initiative in the game. Their record against the top 6 is poor this season, and you can quite easily see why Romelu struggles there. 

I don't remember Everton sitting back under Martinez and the story was still the same. I just can't see any positives in the prospect of him rejoining. Him being a younger Costa in my eyes isn't appealing.

Belotti's basket is where we should be putting all eggs in.