Politics & Stuff

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

15 minutes ago, Fernando said:

Sounds like conspiracy theory. Kind of of like of the USA with 911. 

Hey everyone can have their own opinion, but I don't agree with those conspiracy theory. 

Maybe. Which bit do you think is a conspiracy ?

[Fernando 6,585]

Just now, Fulham Broadway said:

Maybe. Which bit do you think is a conspiracy ?

That the leader of Israel knew and turn a blind eye. Basically that is what is saying, Netanyahu knew and so on. 

Sounds similar to the conspiracy theory of USA with Bush and all that stuff. 

Made for a great documentary back then the Fahrenheit 911 and stuff like that. 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

6 minutes ago, Fernando said:

That the leader of Israel knew and turn a blind eye. Basically that is what is saying, Netanyahu knew and so on. 

Yeah maybe. Israel has one of the best intelligence and eavesdropping services in the World, and the second biggest military capability in the World per capita, yet in response to the attacks outside Gaza they took 8, 13, and 20 hours to respond respectively. Seems a bit weird, maybe they had a day off.

Netanyahu “Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas … This is part of our strategy – to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.” Netanuahu to his cabinet 2019.

[Fernando 6,585]

1 hour ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Yeah maybe. Israel has one of the best intelligence and eavesdropping services in the World, and the second biggest military capability in the World per capita, yet in response to the attacks outside Gaza they took 8, 13, and 20 hours to respond respectively. Seems a bit weird, maybe they had a day off.

Netanyahu “Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas … This is part of our strategy – to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.” Netanuahu to his cabinet 2019.

Or they where overconfidence and they didn't think something like this could happen. But rest assure they will do their investigation and if  it's true then he will be condemn and go to jail. If not and it was just a fault of over self confidence, then things will change. 

And as far as that quote from 2019, I'm trying to find it but all i get is sketchy places.....You got one from a reputable sources? 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

10 minutes ago, Fernando said:

Or they where overconfidence and they didn't think something like this could happen. But rest assure they will do their investigation and if  it's true then he will be condemn and go to jail. If not and it was just a fault of over self confidence, then things will change. 

Massive groundswell in Israel for Netanyahu to go once this is all over

 

11 minutes ago, Fernando said:

And as far as that quote from 2019, I'm trying to find it but all i get is sketchy places.....You got one from a reputable sources? 

Warning: Benjamin Netanyahu is walking right into Hamas’s trap | Jonathan Freedland | The Guardian

Jonathan Freedland is Jewish.

Also I have Evangelical Christian friends in the US who were brought up to see Israel as the cradle of Christianity, even they are turning away from the pariah apartheid regime now.

[Fernando 6,585]

31 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Massive groundswell in Israel for Netanyahu to go once this is all over

 

Warning: Benjamin Netanyahu is walking right into Hamas’s trap | Jonathan Freedland | The Guardian

Jonathan Freedland is Jewish.

Also I have Evangelical Christian friends in the US who were brought up to see Israel as the cradle of Christianity, even they are turning away from the pariah apartheid regime now.

I check the article, guy is saying something similar I mentioned that just like US with 911 they went with rage and did some bad decisions. Similar here Israel.  

But I checked the quote and it took me to Vox and this is what Vox said: 

Second, a columnist at Israel’s Ha’aretz newspaper unearthed evidence that Netanyahu has intentionally propped up Hamas rule in Gaza — seeing Palestinian extremism as a bulwark against a two-state solution to the conflict.

“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas,” the prime minister reportedly said at a 2019 meeting of his Likud party. “This is part of our strategy — to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.”

These exact comments have not yet been confirmed by other sources. But the Times of Israel’s Tal Schneider wrote on Sunday that Netanyahu’s reported words “are in line with the policy that he implemented,” which did little to challenge and in some ways bolstered Hamas’s control over the Gaza Strip. Moreover, Schneider notes, “the same messaging was repeated by right-wing commentators, who may have received briefings on the matter or talked to Likud higher-ups and understood the message.” Some Netanyahu confidants have said the same thing, as have outside experts.

https://www.vox.com/23910085/netanyahu-israel-right-hamas-gaza-war-history

That sounds like a he said, she said. Those quotes as far I can see are no concrete as it's not taking it back to 2019, but to just recent articles.....

 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

Just now, Fernando said:

I check the article, guy is saying something similar I mentioned that just like US with 911 they went with rage and did some bad decisions. Similar here Israel.  

But I checked the quote and it took me to Vox and this is what Vox said: 

Second, a columnist at Israel’s Ha’aretz newspaper unearthed evidence that Netanyahu has intentionally propped up Hamas rule in Gaza — seeing Palestinian extremism as a bulwark against a two-state solution to the conflict.

“Anyone who wants to thwart the establishment of a Palestinian state has to support bolstering Hamas and transferring money to Hamas,” the prime minister reportedly said at a 2019 meeting of his Likud party. “This is part of our strategy — to isolate the Palestinians in Gaza from the Palestinians in the West Bank.”

These exact comments have not yet been confirmed by other sources. But the Times of Israel’s Tal Schneider wrote on Sunday that Netanyahu’s reported words “are in line with the policy that he implemented,” which did little to challenge and in some ways bolstered Hamas’s control over the Gaza Strip. Moreover, Schneider notes, “the same messaging was repeated by right-wing commentators, who may have received briefings on the matter or talked to Likud higher-ups and understood the message.” Some Netanyahu confidants have said the same thing, as have outside experts.

https://www.vox.com/23910085/netanyahu-israel-right-hamas-gaza-war-history

That sounds like a he said, she said. Those quotes as far I can see are no concrete as it's not taking it back to 2019, but to just recent articles.....

 

The Guardian would not quote Netanyahu without absolute guaranteed authenticity - they would be sued to the extreme. Though you can understand the Israeli  PR machine doing whatever it could to bury the quote.

[Fernando 6,585]

Just now, Fulham Broadway said:

The Guardian would not quote Netanyahu without absolute guaranteed authenticity - they would be sued to the extreme. Though you can understand the Israeli  PR machine doing whatever it could to bury the quote.

But I can agree with the article because I remember after September 11 no one thought with a cool head. It was just a rage to get pay back. 

With what Hamas did, Israel is in a similar mode. And that is the sad part, because yes Hamas are a terrorist organization, but a lot of innocent people are dying. That is always the worst part of war  weather here in Israel, Ukraine, wars in Africa etc etc. 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

Piers gets pwned by Lowkey

 

[DDA 9,947]

10 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Piers gets pwned by Lowkey

 

Watched it earlier. Lowkey is far too intelligent to let Peirs get away with making every interview about his own moral conundrum. We all know Peirs has been banging to the beat of a drum to only sound out the atrocities of October 7th with completely disregarding the deaths of thousands of Palestinian civilians that were taken before that day. Peirs is a bang average journalist, always has been and always will be. Lowkey is and always has been about seeking the truth.

[lucio 5,418]

Hmmm 🧐 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

4 hours ago, DDA said:

Watched it earlier. Lowkey is far too intelligent to let Peirs get away with making every interview about his own moral conundrum. We all know Peirs has been banging to the beat of a drum to only sound out the atrocities of October 7th with completely disregarding the deaths of thousands of Palestinian civilians that were taken before that day. Peirs is a bang average journalist, always has been and always will be. Lowkey is and always has been about seeking the truth.

In his defence, a small one, he has had palestinian speakers on most nights - but youre 100%. Every night he mentions how he was against the Iraq invasions, and he had a go at Lowkey yet lets all the Israelis off never challenging the genocide or the 6500 killed in the last 7 days

[MoroccanBlue 5,385]

I'm just glad Piers is getting recognised for the blatant disparity in his views on the Israel-Palestine conflict, and how he has the audacity to claim he's being "Fair".

Hilarious how he's been bombarded the last few days after saying he denied claiming "Hundreds of Israeli babies were decapitated", only for evidence to resurface that put him on blast for saying that. He's now trying to change his tune by saying, it was reported to him that babies were decapitated, as if that makes a difference. There's a reason he was sacked as a journalist for falsifying claims. 

7 hours ago, Fulham Broadway said:

In his defence, a small one, he has had palestinian speakers on most nights - but youre 100%. Every night he mentions how he was against the Iraq invasions, and he had a go at Lowkey yet lets all the Israelis off never challenging the genocide or the 6500 killed in the last 7 days

It shouldn't be restricted to only the last 7 days though. We are talking about a massive difference in death proportion since the 1950s. 1 Israeli for every 30 Palestinians. Heroism vs Terrorism apparently. But Piers won't even have the balls to go as far back as 7 days so I doubt he will ever ask this question.  "Do you condemn the Israeli Government and the IDF for the ethnical cleansing on Palestine for the past 50 years?"

He's just had that far right activist Emily Austin on his show that tries to defend this claim that it was the Arabs that started to war in 1948. Irritated me that the Palestinian she was debating with never brought up the several ethnical cleansing massacres Zionists committed months prior before the Arabs declared war.  

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

42 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

I'm just glad Piers is getting recognised for the blatant disparity in his views on the Israel-Palestine conflict, and how he has the audacity to claim he's being "Fair".

Hilarious how he's been bombarded the last few days after saying he denied claiming "Hundreds of Israeli babies were decapitated", only for evidence to resurface that put him on blast for saying that. He's now trying to change his tune by saying, it was reported to him that babies were decapitated, as if that makes a difference. There's a reason he was sacked as a journalist for falsifying claims. 

It shouldn't be restricted to only the last 7 days though. We are talking about a massive difference in death proportion since the 1950s. 1 Israeli for every 30 Palestinians. Heroism vs Terrorism apparently. But Piers won't even have the balls to go as far back as 7 days so I doubt he will ever ask this question.  "Do you condemn the Israeli Government and the IDF for the ethnical cleansing on Palestine for the past 50 years?"

He's just had that far right activist Emily Austin on his show that tries to defend this claim that it was the Arabs that started to war in 1948. Irritated me that the Palestinian she was debating with never brought up the several ethnical cleansing massacres Zionists committed months prior before the Arabs declared war.  

Yeah i know the history 100%. But even if you didnt, you dont have to be a Muslim, Christian, Atheist, Jew, anything, just a human being to call it what it is apartheid, occupying, genocidal regime. A US sattellite state in the Middle east

Saw that Emily Austin she was just appalling as are most apologists. The UK ambassador is horrific = apparently she is the granddaughter of Irgun. The leader of the group that blew up the King David Hotel, an Israeli, false flag bombing that accelerated the 'cleansing' resulting in hundreds of settlements and 5500 Palestinian deaths. 

The MSM is 100% complicit as well. On not one 'newspaper' can you leave a comment about 80% of UK MPs being in the 'Friends of Israel' group. If you do it gets deleted, if you persist your account gets terminated. All the MPs  have been given all expenses Israeli holidays, wined and dined in luxury. Call it for what it is, bribery. AIPAC in the US is the same , as in most other European countries.

[Vesper 30,233]

20 hours ago, Fulham Broadway said:

AIPAC in the US is the same

they are horrid

 

The Israel Lobby in the US - VPRO documentary - 2007

 

For many years now the American foreign policy has been characterised by the strong tie between the United States and Israel. Does the United States in fact keep Israel on its feet? And how long will it continue to do so? In 2006 the American political scientists John Mearsheimer and Steve Walt published the controversial article 'The Israel Lobby and US foreign policy'. In it they state that it is not, or no longer, expedient for the US to support and protect present-day Israel. The documentary sheds light on both parties involved in the discussion: those who wish to maintain the strong tie between the US and Israel, and those who were critical of it and not infrequently became 'victims' of the lobby. The question arises to what extend the pro-Israel lobby ultimately determines the military and political importance of Israel itself. With political scientist John Mearsheimer, neocon Richard Perle, lobby organization AIPAC, televangelist John Hagee, historian Tony Judt, Human Rights Watch director Kenneth Roth, colonel Lawrence Wilkerson, Democrat Earl Hilliard, Israeli peace negotiator Daniel Levy and investigative journalist Michael Massing. Originally broadcasted by VPRO in 2007. © VPRO Backlight April 2007

[Fernando 6,585]

Another mass shooting in USA, this time in Maine. 

This is getting crazy. 

[lucio 5,418]

Guns are for losers 

[Fernando 6,585]

21 hours ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Yeah i know the history 100%. But even if you didnt, you dont have to be a Muslim, Christian, Atheist, Jew, anything, just a human being to call it what it is apartheid, occupying, genocidal regime. A US sattellite state in the Middle east

Saw that Emily Austin she was just appalling as are most apologists. The UK ambassador is horrific = apparently she is the granddaughter of Irgun. The leader of the group that blew up the King David Hotel, an Israeli, false flag bombing that accelerated the 'cleansing' resulting in hundreds of settlements and 5500 Palestinian deaths. 

The MSM is 100% complicit as well. On not one 'newspaper' can you leave a comment about 80% of UK MPs being in the 'Friends of Israel' group. If you do it gets deleted, if you persist your account gets terminated. All the MPs  have been given all expenses Israeli holidays, wined and dined in luxury. Call it for what it is, bribery. AIPAC in the US is the same , as in most other European countries.

I agree with most except this:  A US satellite state in the Middle east

for real? If USA was that powerful we would have Afghanistan and Iraq as another colony. 

We suck at maintaining satellite states. So I don't agree with that, otherwise we would continue to have heavy presence everywhere. Another example Panama was all USA, then they kick us out. 

So no I don't agree with that, we are very bad maintaining that. 

[Fulham Broadway 17,335]

1 hour ago, Fernando said:

I agree with most except this:  A US satellite state in the Middle east

for real? If USA was that powerful we would have Afghanistan and Iraq as another colony. 

We suck at maintaining satellite states. So I don't agree with that, otherwise we would continue to have heavy presence everywhere. Another example Panama was all USA, then they kick us out. 

So no I don't agree with that, we are very bad maintaining that. 

Maybe. It is strategically more important for US interests than Panama. Israel and US share intelligence. Israel is surrounded by largely states that are arab and sceptical towrds US intentions. It is strategically very important for US hegemony. AIPAC is the most powerful lobby group in congress. The US gives Israel 3,8 billion dollars a year and state of the art latest military and surveillance equipment, Israel has just held the begging bowl out again and asked for an extra 10 billion of US tax payers money for military equipment that they will doubtless receive, pretty unique relationship if not a sattellite state.

[Fernando 6,585]

6 minutes ago, Fulham Broadway said:

Maybe. It is strategically more important for US interests than Panama. Israel and US share intelligence. Israel is surrounded by largely states that are arab and sceptical towrds US intentions. It is strategically very important for US hegemony. AIPAC is the most powerful lobby group in congress. The US gives Israel 3,8 billion dollars a year and state of the art latest military and surveillance equipment, Israel has just held the begging bowl out again and asked for an extra 10 billion of US tax payers money for military equipment that they will doubtless receive, pretty unique relationship if not a sattellite state.

Well it's because Israel has done good with what it's giving. Because we tried to do the same in other countries, Israel is one of the few that has come good. 

Would have love to have the same in Iraq and Afghanistan, but it never worked. So it's not as easy as it seems, there's many factors to consider. 

If Israel has progress today is a lot because of their people. Other countries just kicked us out and have either progress or decline, and I would say most of them have decline. 

Edited October 26, 2023 by Fernando