Closed Chelsea v Basel

[The only place to be 11,313]

Well it's not like an incredible change is it? It's not like I've thrown down a 2-3-4-1 or something. The 4-2-3-1 is just a modified 4-3-3 anyway.

No.

So why bother changing it then? It's not like FIFA where it's simply a small change because it impacts on every phase of the game. Again, we have players trying to learn the new system and people just want to change it for no clear reason.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Then why did you bring it up in the first place if it's such a minor change? All I posted was my idea of a team. Geez.

'Where's the value in changing formation whilst the team are trying to learn a new system, right at the start of the season?'

'So why bother changing it then? It's not like FIFA where it's simply a small change because it impacts on every phase of the game'

Geez, soon enough you will be arguing with yourself. Bloody hell mate.

I didn't say it was a minor change. I said it was a change that impacts on every phase of the game.

Wasn't even arguing, just trying to discern your logic for wanting to change the formation at a fairly critical point in the season. Apologies if having a discussion about football and Chelsea fucked you off.

[Special Juan 28,187]

Here we go again :banghead:

[Spike 12,049]

Here we go again :banghead:

No, here we don't go again.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Here we go again :banghead:

I asked him why he'd change it, he turned it into something it wasn't.

No need for you to get all hysterical.

[Milan 17,964]

Abramovich might not be present tonight as he is enjoying cycling in Croatia..

[bushman 2,043]

Since Chelsea have not scored many goals lately. I hope they can score a few tonight.

Personally, I´d like to see 2-3 goals & none of that tight game crap.

[BleedsBlue 1,549]

I don't think Eto'o will start this one because he played 90 minutes on Saturday.Honestly,I would like Jose to try Ba out for this one instead of Torres but we all know that's not going to happen.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Well it's not like an incredible change is it? It's not like I've thrown down a 2-3-4-1 or something. The 4-2-3-1 is just a modified 4-3-3 anyway.

No.

True. 4-3-3 is just a 4-2-3-1 with an inverted triangle in the middle.

[polo 18]

the easiest team in CL

[The only place to be 11,313]

True. 4-3-3 is just a 4-2-3-1 with an inverted triangle in the middle.

It's really not that simple. Formations aren't static things, but that's really not a discussion for this place.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Hearing rumours Ba will start too! Not disappointed at all because I believe he is a Baad man! Thought Eto'o would start mainly because we need to get someone in that plays consistently.

If its Demba Ba I expect him to do well and bang in some goals for us.

[Rmpr 8,977]

True. 4-3-3 is just a 4-2-3-1 with an inverted triangle in the middle.

That depends a lot on how and with what you are making your comparisson. Not all 4-3-3s look the same and not all 4-2-3-1s look the same as well...

For instance, Bayern's variation of 4-2-3-1 is very similar to what Wenger does at Arsenal (not comparing the quality here), but at the same time it is very different than our 04-07 team with Mourinho. It is not only about the disposition of the player on the pitch, it is also about their roles and how the team plays collectively.

There is also Barcelona's 4-3-3, which is different than any other 4-3-3 aproached we had ever seen and it actually looks more a 3-4-3 to me. Which is something that is clearly in a very opposite direction than our aimed 4-2-3-1. The whole idea and plan of game is different.

I could give more examples and really develop in the subject, but that is not what the thread is for. I only wanted to show that formations have a lot more to it than numbers and schemes, it has a whole mentality attached to it and that is what makes one very different from the other. Playing 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 indeed impacts on one' performance, so I dont think it is as easy as you are making...

Chelsea and Mourinho are trying to implement a new mentality and style of play and it will obviously have its ups and downs as things take time to adjust. However, if we keep changing formations and aproaches after every loss, things will get stagnated and we will not get sny better!

EDIT: However, there are some formations that are just stupid and in the end are the same bullshit as the classics though (4-2-2 is just a 'modern' 4-4-2, 4-5-1 is a defensive 4-2-3-1, etc). I think I had a conversation with Strike about this a couple of months ago.

[bushman 2,043]

Perhaps, we might see BA starting tonight.

It would be his monumental chance, I feel.

It must be hard for him, disallowed to join Arsenal, most likely makes only a half of Torres´ 10. 8m a year, if that.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

It's really not that simple. Formations aren't static things, but that's really not a discussion for this place.

In this case, it really is. Changing from 4-2-3-1 to 4-3-3 only changes a little the dynamics of the middle three and affects none of the other 8 players. In fact we've already changed from 4-2-3-1 a couple of times this season in mid-game. But have it your way.

[Chelsea Legend 11 4,062]

Perhaps, we might see BA starting tonight.

It would be his monumental chance, I feel.

It must be hard for him, disallowed to join Arsenal, most likely makes only a half of Torres´ 10. 8m a year, if that.

He's a good striker hasn't been given enough games to find his form with the club.

[LegenTerry 273]

3-0

Mata,Eto'o,Oscar

[CHOULO19 24,332]

That depends a lot on how and with what you are making your comparisson. Not all 4-3-3s look the same and not all 4-2-3-1s look the same as well...

For instance, Bayern's variation of 4-2-3-1 is very similar to what Wenger does at Arsenal (not comparing the quality here), but at the same time it is very different than our 04-07 team with Mourinho. It is not only about the disposition of the player on the pitch, it is also about their roles and how the team plays collectively.

There is also Barcelona's 4-3-3, which is different than any other 4-3-3 aproached we had ever seen and it actually looks more a 3-4-3 to me. Which is something that is clearly in a very opposite direction than our aimed 4-2-3-1. The whole idea and plan of game is different.

I could give more examples and really develop in the subject, but that is not what the thread is for. I only wanted to show that formations have a lot more to it than numbers and schemes, it has a whole mentality attached to it and that is what makes one very different from the other. Playing 4-3-3 and 4-2-3-1 indeed impacts on one' performance, so I dont think it is as easy as you are making...

Chelsea and Mourinho are trying to implement a new mentality and style of play and it will obviously have its ups and downs as things take time to adjust. However, if we keep changing formations and aproaches after every loss, things will get stagnated and we will not get sny better!

EDIT: However, there are some formations that are just stupid and in the end are the same bullshit as the classics though (4-2-2 is just a 'modern' 4-4-2, 4-5-1 is a defensive 4-2-3-1, etc). I think I had a conversation with Strike about this a couple of months ago.

Completely agree. In fact I was making the same exact point the other day in the Mikel thread when Kojo said that Mikel would never fit in 4-2-3-1. But I was talking about our team in particular changing from 4-2-3-1 to the 4-3-3 that Spike posted because obviously you would expect that if we were to make such change, player roles won't change and the over all offensive and defensive system won't either. It would just alter a little the jobs of the three in central midfielders.

In fact you can play a 4-3-3 without inverting the triangle and having, for example:

Ramires-Mikel

Oscar

And this will be exactly as playing a 4-2-3-1 with Oscar in the number 10 role but just under different naming.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

PS: Our youth team just beat their youth team 4-0 with goals from Feruz, Swift and Kiwomya (x2). Similar result for the senior team? :cfc:

[The only place to be 11,313]

In this case, it really is. Changing from 4-2-3-1 to 4-3-3 only changes a little the dynamics of the middle three and affects none of the other 8 players. In fact we've already changed from 4-2-3-1 a couple of times this season in mid-game. But have it your way.

Not true in the slightest I'm afraid, and that's without referring to what kind of 433 or 4231 you're talking about or even the personnel you're using. Again, formations are complex things and what is a 433 in attack becomes a 451 in defence, whereas when we played 4231 under Benitez it would often become a 442 in defence.

That's not 'my way' but just football.