OhForAGreavsie

Torres, thank goodness, is very much the past and I have no hopes that Falcao will be the future so maybe I don't have any business posting in this thread but... I maintain that Torres has always been technically limited. While you and I clearly disagree about that, we would probably agree that one, or even fifty, examples where some piece of skill or other is successfully executed does not disprove an opinion formed by watching a player over 90 minutes on many occasions. The question therefore is whether or not that clip gives an accurate impression of Torres the player. I say it does not. Danny Murphy tells a story of taking knowledgeable friends to watch Torres play for Liverpool. He says they would all comment on how much was lacking from the striker's game and that they found those limitations far more noticeable than the positive qualities he had. It is only opinion of course but I say Murphy's friends were right. I heard Murphy say that on the radio but here is another quotefrom him. "I remember when he was doing well at Liverpool talking to a couple of the lads there and they were a bit negative about his technical ability and what he didn’t have, rather than what he did have, which was pace and power. But the rest of his game has never been perfect, far from it, in fact. There was a spell at Liverpool when he was unplayable because of his power and his pace, but once he lost that and his confidence went he became reliant on his technical ability, which he’s not very good at – his hold up play, his passing, his decision making, which is terrible." For me, all this is true and was easy to spot. I was furious the morning I woke up and found that we had signed Torres. What followed was inevitable in my opinion.

I'd say compensated for Torres's lack of ability rather than hid it. The shortcomings were there to be seen, and some of us said so. Falcao is clearly more gifted than Torres but I wouldn't want us to sign him. Most of us would agree, wouldn't we, that our squad needs bolstering in other areas first and that the cost of acquiring Falcao is way out of sync with our need for him.

True enough.

Ancelotti quoted as saying Varane going nowhere. Of course that's what they usually say but all logic suggests this must be the truth.

These days of yore. Pure poetry, like your style!

Having spent 18 months or so screaming that we should sign this player, I'm suddenly developing cold feet. I did not see all of Reus's performances between his return and most recent injury setback but he was far from sharp in those I did see. If my assessment that he was off the pace is correct there could be many perfectly reasonable explanations for a lack of sharpness when a player returns after such a long lay off. Especially when he's coming into a struggling side. Still, I have to admit that what I saw was worrying enough to make me wonder if the injuries have cost him something.

Yep not a place of happy memories for a German Chelsea fan. Still, after Belo Horizonte, maybe the memories of Yokohama have been soothed just a little bit.

As has been said, Oscar has had many, many games which are below the required standard. It would not be correct for anyone to say that he is the worst ten in the business but I don't believe anyone is saying that. The opinion I and others are expressing is that he is not good enough for the level Chelsea hope to achieve. Finding a ten who is good enough will improve us in the same way we were improved by the upgrade from Mikel to Matic.

I hope they were late!

I thought there were a few errors Barbara. I don't remember any well enough to describe them but I do remember noticing as they happened. In fact at one point my summary would have been that Luis was not having a good game, but he picked up.

He certainly did enough to earn another start.

There is no doubt in my mind that Oscar is currently the best option we have for his position. That however is a problem we must solve.

Hello Robguima, Got to say I'm with didierforever on this. My view is that Oscar is not good enough for a club with our ambitions full stop, but he was especially horrible in the first half. During that period it seemed to me that virtually nothing he tried to do came off. I don't think however that today has much relevance to the debate about Oscar's future. Everybody has bad days. Today was Oscar's turn for a really bad one, that's all. The real discussion about Oscar reminds me of the Mikel conversations that used to go on. People argued back and forth about Mikel's worth and there were accusations that his doubters didn't notice all of his ugly but vital contributions. Those conversations more or less stopped when Matic returned and showed up Mikel's limitations for what they are. For me it is urgent that we upgrade Oscar. When we get a genuinely good 'ten' that fit's Jose's system, I think it will be even more clear that Oscar has not been contributing enough when he is in possession. I also don't see that he is bound to improve. In fact I'd say that he is bound not to improve but time will tell so no sense arguing it either way I guess. Lastly there are stats in this thread highlighting Oscar's defensive contribution but let's not forget that a significant portion of the defending we needed to do today flowed from Oscar's appalling play. Granted he was better in the second half but his overall grade would still be very, very low in my opinion. To be the player we need Oscar's grade should be consistently very high. It isn't.

Thank you for your good wishes.

If I was elsewhere and I found something with which I wanted to take issue I'd have done so but this is where I am and your post is what I read. Having done that, I took issue with what you seem either to find funny or a matter for levity. Meanwhile, how could I be responsible for what you do? I'm afraid you have to bear that burden yourself.

You aren't responsible for what Jimmy Carr does, only for what you choose to do or not to do.

Many, many years ago I was travelling back from a night game at QPR. I was on the upper deck of a bus and the conductor (told you it was a long time ago) was Jewish. One lad, a Chelsea fan, thought it was funny to chirp up with the hissing sounds and the breathe deeply comments. The conductor was mortified and fearful. Who knows what terrors may have been visited on his family or even what horrors the man might have seen himself. The stupid little boy who was causing offence was a little younger than me. Like me, he was on his own so when I told him to shut up, he did. I was bigger than him but I don't think that's why he quit. That type of behaviour was all too common in the shed and the North Bank in those days. I'm pretty certain he was just repeating some learned behaviour. I don't think he had ever been challenged about it before or been exposed to its effects. I think he stopped because it suddenly dawned on him that it wasn't just something to be laughed at, but was something that mimicked a wickedness. A wickedness which created countless real victims and left a lifetime of indelibly evil memories in its wake. But you are correct, if you want to joke about the chief perpetrators of that wickedness it is your right to do so.

Freedom of speech is much in the news. Unless that freedom includes the right to offend then it is no freedom at all but, come on, this? Maybe I'm getting too old but I am never going to find levity in any allusion to the Schutzstaffel, whether or not that allusion is intended.

I apologise for my earlier comment in which I described this post as 'nonsense'. Choulo was right and I was wrong.

Sorry.

Welcome Amjd. I hope that you get to fulfill your wish one day.

Just to be clear it's not only applicable when Europa League players move to Champions' League clubs, it also works the other way round too. No player is allowed to represent more than one club in the same competition but each club is allowed to play a maximum of 1 player who has previously appeared for a different club in a different UEFA competition during that season.

I acknowledge that City, who initially used the term loan to describe the move, have stopped doing so and that it is reasonable for Choulo and others to read that as confirmation of their point of view. On the question of Lamps status with Chelsea fans I'm not personally too bothered but I'm desperate that he should not be booed on 31st January. He is a legend of our club and if he should be booed it would send an appalling message about Chelsea fans. If people don't want to cheer him then fine but please no booing. Personally I never believed Frank was as good a player as his reputation suggests and I never loved him the way most CFC fans do, or did anyway. I think that makes it easier for me not to be too angry with him now. When Scholes retired from international football the United man cited certain England players playing selfishly for themselves as one of his reasons for quiting. I always thought Frank was one of the people Scholes meant. I have no evidence to support that opinion but selfishness was often a complaint I made against Frank myself.

I found it by going to fifa.com and searching Lampard.

FIFA themselves say that NYC have given the contract extension their blessing. Strange if it's nothing to do with them. Other than that, we're talking round in circles so perhaps it's time to agree to disagree.