Puliiszola

They trashed Liverpool 4-0, but we play our best defensive game, but it's only because city were uninterested. I guess the whole dynamic would have changed if jorginho was playing. 3 games to go, hopefully he does not take the field again. Would be best for the club. And then bye bye

Don't give you giving the same amount of credit to city, which was our best defensive performance in last 2 years. Hmmm, does not seem like it, but sure.

That Leicester game, half the team seemed to be on the beach. You can take it that way. If I was a betting man, I would wager jorginho not being here at the start of next season rather than being here. And that too with some confidence.

I guess there is a massive difference in our povs. Because I can't seem to remember how we kooked defensively vulnerable against villa. As for whu, hardly had a sniff till ht, then concede for a set piece. Then over commit and get countered. I mean just look at those 15 mins at palace vs those 4 games and we should know the difference. But okay, I feel there is just too big a difference in how we are viewing things, so no amount of back and forth is going to help anybody. I am just happy that SFL had kante and Gilmour ahead of jorginho and that there are significant rumors of him leaving. Think he is perfect for serie a, but has been totally exposed in the PL

How? Those 4 pl games after restart, you seriously think was similar defensively to the rest of the season, forget goal conceded, or jorginho or kante. But those 4 games, how many chances did we concede from open play?

Sure agree to disagree. But just to point out, you have not given a single argument regarding why we are not.

Understand the dynamics of playing Kante as a DM and jorginho as a DM. you cant play Kante as a Striker and then say, look we are not scoring goals. The roles were/are different. Kante as a DM gives a defensive surety. No one is blaming ÖNLY jorginho. Have you even been reading what I and others have been writing. About the "poor back 5", "making us WEAKER defensively" etc etc. Stop trying to put words in my mouth. But for me DM, is the most important position on the field. A good DM, can single handedly change the way the game will be played by both teams. For us, when its jorginho as compared to Kante, cant see an upside. As for the nullified, again please read what is wriiten and understand the context. This was my exact comment: "Because just like SHU, Jorginho might not be in a direct mistake or line of fire for the goal conceded, but as a whole was nullified time and again by SHU and a lot of opposition teams." Dont know how or why you got the idea that i am talking about attack when its all about the defence, that he might not be directly in mistake for the goals, but the way teams nullify his presence as a DM.

How many of those had Kante as a DM? As compared to jorginho. Do you have the figures for those? Because For jorginho it is. 24 starts, 9 losses. So out of 11 total losses we have a union of atleast 9 losses. The whole point is if it should be Kante or Jorginho as a DM, so we have to look at those players in those positions.

Go ahead, I would love an analysis of each of our goals that way to be proven wrong. Honestly. Because just like SHU, Jorginho might not be in a direct mistake or line of fire for the goal conceded, but as a whole was nullified time and again by SHU and a lot of opposition teams. COuld we have set up in that way with jorginho? Remembver this was the same team who got embarassed 6-0 by city. Seriously? Jorginho would have made no difference for the zaha goal because he would/should have been where gilmour was. James lost the ball at half way line and he would have been going with the winger. It was a banger/GK mistake. There are some goals which are unstoppable (like KDB's), no amount of assigning blame would siffice. And irrespective of the goal, its the midfield "control" that jorginho brings to the team, right? Even a team like palace bossed us with him on the pitch and carved us open 2/3 times. Who is saying kante does not do that. But I dont praise him for it, or say that he should be in the team because he can make a simple sideways or backwards pass of 5 metres. That is the point. What jorginho brings to the team can be replaced by Kante, what kante brings to the team as a DM, cant be replaced even a bit by jorginho. Or maybe, teams did not press kante because they are aware of his busting runs and decent ball retention. WHere as when jorginho plays, he is continously targetted by opposition teams for his slow recovery, 0 chance of going past a player and possession vulnerability. Or are you trying to say that Jorginho is pressed because teams fear he will play that Cesc-esque pass from the deep. because that would call for a LOL

Really? Villa 1 goal conceded - set piece City 1 goal conceded - set piece (unstoppable) and kept city at bay through out the game Whu - 3 goals conceded - 2 by set pieces. Watford - did they have a chance? With kante we would have conceded far lesser oppurtunities from open play in those 4 games than with jorginho in a 15 mins sub performance against palace where we were mega lucky to come out with a win. As for kante's passing, we all know thats not why he will be playing as a DM. It would be for better defensive cover to an already troubling back 4 and giving our no. 8s more freedom. Whereas with jorginho we lose every sense of balance in attack or in defence. All we have is worthless and ponderous possession between him and the back 4. So to answer your question, a definitive YES to if kante made us better.

This. Along with you can't realistically expect to change 5 at the back to compensate the weakness of the one ahead of them. The cons far outweigh the cons of jorginho. If like Pirlo he had marchisio and Asamoah as well as vidal doing his dirty work for him, then it would have made sense. But we have mount, rlc, kai, kova. We need a proper DM to get the best out of their skills of creativity and ball carrying without always looking behind their shoulders about jorginho

Welll... CHelsea fans helping him out

Lampard kept playing because we literally did not have players to fill in. Kante kept getting injured, rlc was injured. Mount had to play winger as CHO was injured, puli needed time to settle in. We literally did not have mids. We were good from August to Oct. But that's the point, once the teams figured us and jorginho out, it was not only easy to stop us, but counter the shit out of us. Jorginho was/is targetted by most teams. Why do you think this is the only article out there? These articles about jorginho's flaws have been coming out one after another since his sarri days. Obviously, it's not "only" his fault. But like you said, "he is an important cog" for our beautiful football, similarly he is an important cog of our defensive prowess. As for pros and cons, what's the point of a list when people want to absolve a defensive midfielder for all his defensive frailities because "he can keep the ball ticking". He makes our already poor defense look way worse. As for attack, can't score, can't assist, hell does not even have a great passing range. I mean what are the pros that I supposed to be talking about here?

http://forum.talkchelsea.net/topic/26646-1-kepa-arrizabalaga/?do=findComment&comment=1490128 I said the same thing. Just seems so weird. Especially given ATM's wage bill is far lower than ours.

How was it easy on the eye when the same thing kept happening again and again? I think we have forgotten how poor we had it at end of Nov to around Feb. The losses to whu, Everton, soton, bournemouth. 4 losses in 6 games. All of them following the same script. Yes, the article is biased, but that's fine. If one has an opinion, then they should try to delve to find out proof if their opinion has any merit. This does. All this "jorginho helps us playing beuatiful football", is pointless when that football is mostly pedestrian and the same football finds it difficult to break down low blocks (which has been our Achilles heel this season).

Don't know if we can say we were playing "well". Getting opened so easily. 9 losses in 28 games. Also, there were a lot of jorginho critiques before the whole fiasco too.

https://weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com/features/2020/7/17/21328060/jorginho Loved this. Shows how much overhyped jorginho is. Should be one of the first names out.

No way can we afford or should we afford 400kpw wages of alaba and oblak

Are there any rumors about it? I do know that they have had some poor results since the restart. But nothing other than that

Well said and put. But the problem is who is available (even for the right money).

How about ake? Decent cover for Lb along with azpi, and a quality CB

Let's hope. I am worried now tbh. Really was not even after the SHU loss. Could see wolves dropping points, and Leicester dropping points. Let's hope Jose does us a massive favour.

Weird performance by SHU. Let's hope they come out with some energy

Hard to see it happening though. Haller and Antonio are good.strikers. no point in buying a 3rd striker who woukd probably be one of the highest earners in the club.

Well.same can be said about Andreas, zouma, tomori. Infact we have seen it actually happening to the likes of gomez and matip. Does not mean Rudi should be given that chance.