Ossie the King

That's believable. This summer he was let down badly by the board, and simply wasn't backed. The club showed no ambition to regain the league, had no ambition to progress in Europe and were inept along the way. But we're a 'big club' apparently. Roman just needs to write big cheques and he needs to employ a director of football or a technical director who will tell him to butt out....but instead he has Michael Emenalo and his old secretary advising him. The dream team indeed. Man City instead have hired the guys who helped build the Barcelona dynasty. Qualified men, not a women's coach and tea maker.

Think you might be confusing him with his Blues Brother Frank Sinclair.

You don't have to agree, that's the beauty of discussions. You have to bear in mind that you're speaking from a position of no responsibility whatsoever though, so you can say 'take risks' because you've got no skin in the game. Jose didn't have that pleasure. He had to manage real people and get the best out of them. Maybe he could've thrown in a couple more youth team players and they would've performed, but equally they might not have. He took a decision that the players who won the league last season and showed phenomenal form might regain it through playing time. It's not a crazy theory.

And yet they're primed to win the league this season, look well positioned in Europe and have a great idea of who they want to take over next summer. Plus they have a fantastic infrastructure in place, a great academy and a growing stadium and fan base. You quite within your rights to talk about short term thinking but I can honestly say I wouldn't follow such thinking in either my personal or professional life. Short-term aims are key, but you have to have long-term aims as well as measurable goals along the way. They know exactly what they want to achieve this season and they went about doing it ruthlessly in the summer whilst we bodged every deal. You can dismiss them all you wish but let's see if you can do that next May.

But in your scenario you're talking about a new manager changing everything 3 times a decade. That's not ideal for consistency and not great for youth development. Cosmic elsewhere spoke about an overarching philosophy that outlives individual managers, much like Barca and Bayern have and much like City are developing. Where is that coming from in our club, if not the technical director? And if it's not coming from anyone, what is our philosophy? Or are we nothing more than a rich man's plaything? Anyway, sorry about the Emenalo post. Enjoy your evening.

I agree about Hazard, but he's also had barren spells and made mistakes. That's because he's human. What we've done is backed him because we know what he can produce. Surely the same applies to Jose? Yet some have laid the blame squarely at Jose's feet. Isn't the truth that it's a TEAM effort? Out of interest, who do you want as coach next?

Ok that was a low blow. Sorry. But who exactly do you have faith in? Where does your optimism come from? Roman's chequebook isn't even as powerful as it once was with the increased buying power throughout the league. Who are you backing to lead us forward if not the technical director?

No I meant this sacking of Jose and the hiring of Rafa. I'm grateful for the things I've got to experience over the last 10 years but supporting this club isn't just about that. I was just as excited when I found out we had signed Mark Hughes on Ceefax to be honest. Funnily enough I took my uncle to one of his old haunts up near the Kings Rd before the PSG match last season and that was a gastro pub too. Happens to us all mate, our dingy places get turned into swanky bars that take 20 minutes to get served at. God we sound old.

Mate you are absolutely 100% spot on. The only thing we disagree on is where that philosophy comes from. We had ONE footballing person in a position of any real power at the club and we sacked him. But that's a fantastic post and something I've said elsewhere. Barcelona is a club of the people and the ideology outlasts any manager. Bayern have that. United do have it but they've faltered in the last few years. But I still think they know who they are deep down. Manchester City have it too. They know exactly who they want to be and they hired people to work below their owners to do it, and they still backed their coach 100% despite everyone knowing they want Pep. They are the model to follow (so depressing to type that). But your post is fantastic mate and you seem to totally get that we need an ideology, but that we have NO-ONE their to implement it. That's why I have no optimism.

Absolutely. And by the same token 'attacking' play doesn't always lead to goals and goals don't always lead to wins. Otherwise teams would simply play with 10 strikers high up the pitch. As I said earlier, it's a chess game. Sometimes you have to let the other team have the ball and exploit them on the counter. Even Wenger finally realised this away to City last year. Exactly. The same players when Jose is apparently a 'chequebook manager' according to some. Where was his John Stones to bring in? Where was his Pogba? Why were were outspent by City in the summer? He knew he needed more players, everyone did. He was given Pedro to replace Cuadrado and Falcao to replace Drogba. Who was the addition? Papy Dojflnslnf. That's not on him. The club stagnated and showed NO ambition to reclaim the title. But he did. I actually think he was undermined by the board who not only failed to acquire new players for him, but sold Cech to Arsenal and strengthened them immeasurably. That's not to say he didn't make mistakes but did the board do anything in the summer to back their coach? The answer is surely no isn't it, yet you're optimistically thinking they'll be the ones to make the changes necessary to take us forward? I just don't have as much faith in Michael Emenalo as you.

The one constant at this club has been Roman continually chopping and changing managers. The change you see has to be instigated by someone - who is that? Real change will only come when there's someone dictating the direction of this club who knows something about football. We don't have that. We did have it two days ago. We had one of the finest footballing minds of his generation who apparently stagnated whilst taking this club to it's first title in five years and couldn't get us to play attacking football whilst getting us to score more goals than almost every other team in the league.

Again, I think that downplays a lot of the nuances involved in football. For Cesc to have time to play a pass or for Hazard to have space to operate in you need 10 other players working together to create that. It's about dragging the opposition around the pitch, letting them overcommit in one area and attacking the space they've left. I know this is very simple stuff and something everyone understands but it's occasionally worthwhile getting right back to basics. When something is reiterated a number of times, like Jose or Fergie are footballing geniuses, there is obviously going to be another line of thinking that arises that simply asks 'but are they?'. The biggest issue for me all season has probably been Diego Costa not doing the basics, occupying the right areas and Jose specifically mentioned that. If we can fix that then we go a long way towards sorting a lot of the issues facing this team. Cesc has someone to target, Eden has someone to drag defenders away from him etc.

Your profile says you're 78 and you were a fan since 1975 which means you started supporting at the age of 38. Is that any more believable than me being taken to a game whilst still an infant? Don't confuse the question mark as a sign that I'm excitedly awaiting a response to that. I believe we've both made all the points we need to make to one another. Best of luck to you but I've been advised to stick you on ignore and I think I'll be doing that.

Let's not rewrite history too much. Jose's team know how to score goals, indeed only City scored more than us last season and in the two league-winning seasons of his previous stay (and the third year when he didn't win) we were either the top scorers, or second-top scorers in the league. We've absolutely destroyed top teams as well. But football isn't just about scoring goals, much like boxing isn't about swinging wildly at your opponent leaving your chin exposed. It's a much more nuanced sport than that which is why Kevin Keegan has zero league-winners medals as a coach.

Maybe I'm stuck in the past, getting the train into London, seeing those first flickers of blue at the station, having a chat with some bloke I've never met before but have known all my life, getting a song going on the tube, packing onto a train at Earl's Court and hopping off at West Brompton, having a sing in the Lily, wandering along to Brogans and sweating my bollocks off for a pint and then doing what I've done for almost 30 years, what my dad and uncle did, what their dad did and singing whether we win or lose. Maybe I should just evolve. But that sounds like shit.

See I do agree with some of what you're saying, but I don't believe we had the options in the squad to make the changes we needed to. Everyone knew both us and City needed to improve, yet they went and spent three times as much as us (net) to do what they needed to. There seems to be an acknowledgment that we were running on fumes towards the end of last season but we didn't do the business in the summer so when players had a downturn in form, we're left to look at Loftus-Cheek to come in which is massively unfair and also overlooks a lot of his weaknesses that he needed to work on gradually in order to maximise his potential. You also say about doing things 100 times. If we're talking about Matic, Costa and Cesc then they don't have that sample size. It's roughly half of that and in the vast majority of those appearances they were magnificent and impactful. To regain the title we needed them to get back to that level and with fitness seeming to be a factor, match time was probably key to them getting there. You can't then drop them however much you'd like to. We simply don't have the resources for that to be a realistic option.

Just to add the except above the one you posted: I believe it was a terrible mistake for the club not to view this season as a write-off and start to rebuild a new squad around you. Somebody once said to me, "The problem is that Chelsea doesn't have a Beckham," in other words a single figure who symbolises the team. But we did. It was you. As Lynette tells her ex-husband Tom in a moving scene in Desperate Housewives, it was always you. Now I disagree with the Beckham bit because the symbol of United was Ferguson, possibly Giggs or Scholes, but Jose was a symbol of Chelsea. When we needed someone to look to, it was him. When opposition fans needed to slag us off, he took the majority of the shit. It's hard to express how reassuring it was to be in the stands and turn to see Jose in the dugout. He was the focal point, he was the name we sung and he was the person we looked to and supported. Not what do we do? Look to the middle tier of the West Stand? Do we look to the pitch to see Didier or Frank? Only JT remains and he's been hung out to dry by the players around him at times and even some of those fans who write him off. We've decided to let go of the biggest personality at this club, one of the biggest icons this club has ever had and we've got FUCK ALL to replace it with, and nary a plan to find a new one. But that pales into insignificance because TV ratings for our matches in Djibouti might drop a couple of points.

Building a new stadium makes long-term financial success. It's also a massive gesture but don't forget what happened in 2011 when he tried to rig the vote. I'm very certain that the man loves football but he's not the second coming of Matthew Harding. We were lucky that he chose us (in a sense) and we are fortunate to have an owner so willing to invest in us but that hasn't come without us losing some things. He's shown on more than one occasion to either have no idea what the hardcore support of this club thinks or to simply not care, but that's his right. We're simply customers of a business and we mean nothing in the grand scheme of things because of the increased TV revenues. Not to sound too much like an old man but football has changed a lot and not always for the better.

Mourinho developed a relationship with the fans which is why we sung his name relentlessly. His personality both reverberated and informed the existing personality of the Chelsea support. Roman simply hasn't done that, nor has he made any attempts to engage with the fans. In fact the one time he needed to do that in 2011, he tried to steamroller the very fans who SAVED this club 30 years ago. That stuff actually matters on a personal level, whether you accept it or not. How about we apply that concept to both parties? And to Matic, Cesc, Costa et al? That camp obviously has to believe that because they've ultimately got what they want but I think there's a hardcore of support who feel betrayed. They put their voices firmly behind Jose every matchday (and I've seen them catch some stick on here for that which is laughable) and the club have disregarded that. I think betrayal is perhaps the best word for the way a lot of fans are feeling and there's a gradual realisation that the club that they once had has disappeared. The problem is that a lot of those fans are also amongst the CPO and there will be a reaction when the club comes to them. Out of interest, if you're a CPO member what is your feeling on the matter?

Or he's won trophies IN SPITE of changing managers many times? Maybe Roman just has the level of success you'd expect of anyone spending the amount of money he did regardless of their footballing acumen. After 13 seasons he's got a club who have no idea what they want to be on the pitch and he's surrounded himself with yes-men who will keep it that way whilst alienating the hardcore support on two separate occasions. And in Manchester you have another team in blue who know exactly what they want to be, exactly who they want in charge, have two great footballing people actually running the club and an owner who spent THREE TIMES AS MUCH AS US NET in the summer. We're a husk of a club at the moment.

So was the option to drop them completely and give them run-outs in the cup? Cesc was dropped a couple of times and Costa had enforced periods of time on the sidelines but we simply don't have the competition in the squad to do that. Obviously you think differently and that's you're right but again we're talking about the failures to improve the squad in the summer and provide competition for established players. It would've been lovely to have dropped Cesc and brought in Pogba or Vidal but we didn't have that option so we're left saying we should've played Loftus-Cheek who has a lot of potential but also has a huge amount to learn. Matic and Fabregas were the best midfielders in the league last season in my view and I think their form will eventually pick up again.

The guy has invested a ton of money and seems willing to do more and for that I am grateful. But if you think he's a lifelong fan like us then you're deluding yourself. If you're looking for a lifelong fan who put their money into the club they supported then look at the names of our stands....here's a clue, he's name wasn't East, West or Shed. Roman has done amazing things for this club, and he seems to enjoy owning the club but I think we have to be realistic.

But it's not just that he wouldn't have been worse, but would he have been better than them at their normal level and doesn't the manager need to get them back to that level? Matic's drop-off in form was remarkable but we needed him to get back to his best and you need to give him minutes to do that don't you? How else does a player play their way back into form? Or do you accept that their form simply won't improve and leave them on the bench? That's why no-one can convince you, because there are no certainties in sport. All you can do is make a judgment based on what you know. We all knew what they were capable off because we saw it last season, so you have to back them to return to that and how do you go about that? By playing surely?

I agree, but there was absolutely no intention from the club to retain the title this season based on their transfer dealings. Absolutely none. Not only did we see City strengthen considerably and not try to keep pace, we also helped Arsenal improve by selling them a piece that they had been missing since Lehmann left (and that's being kind because Seaman is probably closer to Cech's level). Mourinho was undermined by the club in the summer. It shouldn't have been this bad, but it was always going to be a step down on last season.

But you have to back that manager and give him the tools, which we didn't this summer. And this was Mourinho - not just a top class coach but someone the supporters would back no matter what, and they couldn't give him that support?? What chance does anyone else have?