Formation and Tactics Discussion

[Hutcho 8,443]

It looks better because of the attack options we have definitley. But the double pivot looks a huge weakness it really does. And Cahill is still a new player, yes he has had a great 6 months and won two big trophies but he's still a new player and needs to get fully used to the whole team on a consistent basis.

I think it would be wise to get a DM, i think Ramires can play it however, he's also a very good alternate midfielder in the 4-3-3 (one of the best may i add).

Ramires is definately more suited in a 4-3-3 as a box to box midfielder, but don't think it would be too wise to have him in there at DM, if thats what you meant. Atm the only 2 players we have who i think can play there are Mikel and Essien (which could be a bit risky after recently getting back).. Definately like tiote, who would be great there. Better organisation in the double pivot in a 4-2-3-1, could solve a lot of the problems, as lamps goes forwards and mikel is left alone as no one drops in... Still think mikel can do it, so a new DM isn't essential imo.

Also i forgot to add; a 4-3-3 would give us greater width as in the first half especially i thought we were slightly narrow at times...

[oman43 45]

We have brilliant attacking talent, but this doesn't mean they can/have to play at once. In modern day football 2 CDM is essential and with Mikel hitting form and Lampard adjusting to that role last season it seems logical to play them again! The team for me would be: In the 4-2-3-1

Torres

Hazard-Mata-Ramires

Lampard-Mikel

Cole-Terry-Cahill-Ivanovic

Cech

[Spike 12,049]

• Ramires is at his best in the midfield of the 4-3-3. With two other midfielders covering him, he can do his charges through the pitch; which is something I don't think he can do in the double pivot of a 4-2-3-1 .
  
• Mata is very restricted on the wings as he can't dictate play, but he is nonetheless capable. His main problem is his lack of pace.
  
• Mikel is an absolute beast when it comes to playing defensive football, one of the best players around for the 'catenaccio' approach. He seems over his head with an attacking philosophy.
  

[Blu4Lyf 46]

It isn't, no more stupid posts like this please. There's a difference. Mata and Oscar play deeper, and we rotate with the two midfielders who go forward, Ramires is good at going forward so let him have a go. It's a big difference, an extra attacker or an extra midfielder?, i would choose the 2nd option. Mata can convert to a midfielder, he wont be so much on free roam but he can do it with work rate. Look at David Silva, he even covers Yaya Toure and plays DM. Mata can do it too, just let him go at it.

Did you even read what I wrote? I'll take that as you not actually looking at the alignment. The wingers in both systems still have to drop back to play defense. Also, David Silva has absolutely nothing to do with Mata. Mata was useless on defense when Robbie took over. You want Mata to run protection for Ramires. AND YOU SAY MY POST WAS STUPID???? Jesus christ I haven't been on this board for long but you it's apparent you argue just to do something with your time.

[mickaaa7 10]

-----------------hazard--------------

marin-----------------------ramires

--------oscar-------------mata----

------------------mikel--------------

cole---terry---------luiz-------iva

---------------cech

[OneMoSalah 8,778]

no. don't be fooled by a poor pre season. we played mereiles as a no 10 for god's sake and lukaku was our main striker all pre season long. these are not players who will feature next season for our team. not crucially anyway.

when mata, oscar, sturridge comes back- you will notice the difference in pace and movement.

Mata, Oscar and Sturridge will have to earn their places in the team again and then gel with the players so we will have to wait even longer.........

Meireles has played the #10 role for us before, he turned a few times and got a few passes off but I think hes much better as a box to box midfielder where he can pick up on the loose scraps and try and kick start a move for us.

[Strike 7,217]

the 4-2-3-1 is a poor tactic on the offense. What makes it tick is the double pivot and to be fair Chelsea were extremely poor in the first half of the Milan game as the double pivot sat deep. The second half was much better mainly because the midfield started to drive forward.

I hope we try other systems in the game against Brighton at the very least.

[Strike 7,217]

no. don't be fooled by a poor pre season. we played mereiles as a no 10 for god's sake and lukaku was our main striker all pre season long. these are not players who will feature next season for our team. not crucially anyway.

when mata, oscar, sturridge comes back- you will notice the difference in pace and movement.

this coming from the man who said that the 4-2-3-1 will work with better/faster players. Torres for Lukaku and Mata for Meireles wont change a thing. the limitations of the 4-2-3-1 system will still be there. Attacks will fizzle out in the final third and we will struggle to break down stubborn defences. its time to change the system

[HRiver 1,512]

Torres

Hazard - Mata - Ramires/Oscar

Lampard - Mikel

Cole - Terry - Luiz - Ivanovic

Cech

[KonohasOrangeFlash 2,607]

Torres

Hazard - Mata - Ramires/Oscar

Lampard - Mikel

Cole - Terry - Luiz - Ivanovic

Cech

NO MORE RAMIRES ON THE RW!

[HRiver 1,512]

NO MORE RAMIRES ON THE RW!

Why?

[Spike 12,049]

Why?

His technical skills make me cry.

[Hutcho 8,443]

NO MORE RAMIRES ON THE RW!

I agree with Konohas, i think, providing everyone is fit, oscar has to play ahead of him if we play a 4-2-3-1.... It's a shame for one of our best players last season, but has to be done i think. One of our best box to box midfirlders, but it doesn't give us much width and isn't his best position by far.

[Strike 7,217]

I agree with Konohas, i think, providing everyone is fit, oscar has to play ahead of him if we play a 4-2-3-1.... It's a shame for one of our best players last season, but has to be done i think.

Nah, Oscar is best suited at CM. Marko Marin on the right would be better seeing as he relies solely on his right-foot

[Waterfall 893]

------------Torres------

Hazard----------Ramires

-----Mata----Oscar

----------Mikel----------

Cole-JT-Cahill-Ivanovic

[Hutcho 8,443]

Nah, Oscar is best suited at CM. Marko Marin on the right would be better seeing as he relies solely on his right-foot

Sorry, yeah i mean i would play Oscar ahead of ramires, but i would probably play Oscar at Cam and Hazard on the right if i was putting it in a formation, though as many has said to me, he plays there for brazil, which is good credentials, so may even play RW/RAM

[Hutcho 8,443]

------------Torres------

Hazard----------Ramires

-----Mata----Oscar

----------Mikel----------

Cole-JT-Cahill-Ivanovic

If you were going to do that line up i think it would be better to swap ramires with Mata, so Ram can play in his best position, though i think that is too attacking, and would require a lot of defensive work from mata and oscar...

[GhanaBoy 104]

at last we can come to the coclusion lampard and mikel do not fit the bouble pivot. neither wants to deffend and neither moves the ball quick enough. we may have bought players for our attacking thid but the crucial part of the midfield is still lacking, and as such our deffending hasnt been great. I wish Robbie would use Mceachran and Romeu (ala Swiensteiger and Gustavo)as our new double pivot. Its no wonder our best performance so far ( Seattle) came with him in midfield both dictating and controlling the game. And we know Romeu is quicker in his passing and deffencive qualities. While lampard still gets forward and neglets his deffencive responsibilities, while Mikel even though 25 has not learned that when one goes up the other stays home, or ( Like last year)when Luiz goes up drop in to cover.

Pweople will say its only preseason but this was our fouth match while AC Milan this is their third. Plus arguably in our whole line up ( first half) we had players all fimiliar to each other over the year(s) with the exception of Hazard.

We are trying to move in a new direction yet we are stopping at the half way house ( aka Lampard, Mikel Essien Etc... ) As our slow labored play still constrives us to the past. As we all saw the new players and young once were the brightest and imaginative of them all.

And why are we playing Ramires on the wing? Were we playing Barcalona or was it AC Milan I saw. Love the guy but he is limited, and only works for a strategic required gameplan. Not the Wigans of the world. People need to put their sentimentalism on one side and remember its a squad game not my favorate eleven squad.

I thought thrugh out this preseason Robbie would show us something diffrent, change of tactics, formations , and his own brand of philosophy but in the end , nothing . I am quite dissapointed and so will Roman.