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Jason

Super Frank Thread

Started by Jason,

3,430 posts in this topic

If you have Rudiger,Alonso azpi in your team what are you waiting for?We must sell and Jorginho unfortunately he isn’t for us . I would like partey instead of him.

we can’t defend for two reasons:

1.we haven’t defense obviously 

2 we haven’t a clear DM  we need a player like Matic etc.

we don’t have balance in our game .

 

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1 hour ago, kellzfresh said:

He was dominated tactically by Arteta. We never had a stable period of dominance after the first 15 minutes. It doesn't help that we had midfielders who couldn't give a forward pass without losing the ball and pulisic (our only high quality player in attack/midfield) getting injured.

Lamps has to develop some sort of system/style of play to help the players. This is what coaches like conte/Mourinho of old did. Conte tactics made Moses/Alonso look quality. This current way we are playing where we are so random, depending on how good our players are on the day, without any recognised system means, the only way we can get successful under Lamps is to get quality players all over the pitch.

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Another thing that I'd maybe point out is that Lampard needs to decide what he wants to do with the youth players. He played them right up until lockdown but since then, he's played them less and suddenly relied on the more experienced players. It hasn't exactly turned out bad for us but it's almost like a change of direction all of a sudden when he appeared to sacrifice long term gains for short term gains. 

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Lampard is following the well trodden path of all English managers. Play till the bitter end have a stint in the BT /Sky studio and go into management utterly unprepared. Lampard went to the States for the money when what he and other managers should do is take a year off go and study other managers coaching techniques take a few courses and then go into management.

You get the impression Lampard can't take criticism and is very thin skinned and is almost dismissive in interviews. An injury hit squad facing Bayern next week things could get messy. Lampard has had his season ok an odd one in difficult circumstances but it's time fans started judging him on results and not his legacy as a player. You can blatantly see it in posts where fans are reluctant to slag him off and that's understandable to a degree but there's a song with the lyric '' Excuses have their uses but now they've all used up''. As far as I'm concerned it's Joe Bloggs manager not Frank Lampard Chelsea legend.

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13 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Lampard is following the well trodden path of all English managers. Play till the bitter end have a stint in the BT /Sky studio and go into management utterly unprepared. Lampard went to the States for the money when what he and other managers should do is take a year off go and study other managers coaching techniques take a few courses and then go into management.

You get the impression Lampard can't take criticism and is very thin skinned and is almost dismissive in interviews. An injury hit squad facing Bayern next week things could get messy. Lampard has had his season ok an odd one in difficult circumstances but it's time fans started judging him on results and not his legacy as a player. You can blatantly see it in posts where fans are reluctant to slag him off and that's understandable to a degree but there's a song with the lyric '' Excuses have their uses but now they've all run out''. As far as I'm concerned it's Joe Bloggs manager not Frank Lampard Chelsea legend.

I was supportive of the idea of giving Lampard the job last summer, mainly because I felt with the loss of Hazard and the transfer ban it was a complete free hit for someone to come in who cares about the club and I'd expect to be prepared to lay down a long term plan for the club which would involve trying to integrate some of our youth players to freshen up the squad. Some of them the jury is still out but 2 or 3 of them will definitely carry on playing regularly into next season and beyond, and very likely 2 or 3 more will at the very least be squad players. That's a huge bonus moving forward for the club. None of them are at the level they need to be yet to be challenging for the league but a year under their belts will help on the way to that. Somebody like Rashford seems to be getting lots of headlines this season but he's been around the United first team for 4-5 years and is only really now going up a level. I think Lampard placing faith in a number of them at times throughout the season will be a long term benefit to the club.

To get top 4 I think was the absolute peak of what we as fans could have expected this year having lost our best player, and arguably the best player in the league. So just on a basic overall of the season I think Lampard has done a good job and achieved.

However make no mistake, next season we do need to improve. Even if they don't make many signings, I would expect Arsenal and Spurs to improve next season with a full season of their managers. Wolves have been there or thereabouts for two seasons now and if they can add one or two, there's nothing to suggest they won't be again. And United I expect will kick on based on their form in the second half of the season as opposed to the first. We've been consistently inconsistent throughout the season. It was enough this year, but it won't be next. 

I like the signings that Lampard has made and the Havertz potential signing could be a huge one. The presence of Lampard as manager seems to have been a great pull for all of them too which could be a big thing moving forward in our recruitment. I don't think Werner or Havertz would have been viewed as attainable targets a few months ago but the uncertainty of times and Lampard seemingly a very persuasive influence has presented an opportunity that the club look to be taking. These three signings will hopefully address one issue in our team that we're not clinical enough, especially against teams in the bottom half of the table which is a big reason why we've dropped silly points. Lampard now has to address that defence with at least a couple of signings.

And then there are a number of aspects of his coaching that need to be worked on. Particularly the defensive shape when we have the ball (because we always look susceptible to the counter) and defending set pieces. Maybe it's possible to develop a more solid shape next season if we have a better crop of attacking players. Sarri was able to do this in the second half of his season with Hazard in the team to bail out a toothless attack. But with the players coming in, we should have as strong a midfield and attack than we've had in years. 

I don't mind Lampard being versatile also, but like others have mentioned, I think he needs to decide on what his primary formation and set up is going to be and predominantly stick with that moving forward. I think it will be a 4-3-3 with a more defensive minded midfielder and two 'number 8's' but that remains to be seen. He's chopped and changed a lot this season and has seemed to overthink at times. He's in a difficult spot because we have a lot of players in the squad that have been brought under Conte to suit a back 3 system when I think he wants to use a back 4 moving forward. Sarri had the same problem last season. But that is something he needs to address with the personnel at the club. I think there is a ruthless streak there in him because lots of players have been dropped and/or hooked this season and he must show that this summer in the market.

I think if Lampard fails to address certain problems that we can all see from this last season in the transfer market, or does look to address them in the market and they are still apparent next season, then there will be a lot of questions asked of him and whether he'll be the right man to take us forward. I think for this season though, and given that we managed top 4 under testing circumstances, he can be given a large benefit of the doubt. But that won't be the case next year, and strides will need to be made.

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Tactically got destroyed, I was baffled the highline we had when they scored. They have 3 pacy players up front, you are a goal ahead and our defence is almost at the half way line? Thats poor.

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Reece Callum and Tammy will all suffer next season with lack of game time.

They should, we never see much from them


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27 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

I was supportive of the idea of giving Lampard the job last summer, mainly because I felt with the loss of Hazard and the transfer ban it was a complete free hit for someone to come in who cares about the club and I'd expect to be prepared to lay down a long term plan for the club which would involve trying to integrate some of our youth players to freshen up the squad. Some of them the jury is still out but 2 or 3 of them will definitely carry on playing regularly into next season and beyond, and very likely 2 or 3 more will at the very least be squad players. That's a huge bonus moving forward for the club. None of them are at the level they need to be yet to be challenging for the league but a year under their belts will help on the way to that. Somebody like Rashford seems to be getting lots of headlines this season but he's been around the United first team for 4-5 years and is only really now going up a level. I think Lampard placing faith in a number of them at times throughout the season will be a long term benefit to the club.

To get top 4 I think was the absolute peak of what we as fans could have expected this year having lost our best player, and arguably the best player in the league. So just on a basic overall of the season I think Lampard has done a good job and achieved.

However make no mistake, next season we do need to improve. Even if they don't make many signings, I would expect Arsenal and Spurs to improve next season with a full season of their managers. Wolves have been there or thereabouts for two seasons now and if they can add one or two, there's nothing to suggest they won't be again. And United I expect will kick on based on their form in the second half of the season as opposed to the first. We've been consistently inconsistent throughout the season. It was enough this year, but it won't be next. 

I like the signings that Lampard has made and the Havertz potential signing could be a huge one. The presence of Lampard as manager seems to have been a great pull for all of them too which could be a big thing moving forward in our recruitment. I don't think Werner or Havertz would have been viewed as attainable targets a few months ago but the uncertainty of times and Lampard seemingly a very persuasive influence has presented an opportunity that the club look to be taking. These three signings will hopefully address one issue in our team that we're not clinical enough, especially against teams in the bottom half of the table which is a big reason why we've dropped silly points. Lampard now has to address that defence with at least a couple of signings.

And then there are a number of aspects of his coaching that need to be worked on. Particularly the defensive shape when we have the ball (because we always look susceptible to the counter) and defending set pieces. Maybe it's possible to develop a more solid shape next season if we have a better crop of attacking players. Sarri was able to do this in the second half of his season with Hazard in the team to bail out a toothless attack. But with the players coming in, we should have as strong a midfield and attack than we've had in years. 

I don't mind Lampard being versatile also, but like others have mentioned, I think he needs to decide on what his primary formation and set up is going to be and predominantly stick with that moving forward. I think it will be a 4-3-3 with a more defensive minded midfielder and two 'number 8's' but that remains to be seen. He's chopped and changed a lot this season and has seemed to overthink at times. He's in a difficult spot because we have a lot of players in the squad that have been brought under Conte to suit a back 3 system when I think he wants to use a back 4 moving forward. Sarri had the same problem last season. But that is something he needs to address with the personnel at the club. I think there is a ruthless streak there in him because lots of players have been dropped and/or hooked this season and he must show that this summer in the market.

I think if Lampard fails to address certain problems that we can all see from this last season in the transfer market, or does look to address them in the market and they are still apparent next season, then there will be a lot of questions asked of him and whether he'll be the right man to take us forward. I think for this season though, and given that we managed top 4 under testing circumstances, he can be given a large benefit of the doubt. But that won't be the case next year, and strides will need to be made.

The frustrating about Lampard this season is that we, the normal football fans without any managerial experience, can see what the problems are, can tell what we should or should not do when it comes to the basic things and yet, Lampard still goes and commits some of the most obvious, basic mistakes. And I don't believe for a second that the problems we have had this summer are all down to the players. You would think that he who supposedly has a high IQ and given the fact that he played under some of the best managers in history, he would at least demonstrate some of the know-hows, be streetwise etc. But no, none of that is being shown. One game we are set up perfectly and look like world beaters and the next, we are set up naively and look like clowns. 

On the Hazard subject, he was very good for us during his time at the time but maybe, we overrated his impact on the team because our record without him (excluding this season obviously) was actually good. I can't remember what the exact stats are but we have lots of wins and not too many losses. 

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48 minutes ago, Superblue_1986 said:

and strides will need to be made.

Made me laugh as strides are slang for trousers or should I say pants for all the septic tanks :). Good post by the way and I don't disagree with any of it but I'm still not convinced Lampard has the minerals to become a top manager.

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1 minute ago, Jason said:

The frustrating about Lampard this season is that we, the normal football fans without any managerial experience, can see what the problems are, can tell what we should or should not do when it comes to the basic things and yet, Lampard still goes and commits some of the most obvious, basic mistakes. And I don't believe for a second that the problems we have had this summer are all down to the players. You would think that he who supposedly has a high IQ and given the fact that he played under some of the best managers in history, he would at least demonstrate some of the know-hows, be streetwise etc. But no, none of that is being shown. One game we are set up perfectly and look like world beaters and the next, we are set up naively and look like clowns. 

On the Hazard subject, he was very good for us during his time at the time but maybe, we overrated his impact on the team because our record without him (excluding this season obviously) was actually good. I can't remember what the exact stats are but we have lots of wins and not too many losses. 

Agree on the first part. It's not just the players. Lampard currently is inconsistent himself tactically and we've suffered at times this season as a result. That has to improve, and I would like to believe that bringing in his own players next season to play what is hopefully going to be in his own image and preferred system will allow us to become more focused specifically (both players and coaching) rather than the regular changing that has been done this season.

Don't agree on the second part. Hazard's output last season accounted for around 50% of our goals in the league. To lose that quality without being able to adequately replace it was going to be a huge problem. Our overall record without Hazard might be pretty good i don't know, but the overall quality in our squad has reduced over his time here. Players like Mata, Costa, Fabregas, Pedro were either left to decline or not sufficiently replaced and last season I felt was a boiling point whereby we were fully reliant on Hazard to carry us through the season, because there was very little to support him. I feel getting through this season without him was a huge thing. And hopefully the recruitment this summer will be spot on. The signs are encouraging that we're no longer settling and instead moving for the best that are available and attainable.

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10 minutes ago, Jason said:

But no, none of that is being shown. One game we are set up perfectly and look like world beaters and the next, we are set up naively and look like clowns. 

But didn't we all widely prepare and even accept that initially? Possibly even to a larger degree than what's transpired given how many (paraphrasing) "I'll be happy with 10th aslong as we see signs of progress" comments there were in the summer.

Ultimately yes he has to improve on aspects of his management to make it as a top-level manager but if we at the start of this season were offered 4th, all our top 6 rivals plus Wolves, Leicester (the two suprise top 4 challengers) and (this one's for your benefit) Ajax beaten atleast once, four CL winning managers outsmarted plus some promising looking attacking games along the way pretty much all of us would have asked what the catch was.

However one thing I think we can all agree on is most of the mitigation is gone next season. I still think it's too early to challenge for the league (we likely won't get everything we need and even if we do they will need time to gel) but 75-82 ish points should be the target and with his attacking singings and (hopefully) a keeper of his choice he'll have to improve on performances and results.

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Just now, Iggy Doonican said:

Made me laugh as strides are slang for trousers or should I say pants for all the septic tanks :). Good post by the way and I don't disagree with any of it but I'm still not convinced Lampard has the minerals to become a top manager.

You learn something every day!

I think the biggest thing this season for Lampard was getting through it. Lots of people outside the club, pundits, opposition fans, had us around mid table. I think a few of our own fans probably did too (I personally felt if we remained in the top 6 it would have been acceptable given the circumstances). Now though is where the pressure cranks up because it looks like we'll spend big. The club is trusting Lampard to use those funds wisely and start rebuilding a squad which has needed a real refresh for a long time. 

I think there have been signs this season of him becoming a top manager. We at least one, beat all the top teams this season and have had some really excellent results and performances. But there have also been times where Lampard has been outdone tactically and made to look the somewhat rookie coach that he is. Those inconsistencies have to be drastically reduced next season for us to continue to progress. 

Either way though, I feel the opportunities he has given to academy players has put some on the road to hopefully making it at Chelsea, and opening the door in the future to more coming through (with or without Lampard) and the signings look highly promising and with the long term in mind, no longer short term stopgaps. This feels like the start of something. Hopefully Lampard can develop like the team and prove up to being the one to lead it.

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The frustrating about Lampard this season is that we, the normal football fans without any managerial experience, can see what the problems are, can tell what we should or should not do when it comes to the basic things and yet, Lampard still goes and commits some of the most obvious, basic mistakes. And I don't believe for a second that the problems we have had this summer are all down to the players. You would think that he who supposedly has a high IQ and given the fact that he played under some of the best managers in history, he would at least demonstrate some of the know-hows, be streetwise etc. But no, none of that is being shown. One game we are set up perfectly and look like world beaters and the next, we are set up naively and look like clowns. 
On the Hazard subject, he was very good for us during his time at the time but maybe, we overrated his impact on the team because our record without him (excluding this season obviously) was actually good. I can't remember what the exact stats are but we have lots of wins and not too many losses. 


While I agree with you that Lampard does mistakes, mistakes that many football fans do not understand why he does them, but Sarri and Mourinho clearly made obvious mistakes too. Sarri always made the most obvious Barkley in Kova off sub, never rotated, wasted pre injury CHO's potential, could not solve our defensive problems especially after half time, sticking with the same 4-3-3 formation etc. That is just what comes to my mind right now.

Mourinho never rotated, always used the same formation 4-2-3-1, made obvious mistakes like selling KDB and thinking that Oscar will be the next Kaka lol, not giving Salah a fair chance, wasting RLC and Boga's potential, he never benched Iva (he was one of the worst FBs in the world back then) etc.

So, it is not like our previous managers were masterminds, who only had bad luck. They made clear and obvious mistakes that got them sacked.

On Hazard, he was involved in 49% of our goals last season. Also, I do not know what statistic you mean, but Hazard was rarely injured. In our title winning seasons, he missed almost no match. He was not even injured under Mourinho once in our title winning season and under Conte, he was also not injured once when we won the title (he just came from an injury at the beginning of the season but after that none) .
Probably your stat involves some rubbish EL matches or Carling Cup matches, in which Hazard did not play. Those stats mean nothing. Hazard carried us for many years and we only had the luck that Pulisic had a good season, so we did not miss him that much. Also, our youth was scoring many goals etc.
I would rather have Hazard from last season than Pulisic because Hazard was better and never injured, while Pulisic is injured all the time and does not yet have Hazard level.


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19 minutes ago, Iggy Doonican said:

Made me laugh as strides are slang for trousers or should I say pants for all the septic tanks :). Good post by the way and I don't disagree with any of it but I'm still not convinced Lampard has the minerals to become a top manager.

my aussie mates call trousers strides all the time too

and lol at septic tanks

naughty naughty

:ph34r:

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4 minutes ago, Tomo said:

But didn't we all widely prepare and even accept that initially? Possibly even to a larger degree than what's transpired given how many (paraphrasing) "I'll be happy with 10th aslong as we see signs of progress" comments there were in the summer.

Ultimately yes he has to improve on aspects of his management to make it as a top-level manager but if we at the start of this season were offered 4th, all our top 6 rivals plus Wolves, Leicester (the two suprise top 4 challengers) and (this one's for your benefit) Ajax beaten atleast once, four CL winning managers outsmarted plus some promising looking attacking games along the way pretty much all of us would have asked what the catch was.

However one thing I think we can all agree on is most of the mitigation is gone next season. I still think it's too early to challenge for the league (we likely won't get everything we need and even if we do they will need time to gel) but 75-82 ish points should be the target and with his attacking singings and (hopefully) a keeper of his choice he'll have to improve on performances and results.

Agreed on next season. The target, in my opinion, should be looking to add 10-15 points on this season. When you think we got one point from a possible twelve against West Ham and Bournemouth, I think that is a very realistic aim and should keep us in the top 4 places whilst pushing closer to the top of the table. Whilst defensively we have problems, I think a large part of our problems against the teams in the bottom half this season has been our inability to convert a raft of chances we've created against them and in many circumstances we've been routinely punished off one or two chances for them. Hopefully this is something that the new signings will address next season with additional creativity and goal threat because our record this season against teams in the top half has been pretty reasonable.

People have mentioned we've been lucky getting top 4 this season with our points total but it shouldn't be compared to previous years. We're nowhere near as good a team as we have been in previous years and a number of teams have been catching up over time. There's no longer a huge gulf between us, United, Spurs and Arsenal compared to the likes of Wolves and Leicester. The league table never lies, and this season us and United have proved good enough for top 4. Maybe next season an extra 10 points will only just be enough for top 4 or maybe it moves us further away from the pack. Who knows?

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3 hours ago, Special Juan said:

Kepa, Rudiger, Alonso and Azpilicueta.....All four are not good enough and we need to realise that immediately. Rice won't fix every issue but him and LB is a fucking start

Azpi and Rudiger are probably untouchable, and Alonso going would need we are bringing in two LB's in one window which is doubtful

and add in AC, Zouma, Emerson to the shit patrol

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1 hour ago, Atomiswave said:

Tactically got destroyed, I was baffled the highline we had when they scored. They have 3 pacy players up front, you are a goal ahead and our defence is almost at the half way line? Thats poor.

yep that was a a massive Lampard cock-up

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Chelsea: Twitter thread about 'wrong decisions' Anthony Taylor has made against the Blues

https://www.givemesport.com/1588140-chelsea-twitter-thread-about-wrong-decisions-anthony-taylor-has-made-against-the-blues?autoplay=on

Anthony Taylor was trending on Twitter on Saturday evening following his performance in the FA Cup final between Arsenal and Chelsea.

The 41-year-old referee was heavily involved in the outcome of the match, which Arsenal won 2-1, after sending off Mateo Kovacic.

Arsenal had just gone ahead through Pierre-Emerick Aubameyang’s second goal when Taylor showed Kovacic a second yellow card for a foul on Granit Xhaka.

There was minimal contact, though, and a second yellow seemed harsh.

 

Taylor’s name was all over social media following the match, with Chelsea fans expressing their disapproval.

“Who will lift the cup, Aubameyang or Anthony Taylor?” @ExpressionsOOZ wrote on Twitter.

“Well done Arsenal and Anthony Taylor. Arsenal fans, he was your best player on the pitch,” @CFCBlues_com also fumed.

It’s not the first time that Taylor has made big decisions that have cost Chelsea, though.

He sent off Victor Moses when the Blues were beaten by Arsenal in the 2017 final.

He was also in charge of the 2015/16 Community Shield. Chelsea again faced Arsenal and lost 1-0.

So it’s no surprise that Chelsea fans have an issue with Taylor.

And one fan account has created a Twitter thread that claims to show every wrong decision Taylor has made against Chelsea.

Yes, there’s history here.

The thread, which includes 15 examples, begins with the 2017 cup final, when Alexis Sanchez was accused of a handball before his opening goal.

Moments against Manchester United, Tottenham Hotspur and Manchester City are also mentioned as the frustration against Taylor builds.

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It wasn’t just the fans who were furious with Taylor’s display in the latest cup final.

Former club captain John Terry was aggrieved with Kovacic’s sending off and thought that Arsenal’s Hector Bellerin should have been punished for a foul before Aubameyang’s second goal.

He reacted on Instagram, saying: “Never a second yellow, and surely that was a foul in the build up to the second goal.”

p1een6oihf18n11cuieeg1sd7147h1a.jpg

Meanwhile, BT Sport commentator Glenn Hoddle called the decision to show Kovacic a second yellow card “ridiculous”.

“To get sent off for that is ridiculous, it really is,” former Chelsea player Hoddle said, per football.london.

“To be sent off for that as a second offensive, the first one yes of course, but take a second to look at it.

“That is where every ex-professional footballer knows it is not a second offensive to be sent off."

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