OneMoSalah

Doubt Oblak will come here. That cheap as well no chance. Nick Pope would be a laughable signing for first choice too. Back up decent enough but first choice cmon

Look at us under Conte in his first year compared to now, the difference is huge. The fight in this team isnt there for me, we concede one goal roll over and end up losing even more. Man City game at the Etihad under Antonio was one of the best big games weve played in years, 1-0 down but won 3-1, agter that equalizer it looked pretty obvious we would go on to win the game.imo because we did all the things you want to see from.a big team.in a big game. As for the other comment about English. He might not speak English but neither did Ancelotti, Conte, Pep or Klopp either at some point. Its not as if he cant learn.... Allegri also learning. As well as many many others who have over time.

Again though if it was anyone else would it be as big a problem? Jorginho seems to get some sort of special criticism everytime we lose for something even if it is minimal such as a booking for dissent. Be it 1 bad pass or a wee booking that hardly altered the game or this or that. Theres still an heir of the whole Sarri's man scapegoat sort of thing around him I feel. He isnt immune to criticism but he seems to get it more or less every week for wee stupid things that if it was anyone else it wouldnt be mentioned or an issue in my eyes. Even more annoying nobody's brought this comment up that Frank said this after the game "Our choice of pass in the final third has to improve." I mean really?! What does he expect? He started 2 of our most inconsistent players in advanded positions vs Bayern Municu ffs. Wont go into it as we've been discussing in Mason's thread and Ross' for a long long time about these things. I mean as bad as it sounds not starting Willian, who showed vs Barcelona 2 seasons ago over 2 games he can hurt top teams and even in some of the minutes he had yesterday he looked more purposeful thsn both, then says that. He is starting to sound like Ole Solskjaer a lot. Particularly after big games. Excuses after excuses despite the things hes bringing up being directly created by his selections. Questions need to be asked.

Perhaps but its not as if nobody gets booked for dissent in other teams or leagues or as if players getting booked for dissent is a major issue that only we have. Its part and parcel of modern day football because referees are so protected from players giving them a bit back or disagreeing with their decisions.

Not sure for definite. If it was successful the fans wouldn't be bothered because wed get good results and be competing. Plus the fight and application his Atletico teams have shown particularly the bigger games, it is exceptional. Do we have that fight or passion in this group? Not necessarily sure.

They are just efficient and want to get to the front players quicker so they can do the damage. None of this fucking about passing around the back trying to look good and playing safe. Or trying to be Barcelona or Ajax or whoever. Good Bayern teams have always been like this. Under Jupp when they won the treble before Pep went there as well they were able to control games but they just wanted to go and get into the final third as often as they could.

Again being vice captain and getting a booking it means nothing at all, these things happen, how many times did Cahill, Terry etc all get bookings or worse? Plus if him getting booked is one of the biggest issues or a problem from that game then we clearly watched different games. If it wasnt Jorginho youd not make a fuss I reckon... Would be more concerned about the performance as a whole, the defence and team shape again after all the praise v Spurs, Mount and Barkleys performances especially and Alonso's red all much much bigger issues.

If pressing is affecting the rest of his game then fuck knows how hes made it being a professional footballer because a lot of players can do it and still manage to deliver with the ball. I mean did pressing affect all of Peps Barca team with all those players or his Man City team now or Conte's Juventus teams etc consisting of Marchisio, Pogba, Vidal, Pirlo etc? It didnt. He is maybe one of the triggers for our press but if thats affecting his ability on with the ball then he needs to get fitter and much much better.

Actually good points regarding his performances in particular the last few seasons, although they've still severely overachieved throughout his time there. I feel his system and style suits knockout football more and against smaller teams they can sometimes find themselves struggling to take the initiative with the ball although theyve still improved compared to where they were beforehand too at the beginning under him. I think Atletico will be lucky to ever win another Liga in the next 5-10 years regardless of manager and their styles because Barca and Real can just get away with slow starts by pasting everyone from a certain point onwards, lets be honest when you have/had Messi or Ronaldo you can always catch the difference. Plus theyre always gonna recruit the top level of players compared to them, the Pogbas, Griezmanns, Suarez, de Jongs, Coutinhos whoevers going and have top ready made players/generation talents compared with Atletico maybe bar the odd one having.to go for more further afield options or players they wouldnt take. Still think Simone regardless of the style has built a team that never seem to know when their beat in the big games, their attitude and application is fantastic. Theyve only lost 40 odd games in the league in his whole time there too which is very impressive considering hes been there 8 or 9 seasons. I just get the feeling he would be successful here too. Precisely. Thought going with 3/5 at the back would of been an appropriate enough start but boy was I wrong 😂 suppose we will probably get our annual humilation by Bournemouth now too.

Dont see what the problem would be with Simone or even Frank taking a leaf from his book in these bigger games. His approach in these sort of games isnt necessarily the worst thing.

As mentioned in previous page. End product. Needs to be consistent regardless of if you are 21 or 30 in these games. For a number 10, all the running and pressing and tackling in the world will not get your team anywhere v the likes of Bayern etc.

I see is back Anyway, Kepa Azpi-Christensen-Rudi James-Jorginho-Kova-Alonso\Emerson Willian-Giroud-Mount No Callum, Kante or Pulisic due to injuries. Pedros available and RLC is back so heres hoping Ruben gets some minutes. Interested to see where he will fit in for sure with Frank and if he can get back to the levels he did last season. Still unsure where he would feature in a 343 though which I think in these games is our best option as the bulk of the defensive players have the experience of playing it together and are probably better suited to it imo (doesnt mean it will nevvessarily work tonight I suppose but who knows?). Think going with a back 4 would be a bit of a risk. Plus 3 CBs v 1 Lewandowski seems a bit fairer 🤣

I know he had double figures for Vitesse in each but I dont think he had at Derby. Again though, as we have said all season Lampard has overplayed him and neglected others but again the onus to perform falls on the player, I wouldnt say he was flogged as such but more that he was be selected when playing poorly. He can do better as weve seen this season but I get the feeling he will be a streaky player for now few good weeks then some poor for another season or two which is frustrating. Its an age thing as well but I still think as we seen at the beginning of the season he has a lot more than what he has shown before the last month or so. Re Oscar: Perhaps but there were patches where even he showed a bit of consistency at spells and he hadnt had the luxury of playing in Europe or being older when we got him in the team. Then when he was say 21 or 22 we expected more from him. Mount and Oscar do have a lot of similarities too as players, boths 10s, slighter players who like to try play quick 1 and 2 touch combinations, regular set piece takers (although corners from both need/needed improved as well), like to get into the box, try to score goals. Its an inevitable comparison before taking into account the usefulness in big games more for traits youd not necessarily expect or want to see your being recognised for in bigger games.

Think as well, which hasnt been mentioned at all, Frank deployed a back 5 where 4 of the 5 players have regularly played in a back 3 under various managers at other teams and here. It isnt exactly the same obviously Frank has put his touch on it but the basics of it are the same with and without the ball, make the pitch as wide as possible with it to try utilize the free man out wide which eventually ends up creating space in the middle and then make the pitch narrow without it. The players are used to it and have trained it alot (especially with Antonio who was hugely renowned for team shape exercises in training and obviously 343/352 is his preference tactically). Azpi under Conte here, Christensen at Mochengladbach and here under Conte, Rudiger at Roma, here under Conte and for Germany and Alonso at Fiorentina and here under Conte. Theyve also played it together countless times as mentioned with that time under Conte. Thats probably a huge reason as to it looked more natural and how we looked more comfortable in it I think compared to Spurs, who have predominantly deployed a back 4 under Jose (and Pochettino before) more or less every game (Jose only really ever gone 3 at the back by sacrificing a fullback for an attacker when his team needs a goal in stages of games, particularly at Inter, Madrid and here). The players know their roles more clearly in it imo than when he play a back 4 most weeks. Alonso and Azpi aren't too sure in a 4, they know they have to go forward but leave space in behind them. In a 3 they both have different roles but it also masks issues of theirs, Alonso has a CB behind him who is better positioned to cover him and Azpi isnt as far up the pitch where he will struggle to recover/be caught out of position more. I think going with a 4 v Bayern would be a huge mistake as well. Go for the same 3 CBs then James and Emerson although Alonso could deserve to remain in the team as his offensive contribution v Spurs was good.

Perhaps but I think other than that one season at Vitesse his assist rate isnt that great, dont think he got a huge bunch for Derby IIRC was more goals. He has to become better at that side of the game (inconsistent end product is as big a reason as to why he hasnt got that many as a team that is the unfinished article) as well as the goals which he seems to be able to get although this season he is at a higher level. He has been overplayed I will agree as well as being played through a shit spell when FL could of took him out the firing line and playing in a team that can still improve (ironically his position off the front can be improved on and hopefully Ziyech will be a real option there as I think he will be more productive centrally) but I think he needs to show more creativity. In both the big games and the smaller games for us. Its no good just being useful as a player who plays in an advanced position who will put a shift in and willing to press as weve said, yes those things are useful but you expect it from every player regardless. If we become a title challenging team and he hasnt developed that creative side many will get even more frustrated than him and a ruthless manager will bench or get rid of him. He can potentially be a 10+ goal and assist player in time but using Dutch league and Championship performances as a barometer isnt exactly necessarily going to help ease those doubts for many. Although I do see it both ways. Bar the 2 big games, the Burnley (at the Bridge) and Leicester matches, Mason hasnt impressed me for a long while.. probably since the reverse game v Burnley at Turf Moor. He has played virtually every game all season and for arguably 2 to 3 months was a passenger and a huge reason why we struggled in an attacking sense. He hasnt scored since December in the league and only has 3 assists since October (which for someone who also takes set pieces and freekicks isnt exactly good is it?). Yes he deserves an opportuinity to grow and progress as he is still only 21 but the comparisons with Oscar at times is even off because Oscar would consistently score more goals and get more assists at times too.

He said Liverpool suit his style. Id say like when we went after Chamberlain under Conte and Cavani in January we are probably never going to be his first choice. Even with all the bonuses or money in the world.

Yeah he is young still but it depends though. Normally with these more creative players who play off the front or as a more advanced midfielder, even when they are younger, you can see the ability or the potential and things like if they can see those runs and execute the final pass. I am yet to be fully convinced he will be a top creative player due to this. I still think he is a bit safe. Think this is why people will also make the envitable Oscar comparisons. Oscar was comfortable at many things but he never ever would of made that jump to be a top top player because he never had that final pass as well as the consistency. That could change but again I dont see him in the mould of like Dele Alli either who is more of a rounded midfield player whos major contribution to a team is going to be goals.

Dont think thats exactly the most promising thing to use, he could go and play good again ir go and have an absolute horrorshow. Lewandowski is in great form as well.

Fucking hell Frank starts Giroud and he fucking scores. Hopefully that means no more Batshuayi from the beginning. Plays a natural left sider on the left and we looked 100 times better too. What has Frank been thinking the previous months? Would really like to know. Barkley as well has struggled some games this season but another who could of been used more. Food for thought. Mount, surprisingly in the last 2 games vs top teams, very good.

Have to disagree, I think a more experienced manager could still of managed top 4 with our squad, as they could find other ways to get over the line especially Allegri who is very adaptable tactically and has shown he can get good results even when his teams dont necessarily play good. Maybe not Enrique and the verdicts still out on what Sarri may have done with another season here but I dont think it would be as open and closed as because we lost Hazard we would be lucky to get top 4. I dont think any manager would start Batshuayi here regularly. Nobody is that stupid, surely? Allegri liked Mandzukic and Kean at Juve so I think we would of seen Giroud and Abraham more than Batshuayi if he came here for instance. Also I dont think he would of shunned Reece or Callum for definite. Maybe Mason or Tomori but with Ruben out and uncertaincy who is out best CBs who knows? Lampard also cant have the luxury of a free hit season now like many think because we were 12 points clear for top 4 at one point. Young players or not blowing that gap in spectacular fashion is ridiculous.

Maybe throw Zouma in the deal. Not sure we will still be interested was more when Conte was here. Then Sarri wanted Rugani. Hopefully we will be but not sure think it was more manager driven than the club.

Have to agree. Ash could have been a squad player for another season or two still but again respected his decision and Jose and him didnt really seem to see eye to eye IIRC towards the end of that season either. Used to cry when people said about using Baba or Kenedy at LB, both below average as hell. Baba should never have moved here would of developed into a better player playing every match in Germany. Kenedy at LB was never going to work, was just Mourinho restricting, or remoulding maybe a better term for it, another player similarly to like Mikel when he first arrived. Although I did think Mikel got a lot of shit on here over nothing because he was good enough in periods in his spell here before leaving and played through some tramatic shit like when his dad was kidnapped under Villas-Boas. He had maybe 3 or 4 good games at the start of the season. Even then, were they really outstanding? Had some half decent games with Sarri I will give you that but he has been pretty poor ever since those games at the start of the season (although FLs choice to use a RB over 2 natural LBs is questionable given how it hasnt improved our backline at all really). Even over his spell here, he has hardly been convincing. He has played in 16 games this season for us, poor in most. Using 1/4 of those as a sort of he was good before his injury is like saying Torres was good for like 3 or 4 games in a row under Villas-Boas, Benitez (although think he had most prolific spell of his career with us under Rafa) or Mourinho before he would churn out those shite games for weeks on end after. Going from memory I've thought he played well in his debut vs Hull in a cup game and vs Burnley under Conte, in the Europa League final under Sarri, the United game and Super Cup final under Frank. Thats over the course of nearly 3 seasons. Struggling to think of many other games were hes really looked as if he could be a long term solution. Maybe missed a few but there seemed to be some sort of hope because he had a good season in Italy with Roma (before he injured his ACL which wouldnt have helped him) where he apparently matched Alex Sandros performances (again I very much doubt that as Alez Sandro is a different level alltogether) and stats that we got some sort of bargain.

Yes in our run of form another loss would be great. Who is this crackpot?

Agree regarding Giroud for definite and to an extent the top 4 at the start of the season for an inexperienced manager seemed a stretch compared to the other teams but he had us there and comfortably in a position to get it for sure but through poor results and more importantly regressing performances weve fucked that lead beyond belief. Which he should be held accountable for 100% because he has made huge judgement calls on the squad, as well as selection and tactical things that havent helped at all. He can't hide or be sheltered from critcism or scrutiny because nobody thought we would get top 4 before a ball eas kicked because one as questionable as it was a more experienced proven coach could definitely do it in my opinion, secondly that was always going to be something the club expects regardless of manager in this day and age and he knows that from his playing days here and lastly because we were there, like 12 points clear of most teams we are now locked in this tight battle with. Disagree regarding Kepa. As Ive mentioned in his thread I still have a lot of faith in the guy and he will come through this spell.

Dont blame him. Seeing your manager pick a RB at LB week in week out must be agonizingly frustrating. Be like the same reason as why Cole probably decided to leave us under Jose, guy might of not been at his past level and Azpi was playing extremely well but as a player it must be frustrating as fuck seeing someone an unnatrual position they wouldnt normally play every week ahead of you.