Frank Lampard

[MADEZ 9]

One cannot compare the two,different players,generation ,achievement ,and abilities

[kellzfresh 7,229]

Lampard is a cm and they last long in that role, even up to 38years.(Proof, scholes) His influence is still there with a die hard mentality befitting of a chelsea legend.

Even though manchester city have a better squad than manunited last season, they were equal on points with manutd. This is down to the winning mentality manutd hav, they don't give up till the last second. We need lamps and john for this mentality.

Our first team were on par with manutd last season(they didn't have van persie and vidic injured and we had drogba, a better back four, cech and better startin 11 than manutd) but our mentallity is what seperated us from being close to manutd last season in the league. (injuries to lamps and terry first half of last season included)

Looking at our younger players, the feeling of being okay not contending for the title is felt. Like lamps said, "we hav been competing for years and comin second was a disapointment." Our younger players don't have half of lampards mental strength which is vital for a season long run of tough games. Talent can only get u to a level, but mental strength is as important.

We need lamps for another year (even as a substitute player) to build this mentallity into the rest of the younger ones so that we can begin to compete again for the league.

Letting him go will be a huge loss, when he can only add more to the team.

[MADEZ 9]

but could Zidane make it on cold thursday night in Stoke?

LOL,ofcourse he dare not

[The only place to be 11,313]

One cannot compare the two,different players,generation ,achievement ,and abilities

It's not like comparing Bobby Moore and John Terry (I actually think JT was better). One wasn't playing with 2kg footballs on bogs comparable to the Somme (although Upton Park and the surrounding areas do share a passing resemblance with a war zone), whilst the other played on manicured pitches with featherlight balls (coincidentally that's Julian Dicks's nickname). They both played in almost exactly the same era, with the same players in a couple of instances.

It's perfectly fair to compare the two.

Lampard is a cm and they last long in that role, even up to 38years.(Proof, scholes) His influence is still there with a die hard mentality befitting of a chelsea legend.

Even though manchester city have a better squad than manunited last season, they were equal on points with manutd. This is down to the winning mentality manutd hav, they don't give up till the last second. We need lamps and john for this mentality.

Our first team were on par with manutd last season(they didn't have van persie and vidic injured and we had drogba, a better back four, cech and better startin 11 than manutd) but our mentallity is what seperated us from being close to manutd last season in the league. (injuries to lamps and terry first half of last season included)

Looking at our younger players, the feeling of being okay not contending for the title is felt. Like lamps said, "we hav been competing for years and comin second was a disapointment." Our younger players don't have half of lampards mental strength which is vital for a season long run of tough games. Talent can only get u to a level, but mental strength is as important.

We need lamps for another year (even as a substitute player) to build this mentallity into the rest of the younger ones so that we can begin to compete again for the league.

Letting him go will be a huge loss, when he can only add more to the team.

You make a fair point, but I personally don't think losing Frank will have a massive impact on next season. Now that's dependant on us getting the right manager in, and he may think differently (the new guy might want Frank), but if we're looking at signing someone like Modric to play in that DLP role then I think we'll be pushing for the title.

Personally I would have loved us to get Dembele in the summer and it's annoying that he's gone to Spurs.

[TrippingStep 336]

In my opinion, Zidane is easily in the top 5 midfielders of the modern era - one of the indisputable greatest players of all time.

But so is Lampard in my books.

There are only a couple straight up midfielders still at it today that I would honestly rate on Zidane's level in terms of the players they have been as well as the ones they still are - which would be Lamps & Gerrard - purely because of their sheer efficacy on the pitch & ability to dictate entire matches when they are at the top of their game; as well as set up & score the goals that decide not just results, but ultimately, titles & trophies.

If you said Zidane was the most talented midfielder in history - I would agree without a doubt - he may possibly have been the most talented individual to ever kick a ball in many individual's perspectives. However, considering the fact that at the end of the day, football is really about putting the ball in the back of the net - & seeing as Zidane struggled to make double figures every season while Lamps has done so for the last 10 in a row without fail - you do have to look at the fact that one of the aspects of footballing ability that Frank has never been outdone in by any other midfielder - is scoring goals.

I regard that as possibly the most valuable talent of all, because his goals as well as the countless ones he has set up for others are what win you games & they have quite literally carried us through periods of many seasons - & yet in reality that is just a part of what makes him so special.

It's also his unique intellect, unrivalled positional awareness, spectacular precision, unbelievable consistency, & most of all, his undying loyalty & commitment to the game & his club. As much ability as Zizou had, talent & flair don't simply trump all of those attributes on the pitch.

You can say what you want about stat sheets not reflecting the entire player, & that Zidane's moments & goals were that of an immortal legend - fair enough because they don't show how fluid & seamless he was in possession, or the kinds of passes he saw that no one else would have been able to, along with all of the glorious goals - but anyone who has been watching Chelsea for the past decade knows there is so much more to Lamps than the record-breaking stats alone.

& as sweet as that sublime volley against Leverkusen in the 2002 Champo League final was (I went absolutely mental when that flew in since I've always been a huge fan of Real), to this day I am still yet to see a better goal hit the back of the net than Frank's against Barca in 2006.

Maybe it escapes your memory since it was over 6 years ago, but I was lucky enough to witness it in person at the Nou Camp while rabid Catalonians displayed their bloodthirst a few feet in front of me as they attempted to rip & climb the flimsy 'protective' netting that was the only thing separating us; so naturally it is carved into mine for all eternity. That night, Frank proved once again that impossible is nothing - it wasn't the first time he had done so, & it certainly wasn't the last.

For every magical moment of Zidane's that you can fit on a highlight reel - I can offer you one of Lampard's that I would hold in equal regard & magnitude. For every amazing Zidane goal or pass you can show me - I can show you 3 of Frank's.

It is true that Zidane was a legend at both club as well as international level because he led them to world cup glory as well as (losing them) a final - & Lamps has never lifted an international trophy. But the fact is that at club level alone, there's not really any legitimate comparison between them. You can't just dismiss the stats as if they obscure the truth on the field, because when we're talking about something as definitive in football as goals & assists - when that is the very essence of what midfield playmakers are all about - they really just don't lie.

194 goals & 130 assists in 581 appearances for this club - & still counting.

Zinedine's still stuck on 128 last I checked... & that is from over 100 more appearances than Frank has made to this day.

If those numbers don't mean anything, you should be able to find plenty of visual evidence of them on youtube without much difficulty.

As much as saying that Lampard is better than Zidane might be wrong to you - saying that Zidane is outright better than Lampard makes you just as wrong from my perspective.

Zidane made the other players play better, the team played better with him.

Man I hate the statistics.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

We need to move on. Plain and simple.

JT next please.

What? Now u want JT out too? Where u drunk when u wrote that??

[The only place to be 11,313]

What? Now u want JT out too? Where u drunk when u wrote that??

JT's contract is up next year and he's becoming increasingly injury-prone. I think it's likely that the club parts company with a player who has a shit ton of baggage.

But if we are talking about Terry, it is perhaps fair to note how the club stood by him when it might have been easier not to. It's been mentioned that the club doesn't respect it's legends and treats them unfairly, but Bruce Buck not only supported JT every day during his trial but also defended the decision to reinstate him as captain (alongside Gourlay) when it might have been easier to sell him down the river.

[super_frank8 186]

I don't have an anti-Lampard attitude. I was there at his first game, I'll be there at his last game and I've been to hundreds in between. But I'm a Chelsea fan first and foremost and the club's interests will always be more important to me.

I've had shit from people on this forum telling me what proper Chelsea fans should think and calling into question my own support. I've had scum like you calling me a paedo and it's quite frankly ridiculous. If I thought people like you represented Chelsea fans in any way, shape or form I would probably chuck it in tomorrow but you don't.

Lampard is one of the greatest midfielders in the Premier League, he's responsible for some truly happy times in my life, he has some fantastic statistics and he's a true gentleman to cap it off. He was even one of the best midfielders in the world for a couple of seasons. But Zidane is in my view the greatest player to have ever played the game - he's certainly the greatest player I've ever seen and I've been lucky to have seen the likes of Ronaldinho, Iniesta, Messi, Rivaldo and even the Weah bear.

I'm with Makelele on this issue - there is no doubt over who the greatest player of the last 20 years is.

That doesn't mean I don't love Lampard, as I'm sure you'll tell me in a long-winded post (you need to learn the power of brevity), but it just shows that I'm capable of being objective.

LOL

Can't believe you're still raging on about your poor pedo feelings being hurt.

& 'scum'? Fuck man, that one really stung...

Look, if you don't rate Lampard among the names that you have just mentioned, then I don't know how much more obvious it could be. In fact I would have to assume that you don't include Gerrard in that column either in that case, which is equally as ridiculous.

It is clear that you regard flair & skills & flicks & tricks above all else - which explains why you don't appreciate Lamps the way that myself & many others do.

It is the same reason he is so underrated by much of the football world who will always choose the guy who can take on 3 players at a time & score a handful of wonder goals, rather than the one that can land a 60 yard pass on his teammate's foot 9 times out 10 & provides a more lethal goal threat than all of the players in front of him. The same reason he didn't win FIFA World Player of the Year & the Ballon D'or in 2005 when there was no other coherent decision that could have been made other than awarding him the accolade that he more than deserved.

It's nothing but prejudice, all driven by this old-school elitist attitude & it's inherently snobbish condescending ignorance - going by traditional values rather than the ones that actually count when you want to win games.

There's no point arguing about who's the better player in our own opinions, because I believe that is entirely subjective - but to say that Zidane is objectively a significantly better player than Lampard? Well that's simply not objective whatsoever.

[kellzfresh 7,229]

You make a fair point, but I personally don't think losing Frank will have a massive impact on next season. Now that's dependant on us getting the right manager in, and he may think differently (the new guy might want Frank), but if we're looking at signing someone like Modric to play in that DLP role then I think we'll be pushing for the title.

Personally I would have loved us to get Dembele in the summer and it's annoying that he's gone to Spurs.

It will be a big loss in my opinion. He is still better than any cm we have, his spirit is immense. And I don't think he will complain being on the bench and coming in when we need him.

He is like a leader to the players and he will be perfect in helping the young players with our culture and winning mentality.

We need a DLP and I am 100% in support of that, but with lampards presence it will do us more favours than harm.

The problem is that no club will pay 140k for a 34yr old player, especially with FFP and telling lamps to reduce it to 100k or less would be a massive loss to lamps.(Lamps might think about it, but His agent won't allow that) so the board is willing to let him go but I'm afraid it might backfire like it happened to acmilan in pirlo's case.

[super_frank8 186]

Zidane made the other players play better, the team played better with him.

Man I hate the statistics.

Oh really?

Well I apologise in that case, because here's a few more for you:

& that is just this season...not including the last few wins...when he is apparently past it according to yourself & others.

Maybe you don't realise because you are as naive as the paedophile, but Lamps doesn't just make the players around him play better, he makes them score goals & win games when he's in the team. You may hate statistics, but they are merely to keep record of events - if you actually need visual proof due to some kind of conspiracy theory, then as I mentioned previously, you'll be able to find plenty of evidence on youtube or any Chelsea season review DVD from the last 10 years.

[The only place to be 11,313]

LOL

Can't believe you're still raging on about your poor pedo feelings being hurt.

& 'scum'? Fuck man, that one really stung...

Look, if you don't rate Lampard among the names that you have just mentioned, then I don't know how much more obvious it could be. In fact I would have to assume that you don't include Gerrard in that column either in that case, which is equally as ridiculous.

It is clear that you regard flair & skills & flicks & tricks above all else - which explains why you don't appreciate Lamps the way that myself & many others do. It is the same reason he is so underrated by much of the football world who will always choose the guy who can take on 3 players at a time & score a handful of wonder goals, rather than the one that can land a 60 yard pass on his teammate's foot 9 times out 10 & provides a more lethal goal threat than all of the players in front of him. The same reason he didn't win FIFA World Player of the Year & the Ballon D'or when there was no other coherent decision that could have been made other than awarding him the accolade he deserved.

It's nothing but prejudice, all driven by this old-school elitist attitude & it's inherently snobbish condescending ignorance - going by traditional values rather than the ones that actually count when you want to win games.

There's no point arguing about who's the better player in our own opinions, because I believe that is entirely subjective - but to say that Zidane is objectively a significantly better player than Lampard? Well that's simply not objective whatsoever.

You're talking utter bollocks again. Flair and tricks are great, but they're by no means the be all and end all of how I judge a footballer, and they certainly weren't what defined Zidane's game in my view. If you're reducing him to a glorified futsal player or even a high-class Denilson then you're way off the mark in your assessment of his game. He was just the most beautifully composed footballer I've ever seen, able to move the ball around with such grace and efficiency that he didn't need to jink past 3 players - but he could if he had to.

It's got nothing to do with old-school attitudes or any other bull-shit term you'd like to throw in there (I'm in my twenties - old-school for me barely reaches beyond the start of Ryan Giggs career). People seem to want to paint me as a Lampard-hater (and I use a term only twats use intentionally) because I'm not getting too hung up on him leaving. I'll be sad to see him go, because almost every time I've gone to a match in the last decade he's been there. He's part of the furniture, but we're redecorating. In fact we're not just redecorating, we're having the foundations re-done.

Now would I like him to be part of the squad next year - selfishly, yes. But do I think that's best for the team going forward when we'll probably have a new manager in trying to build something new? I've got to be honest and say probably not. The one thing we can all agree on is that Lampard is a massive presence and that is both a good thing (countless numbers of examples over the years) but occasionally it's something that can hold you back. People want to talk about Giggs and Scholes but they ignore the fact that Fergie has been a constant there and they haven't really changed the way they play football in 20 years. We are and I think there are players out there better suited to the position.

As for my feelings being hurt, that's not the case. I just think what you did was scumbag behaviour and I'd hate for someone to view this forum and this you represent in any way what the average Chelsea supporter is like. I've been going for 20 years and you aren't what I recognise from my time supporting the club. If you think you are then you haven't got the first fucking clue about the greatest football club in the world.

[xPetrCechx 13,563]

Lampard snubs £20m offer to join Drogba and Anelka in China

Guizhou Renhe were ready to offer the England midfielder a £250,000-a-week, two-year deal starting in March.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2262638/Chelsea-ace-Frank-Lampard-snubs-20m-offer-Chinese-club-Guizhou-Renhe.html

[Spike 12,049]

WHY DO I KEEP COMING TO THIS TOPIC? WHY DO I NEVER LEARN? MAYBE I NEED SCARLETT JOHANSSON TO TIE ME UP AND TEACH ME THE ERROR OF MY WAYS.

[TrippingStep 336]

WHY DO I KEEP COMING TO THIS TOPIC? WHY DO I NEVER LEARN? MAYBE I NEED SCARLETT JOHANSSON TO TIE ME UP AND TEACH ME THE ERROR OF MY WAYS.

To make things worse, I would gladly be in the same room when you are tied up by Scarlett Johansson.

You would not forget what you would see

[kellzfresh 7,229]

JT's contract is up next year and he's becoming increasingly injury-prone. I think it's likely that the club parts company with a player who has a shit ton of baggage.

But if we are talking about Terry, it is perhaps fair to note how the club stood by him when it might have been easier not to. It's been mentioned that the club doesn't respect it's legends and treats them unfairly, but Bruce Buck not only supported JT every day during his trial but also defended the decision to reinstate him as captain (alongside Gourlay) when it might have been easier to sell him down the river.

JT is legend, from our academy and is breathing chelsea and bleeding blue.

JT is the casillas of chelsea, in no way is JT going when he is still a very capable defender.

Are u really okay with JT leaving??

This is just like a movie to me

[The only place to be 11,313]

JT is legend, from our academy and is breathing chelsea and bleeding blue.

JT is the casillas of chelsea, in no way is JT going when he is still a very capable defender.

Are u really okay with JT leaving??

This is just like a movie to me

It's 18 months down the line and he's only just come back from injury. Let's see how things go but if he plays like the old JT then I can see us offering him an extension, although let's not pretend there aren't a number of factors that might end up seeing us not.

To me though, he's Mr Chelsea.

[BlueLion. 21,491]

May I remind you that whilst we at TalkChelsea encourage debate between members, it is also the prerogative of each individual to keep their content clean. Attack the reasoning, and not the poster.

Anyone who contravenes this will be handed a Level 2 warning for insulting other members and will receive a seven-day suspension.

You have been warned,

Alex.

[super_frank8 186]

You're talking utter bollocks again. Flair and tricks are great, but they're by no means the be all and end all of how I judge a footballer, and they certainly weren't what defined Zidane's game in my view. If you're reducing him to a glorified futsal player or even a high-class Denilson then you're way off the mark in your assessment of his game. He was just the most beautifully composed footballer I've ever seen, able to move the ball around with such grace and efficiency that he didn't need to jink past 3 players - but he could if he had to.

It's got nothing to do with old-school attitudes or any other bull-shit term you'd like to throw in there (I'm in my twenties - old-school for me barely reaches beyond the start of Ryan Giggs career). People seem to want to paint me as a Lampard-hater (and I use a term only twats use intentionally) because I'm not getting too hung up on him leaving. I'll be sad to see him go, because almost every time I've gone to a match in the last decade he's been there. He's part of the furniture, but we're redecorating. In fact we're not just redecorating, we're having the foundations re-done.

Now would I like him to be part of the squad next year - selfishly, yes. But do I think that's best for the team going forward when we'll probably have a new manager in trying to build something new? I've got to be honest and say probably not. The one thing we can all agree on is that Lampard is a massive presence and that is both a good thing (countless numbers of examples over the years) but occasionally it's something that can hold you back. People want to talk about Giggs and Scholes but they ignore the fact that Fergie has been a constant there and they haven't really changed the way they play football in 20 years. We are and I think there are players out there better suited to the position.

As for my feelings being hurt, that's not the case. I just think what you did was scumbag behaviour and I'd hate for someone to view this forum and this you represent in any way what the average Chelsea supporter is like. I've been going for 20 years and you aren't what I recognise from my time supporting the club. If you think you are then you haven't got the first fucking clue about the greatest football club in the world.

I never said that was what defined Zidane's game either, that is just you shoving words down my throat. Maybe if you'd bothered to read my previous post in full then you would have realised my full appreciation for Zidane's talent & ability. He's easily the most technically gifted & fluid footballer I have ever seen, & that does him absolutely no justice whatsoever.

But neither does the way you speak about Frank, as if he is just some run-of-the-mill English midfielder that pales in comparison to the international class & stature of the legendary Zizou - when that couldn't be further from the truth.

You seem to be misinterpreting what I'm saying as usual, which is probably intentional as I have learnt. I'm not saying that Zidane isn't the most talented player to have ever walked the earth, I think someone like Messi has nothing on him in all reality - when it comes down to how impressive players are, no one possesses the same refined poise & composure as Zinedine Zidane did.

But as impressive as he was, Lampard has undoubtedly won far more games due to his performances, assists & goals; & that is what matters in football.

Call it a difference of opinion/footballing values/whatever you want to call it - but I would honestly take a player that is capable of this over Zidane without a doubt:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4LCqNciODk

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_8NI69nlUw8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mmYEi2jre4

That last bit gave me a nice little chuckle though. I mean, how entirely up your arse does your head have to be before you realise how much of an conceited condescending mug you actually are? Just because you've been going to games for 20 years doesn't make you the all-seeing all-knowing super-fan that you feel the need to convince & remind everyone of every other post.

I don't know about clues, since you apparently have some kind of covert ops inside intel at the Bridge if I'm not mistaken - but I do know that I have considerably more of a heart than you do when it comes to this club the players that you claim to 'love'.