Mohammed Seif

You see mate, this has been going on prior to Hamas coming to power in 2006. So clearly the problem isn't Hamas. The UN, UK, EU, and even USA, realize that the main problem with reaching a peace solution is Israel's contentious ignorance of international law through building illegal settlements. The term illegal settlements is not my definition by the way. It is how these countries see it. Hamas is just an excuse. Mahmoud Abbas who is the head of the Palistinain Government (who was not violent) was an excuse prior to Hamas in 2006. Even Yasser Arafat was an excuse. The international community though understand it is the settlements. The only nation that ignores this is Israel.

Again, you are not aware of what you are talking about. And apparently you are not trying to be objective. You are using a Chabad site?!!! Are you serious? Is that how unbiased you want to show yourself? 6 day war, i.e the invasion of Israel in 1967, Israel attacked countries buddy and occupied their lands. Not a single country fired a bullet towards Israel. But as history repeats itself, Israel said it has the right to defend itself. In 1967 they were scared of tensions, in the 1990s they were afraid of kids with rocks.....etc. A pattern that repeats itself. That led to the war in 1973, where Israel losses were more than the war in 1967, 1956 and 1948 COMBINED. Bar Lev was destroyed by the Egyptians sing water pumps (LOL). Later on Egypt took its land back and a peace treaty was made. And btw, Iraq was not involved, and no other country actually fought. Anyways, listen man, apparently if Ecuador gets invaded, you will be ok with it and against people defending themselves and getting their land back. That ain't the case with the majority of people. Just because you don't want the Palestinians to fight back for their land, doesn't mean that they will. Doesn't mean they don't have the right to do so too. Even the UN recognizes the right for resistance in occupied lands. So whether you personally approve this or not doesn't matter. You choose to deny the right for people to exist, fine, but then you can't blame them for denying your right to exist. You have no basis for your argument. You keep avoiding points and jumping to different matters. That shows you either don't know much and repeating something without full understanding, or you know that your points are weak and it is better to derail. Let us ended right here. You asked what I think. I told you what I think. It is absolutely your right not to agree with it. And that is totally fine by me, as it doesn't change any of the facts or the situation in the region. https://history.state.gov/milestones/1961-1968/arab-israeli-war-1967 That is what the west thinks.

No human being can ever explain the two humanity crimes that happened their. It is a tragedy man. And absolute disgrace. The images just flashed back as soon as I read this. Painful mate, VERY PAINFUL.

You see buddy, even they way you put the sentence you show how are EXTREMELY BIASED. Maybe people who were in the conflict someway or another (like myself) can be biased because they have history. You have no excuse what so ever. Even if you are Jew (which I don't know as I never asked you), you shouldn't be biased because this is not a religious problem The proper statement should be Israel came against other nations or Israel invaded other nations. HUUUUUGE difference as Israel was not under threat and it was an aggressors act. Listen buddy, maybe if your country gets invaded, some people will be like you and say "no problem, we lost our land, it happens", like you are expecting the Palestinians to do and the rest of the countries that Israel is occupying their lands like Jordan and Syria. But people don't do that. People will keep fighting unless they get their land back. People will fight for their existence. You happen tp be talking to one person (me) who represents the best example in the world of such people and countries. I am not trying to be cocky in any sense, but Egypt, the oldest existing civilization, could have easily ended up like Mesopotamia or MANY OTHER NATIONS, who now fail to exist, if the Egyptians stopped fighting for its land. We have been invaded, countless times by the STRONGEST NATIONS IN THE WORLD during different eras. But they got kicked out eventually, and we still exist. There are other nations and civilizations who have done the same. It is their ABSOLUTE right to fight to get their land back. REGARDLESS of how long their land was stolen from them. And no one on earth has the right to tell people to stop fighting for their land. If they surrender and give it up, then that is a different issue because it would have been a choice thy made. As far as I know, non of the nations whose lands have been stolen have surrendered. They may not be able to fight back at the mean time, but they will definitely try to come back. Maybe they will succeed maybe not, but they will keep trying. Seriously buddy, you need to read much more and have a more " logical unbiased approach" in order to understand this conflict. As long as you base your arguments on what you think and what you believe without having to have reference, you will not be able to pass your point. Even Israelis acknowledge that the Palestinians have the right to have their land and exist (except the extremists of them). So I don't see why you would have such a radical point of view. No offense of course buddy.

If Egypt lost that 6th day war, how come they got their land back??!!!!! You need to read much more Fernando.

No Fernando, they are not a terrorist affiliation. If you can't make a distinction between an armed group and a civilian population, then you have a major problem buddy.

You have to give them a country then ask them to control their nation. When you give them no country but a large prison cell, then there are no basis for that argument. When you give them their state according to the 1967 borders agreement, I might be able to see an argument being made. But there is no excuse for killing civilians. That is called ethnic cleansing. There is also a difference between having collatoral damage in civilain lives and killing 70%-80% civilian. That is just dehumanizing Fernando.

Palestinian authority is not Hamas . Hamas is condemned and referred to as a terrorist group. Palestinians are not Hamas.

Fernando buddy , you have ignored what I said. I said there are no proofs for Israel's claims and there are proofs of the war crimes . That was in the first couple of lines. I also said that this has been going on PRIOR TO THE EXISTENCE OF HAMAS. You ignored that too. About "if the world cared" statement, check the vitos by the U.S. You put your argument on what you think. I respect what you think. But what you, I and anyone as individuals thinks has no relevance really. You have to provide facts. And the experts on this matter have found Ariel Sharon a war criminal. Have found the 2008 war against Gaza a war crime. Have found what happened in Lebanon a war crime. And the justifications of Israel's disproportionate attacks has been condemned by the international community. I don't know what more solid ground you need. But if you do have anything that is not subjective or based on a gut feeling, please feel free to share it.

Is Hamas using schools of hospitals? I already answered that there is no evidence for that. Only claims and accusations. Even "IF", that according to the international community is unjustifiable. There are solid proofs however, that non hostile civilian areas have been targeted. Their is a CLEAR distinction between Palestinians and Hamas. As I told you, such actions from Israel have been take PRIOR TO HAMAS. Therefore the problem of peace is not with hamas it is with the Israel. You didn't think Israel is targeting on purpose civilian targets? Well that is your point of view. Evidence says otherwise. Gold Stone ( UN investigation) report for 2008 war has condemned Israel for war crimes. Currently, the UN says that their might be a war crime. End result of this assault, will be more civilians dead, more humanitarian crisis and guess what, Hamas will still exist and only get stronger. Similar results that you can clearly see from the history of this conflict. The authority in Palestine is not Hamas btw. So again, the excuse that peace cannot be achieved because of Hamas is nothing but an excuse to continuously carry out attacks against the Palestinians and hopefully achieve what the settlers have against the native Americans and later on attempted to the African Americans. That should be a recent reference. http://www.btselem.org/download/20090909_cast_lead_fatalities_eng.pdf http://www2.ohchr.org/english/bodies/hrcouncil/docs/12session/A-HRC-12-48.pdf

Ok let us start with the first question, is there a reason to hit those targets on purpose. The answer according to Israel is Yes! The given excuse is the usual that has been said for decades PRIOR TO THE EXISTENCE OF HAMAS. You have to ask yourself a question, can there be such an excuse for such a long period of time? My I remind you the same excuses were used against Arafat, when Palestinians had only ROCKS. Same has been used against Lebanon, when Israel was clearly the aggressor.Regarding that atrocities are not common, all you have to do is check the UN. Israel, has been condemned many times and has been constantly ignoring all UN resolutions and decisions. So the morality of Israel is being questioned here. Everyone here agrees that Hamas is a terrorist group. (Atleast that is what I got from different people who contribute constructively to this topic). Having said that, there are no clear or solid evidence that Hamas have been using schools and hospitals. Again that same excuse was used in 2008 where over 700 civilians, who did not contribute to violence according to different human rights organizations (including b't salem, an Israeli organization), were massacred. Only 3 Israeli civilians were killed and 10 Israeli soldiers were killed, 4 died due to friendly fire. I am stating these numbers to draw a comparison with the Numbers that will be announced after all this is over. Currently there are over a 1000 dead Palestinians dead. According to UN estimations 70%-80% are civilians. Ofcourse when this is over and bodies are going to be recovered from underneath the ruins, the numbers will increase assuming this ends as we speak (which is not the case). Now let us look at the rockets fired. In 2008 they were estimated as a couple of 100 rockets. This current conflict estimates a 1500 fired. Israeli casualties are currently estimated to be 3 civilians and 42 soldiers. i.e, the actions of Israel in 2008 we a COMPLETE FAILURE AND ONLY RESULTED IN MAKING HAMAS STRONGER AND MORE CIVILIAN DEATHS. With very LIMITED COVERAGE, we witnessed incidents that indicate that Israel is just committing genocide. Choulo has posted a few already in the previous pages and other members. The killing of the four kids playing football in a non hostile area on the beach and late shelling of the UNRWA shelter that had nothing in it. It is the fourth UN shelter to be bombed. There is no solid evidence of the "human shield argument" what so ever. It is just an excuse. Lately, in the non hostile West Bank, Palestinians were killed in a demonstrations. The human rights (again Israeli), have said that there were no evidence that Palestinians used fire arms. Yet they were shot and sniped. There is no excuse what so ever for the disproportionate attack on Gaza. Israel, has the one of the most advance intelligence and offensive/defensive arsenal, to take out specif targets without causing civilian casualties. This is not a myth or an assumption as Israel has done that before when it WANTED TO DO SO. Let us look at the situation in Gaza. You have millions who are exiled, and 100s of thousands who are refugees in the country where they and their families where born. Are they getting houses build? No. Do they get their basic survival needs such as food and water? No. Ofcourse, if they are not getting those, then the question of security, health and education is irrelevant as the answer is already known or can be logically deduced. Yet Israel still targets homes, schools, hospitals and the already deteriorating infrastructure. There has been many solutions given to this situation. It was called the two state solution based on the borders of 1967 which the entire wold and the Palestinians have agreed to. But ofcourse as Israel chooses to ignore that, and continue with their settlements on the occupied territory (according to the UN), the solution cannot be implemented. And that again is PRIOR TO HAMAS. Now regarding the U.S, that is a bad case for argument. The U.S has committed a lot of war crimes also in the name of defending itself. You can refer to the millions dead in Iraq. Was there an excuse? Ofcourse not. All there was, were fabrications carried out by the Bush administration and the media in order to portray this as a "war on terror". Shortly, they U.S was exposed when NO EVIDENCE what so ever of WMDs where found. The U.S then, used the excuse of "inserting democracy". We all know how that turned out. That was a crime against humanity. Whether the international community condemns it or not, that is another issue. Even many Americans know that including the ones who served in the military. Not to mention the use of forbidden weapons that has caused mutations in unborn kids. My country has a history of 3 wars with Israel (1956, 1967 and 1973), so we understand how the Israeli military works. Lebanon has had its shares of massacres condemned by the international community so you can get the insight of Choulo on this matter. But if you think that we are biased because we are Arabs, there are many respectful members here who come from a neutral prospective and are known to be level headed so you can also take their point of view. Fulham, Stingray, Peace, and others (whom I apologize if I didn't mention). Even better, you can check out the UN and human rights reports. Hope than answers your question.

Sounds familiar . They all, (Islamic militant groups), follow the same agenda I guess. They also tend to follow a similar pattern to enforce their power. They tend to create pockets of instability, from which they can operate and carry out further operations. I am glad your country is not taking this lightly. They only way to get rid of them is by eliminating them. Ideological reform doesn't seem to be working much (at least in Egypt it has failed during the era of President Sadat 1970-1980). However, it will definitely be hard if they are residing in an area with civilian population. This means your military would have to carry out continuous precise operation which will definitely make this a long term war. Intelligence will be a huge factor these operations.

Nice blog. Frankly all that I have heard were the drone attacks by the U.S and lately wave of attack by Taliban on different facilities, including an airport (if I can recall correctly). I think I understand that Pakistan as a country (economy, education....etc), like Egypt and others, form an encouraging niche for radicals if left unattended. I might be wrong, but that is what I get from my Pakistani friends here. I would appreciated if you provide your info on the matter. I don't really understand what Taliban is hoping to gain out of this. Usually, such groups seek to some way or another rule. Pakistan is no small country and it has a very strong army. Taliban have been really bombarded in Afghanistan, and though still a threat, but much weaker. I can't understand what are they possibly hoping to achieve. I understand what they are trying to achieve in Egypt in the area of Sinai. The peace agreement with Israel, doesn't allow Egyptian military to be present there, so they are taking advantage of that hoping to establish some sort of state there. What about Pakistan?

Eih yabni el seya3a di?Ostaaaaaaaaz Translation: Egyptian slang terminology for good job.

LOL, You talk "as if" I replied back and denied that we have problems in our society. Though I clearly said that we DO acknowledge our problem. So instead, you act as if that I am denying all this. No arguement so you make an arguement on my behalf? That is weak. Or maybe you expecting a rise out of me where I would start to bash your country? Sorry, ain't gonna happen. I ain't the stereotype guy. It os only an arguement when there are points for and against. And I didn't disagree with you or deny the crimes towards women in my country. Better luck next time.

LOL, glad you I taught you about Chomsky. You are welcome. P.S. I ain't the one who has no clue what he is talking about mate.

Nice of you to call me mate, mate It is funny, because I got to you apparently without intending at all. You just had to throw my name hint and hint my country. No problem. I can dig that. We acknowledge our problems. We are courageous enough to admit them. We are courageous enough to go through two revolutions in 3 years to make things right. And apparently we are. We don't assume that we are perfect and better than the rest of the world. We are not trivial or ignorant. And we don't get pissed when crticized, even if the criticism was as gentle as the one Peace gave to an over all political environment in the western country mate. I think any rational personal would accept some criticism, not assume perfection, acknowledge problems and tries to solve them. Right mate?

http://ukfeminista.org.uk/take-action/facts-and-statistics-on-gender-inequality/ LOL

Dude, what are you talking about? your friend is the one who put that. Ask him. LOL

You have a source? Nothing on CNN, nothing in the Guardian, Daily Mail, France 24, BBC, Sky News, or even Fox News. All there is, is the bombing of the U.N School used for shelter and the death of civilians. So please if you have a source, share it.

You actually have any source or is this FB stuff? I want to read the full story

So you killed all these civilians to destroy Hamas and once you actually capture some you let more than half of them go. LOOOOOOOOOOL. What is that all about? I thought they are firing rockets and ruining the lives of Israelis. Please tell me that you are not sure. Or explain at least.

No I was. Read some other books too like The Invention of the Jewish People, The Iron Wall, Cold War and the Middle East, The Holocaust Industry and many others. The approaches had nothing to do with Protocols of the Elder Zions but they all arrive to a the same conclusion. Read more of Chomsky's researches. If someone tells me a book is a fraud, then I actually read different things to be sure. I don't take whatever that is told to me as a given.

That is cute

So out of the entire list you picked Finklestein, who other Jewish Israeli scholars actually know what they are talking about, respect his views and agree with him. LOL. That is weak. What about the rest? Dude, that is just lame, but, whatever makes you happy.