N'Golo Kante

[Rapkun 668]

The only situation where the club should consider selling Kante is if our medical team feel his injuries are a real issue and could potentially prevent him from playing his best football ever again. Otherwise it's a no-brainer, he's the best player in the world at his position and the best player at our football club. No player could replace him. The Coutinho-Kante swap that's mentionned in the Goal article made me chuckle.

[OneMoSalah 8,776]

Also can somebody please explain where is this sell him hes struggling with injury shit coming from so we should cut our losses shit is coming from? Hes had a bad spell between the end of last season to now with a few injuries. 

Some people have really short memories. Countless players over the years have had one bad season for injuries. Even here, Hazard that year Jose got sacked for instance he struggled with niggling injuries all season, didnt see people saying time to cash in on him then? Diego had them the same year as well if I remember correctly? Lampard in 2010-11 struggled with a few injuries over a period as well. Was there the same get rid of him shit going around then? 

[Vesper 28,773]

1 hour ago, OneMoSalah said:

Also can somebody please explain where is this sell him hes struggling with injury shit coming from so we should cut our losses shit is coming from? Hes had a bad spell between the end of last season to now with a few injuries. 

Some people have really short memories. Countless players over the years have had one bad season for injuries. Even here, Hazard that year Jose got sacked for instance he struggled with niggling injuries all season, didnt see people saying time to cash in on him then? Diego had them the same year as well if I remember correctly? Lampard in 2010-11 struggled with a few injuries over a period as well. Was there the same get rid of him shit going around then? 

He struggles, and the club struggles, when he plays right-sided MF in the 4 3 3 Lampardesque system, plus he is now looking like he is becoming very injury-prone.

That said, I must say, 70m euros (reported selling price, see above posts by others) is shit low, that is only £61m at current FOREX rates. Fucking COVID-19 is going to fuck us on sales (hopefully made up by far cheaper buys)

 

[Tomo 21,733]

14 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Lampard ready to sell Kante basically? While he hasnt been at his best this season that is a bold and huge risk if you ask me. Even more so for somebody who has 2 years experience as a manager. Even at 29, having someone like that in the squad is always a good option to have. Plus you would say he is probably our best player on paper, what sort of sign does that send out, selling 2 of our biggest and best players in the past 2 seasons?

I don't think it's too big a risk purely because we've demonstrated we can cope without him and not just in small games, plus as @communicatesaid we're not in the position to win the league or (bar a fluke run) CL at the minute so it makes little sense going down the squeezing whatever we can out of him route.

In this system Kova and even Ross are better fits for the RCM position, we shouldn't fall in the trap United did with Rooney and keep playing Kante out of gratitude for how good he was under Conte.

I wouldn't advocate selling him domestically because unlike with Matic (still to this day laugh at how we got £40m for him) I'm not sure whether Kante's dip is down to natural decline or not being suited to our new style but if a good offer comes in from abroad it makes sense for all parties to take it.

[Tomo 21,733]

2 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

 Lampard in 2010-11 struggled with a few injuries over a period as well. Was there the same get rid of him shit going around then? 

Actually yes, a lot of people wanted a massive overhaul at the time and that included the old guard JT and Petr aside.

Munich happened so obviously in hindsight thankfuck they didn't leave that year but no one could have guessed that was coming. 

[Vesper 28,773]

3 hours ago, Rapkun said:

Otherwise it's a no-brainer, he's the best player in the world at his position and the best player at our football club.

The massive problem is he is NOT played at his natural position. He is middling as a RMF in Lampard's 4 3 3, and the team's results with him there attest to this.

Square peg, round hole and all that.

[MoroccanBlue 5,296]

More of a system issue than position issue actually 

[communicate 2,703]

7 hours ago, Tomo said:

I don't think it's too big a risk purely because we've demonstrated we can cope without him and not just in small games, plus as @communicatesaid we're not in the position to win the league or (bar a fluke run) CL at the minute so it makes little sense going down the squeezing whatever we can out of him route.

In this system Kova and even Ross are better fits for the RCM position, we shouldn't fall in the trap United did with Rooney and keep playing Kante out of gratitude for how good he was under Conte.

I wouldn't advocate selling him domestically because unlike with Matic (still to this day laugh at how we got £40m for him) I'm not sure whether Kante's dip is down to natural decline or not being suited to our new style but if a good offer comes in from abroad it makes sense for all parties to take it.

This any of the top 6 will take kante with open arm. 

[Vesper 28,773]

13 hours ago, MoroccanBlue said:

More of a system issue than position issue actually 

yes, that too, as there is no correct position to play him at in Lampard's 4 3 3 

[NikkiCFC 7,942]

 

Nicolò Schira

 

@NicoSchira

·

10h

 

Many clubs are interested in N'Golo #Kantè (Real Madrid, Barça, PSG and Juventus), but #Chelsea don't want to sell him. #transfers #CFC

[Fulham Broadway 16,832]

He's going nowhere

[OneMoSalah 8,776]

On 15/04/2020 at 8:18 PM, Vesper said:

He struggles, and the club struggles, when he plays right-sided MF in the 4 3 3 Lampardesque system, plus he is now looking like he is becoming very injury-prone.

That said, I must say, 70m euros (reported selling price, see above posts by others) is shit low, that is only £61m at current FOREX rates. Fucking COVID-19 is going to fuck us on sales (hopefully made up by far cheaper buys)

 

Injruy prone? Cmon the guys had maybe 8 months where hes picked up wee niggling injuries, its hardly being injury prone. If he had been in and out the team for 18 months to 2 seasons I would see the point but its nowhere near that extreme as in half a season he still has over 20 appearances.

As someone mentioned its more a positional/tactical issue than a personnel one. I dont think selling him for any price is a wise move, we have used 433, 4231 and 343 this season and he is capable of being very effective in at least 2 of those systems. Even with Sarri in a 3, in that right side he showed he is very capable so I dont think hes useless in that formation as you would think reading this thread and match day ones at times. Also players can have bad or poorer seasons to normal then bounce back as weve seen with Eden, Diego, Azpi, Matic, among others in recent times here.

On 15/04/2020 at 8:29 PM, Tomo said:

Actually yes, a lot of people wanted a massive overhaul at the time and that included the old guard JT and Petr aside.

Munich happened so obviously in hindsight thankfuck they didn't leave that year but no one could have guessed that was coming. 

Perhaps but I dont think Lampard in 2010/11, even suffering from injuries would of been anywhere near the top of the list for going, although it was inevitable he would need replaced eventually as would others, as weve mentioned in the thread talking about the 1 year contract thing. Still remember the huge complaints when Villas-Boas had him out of the team as well the next season so I cant imagine that many were so willing for him to go.

On 15/04/2020 at 8:27 PM, Tomo said:

I don't think it's too big a risk purely because we've demonstrated we can cope without him and not just in small games, plus as @communicatesaid we're not in the position to win the league or (bar a fluke run) CL at the minute so it makes little sense going down the squeezing whatever we can out of him route.

In this system Kova and even Ross are better fits for the RCM position, we shouldn't fall in the trap United did with Rooney and keep playing Kante out of gratitude for how good he was under Conte.

I wouldn't advocate selling him domestically because unlike with Matic (still to this day laugh at how we got £40m for him) I'm not sure whether Kante's dip is down to natural decline or not being suited to our new style but if a good offer comes in from abroad it makes sense for all parties to take it.

Maybe we arent in a position the win the league in the next season or two but again, the Kante level players are the type you need, guys who are world class. Even then with the correct recruitment theres no reason why we cant challenge, we have done it before. Yes City and Liverpool are ahead and their managers are much more experienced and better but again, a few top quality players in key positions to go with what we have, its not impossible. Plus Lampards objective over the duration of his contract has to be to compete/win the league, just like Sarri's would of been eventually and just like Conte's beforehand. I dont think selling Kante is going to help towards that.

We may have coped in big games without him but for the Bayern game for instance do you not think we would of been a bit better and not got overrun as easily in MF with him, specially as we played 343? Or the 4-4 game with Ajax, I think we wouldnt have looked so open at times with him starting? Also his performance in the Super Cup which was arguably one of our best performances of the whole season and in Lampards reign, he was excellent I felt. Yes hes been up and down but so has the full team this year. I do not think there is one player except maybe Kovacic who you can say has played consistently well this season. I get the stats may look better with him out of the team than in it but I think its also very misleading to assume he isnt of any use here as we have seen we can go 433, 343 or 4231. 

Regarding Rooney, his situation was different to Kante because not only did his physical qualities deplete but the way he played changed heavily when they started playing him as a 10 and not a CF. Other than a shit run of wee niggling injuries, Kante is pretty much still playing the same way he did at Leicester and probably beforehand - but has improved with the ball. Also Rooney had basically been playing every week since he was 16, then from 18 to say when he was about 30 he was playing CL every season, went to more or less every World Cup, more or less every European Championships etc etc. For me theres no doubt that Rooneys case and Kantes are totally different. Rooney is probably more similar to Michael Owen in a way that he did so much so young that he was always going to burn out physically unless he went and did what Ronaldo did in terms of his training, preparation and managing himself to ensure he could play at that level for so long. Although Michael Owen was pretty fucked earlier in his career due to injuries. 

I think it is a tactical issue for sure that has affected Kantes performances this season although again there was the same complaints under Maurizio and he ended up upping his game and playing very good in that role he was in. I dont think we should just say lets sell him abroad because the fact Barcelona, Real Madrid and Juventus are all credited heavily with an interest shows he has plenty to offer. 

I liked Conte's quote about being a tailor when he changed the teams shape in his first season here. I think we and Lampard has to 100% consider keeping Kante for that reason, he has shown he will mix it up tactically etc too. I dont think its exactly sentimental to want to keep arguably one of the best midfielders in the planet still..... 

[Tomo 21,733]

2 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Maybe we arent in a position the win the league in the next season or two but again, the Kante level players are the type you need, guys who are world class. Even then with the correct recruitment theres no reason why we cant challenge, we have done it before. Yes City and Liverpool are ahead and their managers are much more experienced and better but again, a few top quality players in key positions to go with what we have, its not impossible. Plus Lampards objective over the duration of his contract has to be to compete/win the league, just like Sarri's would of been eventually and just like Conte's beforehand. I dont think selling Kante is going to help towards that.

We may have coped in big games without him but for the Bayern game for instance do you not think we would of been a bit better and not got overrun as easily in MF with him, specially as we played 343? Or the 4-4 game with Ajax, I think we wouldnt have looked so open at times with him starting? Also his performance in the Super Cup which was arguably one of our best performances of the whole season and in Lampards reign, he was excellent I felt. Yes hes been up and down but so has the full team this year. I do not think there is one player except maybe Kovacic who you can say has played consistently well this season. I get the stats may look better with him out of the team than in it but I think its also very misleading to assume he isnt of any use here as we have seen we can go 433, 343 or 4231. 

Regarding Rooney, his situation was different to Kante because not only did his physical qualities deplete but the way he played changed heavily when they started playing him as a 10 and not a CF. Other than a shit run of wee niggling injuries, Kante is pretty much still playing the same way he did at Leicester and probably beforehand - but has improved with the ball. Also Rooney had basically been playing every week since he was 16, then from 18 to say when he was about 30 he was playing CL every season, went to more or less every World Cup, more or less every European Championships etc etc. For me theres no doubt that Rooneys case and Kantes are totally different. Rooney is probably more similar to Michael Owen in a way that he did so much so young that he was always going to burn out physically unless he went and did what Ronaldo did in terms of his training, preparation and managing himself to ensure he could play at that level for so long. Although Michael Owen was pretty fucked earlier in his career due to injuries. 

I think it is a tactical issue for sure that has affected Kantes performances this season although again there was the same complaints under Maurizio and he ended up upping his game and playing very good in that role he was in. I dont think we should just say lets sell him abroad because the fact Barcelona, Real Madrid and Juventus are all credited heavily with an interest shows he has plenty to offer. 

I liked Conte's quote about being a tailor when he changed the teams shape in his first season here. I think we and Lampard has to 100% consider keeping Kante for that reason, he has shown he will mix it up tactically etc too. I dont think its exactly sentimental to want to keep arguably one of the best midfielders in the planet still..... 

Problem is if we say it's more system than decline to get the absolute best out of him again we will have to go back on the change of style we've spent nearly two years working towards and not only that, a style our next generation plus all all our signings under Sarri/Lampard are most suited too, abandoning all that after two years of hard work and around £250m spent would be negligence of the highest order. It wouldn't be worth it even for the best case scenario (getting Kante circa 2016 back).

We'll never know but I'm unconvinced Kante would have made a great deal of difference Vs Bayern, they are simply a better team who brought their A game which rendered us fucked, Kova had one of the best displays I've ever seen from a Chelsea player that night and not even that got us anywhere near them. Also worth remembering Kante has played in hammerings before, like 6-0 at City.

[Vesper 28,773]

2 hours ago, OneMoSalah said:

Injruy prone? Cmon the guys had maybe 8 months where hes picked up wee niggling injuries, its hardly being injury prone. If he had been in and out the team for 18 months to 2 seasons I would see the point but its nowhere near that extreme as in half a season he still has over 20 appearances.

As someone mentioned its more a positional/tactical issue than a personnel one. I dont think selling him for any price is a wise move, we have used 433, 4231 and 343 this season and he is capable of being very effective in at least 2 of those systems. Even with Sarri in a 3, in that right side he showed he is very capable so I dont think hes useless in that formation as you would think reading this thread and match day ones at times. Also players can have bad or poorer seasons to normal then bounce back as weve seen with Eden, Diego, Azpi, Matic, among others in recent times here.

Perhaps but I dont think Lampard in 2010/11, even suffering from injuries would of been anywhere near the top of the list for going, although it was inevitable he would need replaced eventually as would others, as weve mentioned in the thread talking about the 1 year contract thing. Still remember the huge complaints when Villas-Boas had him out of the team as well the next season so I cant imagine that many were so willing for him to go.

Maybe we arent in a position the win the league in the next season or two but again, the Kante level players are the type you need, guys who are world class. Even then with the correct recruitment theres no reason why we cant challenge, we have done it before. Yes City and Liverpool are ahead and their managers are much more experienced and better but again, a few top quality players in key positions to go with what we have, its not impossible. Plus Lampards objective over the duration of his contract has to be to compete/win the league, just like Sarri's would of been eventually and just like Conte's beforehand. I dont think selling Kante is going to help towards that.

We may have coped in big games without him but for the Bayern game for instance do you not think we would of been a bit better and not got overrun as easily in MF with him, specially as we played 343? Or the 4-4 game with Ajax, I think we wouldnt have looked so open at times with him starting? Also his performance in the Super Cup which was arguably one of our best performances of the whole season and in Lampards reign, he was excellent I felt. Yes hes been up and down but so has the full team this year. I do not think there is one player except maybe Kovacic who you can say has played consistently well this season. I get the stats may look better with him out of the team than in it but I think its also very misleading to assume he isnt of any use here as we have seen we can go 433, 343 or 4231. 

Regarding Rooney, his situation was different to Kante because not only did his physical qualities deplete but the way he played changed heavily when they started playing him as a 10 and not a CF. Other than a shit run of wee niggling injuries, Kante is pretty much still playing the same way he did at Leicester and probably beforehand - but has improved with the ball. Also Rooney had basically been playing every week since he was 16, then from 18 to say when he was about 30 he was playing CL every season, went to more or less every World Cup, more or less every European Championships etc etc. For me theres no doubt that Rooneys case and Kantes are totally different. Rooney is probably more similar to Michael Owen in a way that he did so much so young that he was always going to burn out physically unless he went and did what Ronaldo did in terms of his training, preparation and managing himself to ensure he could play at that level for so long. Although Michael Owen was pretty fucked earlier in his career due to injuries. 

I think it is a tactical issue for sure that has affected Kantes performances this season although again there was the same complaints under Maurizio and he ended up upping his game and playing very good in that role he was in. I dont think we should just say lets sell him abroad because the fact Barcelona, Real Madrid and Juventus are all credited heavily with an interest shows he has plenty to offer. 

I liked Conte's quote about being a tailor when he changed the teams shape in his first season here. I think we and Lampard has to 100% consider keeping Kante for that reason, he has shown he will mix it up tactically etc too. I dont think its exactly sentimental to want to keep arguably one of the best midfielders in the planet still..... 

IF we only can get 70m euros (£61m) that has been floated as the ask price (I think that is bullshit, BUT maybe not with COVID added into the mix in a massive way)

then perhaps I would say keep him

but if we are talking my original £100m

SELL

then again, IF FFP is indeed out the window for several years, and if Roman doesnt care about losing a shit tonne (which he will if we keep Knate for 2 or more years more)

then hell, keep him

it isn't like he still cannot serve some roll

if Lampard is ever to be worth his salt, then it is on Lamps himself to sort Kante's role into his (Lampard's) system

COVID-19 has tossed a sheload of  my calculations into the shitter

I do hope to hell you are right about his injuries

I say it is 50/50, maybe I could see 60/40 or even 65/35 in Kantes favour he doesn't fall into that pit

thsi season has freaked me out about injuries overall

wtf is going on????????

it is cray 

 

ps

Barca can fuck off with s straight swap of Coutinho for Kante

Clément Lenglet and ter Stegen, yes, I will take that 

[MoroccanBlue 5,296]

If he’s happy and contempt to stay whilst being downgraded to a tactical player then by all means keep him. 
 

Moving forward, he should only be on the team sheet if the opposition has a better attack+Midfield than us. And used correctly 

[communicate 2,703]

17 hours ago, MoroccanBlue said:

If he’s happy and contempt to stay whilst being downgraded to a tactical player then by all means keep him. 
 

Moving forward, he should only be on the team sheet if the opposition has a better attack+Midfield than us. And used correctly 

I disagree, to use player of kante quality as simply part player is ridiculous especially when we dont have better.

The last two games we looked very2 good but can you see our two winger defend like pedro and willian next year ? Can you see tammy, hold the ball like Giroud.

[King Kante 1,474]

Kante is my favourite player in the current squad but even I admit there is a strong arguement for him to be sold. The reasons for this are; 

A) This Summer is the last one we can sell him for decent money - Covid or no Covid. 

B ) He doesn't really fit the system SFL likes to play. 

C) His fee and wages would be a serious amount that could let us invest elsewhere. 

If he stays then great, he is a fantastic player. However, if he is not sold then he will be a sunk cost and the system will need to change to get the best out of him. 

 

[NikkiCFC 7,942]

It is not easy decision to make. Our midfield in general is not clear. Are you guys aware that when everyone is fit our best player in this season is not starter? Because of the characteristics we go with Jorginho, Kante and Mount.