Politics & Stuff

[cosmicway 1,333]

  On 03/05/2024 at 21:45, robsblubot said:

Only 1800 people burned?! someone deserves a medal! 😆

Seriously, that's just cherry picking one metric.

That was actual "genocide" as the indigenous people were pretty much targeted and exterminated or enslaved because of their race.

"The population of Indigenous Americans is estimated to have decreased from approximately 145 million to around 7-15 million between the late 15th and late 17th centuries, representing a decline of around 90-95%.[59]" 
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide_of_Indigenous_peoples

We learn this stuff in high school in Brazil--very catholic population too.

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That was "los conquistadores" not the catholic church.
You might as well blame the catholic church for Mussolini's fascist regime who were catholics in name and did similar things.
The holy inquisition as such burned only 1800 people throughout its existence.
But the Americans who were not catholics were doing the same - the witches of Salem. You could say to the court that such and such is a witch because you saw it in a dream and that was acceptable evidence,
That was before the revolution and the king of England dispatched judges to America who ruled that evidence based on dreams could no longer be accepted by a court.

Edited May 3, 2024 by cosmicway

[robsblubot 3,595]

  On 03/05/2024 at 22:29, cosmicway said:

That was "los conqustadores" not the catholic church.
You might as well blame the catholic church for Mussolini's fascist regime who were catholics in name and did similar things.
The holy inquisition as such burned only 1800 people throughout its existence.
But the Americans who were not catholics were doing the same - the witches of Salem. You could say to the court that such and such is a witch because you saw it in a dream and that was acceptable evidence,
That was before the revolution and the king of England dispatched judges to America who ruled that evidence based on dreams could no longer be accepted by a court.

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the Catholic Church played a huge part in the conquest in SA.
Pope Francis has asked forgiveness from the Indigenous peoples of Latin America for the many crimes committed by the Catholic church during the “so-called conquest.” (2015)

Once again, we learn this stuff in high school and have known this all my life. It was very much the Catholic Church however you want to call it. There is a reason Brazil has the largest Catholic population in the world.

Regarding the Mussolini, that was exactly my point earlier: that being religious does not seem to make anyone more or less "good" (also a definition that changes drastically decade to decade). I pointed out that the Italian mafia were in general very religious catholic, and reckon that did not make them any better.

Edited May 3, 2024 by robsblubot

[cosmicway 1,333]

  On 03/05/2024 at 22:38, robsblubot said:

the Catholic Church played a huge part in the conquest in SA.
Pope Francis has asked forgiveness from the Indigenous peoples of Latin America for the many crimes committed by the Catholic church during the “so-called conquest.” (2015)

Once again, we learn this stuff in high school and have known this all my life. It was very much the Catholic Church however you want to call it. There is a reason Brazil has the largest Catholic population in the world.

Regarding the Mussolini, that was exactly my point earlier: that being religious does not seem to make anyone more or less "good" (also a definition that changes drastically decade to decade). I pointed out that the Italian mafia were in general very religious catholic, and reckon that did not make them any better.

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There were some priests in it, in league with the conquistadores, but not the catholic church.
These days too we are witnessing this with the covid vaccine.
There are quite a few priests in league with the "sprayed ones", the "psec people" as we call them, but not the church itself.

[Vesper 29,406]

Milwaukee Vegan Cafe Owner Appears With Trump, Assails Migrants.

She said her business did better when Trump was president.

The catch?

“Gray’s restaurant on Wells St. opened in August 2023, more than two years after Trump left office.”

 

 

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 17:35, Vesper said:

Milwaukee Vegan Cafe Owner Appears With Trump, Assails Migrants.

She said her business did better when Trump was president.

The catch?

“Gray’s restaurant on Wells St. opened in August 2023, more than two years after Trump left office.”

 

 

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Right wingers definitely have the edge when being 'economical with the truth', would win the Blatant Lying Cunts event at 2024 Paris Olympics

[Vesper 29,406]

peak (well, I am sure they can actually do worse) Jewish hasbara gaslighting and racist AF baiting and hate from these two similar videos (obviously a template is being used to push this bollocks

trigger alert, this shite is hyper fucking irritating

the US Democratic party chatboard I read has been overrun with the worst sort of ultra zionist 'Israel has the right to do ANYTHING it wants and you are a Nazi jew hater if you say anything against that' cunts of the highest (lowest perhaps is a better descriptive) order

they post dross like this non stop for months and pack attack anyone who says anything against the death and destruction that the RW Netanyahu regime and his lunatic base have done to the Gazans and the West Bankers

some openly call for every single Arab/Muslim to be driven out of Gaza and the West Bank, and to kill anyone who resists, plus they advocate for eventually tossing out all the non Jews in Israel proper

 

 

Edited May 5, 2024 by Vesper

[robsblubot 3,595]

  On 05/05/2024 at 17:56, Fulham Broadway said:

Right wingers definitely have the edge when being 'economical with the truth', would win the Blatant Lying Cunts event at 2024 Paris Olympics

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False equivalence helps them a lot both in social and news media.

One of these days CNN had an article reporting on what the polls (gallup and others) regarding the next election, and the middle east debacle appears to only be popular in Social Media. It won't swing the election for any groups.
Immigration is the thing that can hurt Biden, which is hardly a surprise.

Edited May 5, 2024 by robsblubot

[Vesper 29,406]

  On 05/05/2024 at 17:56, Fulham Broadway said:

Right wingers definitely have the edge when being 'economical with the truth', would win the Blatant Lying Cunts event at 2024 Paris Olympics

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this is the RW MAGA liar from that article

a 'step n' fetchit for Trumpy' sold-out PoC

Shana Gray

https://www.linkedin.com/in/shana-gray-a0481434/

 

Plant based vegan food services

Gray Jett Enterprises, LLC

University of Wisconsin-Milwaukee
Milwaukee, Wisconsin, United States 

 

 

 

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 18:13, Vesper said:

peak (well, I am sure they can actually do worse) Jewish hasbara gaslighting and racist AF baiting and hate from these two similar videos (obviously a template is being used to push this bollocks

trigger alert, this shite is hyper fucking irritating

the US Democratic party chatboard I read has been overrun with the worst sort of ultra zionist 'Israel has the right to do ANYTHING it wants and you are a Nazi jew hater if you say anything against that' cunts of the highest (lowest perhaps is a better descriptive) order

they post dross like this non stop for months and pack attack anyone who says anything against the death and destruction that the RW Netanyahu regime and his lunatic base have done to the Gazans and the West Bankers

some openly call for every single Arab/Muslim to be driven out of Gaza and the West Bank, and to kill anyone who resists, plus they advocate for eventually tossing out all the non Jews in Israel proper

 

 

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Yup the total dehumanising of Palestinians. When people are brainwashed into believing some people arent human it becomes easier to commit genocide.

The nazis with jews 39-45, Rwanda genocide Hutus and Tutsis, Pol Pot Cambodia, Serbs and Croats, etc

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 18:14, robsblubot said:

False equivalence helps them a lot both in social and news media.

One of these days CNN had an article reporting on what the polls (gallup and others) regarding the next election, and the middle east debacle appears to only be popular in Social Media. It won't swing the election for any groups.
Immigration is the thing that can hurt Biden, which is hardly a surprise.

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CNN trying to outdo Fox with shitcunt propaganda

 

[robsblubot 3,595]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:14, Fulham Broadway said:

CNN trying to outdo Fox with shitcunt propaganda

 

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While what he says may be true, or more truthful than what the anchor said, a youtuber making claims confidently really does not work for me as source of news.

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:19, robsblubot said:

While what he says may be true, or more truthful than what the anchor said, a youtuber making claims confidently really does not work for me as source of news.

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Thats great.

The CNN bullshit is just being highlighted for what it is -zionist scripted dogshit- and she is supposedly a 'journalist' 🤣

[robsblubot 3,595]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:23, Fulham Broadway said:

Thats great.

The CNN bullshit is just being highlighted for what it is -zionist scripted dogshit- and she is supposedly a 'journalist' 🤣

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Did I say that? 😃
Don't watch CNN, or MSNBC, much less fox news. I do read articles from CNN when, and only if, there is data in them. I rather have less opinion in my news, not more. That's the reason I also don't get my news from youtube: yes, news media, especially professional journalists still do some vetting of information, which is entirely optional in youtube content.

[Vesper 29,406]

So empire and the slave trade contributed little to Britain’s wealth? Pull the other one, Kemi Badenoch

The business and trade secretary played into the ideological tosh that the wonders of the Industrial Revolution were funded by beer brewers and sheep farmers

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2024/may/05/so-empire-and-the-slave-trade-contributed-little-to-britains-wealth-pull-the-other-one-kemi-badenoch

Britain ran an empire for centuries that at its peak 100 years ago occupied just under a quarter of the world’s land area. Yet if you believe “Imperial Measurement”, a report released last week from the rightwing Institute of Economic Affairs (IEA), the net economic impact of this vast empire on Britain was negligible, even negative.

If you thought the empire profoundly shaped our industry, trade and financial institutions, with slavery an inherent part of the equation, helped turbocharge the Industrial Revolution and underwrote what was the world’s greatest navy for 150 years, think again. The contribution of the transatlantic trade in enslaved people to our economy was trumped by domestic brewing and sheep farming, opines the IEA. The tax “burden” of defending this barely profitable empire was not worth the candle. Instead, it was free-market economics that unleashed British economic growth – a truth that must be restated before Marxists and reparation-seeking ex-colonies start controlling the narrative.

It is a risible recasting of history that should have been ignored as self-serving ideological tosh. But enter the business and trade secretary and aspiring Tory leader, Kemi Badenoch, who took it upon herself to endorse this IEA “research”. She told an audience of financial services bosses at a conference in London: “It worries me when I hear people talk about wealth and success in the UK as being down to colonialism or imperialism or white privilege or whatever.” If you believe any of this story about oppression and exploitation as the cause of British wealth, then the solutions to “our growth and productivity problem” will be even worse. It was “free markets and liberal institutions” that drove the Industrial Revolution and economic growth thereafter.

Except that, while they were certainly part of a cocktail of reasons for Britain’s rise to economic pre-eminence, they were only part. Recent historical research, blithely dismissed by author Kristian Niemietz, the IEA’s head of political economy, has increasingly uncovered a mountain of evidence that places ever more importance on empire, and slavery in particular, as important drivers of the Industrial Revolution and evolution of our economy.

Take innovation, and the correctly celebrated inventions – James Hargreaves’ spinning jenny of 1764/5, Richard Arkwright’s water frame, patented in 1769, and Samuel Crompton’s mule, introduced in 1778/9 – that together made it possible to harness the delicate but tough Barbadense cotton and manufacture it at scale. By the turn of the 18th century, Lancashire had emerged as Europe’s pre-eminent manufacturing centre of high-quality cotton, usable with other weaves and whose dyes and prints would hold. It was a position of global dominance that Lancashire cotton manufacture, soon joined by West Yorkshire, would reinforce over the century ahead.

But as Maxine Berg and Pat Hudson write in their brilliant Slavery, Capitalism and the Industrial Revolution, it was no accident that this all began a few miles from Europe’s largest slave port, Liverpool. Or that fine Barbadense cotton flourished in Britain’s slave plantations in Barbados and elsewhere in the West Indies. Or that much of the finance for investing in these expensive, but highly profitable, innovative machines came from Liverpool merchants whose own fortunes originated in transatlantic trade.

In painstaking research, they place slavery at the heart, not only of early industrialisation, but the growth of services such as banking and insurance. By the last decades of the 18th century, they demonstrate that the West Indies was co-equal with Europe as Britain’s biggest trading partner. Cotton’s importance was preceded by slave-grown sugar, which became a national staple. All this spawned a vast boom in British shipping, from 1m tons and 50,000 seamen in the 1780s to 2.5m tons and 130,000 seamen in the 1830s, with the growth propelled by the Atlantic plantation trade.

The ships and their cargoes, whether of enslaved people, sugar or cotton, needed insuring, generating a large marine insurance industry. Sugar refineries were prone to burning down easily – there were over 100 in London alone in the 1780s – causing the need for specialist fire insurance companies. No account of the boom in the textile industry either side of the Pennines or the City of London is complete without empire and the slave trade, which even after abolition in 1833 would continue as trade in indentured labour.

The trade needed protecting and policing. A strong navy was an imperative – the West Indies became the second most important theatre for the navy outside British home waters, and where the custom of giving sailors a daily tot of West Indian rum originated. A 74-gun ship of the line from 1805 might cost the equivalent of 16 cotton mills, but the money was easily found from burgeoning tariffs. The navy was also a richly profitable and important market for British farmers and gun makers.

No one argues that slavery caused the Industrial Revolution, least of all Berg and Hudson. But to minimise and abstract, as Niemietz attempts, the economic impact of first the sugar and then cotton slave plantations, and also the industries that radiated from them, as not part of the story is plainly inadmissible. It is also true that liberal institutions, such as judicial independence and rule of law, helped early capitalism and was additionally fostered by the creation of a unified internal market.

Britain’s liberal approach to immigration, in welcoming inventors, scientists and engineers from all over Europe, fanned the fires of invention and manufacture, as economic historian Joel Mokyr argues in The Enlightened Economy. Badenoch would be more persuasive if, while exalting such liberal factors, she conceded the critical role of slavery, but also that her own government is hardly a friend of judicial independence, celebrates leaving the largest single market on earth and could scarcely be more hostile to immigration – very different illiberal principles to those she thinks drove the Industrial Revolution.

Empire, without doubt, profoundly affected the British economy. Not least, it was a source of lush, easy profits and rents which have become a benchmark that most British companies target even now, so limiting the projects in which they invest. British industry was still sheltering behind preferential imperial tariffs in 1970.

Empire absolved us of thinking how to develop our national economy; the market seemed to achieve that magically by itself. This magical thinking is now integral to our headlong decline, and the IEA is one of its leading advocates, betraying a wilful ignorance that goes beyond history. Its advice wrecked Liz Truss’s career. Badenoch should beware it does not do the same for her.

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:28, robsblubot said:

Did I say that?

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I dont think I inferred you said anything 🤔

 

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:28, robsblubot said:

Don't watch CNN, or MSNBC, much less fox news. I do read articles from CNN when, and only if, there is data in them. I rather have less opinion in my news, not more. That's the reason I also don't get my news from youtube: yes, news media, especially professional journalists still do some vetting of information, which is entirely optional in youtube content.

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Know youre not British so I dont expect you to know Owen Jones. I would trust anything he says as a journalist than any scripted corporate media whore.

[robsblubot 3,595]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:40, Fulham Broadway said:

I dont think I inferred you said anything 🤔

 

Know youre not British so I dont expect you to know Owen Jones. I would trust anything he says as a journalist than any scripted corporate media whore.

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Fair enough, but they all have agendas. Having an agenda we happen to agree with does not make it more right or wrong. That's why I rather just have the facts, and if they aren't available I will take that as the information I need.

The biggest impact these protests will have is to ruin the lives of some of these students. 

Edited May 5, 2024 by robsblubot

[Vesper 29,406]

Angry Trump Calls Biden Admin the ‘Gestapo,’ Predicts ‘World War Three and Everything Else!’

https://uk.news.yahoo.com/angry-trump-calls-biden-admin-173308435.html

Donald Trump unleashed his anger against Joe Biden at a closed door GOP fundraiser on Saturday where he made a speech that was “frustrated and often obscene,” according to The New York Times. In a Truth Social post the following morning, Trump attacked Biden as “a very dishonest man, a Manchurian Candidate” and predicted “World War Three, and everything else!”

“These people are running a Gestapo administration,” Trump said of Biden at the fundraiser hosted at his Mar-a-Lago property in Florida, audio of which was obtained by the Times. “And it’s the only thing they have. And it’s the only way they’re going to win, in their opinion, and it’s actually killing them. But it doesn’t bother me.”

Trump baselessly accused the Biden administration of secretly masterminding the indictments against him in numerous jurisdictions, resulting in 88 criminal charges. Trump is facing business fraud charges in New York, classified documents charges in Florida, a state election interference case in Georgia and a federal election interference case in Washington, D.C.

The former president espoused conspiracy theories about why he lost the election in 2020 and without evidence accused Democrats of cheating in elections and getting “welfare to vote.”

“When you are Democrat, you start off essentially at 40 percent because you have civil service, you have the unions and you have welfare,” Trump said Saturday. “And don’t underestimate welfare. They get welfare to vote, and then they cheat on top of that. They cheat.”

Even Trump’s own former attorney general, William Barr, has called Trump’s election interference allegations “all bullshit” and admitted there was not voter fraud on any scale that would have influenced the election. At the fundraiser, Trump attacked Barr and said his future pick for attorney general would need “courage” should Trump win the presidency.

Speaking to donors, Trump mocked Special Counsel Jack Smith as “unattractive both inside and out,” adding, “This is one unattractive dude.” Trump then used “two expletives to describe” Smith, per the Times. According to NBC News, the former president called Smith an “evil thug” and “deranged.”

Trump also mentioned South Dakota Gov. Kristi Noem, who was at the event but reportedly left early. He called Noem “somebody that I love” even though sources told Rolling Stone that Trump was “disgusted” by an anecdote in Noem’s book where she proudly described shooting her family dog.

On Sunday, Trump took his anger to his keyboard, posting a rambling message on Truth Social attacking his opponent. Trump blamed Biden for the anti-war protests that are taking place on college campuses and falsely claimed Biden is “unable to talk, unable to reason, unable to put two simple sentences together, unable to even climb 3 steps to a helicopter, or the main stairs to Air Force One.”

Trump also — without evidence — accused Biden of “receiving money, for no apparent reason, from foreign countries.”

“Now we have the protests, and Crooked Joe Biden doesn’t know what to do — Next will be World War Three, and everything else!” Trump wrote. “We are a Nation in Serious Decline, a Failing Nation, but we will not be a Failing Nation much longer. Four years ago we were a GREAT NATION, AND WE WILL SOON BE A GREAT NATION AGAIN!!! MAGA2024.”

During his speech on Saturday evening, Trump challenged donors in attendance to give $1 million that night. If they did, Trump promised, “I will let you come up and speak.” According to the Times, Trump “sounded disappointed until someone accepted the invitation.”

One of the people who accepted the challenge, per NBC, was a woman who came to the podium and stated that “Donald J. Trump is the person that God has chosen.”

[Fulham Broadway 17,091]

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:46, robsblubot said:

Fair enough, but they all have agendas. Having an agenda we happen to agree with does not make it more right or wrong.

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Ironically some of the most truthful respected journalists dont work for Corporate media where editorial control is tightly controlled to an agenda.

 

  On 05/05/2024 at 19:46, robsblubot said:

The biggest impact these protests will have is to ruin the lives of some of these students. 

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Maybe true, but people are idealistic when young, and they see the bigger picture.

The millions that protested about South Africa, Iraq invasions, Vietnam slaughter have all been vindicated and proved right

End of the day you are (not you personally), either against mass murder or you support it.