lionsden

I have plenty of friends who support man utd and even on redcafe, the overall consensus is that pogba was disinterested and playing far below par for the reserves the season before he left for Juve so you couldn't have been more wrong. There are certain factors that influences how well a player does and motivation and form (which applies to every footballer at every level and stage) are key factors. if juve hadn't rescued him and Pogba was still playing poorly for the man utd reserves then you would have said " if pogba was on the same level of talent of say (insert any youngster playing first team football here) then he wouldn't be struggling in the man utd's reserves this season" right?. Do you see the flaw in your argument?.

I disagree with the opening statement. Chalobah last season was every bit as good and talented as both players at similar stages of their career. Pogba wasn't even on the peripheral of first team at man utd. unless you can provide evidence that most people here rated him exceptionally highly and genuinely believed he was " first team ready" and could easily get into our team then it's safe to say that your opening remark is not the general consensus Your point about Wilshere is moot as he went on loan to bolton for only one season and came back straight into the arsenal first team at the age of 18. . . . similar age as Chalobah and he wasn't just sitting on the bench only getting carling cup games neither. He was thrown into the deep end. And your point regarding Van Ginkel is part of the problem. why buy Van ginkel if you already have Chalobah and Ake. who are, imho, more talented than the dutch. Arsenal could have easily bought a midfielder to block Jack's path into the first team and use that "it's risky to throw youngsters into the deep end" arguement to justify the decision regardless of how talented wilshere was/is.

Instead of moaning about lukaku's limited technical ability, the blame should go those who scouted and bought him in the first place for either not spotting or ignoring his defeciency as his first touch didn't suddenly deteriorated when he joined us which is quite ironic given the new philosophy of attacking and free flowing football that the club has openly shown commitment to. Moreover a strikers job is to score goals which he does consistently so the argument against him here is redundant and lacks perspective

I would bet my mortgage on the possibility that Pogba would have suffered the Lukaku,Chalobah treatment had he joined us instead of Juventus and the irony of it all is that Juve actually had one of the best central midfield in Europe prior to Pogba joining them yet they still gave him sufficent game time despite having world class and established players like Pirlo, Vidal and marchisio ahead of him in the pecking order. could you imagine such scenario happenng at Chelsea? me neither. And no one can use the small club, midtable team or low ambition argument as the reason why Juventus were able to successfully blood the young french man into the team neither.

No. more like we shouldn't have bought Schurrle, william,Oscar, Van Ginkel, Etoo and possibly Ba as they werent needed at the time and rather use our resources more efficiently and intelligently. therefore, sturridge and Lukaku taking Ba and etoo's spot and KDB, Chalobah instead of Oscar and Van ginkel.

people always say it's risky throwing youngsters into the deep end too early as it might stunt their growth/development but one could also argue that the knack of constantly loaning out players whilst buying established/talented overrated stars who play in the same position as them also blocks the progress of these youngsters and their path into the first team and often causes them to lose motivation as they know that no matter how well they play, they have little chance of consistently benching those expensive players ahead of them in the pecking order. lukaku being a great example of this atm. Moreover there hasn't actually being many evidence of blooding youngsters too early backfiring. Nathan Ake never looked out of place last season and josh was magnificent under Ancelotti.

Or we could have grown a pair of balls like Juventus with pogba and Arsenal with Wilshere and actually use his services in the 1st team this season.especially given the paucity of quality in our CM position.

I lost faith in our commitment to youth development and integrating academy players into the first team when we bought Van Ginkel and gave him the spot that could and should have been offered to either Chalobah or Nathan Ake. some could argue even RLC. but ofcourse the grass is always greener on the other side. . . .he's dutch int'l, so he must be better.

And after his loan spells what do we expect to happen to him ultimately?. . .even if he continues to excel at every club we decide to farm him out to on loan. if a genuinely world class player like mata and KDB, a certified Belgian int'l are struggling for game time under mourinho then Piazon or whoever has no chance in **** of making it here. by making it, I'm referring to having decent to solid first team participation. Boga and Traore will likely suffer similar fate as by the time they reach the "right age" they would still gave oscar, mata (if he stays) william to contend with and going by the recent and worrying trend of stockpilping attacking midfielders, more £20m plus AM purchase is inevitable to further destroy their chances of ever making it.

keep the excuses coming guys. it's fantastic Thou shall not loan out or sell a striker whose goals to game ratio and overall performance /contribution to the team in the last 9 months makes Steven Fletcher of Wolves look like super world class striker Let's give him 20 years to prove his worth and only then can a definite judgment about him be justified

Let's revisit the excuses shall we. From "Torres suffered series of injuries and hasn't been rested sufficiently in the last 2 years" - "he needs time to adapt to a new system" - "He can only function under a certain system" - "The lack of service is responsible for his woefully unbelievable form" and many more excuses. Allow me the honor to contribute to the growing list of excuses made for Torres. "Global warming, the current situation with Ghadafi and Libya, recent England riot and the high unemployment and inflation rate in the UK and America" can also be attributed to his fall from grace.

We have heard of terms such as Glory hunter, spoil brat, Abramovich's boys used as adjective to describe those that dare speak the bitter, unadulterated truth, criticize under-performing players/managers, demand more from the team/club and refuse to settle for mediocrity. Add "ego satisfaction" to that list. You learn something new every day and such is the beauty of life

Don't change the subject matter. I have merely responded to your doubt as to whether Anelka fits into AVB style of play. The manager himself has publicly emphasized the importance of flexibility in the team and Anelka matches the manager's attacking football philosophy far far better than Torres and Drogba at this point in time.

Yes. He's quick, skillful, has the intelligence and flexibility to play anywhere in the front 3 and can fucking control a ball, beat his marker easily and retain possession unlike Torres and and Drogba.

I agree. Sadly most people fail to see things from your point of view, which is really baffling as it's a very simple concept. a manager should make his team selection based on players that are in form and fit his vision in terms of style of play.

Sigh. When I say nothing surprises me anymore on this forum, this is a classic example of why.

Spot on. if it's possible I had rep you 10000X for this post. Torres my foot.

I was beginning to think I'm the only one that doesn't rate Bruma as a defender/CB at all. I wouldn't say he's shite as a footballer though, he's blessed with decent technical ability and I feel he could flourish as a DM or RB.

Exactly. Contrary to the popular believe that the media are out to get us. Moreover, the pressure and the threat of losing his NT spot permanently should be motivate him to buckle up and start performing. . . .sulking, failing to score and feeling sorry for himself will only prolong the pressure and problem. It's time to step your game up Torres. P.S. Perhaps he could get lucky and score some tap ins ala Inzaghi,chicharito, if he just stays inside the fucking opponents box. He needs goals badly now and his best chance of getting a goal will come only through staying more inside the box and not wandering around the pitch like headless chicken.

And quite rightly so. That's a manager with some balls who bases his team selection on form and merit rather than reputation and sentiment.

Liverpool are historically a big club that has been left behind by the rest of the top clubs and emerging ones. Hence why their fans are so quick to make reference to their past success as a way of retaining some dignity and pride which is rapidly fading into obscurity.

While we are at it, let's also speculate about RA making a possible bid for Messi,Iniesta and Rooney in the near future

Petr is no saint neither. He's made tons of errors in the past as well which cost us many points especially in the 2008/2009 season. when top goal keepers like Cech,Van Der sar, Casillas make mistakes, it often gets overlooked. An advantage many lesser known and back up GK's do not have. The truth is Hilario has proven over the years to be a very reliable back up GK and was man of the match vs WBA, Bar the error that led to the goal, he was absolutely magnificent in the Norwich game as well. give the man some due credit.

I agree. He is the most tactically astute striker we currently have. . . .that has always been my opinion of him and he seems to have addressed his laziness and unconcerned attitude he displayed throughout last season which was my biggest and only problem with him in the past.The key question now is, does AVB see what we see and does have the courage to drop under-performing and unproductive Torres for him. fingers crossed.

What kind of logic is that? smh.