Independent Scotland

[bababoom 4,478]

William Wallace likes this

[Peppen 934]

As a complete novice on the topic (hands down), I find this whole national independence question very interesting.

Let's say Scotland would do fine economically without the union. Would you then support Scottish independence?

Of course there are downsides to going independent. Many countries have done it successfully though. And is it really only a question about money? Nationalism is on the rise most places, so naturally the Scots may want to be 'free'. Agreed, it may not be the best timing ever, but it is, afterall, their country.... Hmpf...

[Mr_President 404]

If I was Scottish I would vote no, and as an Englishman I'd still like to see the union maintained but I can't say I'll be particularly upset if the Scots decide they want complete independence; I really don't think it will affect my life at all.

As Muzchap points out, it is a lot more complicated of a question when you have to think about debt, currency, central banks and the allocation of the natural resources (oil). I fear that some people may be voting based on the emotion of being 'free' and listening to the tripe that the politicians come out with than rationality.

I would certainly be interested to see how Scotland would fare independently, though.

[The_Flash 1,144]

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[The_Flash 1,144]

I don't, and I admitted that in my first post. Looking at it from an outside perspective though (and a limited view), Scotland has the potential to go independent successfully. Sure, it won't be easy, and sure there will be plenty of problems, but it is a possibility. It wouldn't be an instant success, could take decades even, but it could potentially be a good thing for Scotland IMO. As I said, if I was Scottish, with the knowledge I have right now I would be leaning towards yes, but that doesn't mean I actually would 100% vote yes. Leaning towards something doesn't mean you've made your decision if you understand me.

Edit:

Also, quite a huge proportion of Scottish people are drawn towards yes, current polls (excluding don't knows which is a mere 8%) show a 53% no - 47% yes split, that's significant. It's unfair to say that anyone saying 'yes' doesn't know any facts on the situation. 47% is a huge percentage of the Scottish population.

The polls are a joke. They go to predominantly YES communities and they show everyone going to vote yes, and the same the opposite way with being voting NO

No one has been our area asking anyone or people I know so Skipper to speak for the 'population' of Scotland through some random propaganda you've read is almost as embarrassing as the independence campaigners themselves.

What upsets me as a Scottish person born and bred. The flag of Scotland is the solitaire but the flag of the the UK is the Union Jack, I proudly have flown both. What upsets me is that the solitaire flag is being swallowed up by the YES people. It is getting to the point here near Glasgow that it is being emblazoned with YES stickers all over it. It's like you can't be Scottish and still support the Union.

As most of you know I am also a Rangers fan and a wonderful banner was displayed at our recent game which to me was brilliant it had the solitaire and the Union Jack as one.

[OneMoSalah 8,885]

The polls are a joke. They go to predominantly YES communities and they show everyone going to vote yes, and the same the opposite way with being voting NO

No one has been our area asking anyone or people I know so Skipper to speak for the 'population' of Scotland through some random propaganda you've read is almost as embarrassing as the independence campaigners themselves.

What upsets me as a Scottish person born and bred. The flag of Scotland is the solitaire but the flag of the the UK is the Union Jack, I proudly have flown both. What upsets me is that the solitaire flag is being swallowed up by the YES people. It is getting to the point here near Glasgow that it is being emblazoned with YES stickers all over it. It's like you can't be Scottish and still support the Union.

As most of you know I am also a Rangers fan and a wonderful banner was displayed at our recent game which to me was brilliant it had the solitaire and the Union Jack as one.

The whole Rangers thing is just a joke, there are multiple Rangers fans I know that are voting no solely because they are Rangers fans and they sing 'God save the queen' and all that bullshit.... football should have nothing to do with voting yes or no for independence.

.

[The_Flash 1,144]

The whole Rangers thing is just a joke, there are multiple Rangers fans I know that are voting no solely because they are Rangers fans and they sing 'God save the queen' and all that bullshit.... football should have nothing to do with voting yes or no for independence.

I highly doubt that, don't be so ridiculous i think people on either side will decide sensibly based on way more than that.

Please do not start some petty sectarian debate. I was merely referring to the flag.

It's not about football it's about history, generations of history. Rangers are royalists/unionists whatever you want to deem it so of course most Rangers fans will be voting to keep the Union.

Fine you obviously don't like Rangers totally up to you but the club as a whole means a lot to many people so don't be so childish as to call us a joke

Just because we are proud to be British, which is more than can be said for some people.

So what we are proud to sing our national anthem. It's pretty pathetic people who are not. .

I really think this thread should be locked before it gets ugly as a lot of debates in Scotland are at the minute.

[Fulham Broadway 17,306]

It is an emotive issue, and there are fears that Scotland will be divided regardless of a No or Yes vote on the 18th, which isnt healthy for Scotland or the UK.

[The_Flash 1,144]

It is an emotive issue, and there are fears that Scotland will be divided regardless of a No or Yes vote on the 18th, which isnt healthy for Scotland or the UK.

Very true but the problem already exists hence what I want a definitive NO!!!

[Fulham Broadway 17,306]

Very true but the problem already exists hence what I want a definitive NO!!!

So thats a No then. I think youll get your wish.

[Sidzeret 2,257]

I know there are more pressing issues to discuss which I have no clue of, but, again, why isn't this a two thirds vote but a simple majority vote?

[Muzchap 8,966]

I know there are more pressing issues to discuss which I have no clue of, but, again, why isn't this a two thirds vote but a simple majority vote?

I know there are more pressing issues to discuss which I have no clue of, but, again, why isn't this a two thirds vote but a simple majority vote?

Because that's what the 'Yes' campaign pushed for.

What's a bigger joke is that only current residents of Scotland can vote.

Any Scottish person living in England, Wales or NI cannot - that's just ridiculous - this is severely limiting the 'rational' thought processes.

The term 'Freedom' is also being bandied about - what exactly is Scotland not free to do, that other parts of the UK are?

- free healthcare - check

- free schooling - check

- free movement - check

- religious freedom - check

The list is endless ..

It's more of an argument of proportional representation that has been blown out of all context and is now being promoted as 'freedom' under a nationalist movement - claiming oppression.

I seriously believe Scots that vote yes and achieve independence will all expect to be millionaires the next morning.

Very little will change for the average Scots person initially - the real gamble is for the generation after this, that's where the issues will become more prevalent.

The more I debate it in my own mind the angrier I become about the farcical way that 'solid facts' are missing from both the Yes and No camp

As I said many times - a real shame it has come to this... But within weeks we will see

[Fulham Broadway 17,306]

Potential 'constitutional meltdown' and Cameron to postpone general election if theres a Yes vote

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/03/calls-to-postpone-uk-general-election-scots-independence

[Ripamaru 8]

As an American (I shudder to lump myself in with that group but I was unfortunately born here) I will readily admit that I don't know how this would play out. It seems that there are questions about EU membership and currency. I am not sure how they could reject the union and expect to keep the currency seeing how it is the currency of the UK.

The impression I have been given during my lifetime is one of English dominance over both Scotland and NI. A dominance that has had bitter feelings in the past, some more recent than others. I am generally for independence for any peoples who have been colonized and I do (with my very limited knowledge) feel that Scotland and NI are occupied territory more than equal partners in the union.

I cannot begin to imagine the personal feelings involved on either side. I am a student of 20th century history in particular and England/UK lost a massive empire during this span. I have long viewed the separation of Scotland and NI as the final step in this process that has been long overdue.

However this question belongs to the people. I am certainly not a part of this and have no stake in the whole thing other than how it generally affects global politics which I readily admit to having no clue how it would. From that perspective I do not want to see a weakened UK in international relations.

It would seem from an outsiders view that more tax revenue is spent in Scotland than is produced by Scotland for the UK. Correct me if I am mistaken please. If the future financial stability of the proposed nation rests on limited oil deposits it would seem foolish to jump ship from a pure economic standpoint. I have read in the past that the lions share of national revenue comes from England. again correct me if I am wrong. I wonder if this is the case why the opposition from an English point of view other than purely nationalistic reasons (pride).

My final thought here is that from my limited view it would seem that both the Scottish Yes support and the No push from the rest of the UK are both based on nationalism and pride. That many in Scotland don't want to accept that they benefit from England in particular and could be hurt by splitting. Also that many in the rest of the UK are clinging to what land remains in the empire and not accepting that it might benefit them to let Scotland go. It is a very odd situation to me that is unique among nationalist movements.

Keep in mind that living in the US makes it very difficult to obtain any real knowledge about the outside world or even what is happening within our our Govt seeing as how we have no real free press here. Most of what we get is only what is meant for our consumption. So forgive any display of ignorance you may see from me. I am one of the few that honestly seeks knowledge here but that doesn't mean I always get it. It is the sad state of affairs that I am stuck living under. In an Oligarchy that most here still believe is free and democratic. It is quite depressing personally, it is getting to the point of no return where I take my family and leave. Every day brings that closer to reality.

[We Hate Scouse 10,326]

I doubt NI will take a look at this and also want out. They are very patriotic towards the union and queen stimulated by the ill feelings towards Ireland.

Wales on the other hand is a possibility, although they don't have the sustainability that Scotland does.