Would missing out on the top four be the worst thing in the world?

[The only place to be 11,313]

Yes.

Yes. [2]

Amazing level of discourse.

If we do fail to make top 4, and tbh it is getting increasingly likely, then we must focus purely on the league next season. Play the kids in the FA Cup, League Cup and Europa League. Forget them cups for a season entirely. Focus purely and solely on a title challenge and make 10000% sure that we make the top 4 next season. We may be ok for one season but we can't make a habit of it.

Whatever happens this season, I think we're going to be making a title push next season. Look at the players we have on loan, look at the players we have in the squad and we're only a couple of players away from being contenders. We need the right manager but for a while now we've been doing the right thing as a club.

What we need is that impetus or push to put it into practice. But because we've been in the CL people have been satisfied.

Ollie pretty much took the words out of my mouth. I can understand the argument that losing out champions league football isn't the be all and end all, and to a certain extent I agree that it shouldn't but if we think that doing so will force some kind of organizational culture change in the club.....then we're kidding ourselves. My fear with not qualifying for CL is not so much the risk of not being able to keep our top players or bring in new ones, my fear is that the boad, Abramowich & co will become even more desperate to ensure that we don't fail to qualify again. That desperation alone worries me. To me, a desperate Chelsea hiearchy translates to more panic decision making and more managerial turnovers.

Yes ideally we would use our 'hiatus' from the champions league to reform our practices, integrate our youth, allow the manager time to embed his philosophy and come back the next season a better and stronger force.....but we all know that's not gonna happen.

So what changes this summer? You actually make some good points, but I actually think missing out on the CL gives us all some breathing room. It becomes a true period of reassessment when we can look at everything we've done and examine what we can do better going forward.

If we qualify then everyone breathes a sigh of relief and gears up to do the same again. We look at players like Fellaini rather than taking the time to ask whether players like Chalobah could be integrated. We sign Falcao rather than take a risk on Lukaku.

The most frustrating thing about our NextGen success was seeing Arsenal fans who know their stuff admit they we have real quality in our academy but that we'll never see them in the first team.....and they've got a point.

[Melanicus 5,208]

@The only place to be, What should we discuss? It's the worst thing that can happen to our club on so many levels.

[The only place to be 11,313]

@The only place to be, What should we discuss? It's the worst thing that can happen to our club on so many levels.

It's not in my opinion. I think it could be the start of something great where we do things properly and build a sustainable future for the club.

If we don't qualify for the CL, we can still make a push for the league next season and that is the most important thing isn't it? To be the best team in your country? That to me is the measure of success next season, not just being able to go to CL matches.

People keep moaning (incorrectly) that we could become like Arsenal - that to me is the attitude that caused Arsenal's troubles.

[Rmpr 8,977]

It's not in my opinion. I think it could be the start of something great where we do things properly and build a sustainable future for the club.

If we don't qualify for the CL, we can still make a push for the league next season and that is the most important thing isn't it? To be the best team in your country? That to me is the measure of success next season, not just being able to go to CL matches.

People keep moaning (incorrectly) that we could become like Arsenal - that to me is the attitude that caused Arsenal's troubles.

Your points are totally stupid because all you argue that would happen with we miss it can happen with UCL football...

So you prefer us to just lose a hell lot of money, media coverage, players, managers, etc; basically because you want us to. Smart!

[The only place to be 11,313]

Your points are totally stupid because all you argue that would happen with we miss it can happen with UCL football...

There's no need to be rude. Focus less on the insulting and more on making cogent points.

[Rmpr 8,977]

There's no need to be rude. Focus less on the insulting and more on making cogent points.

I didnt insult you nor was I being rude, touchy. Are you going to create another PM so you dont even answer it afterwards?

Your points are stupid and that is the truth, I even explained why, there is no need to do a big discussion out of it.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I didnt insult you nor was I being rude, touchy. Are you going to create another PM so you not even answer it afterwards?

Your points are stupid and that is the true, I even explained why, there is no need to do a big post saying shit.

I don't think the points I've made have been stupid. They come from a place of caring about the club I've supported for a long time and looking at what the future could bring. If you want to discuss these points then I'm happy to do that but dismissing them as stupid without explanation isn't the men discuss things.

Other people have managed that - if you can't then don't respond.

[Rmpr 8,977]

I don't think the points I've made have been stupid.

Of course you dont, you were the one who made them. I have all the right to think they are stupid and you have to accept it.

They come from a place of caring about the club I've supported for a long time and looking at what the future could bring. If you want to discuss these points then I'm happy to do that but dismissing them as stupid without explanation isn't the men discuss things.

I explained why FFS!

The problem is not what you want to happen, because I agree with it all. I just find it stupid to say they are connected to UCL and if we qualify those things wont occur.

The issues you posted have to be resolved no matter if we finish top4 or not and UCL must have no effect on it. The problems will be solved with or without European competition!

The only thing a 5th place will do is fuck us. Money, media, players (ours and transfers), fatigue for shit UEL, José (because we all know he wont put his love above a City offer), etc.

Other people have managed that - if you can't then don't respond.

You seriously must learn to let go, you dont need to quote every single post someone does in your thread.

[The only place to be 11,313]

The problem is not what you want to happen, because I agree with it all. I just find it stupid to say they are connected to UCL and if we qualify those things wont occur.

The issues you posted have to be resolved no matter if we finish top4 or not and UCL must have no effect on it. The problems will be solved with or without European competition!

The only thing a 5th place will do is fuck us. Money, media, players (ours and transfers), fatigue for shit UEL, José (because we all know he wont put his love above a City offer), etc.

These are actually pertinent points. Whatever happens, we need to make changes but I don't know if we do that if we maintain the status quo.

Make no mistake, the ideal situation is that we qualify for the CL and make the right adjustments but I have reservations whether we'll do that. Missing out on the CL for a year would force us to do that whilst also giving us some breathing space to do so.

If we can continue the progress we've made whilst achieving a top four finish then that would be ideal. Ultimately though, I don't think it would be the worst thing in the world if we missed out. The club would still be there, the loyal supporters would still turn up and every other week we'd get to go to see the greatest team in the world play. That's what football is to supporters and as long as that still exists, then we're very lucky fans.

[remains of the day 564]

Your points are totally stupid because all you argue that would happen with we miss it can happen with UCL football... So you prefer us to just lose a hell lot of money, media coverage, players, managers, etc; basically because you want us to. Smart!

Don't think it's stupid at all. From the way things are looking, it's a big possibility that we might not make top 4, I agree that the implications would be dire. However, I think it's refreshing that some supporters are trying to find some positives, in the event that we don't qualify for CL.

[Laylabelle 9,292]

Depends.We finished outside last year and were lucky to make it into the CL...not that mattered anyway as we still ended up in Europa.Just dont want to be a Liverpool where top 4 is the aim rather then the title/2nd etc...just fallen quite far...then again get rid of no doubt a fair portion of glory hunters maybe but still.....

[Santiago. 1,500]

In comparison to Bayern and other clubs as well, it gave their club a chance to rebuild as well as sign a manager that would give the club a new image by introducing youth mixing in with top talents/experience. I honestly think missing out on the top 4 would in fact lead this club to a new direction, but to a positive one IDK considering if Roman will ever put aside his trigger happy finger.

If Hypothetically we were to miss out on the Top 4, it would give us the chance to introduce our youth as well as rebuild imo. What does NOT need to happen, is end up like Arsenal and Liverpool by spending the money we have unwisely.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

Yup. We need CL to keep our current players happy. To get money. To attract new players. To gain interest from neutral fans. To give our younger players experience.

There are plenty of reasons.

Besides regarding your love to youth. Everyone wants (including me) to have as most players from our youth. But dont get delusional. We have plenty of youth players who have Potential to be world class. From Chalobah to Kdb etc. But we also need to look at our PRESENT. Having team of several kids would take CL, PL and trophies overall from us for few years. And what then? Some top players might leave too.

Right now we need manager who will fix things up. Perhaps Mou is only who can fix the mess in shortest time. I cant see some unexperienced coach do anything serious regarding our problems. But as to your youth plan goes, there always needs to be balance between top players and young players. Current team lacks world class players and 2 must come in summer urgently. No one saying we should get Falcao, but someone like Cavani and Moutinho are realy necesary.

We have two problems regarding new players to come

1.) players on specific positions (ST and DLP) who both should be very good. After all we will defo spend 80mio again thanks to Roman's obsesion and we will probably sell Malouda, Essien, Marin, Torres, Benayoun...

2.) rotation/squad players to add depth who should be taken from youth programs or loans. (Kdb, Josh, Chalobah, Lukaku,...). We wouldnt spend anything on them and eventualy they will be starters if they perform.

[bushman 2,043]

What points should be made here to convinced anyone that ending out of top four is not desired.

The whole thread is just one trifle.

Those who think finishing below 4th place may help Chelsea should give up watching Chelsea, I feel.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Yup. We need CL to keep our current players happy. To get money. To attract new players. To gain interest from neutral fans. To give our younger players experience.

Fair points. We need overseas fans to buy our t-shirts but that isn't the be all and end all of football.

There are plenty of reasons.

Besides regarding your love to youth. Everyone wants (including me) to have as most players from our youth. But dont get delusional. We have plenty of youth players who have Potential to be world class. From Chalobah to Kdb etc. But we also need to look at our PRESENT. Having team of several kids would take CL, PL and trophies overall from us for few years. And what then? Some top players might leave too.

Because you can't win anything with kids? Which top players would leave by the way?

Right now we need manager who will fix things up. Perhaps Mou is only who can fix the mess in shortest time. I cant see some unexperienced coach do anything serious regarding our problems. But as to your youth plan goes, there always needs to be balance between top players and young players. Current team lacks world class players and 2 must come in summer urgently. No one saying we should get Falcao, but someone like Cavani and Moutinho are realy necesary.

I agree that we need a playmaker and a third striker but spending £50 million on a striker doesn't guarantee results. I have faith in our scouting system to find us the players we need and we don't need to be in the CL to get them all.

We have two problems regarding new players to come

1.) players on specific positions (ST and DLP) who both should be very good. After all we will defo spend 80mio again thanks to Roman's obsesion and we will probably sell Malouda, Essien, Marin, Torres, Benayoun...

2.) rotation/squad players to add depth who should be taken from youth programs or loans. (Kdb, Josh, Chalobah, Lukaku,...). We wouldnt spend anything on them and eventualy they will be starters if they perform.

I think we can win the league with just the addition of a DLP. I think we need a defender and a third striker but I honestly don't think this squad is that far away from being a top, top team. The key addition will be a manager and hopefully that will be Jose. If he doesn't want to come because we're not a Champions League team then he's not the man we thought he was and it will be his loss.

We are on the cusp of great things at this club and we just need the impetus to have faith and take a chance. Missing out on the Champions League for one season (which isn't that long in a lifetime of supporting a club) whilst building something that will outlive us all is not the worst thing in the world. I think those who think it is are probably younger fans in all honesty, and that's not a sleight just an observation.

[Rmpr 8,977]

These are actually pertinent points. Whatever happens, we need to make changes but I don't know if we do that if we maintain the status quo.

Make no mistake, the ideal situation is that we qualify for the CL and make the right adjustments but I have reservations whether we'll do that. Missing out on the CL for a year would force us to do that whilst also giving us some breathing space to do so.

If we can continue the progress we've made whilst achieving a top four finish then that would be ideal. Ultimately though, I don't think it would be the worst thing in the world if we missed out. The club would still be there, the loyal supporters would still turn up and every other week we'd get to go to see the greatest team in the world play. That's what football is to supporters and as long as that still exists, then we're very lucky fans.

I will try to explain why I highly disagree with you. I will already warn you that I have accumulated hangover, so my already not so good english wont get any better!

1. Money: Dont tell me it isnt important and that EPL increase will cover it. It is a hell lot of money and why not take advantadge of both amounts, UCL + EPL? All other clubs will get a crazy increase in TV rights from the Premier League, it is not like it will be our privilege. Arsenal and Spurs desperately need both incomes, so it is even bigger than being about us. I want to see them fucked up as much as everyone does.

2. Media: UCL is the biggest tournament in the world; where the finest football is played and where we see the best teams and players against each other. The decrease in media exposure is gigantic for a team not in it. How will our partners/sponsors react to it? Adidas wont be very happy to see their second best selling club out of its UCL marketing campaign...

3. Fans: Well, I know you dont respect overseas fans and I dont really give a fuck about it. However, we (including the plastic ones) are important to every club. We buy shirts, products in general, increase TV ratings, travel to London to give YOUR country and YOUR club money, chant, cry, smile, etc. Chelsea magical night last May was huge in gaining new fans (plastic or not, doesnt matter). It is games like this that might sparkle passion inside new fans, specially kids!

4. Players: You talk about how we might not go for super expensive players if we qualify, but I view things exactly in the very opposite way. We arent Arsenal nor Manure who depend on a budget and UEL ruins it. We have a fucking crazy billionaire (that I love) who would actually do crazier things to go back to top4. Falcao like deals only get more dangerous if we fail to make top4. They will ask for more money (due to UCL excuse) and Roman might be able to agree with it in order to buy the stars players he thinks bring success. Dont you remember the situation Torres was brought? Well, it might very well repeat itself!

5. Youth: We dont need UEL to develop them, we have two good domestic cups to do so. Our squad is so thin and weak that we actually need the loaned players back AND some new signs (like Gourlay said, 2-3 top players will do). It is not like if we buy some players, our youngsters wont be used. There are enough matches to satisfy a good group of 22-23 players. KDB, Chabolah, Lukaku, etc; could very well be used in Cup games, some minor League challenges and as direct replacements. I honestly dont belive UCL has anything to do with their development.

6. UEL: This is the worst problem of it all. It makes you travel to far away places, to face shit teams, in shit Thursday. Enough said!

7. League Distraction: This is a bit tricky. I never thought UCL had that huge of an impact on our league performance. I didnt see it influencing it in Mourinho's era nor with Guus and nor with Carlo. In 2012 we werent a good team to challenge for the title anyways. I can see it being an issue if Jose comes though, he will be way more focused in winning it with us than regaining the league. So, I give you this one then...

Ok, I think that is all. Qualifying for UCL is more than important and not doing so only does harm.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

It's not in my opinion. I think it could be the start of something great where we do things properly and build a sustainable future for the club.

If we don't qualify for the CL, we can still make a push for the league next season and that is the most important thing isn't it? To be the best team in your country? That to me is the measure of success next season, not just being able to go to CL matches.

People keep moaning (incorrectly) that we could become like Arsenal - that to me is the attitude that caused Arsenal's troubles.

Now its about money, glory, importance, sucess, trophies...take that away from us and think again if Mata or Hazard (among others) would stay here. For what? Being fifth in league, just to create some youth project etc.?

It sounds nice to have our own team of players we produce but it doesnt go like that. What you think about is utophia. Its never going to happen. We will lose players, money, trophies. In few years we will be medium team with homegrown team. So what? You dont realy think that we can produce 8 homegrown world class players? If 2 will be starters in next five years I will be extremely happy.

Keep up the balance. Experience/Class-Youth/potential.

Right now we have dozen of potential players but very very few top class players. That us exactly why we need two players in summer. If you think getting Cavani and Moutinho is bad because we should have this so called youth project for next 5 years and give up on everything and start from bottom then I dont know what is wrong with you?! It will take 15 years to create something like Barca or Borussia is doing to have youth, fans, great play and success together. This things take time. You have established 11 players and every two seasons you bring in another youth player to try him in first team. Some succeed some not. In the end you have 60 foreign and 40 homegrown players and thats success over 15 years of creating everything from attitude to fans, board members, buying policy etc. If you think we can just do this in few years you are heavily wrong.

In best case your scenario would be like this: we give chance to youth. They dont show enough. We dont qualify to CL for few years. We lack money ti buy players to save situation. We are forced to sell our best players. We lose several fans. We never reach 3 place in PL. We cant attract new players. We cant win any trophies. Roman decides to sell us. Bottom of the story. It takes 10 years to finaly rebuild team. We have new board, coach and full mix of youth and experience. We get to 3rd spot in PL. After decade we play in CL again. We get more money, support and fans thanks to good performances. We win PL, first since 2010. After grear season, we are on top. We are CL trophy main favourites and in 2029 we win it again for the first time after 2012. We have 60% of homegrown players, we are dubbed as next barcelona.

In worse we never recover after Roman leaves and we are officialy midtable team again.

This isnt fifa to get 10 youth players and develop them in world class in 4 years and win everything.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I will try to explain why I highly disagree with you, I will already warn you that I have accumulated hangover, so my already not so good english wont get any better!

1. Money: Dont tell me it isnt important and that EPL increase will cover it. It is a hell lot of money and why not take advantadge of both amounts, UCL + EPL? All other clubs will get a crazy increase in TV right from the Premier League, it is not like it will be our privilege. Arsenal and Spurs desperately need both incomes, so it is even bigger than being about us. I want to see them fucked up as much as everyone does.

Can't disagree. We would stand to lose money.

2. Media: UCL is the biggest tournament in the world; where the finest football is played and where we see the best teams and players against each other. The decrease in media exposure is gigantic for a team in it or not. How will our partners/sponsors react to it? Adidas wont be very happy about seeing their second best selling club out of its UCL marketing campaign...

Again, can't disagree. We wouldn't become a small club overnight though.

3. Fans: Well, I know you dont respect overseas fans and I dont really give a fuck about it. However, we (including the plastic ones) are important to every club. We buy shirts, products in general, increase TV ratings, travel to London to give YOUR country and YOUR club money, chant, cry, smile, etc. Chelsea magical night last May was huge in gaining new fans (plastic or not, doesnt matter), it is games like this that might sparkle passion inside new fans, specially kids!

We need the tourists and the overseas fans to buy our shit but they aren't the priority in my view. They never will be because they aren't what I equate supporting Chelsea with - they're figures on a balance sheet. I will always place an emphasis on the people in the stadium who get behind the team and have done for many years. I'm not going to apologise for that.

4. Players: You talk about how we might not go for super expensive players if we qualify, but I view things exactly in the very opposite way. We arent Arsenal nor Manure who depend on a budget and UEL ruins it. We have a fucking crazy billionaire (that I love) who would actually do crazier things to go back to top4. Falcao like deals only get more dangerous if we fail to make top4. They will ask for more money (due to UCL excuse) and Roman might be able to agree with it in order to buy the stars players he thinks bring success. Dont you remember the situation Torres was brought? Well, it might very well repeat itself!

That's certainly a possibility but we've seen Roman be more restrained over the last couple of years and I would hope that would continue. People like to characterise him as 'crazy' or naive ayetnd nothing I've heard or read comes close to that.

5. Youth: We dont need UEL to develop them, we have two good domestic cups to do so. Our squad is so thin and weak that we actually need the loaned players back AND some new signs (like Gourlay said, 2-3 top players will do). It is not like if we buy some players, our youngsters wont be used. There are enough matches to satisfy a good group of 22-23 players. KDB, Chabolah, Lukaku, etc; could very well be used in Cup games, some minor League challenges and as direct replacements. I honestly dont belive UCL has anything to do with their development.

I think the problem is that we might just use these youngsters for cup games rather than trust them in league matches. They're young players and they will make mistakes but you have to stick by them when they do. We have this bizarre notion that youngsters have to be 100% ready which is completely absurd. No-one is ever 100% ready and you have to be prepared for slip-ups along the way. It's the way they bounce back that will determine their success or failure.

6. UEL: This is the worst problem of it all. It makes you travel to far away places, to face shit teams in shit Thursday. Enough said!

I followed Chelsea to Tromso - it's never shit in my opinion.

7. League Distraction: This is a bit tricky. I never thought UCL had that huge of an impact on our league performance. I didnt see it influencing it in Mourinho's ere nor with Guus and nor with Carlo. In 2012 we werent a good team to challenge for the title anyways. I can see it being an issue if Jose comes though, he will be way more focused in winning it with us than regaining the league. I give you this one then...

I think we're capable of both but the league has to be the most important.

Ok, I think that is all. Qualifying for UCL is more than important and not doing so only does harm.

Fair enough.