Willian

[Tomo 21,681]

Think this maybe the right time to let him go.

As crucial as he's been this season we see it a lot with players in their 30's having one last horrah before totally falling off a cliff.

It was the mistake we made with the old guard and then a few years later Ivanovic and Terry, while they were still performing we weren't thinking ahead regarding succession plan which left us in a bit of a pickle when they turned to shit.

This is a perfect time to end an up down relationship on a high.

[Rapkun 668]

We will most definitely renew his contract. Frank can afford playing youngsters right now while still being somewhat competitive precisely because we have veterans like Willian to offer some guarantees and constitency.

If we let him go, we would need to replace him with an experienced player. I say this because most Chelsea fans want to get rid of him to make room for the rumored Sancho. Does anyone think we can challenge City/Liverpool in the near future with a front 4 of Pulisic/CHO, Mount, Sancho, Abraham?

Pressure will be bigger on Lamps when the transfer ban is lifted and he will be given money to spend. I fully expect him and the board to have higher expectations for next season regardless of wether we are currently overachieving or not.

[Atomiswave 6,072]

Let him go man....let him go. He has done wat he could for Chels.

I know its been mentioned plenty but once again we see why Marina should have sold him to barca for the big amount they offered. Easy money lost.

[1905didierblue 748]

40 minutes ago, Atomiswave said:

Let him go man....let him go. He has done wat he could for Chels.

I know its been mentioned plenty but once again we see why Marina should have sold him to barca for the big amount they offered. Easy money lost.

But who do we replace him with? And what if we are not able to get our options? We have to look at it from the board's and Frank's perspective. Willian is a solid player, performs decently well, gives his all for the team.

His replacements are sancho - coveted by city, United, pool, maybe psg if they lose mbappe. These are clubs, that we sadly can't hold our own against financially. Not anymore. Him being best friends with Tammy and cho is not going to help us here.

Other than Sancho, who is a direct upgrade over willian? Keep in mind, that we already have a young and untested winger in CHO in the squad, the last thing we need is someone that we bring in for a lot of money but who needs the time to bed in too. So in terms of experience - zaha? Ziyech?

At the end of the day willian might actually be the best option to keep for a year or 2. Let Cho, fulfil his potential, and then we can sell/let go off willy and buy whoever we want to. 

The more I think about it, the more I feel, letting him go, is not an option atleast currently. 

[Vesper 27,282]

30 minutes ago, 1905didierblue said:

But who do we replace him with? And what if we are not able to get our options? We have to look at it from the board's and Frank's perspective. Willian is a solid player, performs decently well, gives his all for the team.

His replacements are sancho - coveted by city, United, pool, maybe psg if they lose mbappe. These are clubs, that we sadly can't hold our own against financially. Not anymore. Him being best friends with Tammy and cho is not going to help us here.

Other than Sancho, who is a direct upgrade over willian? Keep in mind, that we already have a young and untested winger in CHO in the squad, the last thing we need is someone that we bring in for a lot of money but who needs the time to bed in too. So in terms of experience - zaha? Ziyech?

At the end of the day willian might actually be the best option to keep for a year or 2. Let Cho, fulfil his potential, and then we can sell/let go off willy and buy whoever we want to. 

The more I think about it, the more I feel, letting him go, is not an option atleast currently. 

It is Pedro (our other RWer who is surely gone) IF Willian leaves as well we need to buy 2 wingers

we cannot roll with just CHO and Pulisic

Mount is not a winger, its a bad fit there

I do not think we will buy two wingers plus the other positions need all in one window, we COULD, we probably should, but I so doubt we will.

I think we renew Willian TBH

BTW, PSG will lose more than likely lose Neymar first, so they will go for Sancho (and probably fail) even with Mbappe still under contract

Another issue is that both CHO (especially CHO) and Pulisic are better at LW than RW

Zaha is an absolutely money bin toss IMHO unless we are talking around half of what Palace will demand

Ziyech and Zaha also both have the same issue (they are 4 months apart in age, Ziyech being the younger), that being IF we buy either or even both, we only get two sub 30yo full seasons out of either or both. They both turn 28 next season. Not a good long term investment unless we get them on the cheap (which is a fantasy). I also do NOT trust that Ziyech can be a full time EPL star atm, and he is poor on defence, unlike Willian. Zaha is only marginally better in that area.

I really like Sancho, but the odds are stacked against us. The one true wild card out there (Mbappe is the biggest pipe dream on the planet) is Dembele at Barca. We would have to REALLLLLY vet him fully, and also we must beat Barca down to a fair price (not easy at all to do). IF Lamps could get the lad's head screwed on straight, Dembele is by FAR the most talented winger out there who is remotely available (other than Neymar and Mbappe) He could, I repeat COULD, be an insane weapon under Lamps.

Very intriguing, but so so risky.

Oyarzabal would be a far cheaper and safer bet for a left-footed RWer (he can play either wing). He is not a superb athlete, but has crazy high technical skills and footie intelligence. Chiesa is a right-footed winger, but often plays on the RW as well.

'The other (and recent, now that I have seen him play superbly on the RW) option is the left-footed Nicolò Zaniolo (who we ARE linked with and HAVE scouted a lot) of Roma, who is 20yo and is a LARGE strong winger(AMF (1.90m) and good on defence.

In short, I have NO idea what we will actually do, lolol

[Atomiswave 6,072]

3 hours ago, 1905didierblue said:

But who do we replace him with? And what if we are not able to get our options? We have to look at it from the board's and Frank's perspective. Willian is a solid player, performs decently well, gives his all for the team.

His replacements are sancho - coveted by city, United, pool, maybe psg if they lose mbappe. These are clubs, that we sadly can't hold our own against financially. Not anymore. Him being best friends with Tammy and cho is not going to help us here.

Other than Sancho, who is a direct upgrade over willian? Keep in mind, that we already have a young and untested winger in CHO in the squad, the last thing we need is someone that we bring in for a lot of money but who needs the time to bed in too. So in terms of experience - zaha? Ziyech?

At the end of the day willian might actually be the best option to keep for a year or 2. Let Cho, fulfil his potential, and then we can sell/let go off willy and buy whoever we want to. 

The more I think about it, the more I feel, letting him go, is not an option atleast currently. 

The offers came way before Lamps was even a manager. There are plenty options out there, it depends if you are willing to pay up and if we deem them good enough. Yes Puli and Cho aint enough but not selling Willy for 55m plus is not astute business imo. And since those offers till now what has Willy done? Sure he has been decent in recent games but not enough to warrant keeping when you have good offers on the table and hitting 30 plus years.

[1905didierblue 748]

7 hours ago, Atomiswave said:

The offers came way before Lamps was even a manager. There are plenty options out there, it depends if you are willing to pay up and if we deem them good enough. Yes Puli and Cho aint enough but not selling Willy for 55m plus is not astute business imo. And since those offers till now what has Willy done? Sure he has been decent in recent games but not enough to warrant keeping when you have good offers on the table and hitting 30 plus years.

The offers might have been there, but they were pointless if the then manager(s) did not want to sell him. Also, those 50m + money would be useful to the board if they felt it would be useful. If we get that fee for willian and have to spend more on a player not as good, then it is a moot issue.

[Atomiswave 6,072]

8 hours ago, 1905didierblue said:

The offers might have been there, but they were pointless if the then manager(s) did not want to sell him. Also, those 50m + money would be useful to the board if they felt it would be useful. If we get that fee for willian and have to spend more on a player not as good, then it is a moot issue.

Ohh I get that........its a very specicalized business buying and selling players. Thats why you need experieced folks behind it.

[Tomo 21,681]

21 hours ago, Vesper said:

It is Pedro (our other RWer who is surely gone) IF Willian leaves as well we need to buy 2 wingers

Do we? It could end up with an unhappy player. 3 players for 2 positions gives us enough scope to rotate and distributing minutes, 4 will likely leave one unhappy with little minutes like what's currently happening to Pedro. 

If we can find a fourth winger who comes in, happily knows his place, can contribute to a solid level and is content with just filling in whenever (like a winger version of Huth being 4th choice behind JT, Gallas and Ricky) then by all means go for it but i feel having 4 wingers all wanting significant minutes is asking for unrest.

Loftus and Mason may not be naturals there but can play there to a decent level in emergency's, especially the former, if we can sign a striker who can play on the wings (like Morelos) that will give us enough cover incase two go down at the same time.

[1905didierblue 748]

18 minutes ago, Tomo said:

Do we? It could end up with an unhappy player. 3 players for 2 positions gives us enough scope to rotate and distribute minutes, 4 will likely leave one unhappy with little minutes like what's currently happening to Pedro. 

If we can find a fourth winger who comes in, happily knows his place, can contribute to a solid level and is content with just filling in whenever (like a winger version of Huth being 4th choice behind JT, Gallas and Ricky) then by all means go for it but i feel having 4 wingers all wanting significant minutes is asking for unrest.

Loftus and Mason may not be naturals there but can play there to a decent level in emergency's, especially the former, if we can sign a striker who can play on the wings (like Morelos) that will give us enough cover incase two go down at the same time.

Totally agree with us. 3 players for 2 winger spots should be a good healthy competition. Have always felt that the 4th spot should go to a youth player (maybe anjorin?). 

Similarly for cms too. Kante, jorginho, kova for 2 spots with gilmour/Gallagher filling in. 

[Jase 43,479]

Regarding the 4 wingers issue, it's worth remembering that Pulisic will take up a non-HG spot from next season onward. So we need to be mindful when deciding on the squad for 2020/21. 

[1905didierblue 748]

27 minutes ago, Jason said:

Regarding the 4 wingers issue, it's worth remembering that Pulisic will take up a non-HG spot from next season onward. So we need to be mindful when deciding on the squad for 2020/21. 

Worst case scenario we will have Reece, tomori, mount, RLC, Cho, Tammy in the squad.

We have the 3rd gk, 4th CB (Andreas?), Lb, 6th cm (gilmour), 7th cm (Barkley) and 3rd St positions to fill with 2 HG spots. Think it will be quite easy to do so even if we keep Willy and buy a non hg winger (not that I want to). 

[Jase 43,479]

2 minutes ago, 1905didierblue said:

Worst case scenario we will have Reece, tomori, mount, RLC, Cho, Tammy in the squad.

We have the 3rd gk, 4th CB (Andreas?), Lb, 6th cm (gilmour), 7th cm (Barkley) and 3rd St positions to fill with 2 HG spots. Think it will be quite easy to do so even if we keep Willy and buy a non hg winger (not that I want to). 

It's not compulsory to fill up the 8 HG spots, if that is what you're getting at. 

[the wes 7,212]

Mourinho will be licking his lips knowing willian is stalling a new contract willian will probably be one of mourinho transfer targets

[NikkiCFC 7,563]

10 hours ago, Tomo said:

Do we? It could end up with an unhappy player. 3 players for 2 positions gives us enough scope to rotate and distributing minutes, 4 will likely leave one unhappy with little minutes like what's currently happening to Pedro. 

9 hours ago, 1905didierblue said:

Totally agree with us. 3 players for 2 winger spots should be a good healthy competition. Have always felt that the 4th spot should go to a youth player (maybe anjorin?). 

 

 

Meanwhile in Madrid: Hazard, Bale, Vasquez, Asensio, Diaz, Vinicius, Rodrygo plus Isco and James.

[1905didierblue 748]

2 hours ago, NikkiCFC said:

Meanwhile in Madrid: Hazard, Bale, Vasquez, Asensio, Diaz, Vinicius, Rodrygo plus Isco and James.

Isco and James are as much wingers as mount and RLC are. Bale had almost got his move to china before asensio's horror injury, plus bale just proves a point - you won't keep everyone happy.

[NikkiCFC 7,563]

5 hours ago, 1905didierblue said:

Isco and James are as much wingers as mount and RLC are. Bale had almost got his move to china before asensio's horror injury, plus bale just proves a point - you won't keep everyone happy.

I'm not saying we should have 7 wingers like Real I was just making interesting example. I'm fine with Pedro and Giroud leaving in January without replacement. 

[Vesper 27,282]

21 hours ago, Tomo said:

Do we? It could end up with an unhappy player. 3 players for 2 positions gives us enough scope to rotate and distributing minutes, 4 will likely leave one unhappy with little minutes like what's currently happening to Pedro. 

If we can find a fourth winger who comes in, happily knows his place, can contribute to a solid level and is content with just filling in whenever (like a winger version of Huth being 4th choice behind JT, Gallas and Ricky) then by all means go for it but i feel having 4 wingers all wanting significant minutes is asking for unrest.

Loftus and Mason may not be naturals there but can play there to a decent level in emergency's, especially the former, if we can sign a striker who can play on the wings (like Morelos) that will give us enough cover incase two go down at the same time.

so if Willian does stay, you are content to roll into next season with him, CHO, and Pulisic as our wingers? so if Willian stays, chalk off any Sancho, etc attempts

same for striker (where I am less concered about a third striker for sure) BUT if we do NOT sell Bats, that means we only have him and Tammy, and odds are high we DO NOT get Werner at that insane low £25m price

We are overloaded at AMF (especially when RLC gets back) so no buying there

I see many who say we do NOT need to buy a CB at all, even if he sell AC (as many say Guehi is good enough)

also many say do not sell Azpi at RB, so no buy there

this leaves LB (and if we miss out on Chilwell, and say (as many on here apparently want to) a hard pass on Alex Telles, that leaves my new suggestion (and this is ONLY if he has a full year of great play as he is new to LB) of Malang Sarr. Gaya has a 100m euro release clause so that is a no go and I will be damned if I accept many saying Alex Telles is not good enough simply becuase he has been in Liga NOS till 26, BUT THEN be told that Grimaldo (the same thing in terms of a Liga NOS player, just 2 and a half years younger but 10 cms shorter and slower and simply not as good in my book) is a perfect buy or bust, and the sense I get from an overall averge is that other than him (and maybe the 

we could be truly arsed at LB if we miss out on Chilwell

a backup GK is needed, but we can grab something decent for cheap (or may roll with a 39yo Wille

 that leaves only DMF/CMF

I have seen many say we do not need anyone there

or to wait as the club will buy (blahhhh) Declan Rice or some say use Ampadu there. Rive is going to be insanely overpriced and we can get a far better (IMHO) player in Camavinga for 40m or so less, but again, I see zero ties to him from us

so it is basically all down to Chilwell and if we fail on him, and the board (which is more than likely going to be the case) ignores Telles and Sarr and keeps Alonso

we are rolling into next year with quite possible almost the exact same team, minus Giroud and Pedro

I think that is just asking for trouble, especially if we do not get Chillwell and those other two LB options are ignore and either nothing is done there or we buy middling dregs

that said, I can so see it happening

I have seen some info and talked to some people and I am actually far more pessimistic that we will spend much at all, unless a gift horse is pushed into out faces (surely we MUST at least attempt to grab Werner at that cut rate price)

I think the club is in financial expenditure contraction mode and that it is gong to be run far more in terms at looking at extracting steady profits regardless of what is going on in terms of results (as long as we are competitive for a top 4 or even a top 7 finish)

I hope I am wrong, but I am far less hopeful of this that I was just a few weeks back.

the more I think about it, the less I think we make a move for Sancho, not at the price he will end up going for

I just hope that it does not go so far as to mandate we tell Leicester to fuck off if/when they demand 70m quid or so for Chillwell