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Tobey Gibson

12. Ruben Loftus-Cheek

Started by Tobey Gibson,

2,153 posts in this topic
southgate is a fan of RLC I'm not surprised 

The best players should be selected on form rather than favouritism. Guess that's why Welbeck is in the squad as well

 

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Very common for young promising players to be selected to gain experience at this level, esp if the manager believes they can provide some contribution. Reckon, from watching him this season, that he's not ready to start many games, but would be an interesting option coming off the bench if you need a goal or simply break through a tight defense line.

He looked pretty inventive and mobile when I saw him. Very interesting player to keep and actually use next season.

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5 hours ago, LAM09 said:

Been selected for England's WC squad. Quite surprised

Not that surprising to me, Southgate coached him at U21 and proper believes in his talent. 

@Unionjack remember I did say Southgate loves him. England’s CMs are quite poor as well so he has a chance to maybe get quite a lot of minutes. 

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Not that surprising to me, Southgate coached him at U21 and proper believes in his talent. 
[mention=13940]Unionjack[/mention] remember I did say Southgate loves him. England’s CMs are quite poor as well so he has a chance to maybe get quite a lot of minutes. 
That dawned on me shortly after but my previous post details my stance. A few better options available (still pleased to see him called up).

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1 hour ago, LAM09 said:
1 hour ago, The Skipper said:
Not that surprising to me, Southgate coached him at U21 and proper believes in his talent. 
[mention=13940]Unionjack[/mention] remember I did say Southgate loves him. England’s CMs are quite poor as well so he has a chance to maybe get quite a lot of minutes. 

That dawned on me shortly after but my previous post details my stance. A few better options available (still pleased to see him called up).

Like who? If guys like Livermore got called up...

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Like who? If guys like Livermore got called up...

Shelvey offers something none of the squad has (a decent passing range), putting his temperamental issues aside. Players that can actually do something when called upon

 

What good did Walcott's inclusion in 2006 do, for example?

 

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33 minutes ago, LAM09 said:

Shelvey offers something none of the squad has (a decent passing range), putting his temperamental issues aside. Players that can actually do something when called upon

 

What good did Walcott's inclusion in 2006 do, for example?

 

Shelvey's temperament definitely plays a part into his non-selection as well as club level.

Reminder that the WC consists of very few games - even fewer if you don't go far. Group stage is really the only place where mistakes are allowed and does not last long (and frankly does not matter much unless you are in a tough group). Temperamental players in single-elimination games is a risk some managers are not willing to take. Shelvey is def a good player though. Technique wise leagues ahead of Bakayoko.

RLC seems to be a player of few important moments, which might be just what the manager is looking for from him.

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1 hour ago, LAM09 said:

Shelvey offers something none of the squad has (a decent passing range), putting his temperamental issues aside. Players that can actually do something when called upon

 

What good did Walcott's inclusion in 2006 do, for example?

 

Shelvey should’ve been called up too. England seriously lack a player of RLC’s skill set in midfield so why not? He’s not a 17 year old Walcott who hasn’t even played in the PL at all. He has a decent PL season and some Chelsea experience behind him. 

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Shelvey's temperament definitely plays a part into his non-selection as well as club level.

Reminder that the WC consists of very few games - even fewer if you don't go far. Group stage is really the only place where mistakes are allowed and does not last long (and frankly does not matter much unless you are in a tough group). Temperamental players in single-elimination games is a risk some managers are not willing to take. Shelvey is def a good player though. Technique wise leagues ahead of Bakayoko.

RLC seems to be a player of few important moments, which might be just what the manager is looking for from him.

 

You'd like to think he would be able to rein in his emotions for 5 games max.

 

Shelvey should’ve been called up too. England seriously lack a player of RLC’s skill set in midfield so why not? He’s not a 17 year old Walcott who hasn’t even played in the PL at all. He has a decent PL season and some Chelsea experience behind him. 

 

I'm not saying he shouldn't be in the squad, but the fact that there are better options ahead of him. He's effectively taken Ox/Lallana's position.

 

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On 5/16/2018 at 5:48 PM, LAM09 said:

The best players should be selected on form rather than favouritism. Guess that's why Welbeck is in the squad as well

 

Young and Delph ahead of Bertrand? Cahill ahead of Tarkowski? 

England fails because they bring names instead of players who are good. 

You could form long term and pick lets say Pope and Tarkowski who are familiar from Burnley, but coach will end up playing Butland who was average this season and Cahill who is way past his best. 

On another point, I understand you want best players in your nt team, but when it comes to RLC Im very excited about him being picked, since Im not english, but Chelsea fan. And he was certainly best young english player this season along with TAA (not counting already established players like Alli, Sterling,...)...there are quite few others who are more questionable picks than RLC IMO.

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Young and Delph ahead of Bertrand? Cahill ahead of Tarkowski? 

England fails because they bring names instead of players who are good. 

You could form long term and pick lets say Pope and Tarkowski who are familiar from Burnley, but coach will end up playing Butland who was average this season and Cahill who is way past his best. 

On another point, I understand you want best players in your nt team, but when it comes to RLC Im very excited about him being picked, since Im not english, but Chelsea fan. And he was certainly best young english player this season along with TAA (not counting already established players like Alli, Sterling,...)...there are quite few others who are more questionable picks than RLC IMO.

 

Need a mixture of youth & experience. Tarkowski (is on standby) should have been chosen ahead of Stones IMO. I agree with the point that reputation comes first more often than not when England is concerned to their detriment, more often than not.

 

I'm not English either but I look at it from an unbiased POV. Welbeck, Stones & Pickford/Butland are also in that bracket.

 

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I hope the lad is better than what I think and even half as good as some others of us think.

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8 hours ago, BlueLyon said:

Young and Delph ahead of Bertrand? Cahill ahead of Tarkowski? 

England fails because they bring names instead of players who are good. 

You could form long term and pick lets say Pope and Tarkowski who are familiar from Burnley, but coach will end up playing Butland who was average this season and Cahill who is way past his best. 

On another point, I understand you want best players in your nt team, but when it comes to RLC Im very excited about him being picked, since Im not english, but Chelsea fan. And he was certainly best young english player this season along with TAA (not counting already established players like Alli, Sterling,...)...there are quite few others who are more questionable picks than RLC IMO.

England look like they are playing a back 3. In that case Young and Cahill are better picks than Bertrand and Tarkowski.

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2 hours ago, Tomo said:

England look like they are playing a back 3. In that case Young and Cahill are better picks than Bertrand and Tarkowski.

Are they tho? Cahill has been exposed playing back 3 time and time again whilst Bertrand is an excellent wing back. If I were Southgate I would not play a back 3 at all. England have mediocrity in depth in mdifield and defense. No need to emphasize that. IMO they should cater around their best attackers Kane and Sterling and support them with midfielders who can play through teh lines. Wich is why i am amazed Wilshere is not in the squad. They have only 4 central mids and 4 centre backs in the squad. But 4 central strikers when they are most likely only play. Just from the mathematics teh only way this makes sense is if they play their outdated 442. Selecting players like Delph and Young who were too bad to play their main position as cms and now are full-back shoe-ins about real full backs and real centre backs is completely beyond me. There must be something going on behind the scenes. Well thank god Southgate selected 3 right back, so at least they are covered if Belgium decides to play KDB, Mertens and Hazard all on the left wing at the same time

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3 hours ago, Magic Lamps said:

Are they tho?

Yeah. Walker Stones Maguire I think. 

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Honestly other than Southgate having worked with him at U21, I dont see how he warrants a place in that squad. He has 2 goals and 3 assists in 25 appearances for the whole season (throw in his fitness issues where he rarely plays a full match too), if that were any other attacking midfield/wide player their would be massive questions asked and if I were English I would 100% think its a huge risk. If England perform badly people will wonder why the likes of Wilshere (hasn't missed anywhere as many games as previous seasons and has the ability to go past players, control a match from a deeper position and will take the ball anywhere on the park) and Shelvey (really surprised he wasn't called up, hes not a world class player by any means but he is more what England need in MF, able to play forward, not scared to take risks) didn't get called up who have been better than Ruben this season. 

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17 minutes ago, OneMoSalah said:

Honestly other than Southgate having worked with him at U21, I dont see how he warrants a place in that squad. He has 2 goals and 3 assists in 25 appearances for the whole season (throw in his fitness issues where he rarely plays a full match too), if that were any other attacking midfield/wide player their would be massive questions asked and if I were English I would 100% think its a huge risk. If England perform badly people will wonder why the likes of Wilshere (hasn't missed anywhere as many games as previous seasons and has the ability to go past players, control a match from a deeper position and will take the ball anywhere on the park) and Shelvey (really surprised he wasn't called up, hes not a world class player by any means but he is more what England need in MF, able to play forward, not scared to take risks) didn't get called up who have been better than Ruben this season. 

This is England mate, a yes man in charge and players in absolute blistering form like Sessengnon staying at home. Also leaving Shelvey at home but allowing players like Henderson to constantly be picked because of the club he's at and the old 'Lion heart" label. It will be the same at the WC as it is every 4 years...under whelming, sideways passing, mistakes, no freedom and players like Cahill, Henderson, and Dier all getting exposed for the average players they are.

Fuck me we are taking Welbeck.

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1 hour ago, OneMoSalah said:

Honestly other than Southgate having worked with him at U21, I dont see how he warrants a place in that squad. He has 2 goals and 3 assists in 25 appearances for the whole season (throw in his fitness issues where he rarely plays a full match too), if that were any other attacking midfield/wide player their would be massive questions asked and if I were English I would 100% think its a huge risk. If England perform badly people will wonder why the likes of Wilshere (hasn't missed anywhere as many games as previous seasons and has the ability to go past players, control a match from a deeper position and will take the ball anywhere on the park) and Shelvey (really surprised he wasn't called up, hes not a world class player by any means but he is more what England need in MF, able to play forward, not scared to take risks) didn't get called up who have been better than Ruben this season. 

It was the right call not to take Shelvey, IMO. He has only been great in recent months and he has never been consistent (or world class). Taking players to the World Cup because they perform in last few months of the season is a big NO-NO. It's like buying players only because they did well at the Euros or World Cup when they are in actual fact a bad player.

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It was the right call not to take Shelvey, IMO. He has only been great in recent months and he has never been consistent (or world class). Taking players to the World Cup because they perform in last few months of the season is a big NO-NO. It's like buying players only because they did well at the Euros or World Cup when they are in actual fact a bad player.
Not sure how 6 games max is comparing to 6 months.

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On 18/05/2018 at 7:35 PM, Jason said:

It was the right call not to take Shelvey, IMO. He has only been great in recent months and he has never been consistent (or world class). Taking players to the World Cup because they perform in last few months of the season is a big NO-NO. It's like buying players only because they did well at the Euros or World Cup when they are in actual fact a bad player.

Honestly not taking Wilshere and/or Shelvey will kill England's chances of controlling a match I think. Shelvey isn't a great player but hes demonstrated an ability to dictate the tempo of games for Newcastle and even at Swansea. I wouldn't say taking players who have only performed in the last few months of a season is a no no, you want players who are good but also players who are in form, I think he'd of been a worth while risk considering RLC has been called up..  could argue hes shown much more consistency than RLC the last wee while as well. 

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