Ricardo Rodriguez

[The only place to be 11,313]

We don't know how much it will cost. But given the fact that Cole is out of contract and Azpilicueta is playing out of position I'd say that is an area where investment is necessary. £45M sounds like a lot I'd £35m for the two sounds more realistic. No way Luke Shaw goes for stupid money he has potential but it still needs to be realized. The numbers being thrown around for him are INSANE and I doubt it realistic.

£20 million for Shaw is probably the starting point. If he comes then we don't need another left-back in my opinion, especially not another young guy who is probably at the same level and needs the same number of games.

[Eligius 121]

We don't know how much it will cost. But given the fact that Cole is out of contract and Azpilicueta is playing out of position I'd say that is an area where investment is necessary. £45M sounds like a lot I'd £35m for the two sounds more realistic. No way Luke Shaw goes for stupid money, he has potential but it still needs to be realized. The numbers being thrown around for him are INSANE and I doubt its realistic.

1. Luke Shaw is English

2. Luke Shaw is a teenager

3. Luke Shaw just got called up

He will definitely command stupid money (LB wise). maybe not from us, but another team.

United needs to upgrade their LB position more than we do and the importance of the fullback to Moyes, I wouldnt be surprised to seem them break the bank for Luke Shaw.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

£20 million for Shaw is probably the starting point. If he comes then we don't need another left-back in my opinion, especially not another young guy who is probably at the same level and needs the same number of games.

£20m? to start? wow... I don't know man that is a lot of dough for just potential, English or not... And I'm sorry but Rodriguez is without a doubt better than Shaw in every aspect of his game. Going forward Ricardo is better and defending Ricardo is WAY better. Shaw is decent young English talent but not bordering on world class... As I said I like the fact he is English but I don't see Ashley-like skill there.

just my opinion but £20M is where it ends for me not where it starts and I don't care what the journos say anything above that is ridiculously overpriced

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

1. Luke Shaw is English

2. Luke Shaw is a teenager

3. Luke Shaw just got called up

He will definitely command stupid money (LB wise). maybe not from us, but another team.

Ryan Bertrand got called up... Luke Shaw is a newish, hot name but in terms of World football he only has potential.

[Eligius 121]

Ryan Bertrand got called up... Luke Shaw is a newish, hot name but in terms of World football he only has potential.

That may be true, however, clubs purchase players due to potential as well...

Shaw is what jack Wilshere was a few years back. The hottest young English talent. What English club wouldn't want that?

(Im not debating whether Rodriguez is better or not, just that Shaw is going to be pricey, due to what I said before).

[The only place to be 11,313]

£20m? to start? wow... I don't know man that is a lot of dough for just potential, English or not... And I'm sorry but Rodriguez is without a doubt better than Shaw in every aspect of his game. Going forward Ricardo is better and defending Ricardo is WAY better. Shaw is decent young English talent but not bordering on world class... As I said I like the fact he is English but I don't see Ashley-like skill there.

just my opinion but £20M is where it ends for me not where it starts and I don't care what the journos say anything above that is ridiculously overpriced

It's not just potential though. He's already performing at a good level week in and week out in the Premier League. You're comparing him with a guy who is three years older and making these claims about him being undisputedly better, but that's just your opinion. Shaw is the second youngest player to reach 50 PL appearances which is a remarkable achievement and he's doing well in a team who have some glaring deficiencies.

Ryan Bertrand got called up... Luke Shaw is a newish, hot name but in terms of World football he only has potential.

Bertrand got called up at the age of 22. Shaw is four years younger.

He's also English and a Chelsea supporter. That counts for something in my book.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

That may be true, however, clubs purchase players due to potential as well...

Shaw is what jack Wilshere was a few years back. The hottest young English talent. What English club wouldn't want that?

(Im not debating whether Rodriguez is better or not, just that Shaw is going to be pricey, due to what I said before).

I'm not saying Shaw wouldn't be well sought after but not for the ridiculous amounts of money I've seen him linked with. LB and RB are not positions that are traditionally big money positions mainly because the game is played in the middle of the pitch. If Shaw goes for more than £18M I would be astounded. I don't care how young he is you don't pay much more than that for a LB because he has potential... Not in a FFP world anyway.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I'm not saying Shaw wouldn't be well sought after but not for the ridiculous amounts of money I've seen him linked with. LB and RB are not positions that are traditionally big money positions mainly because the game is played in the middle of the pitch. If Shaw goes for more than £18M I would be astounded. I don't care how young he is you don't pay much more than that for a LB because he has potential... Not in a FFP world anyway.

You're kidding right? How much more space does Hazard get when there's a left-back to provide width and take a defender away from him?

In an FFP world a young guy actually makes sense because the cost can be amortised over a longer period.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

It's not just potential though. He's already performing at a good level week in and week out in the Premier League. You're comparing him with a guy who is three years older and making these claims about him being undisputedly better, but that's just your opinion. Shaw is the second youngest player to reach 50 PL appearances which is a remarkable achievement and he's doing well in a team who have some glaring deficiencies.

Bertrand got called up at the age of 22. Shaw is four years younger.

He's also English and a Chelsea supporter. That counts for something in my book.

Maybe I'm missing something, what is it that Shaw does at a world class level? how many games has he played in Europe? aren't those prerequisites for guys to command £20m at LB? I mean even Cesar was bought for £9m and had Spanish experience and European experience... I don't know how much Shaw will go for(if he goes) but anything over 18M(and that's high if you ask me) is a gross overpayment. You can make the argument that Rodriguez is one of the top 5 LB's in the world right now with room to grow he does just about everything better than Shaw(and yes I have seen him play A LOT)

The age doesn't matter either England is not exactly producing the best talent around the world and furthermore its a midseason friendly... If he can hold down a regular spot with England that would be fantastic but at current its his first cap and its unlikely he will even play... We'll see.

As far as him being English and a Chelsea supporter I've already said I love that, its not going to possess me to go above and beyond what he's actually worth though. He has good potential and could develop into one of the Premier leagues best but right now paying over £20m for him is nuts... Just my opinion though

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

You're kidding right? How much more space does Hazard get when there's a left-back to provide width and take a defender away from him?

In an FFP world a young guy actually makes sense because the cost can be amortised over a longer period.

I fail to see where that actually impacts what I've said, most games are still won and lost in the middle of the pitch. What is the most a LB or RB was ever sold for? of course the position is vital but is it more valuable than a DM, CB, CF? History says no.

Yes but that doesn't detract from what I've said either, I agree, it doesn't mean you spend upwards of 25m for a LB's potential though

[The Skipper 20,609]

He has good potential and could develop into one of the Premier leagues best but right now paying over £20m for him is nuts... Just my opinion though

How much is he worth to you then? I think Luke is probably worth £15m at most but because of the 'English player tax' his value slightly rises - but it doesn't matter because he is definitely worth it IMO, not because of potential but because of where he's at right now.

I've stopped looking at him as a young kid with potential... He's already one of the best left backs in the PL. Second best English left back only behind Baines right now IMO.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

How much is he worth to you then? I think Luke is probably worth £15m at most but because of the 'English player tax' his value slightly rises - but it doesn't matter because he is definitely worth it IMO, not because of potential but because of where he's at right now.

I've stopped looking at him as a young kid with potential... He's already one of the best left backs in the PL. Second best English left back only behind Baines right now IMO.

actual value? Shaw is definitely not close to as good as Azpilicueta but since he's English I'd say he's in and around £15M. His actual Value right now though... £10M

He doesn't win a lot of tackles, doesn't disrupt the attack at all(with interceptions)... What he does do well is get by his man and has decent pace. I'm not against signing him but lets not get carried away, the things he does well are not elite and its hard to gauge what that will be like in a few years.

[didierforever 7,349]

Why can't we have both? Luke Shaw is young and Rodriguez is nearing his prime years. Also lets not forget Shaw isn't tested at a very high level, he is looking good for Southampton but is he good enough for Europe?

Rodriguez is without a doubt the better LB but I like the fact that Shaw is homegrown and a Chelsea supporter... I say grab both and allow them to duke it out for minutes

Simply can't see it happening. Jose likes a constant back 4. He builds all his teams on a solif back 4. Plus spending 40+ mil on 2 left backs who might very well sit out most of the season with iva-azpi being our 2 main full vacks is just a waste.

If I had to predict, then I ll say

Rb- iva/azpi

Lb- azpi/shaw

With one of the yiuth players (like ake/kalas) as the replacement.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Simply can't see it happening. Jose likes a constant back 4. He builds all his teams on a solif back 4. Plus spending 40+ mil on 2 left backs who might very well sit out most of the season with iva-azpi being our 2 main full vacks is just a waste.

If I had to predict, then I ll say

Rb- iva/azpi

Lb- azpi/shaw

With one of the yiuth players (like ake/kalas) as the replacement.

You could be right. I'm not saying spend 40+m on the two either, I think that number is inflated.

Cole is pretty much gone and Azpi is playing out of position because he is good. That doesn't mean he stays there for the rest of his career, I would imagine we definitely buy one LB who is ready to start in Europe now and have another who has the potential to be great in a few years, while we use Azpi as a secondary bridge for our young LB.

Also Brana can't play RB forever especially the way the game is being played now.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Maybe I'm missing something, what is it that Shaw does at a world class level? how many games has he played in Europe? aren't those prerequisites for guys to command £20m at LB?

Nope. What had Rodriguez done at the age of 18? Oh right, fuck all. He was still playing in Switzerland at the same age Shaw is playing in a proper league.

You can make the argument that Rodriguez is one of the top 5 LB's in the world right now with room to grow he does just about everything better than Shaw(and yes I have seen him play A LOT)

I can't make that argument, but that's just because I don't believe it. You're welcome to.

The age doesn't matter either England is not exactly producing the best talent around the world and furthermore its a midseason friendly... If he can hold down a regular spot with England that would be fantastic but at current its his first cap and its unlikely he will even play... We'll see.

He should be ahead of Cole and maybe even Baines. That's not bad for a player of only 18 and despite England being poor at the moment getting where he has so quickly is not to be sniffed at.

As far as him being English and a Chelsea supporter I've already said I love that, its not going to possess me to go above and beyond what he's actually worth though. He has good potential and could develop into one of the Premier leagues best but right now paying over £20m for him is nuts... Just my opinion though

We need homegrown players. It's as simple as that and we need a left-back. He's proven himself in the league already and he's only going to get better which is why every top club is looking at him.

I fail to see where that actually impacts what I've said, most games are still won and lost in the middle of the pitch. What is the most a LB or RB was ever sold for? of course the position is vital but is it more valuable than a DM, CB, CF? History says no.

Yes but that doesn't detract from what I've said either, I agree, it doesn't mean you spend upwards of 25m for a LB's potential though

I can't even think where to begin answering this without it sounding patronising and like I'm explaining the game of football to someone unfamiliar with it. The game is more complex than looking at action areas on a graph. For Hazard to work his magic he needs runners and he needs space, space created by players making the pitch bigger.....

I can't be bothered.

He doesn't win a lot of tackles, doesn't disrupt the attack at all(with interceptions)...

This post bought to you by whoscored.com.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Nope. What had Rodriguez done at the age of 18? Oh right, fuck all. He was still playing in Switzerland at the same age Shaw is playing in a proper league.

I can't make that argument, but that's just because I don't believe it. You're welcome to.

He should be ahead of Cole and maybe even Baines. That's not bad for a player of only 18 and despite England being poor at the moment getting where he has so quickly is not to be sniffed at.

We need homegrown players. It's as simple as that and we need a left-back. He's proven himself in the league already and he's only going to get better which is why every top club is looking at him.

I can't even think where to begin answering this without it sounding patronising and like I'm explaining the game of football to someone unfamiliar with it. The game is more complex than looking at action areas on a graph. For Hazard to work his magic he needs runners and he needs space, space created by players making the pitch bigger.....

I can't be bothered.

This post bought to you by whoscored.com.

Dude, there is no need for insults... If you wanna carry on like a little baby don't bother replying to my post. If you wanna have real dialogue and real debate please refrain from the kiddie comments. I like Shaw I think he has decent potential but its just potential right now...

The reason why we're looking at Rodriguez is because he has matured into one of the best in the world right now. People develop at different rates, some show early potential and never realize it, others bloom later and never look back. It is a ridiculous debate to engage in when you say "look at what so and so did when he was 18 vs. this guy at the same age" everyone is different.

That's more than fine for me, I've watched him a lot and he IS right up there as far as LB's go...

Okay you rate him higher than Baines and Cole... gotcha, no need to carry on this conversation then.

He is good!! we aren't debating the merits of how good Luke Shaw is! Its whether he's good enough to command over £20m at the age of 18... I don't think that's where his value lies and there are no guarantees on potential he could very well be playing the best football of his career right now.

You have already been patronizing and haven't proven anything. LB and RB are important positions on the pitch just not AS important as other positions on the pitch... Put it this way Real Madrid, one of the top teams in the world played Michael Essien at RB last year...

Fullbacks are used more like wingers now too.

again, with your 'holier than thou' bullshit... How old are you anyway?

[didierforever 7,349]

You could be right. I'm not saying spend 40+m on the two either, I think that number is inflated.

Cole is pretty much gone and Azpi is playing out of position because he is good. That doesn't mean he stays there for the rest of his career, I would imagine we definitely buy one LB who is ready to start in Europe now and have another who has the potential to be great in a few years, while we use Azpi as a secondary bridge for our young LB.

Also Brana can't play RB forever especially the way the game is being played now.

I totally agree. Special on the iva part. I love that guy and his passion but he is more of a cb than rb. Also on the left and iva on thw right means their simply won't be balls in thw box from either flanks. But I think jose looks prettty set up on iva.

Plus I think its also the way jose sees as things right Now. Don't think that he considers azpi solely as a rb playing out of position. Azpi just might be our consistebt lb while shaw be our next gen guy.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

I totally agree. Special on the iva part. I love that guy and his passion but he is more of a cb than rb. Also on the left and iva on thw right means their simply won't be balls in thw box from either flanks. But I think jose looks prettty set up on iva.

Plus I think its also the way jose sees as things right Now. Don't think that he considers azpi solely as a rb playing out of position. Azpi just might be our consistebt lb while shaw be our next gen guy.

Just my opinion but I wonder if the reason Azpi is playing LB has more to do with Cole's decline rather than Brana's ascension? I mean if you rank our FB's I'd say its

Azpi

Brana

Cole

Its definitely easier to convert a RB to LB than to convert a CB to a RB to a LB...

I believe we're using Azpi at LB until we can get one in the next window which will allow Azpi to play RB and Brana to be our Utility defender...

[The only place to be 11,313]

You have already been patronizing and haven't proven anything. LB and RB are important positions on the pitch just not AS important as other positions on the pitch... Put it this way Real Madrid, one of the top teams in the world played Michael Essien at RB last year...

And what did Real Madrid win last year?

Underestimating the importance of positions because games are won in the middle of the park (when they can also be lost on the flanks) is ridiculous in my view. It's when you get stability in those positions that you get really good teams, and in Shaw and Azpi we'd be set for a decade.

Now you might think Rodriguez is better, and at this point in time he may well be. But Shaw has come on in leaps and bounds over the last couple of years to the point where he's made the national squad by the age of 18. I don't see any reason why that shouldn't continue, especially with his work ethic. Physically he's way beyond his years and his technique is good too.

But it comes back to who he is that's key for me. I honestly don't care if he's a bit behind a guy who is 3 years older and who has never played in the Premier League before. Luke Shaw supports Chelsea and he's English, and that actually matters. It matters to the point where I'd be happy for the club to pay a premium for him.

As for my age, well I'm old enough to have seen enough Darren Barnards, Anthony Barness's, Jon Harley's, Terry Phelans, Graeme Le Sauxs and Ashley Coles for me to look at Luke Shaw and think he's got everything it takes to be a Chelsea and England legend if he continues as he has done. He is the one guy I'd be gutted to see go to another English club.

[Shane 2,275]

Shaw is English which makes him home-grown for Champions League, a huge asset.

He's been one of the best left backs in the Premiership this season where Rodriguez hasn't played in it yet.

Shaw is a Chelsea fan, it's his dream to play for the club which you can bank that he'll always show passion and up for the fight.

Can't believe people are even discussing which one to go for.