David Luiz

[DH1988 1,304]

As above, agree and disagree, he is a quality CB but not with Cahill, he isn't commanding enough, Cahill looks worldie when he plays with John, simply because John marshalls the back four.

Partnerships are everything and Cahill + Luiz isn't a great partnership simple as that.

Saying that I would take £40m for him from Bayern/Barca, since he has been dropped etc. he doesn't play with the same tenacity we know him for, understandable.

Iva + Luiz + Cech all at fault for the goal in their own ways.

[Excalibur KTBFFH 109]

As above, agree and disagree, he is a quality CB but not with Cahill, he isn't commanding enough, Cahill looks worldie when he plays with John, simply because John marshalls the back four.

Partnerships are everything and Cahill + Luiz isn't a great partnership simple as that.

Saying that I would take £40m for him from Bayern/Barca, since he has been dropped etc. he doesn't play with the same tenacity we know him for, understandable.

Iva + Luiz + Cech all at fault for the goal in their own ways.

Put Cahill next to a competent CB like Ivanovic and we have no problems. It's not just about John Terry. IMO, Cahill has outperformed Terry this season (and I believe Terry has been brilliant)

[Benches not the shed 77]

David Luiz ain't a top class centre back IMO , there is better out there and if we could get 30-40m for him we would be silly not to cash in... He is very similar to Frank Lebouef I think, in that he is tall and lanky, great striker of the ball but always likely to give away a penalty.

[Excalibur KTBFFH 109]

Yes, the guy who's helped his teams win many trophies including two European trophies and the CONFEDs, the main CB for one of the best NTs in the world, the guy who, just in a few months ago in the summer, everyone here was refusing to sell him to Barca and Bayern for 40m and who everyone in the world considered in the top 5 if not top 3 CBs in the world is "an awful CB"

We drop two points and suddenly everyone turns into a hormone-crazed pregnant women!

This is not a knee-jerk reaction. It's been something that's been said ever since we bought him from Benfica. He's a liability at CB and simply not trust-worthy. Especially in the EPL, with the direct, physical style of play of the lesser teams.

[lionsden 4,689]

Yes, the guy who's helped his teams win many trophies including two European trophies and the CONFEDs, the main CB for one of the best NTs in the world, the guy who, just in a few months ago in the summer, everyone here was refusing to sell him to Barca and Bayern for 40m and who everyone in the world considered in the top 5 if not top 3 CBs in the world is "an awful CB"

We drop two points and suddenly everyone turns into a hormone-crazed pregnant women!

[CHOULO19 24,332]

This is not a knee-jerk reaction. It's been something that's been said ever since we bought him from Benfica. He's a liability at CB and simply not trust-worthy. Especially in the EPL, with the direct, physical style of play of the lesser teams.

I get that you don't like him and you have every right to your opinion, but to call someone as established and accomplished as him as "an awful CB" is just ridiculous. Let's try to keep the discussion a bit logical.

Go back a hundred pages in this thread and read.

[The only place to be 11,313]

100 pages ago

It happens all the time now the tugging of shirts in the box, I just simply do not want to see us doing as we have enough tools to deal with it in our team by defending properly.

See this is the thing with Luiz, it's his consistency level, he hasn't got one. He is either unreal or a complete passenger, and that is one thing Jose must, must work on, and probably will.

Do I worry about Luiz? Yes without doubt, I never know which David Luiz ill turn up.

Why the fuck did he pull Cavani (?) to the ground to give away that penalty, what an idiot he is some of the time.

Things like that, that still make me worry about him as our main CB, you'd expect a 26 year old to not do that sort of things or do it a lot more discretely than what he did it lmao.

Then you've got his fan club (Skipper and robguima) extolling his virtues in much the same way as they have for the next 100 pages.

[The only place to be 11,313]

150 pages ago

This is a bloke who struggles to play defence and after all the hulabalu about him being a DM he can't play there either.

I worry about him.

Less than 10 times have I seen a match where he's started in central defence and come away thinking - "He's a really good defender." He's got around 100 appearances for us now. Surely that should worry people...

Problem being is he apparently has funny hair and is the king of Twitter. I'm sorry but I want an out and out footballer, not a king of social media or someone for the oppo to laugh at.

We paid 24M for this bloke and I am yet to be convinced.

You know, with all the so called 'speculation' around him and Barca, I've often thought it might be better just be better to sell him.

Now I absolutely fucking love the tits off Luiz, and I'm not just basing this around today's game, but I've often thought: how long do we have to wait for him to become 'world class' exactly? I mean, we've heard it before, "he has all the tools" etc. etc., but how long do we wait for him to pay dividends?

£24m for a defender is a lot. A hell of a lot. What happens if he never really learns from his mistakes? What happens if he continues on with his brain farts? Granted, he has improved significantly, but at the start of each season he seems to take about 5 steps backwards. If the speculation is true, Barca would need to offer around £35-40m for Luiz. Can anyone honestly say that they wouldn't, at least, seriously consider such an offer?! Especially given our glaring need for at least 1, if not 2, top defensive midfielders. Also the fact that Azpi now owns the RB spot, meaning Ivan can go back to being a CB.

With that type of an offer, we could get a quality DLP (Beñat?), DM (Capoué?) a young CB (Okore?) and still have change left over! Selling Luiz for such a price would allow us to address other, more glaring, needs for the team...or is it just me thinking this way?!

Everyone is talking about Ramires but Luiz was honestly worse. Was often out of position and lost duel after duel. It's like wasn't even trying. If Cahill hadn't been in "Superman" form the scoreline would have been so embarrassing.

The song remains the same. Three years in and what has he actually changed about his game apart from hoofing the ball out a bit more?

How has he LEARNT from his mistakes?

[Reddish-Blue 2,354]

100 pages ago

Then you've got his fan club (Skipper and robguima) extolling his virtues in much the same way as they have for the next 100 pages.

As I've said before, Luiz needs to leave.

He should join a club that will let him play with freedom & express his natural talent (e.g. Barcelona)

He'll always be a scapegoat at Chelsea...unless Mikel or Ramires have a shocker

[The only place to be 11,313]

As I've said before, Luiz needs to leave.

He should join a club that will let him play with freedom & express his natural talent (e.g. Barcelona)

He'll always be a scapegoat at Chelsea...unless Mikel or Ramires have a shocker

If he left and went to a rival, I'd always fancy our chances of getting him to make a mistake. Of course there's always the chance he would have a stormer too.

As for being a scapegoat, I think that's an overused excuse. It was incorrect about Mikel (who is Mr Irrelevant since we replaced him with a far superior player) and it's incorrect about Luiz.

[lionsden 4,689]

Go back a hundred pages in this thread and read.

You said "everyone in the world" How does the opinion of Chelsea fans on this forum represent that of everyone in the world? I have never seen a neutral fan that holds or ever held Luiz in such high regard. Not a single neutral/unbiased fan never mind everyone in the world.

[lionsden 4,689]

As I've said before, Luiz needs to leave.

He should join a club that will let him play with freedom & express his natural talent (e.g. Barcelona)

He'll always be a scapegoat at Chelsea...unless Mikel or Ramires have a shocker

If his replacement is a reliable,non error prone defender then I can assure you he wont be missed. so yeah he should join a club that doesn't demand consistent performances and professionalism from its players (a circus) if such a club exist. Not sure Barcelona's standard is that low either as their most dominant era has come at a time when they had world class and reliable defenders like Puyol, Pique and Abidal at their peak.

I laugh when people reference pique and barca whenever the topic of defenders who like to express themselves is concerned as if Pique wasn't the best defender in the world at some point and was extremely rock solid at the back. i can't recall the Spaniard being as error prone and childish as Luiz. for all his technical ability, he was a n impenetrable wall at the back.

If Luiz is/was playing at the level pique showed during the dominant guardiola years, no one would hear a word of criticism from me.

[Reddish-Blue 2,354]

If he left and went to a rival, I'd always fancy our chances of getting him to make a mistake. Of course there's always the chance he would have a stormer too.

As for being a scapegoat, I think that's an overused excuse. It was incorrect about Mikel (who is Mr Irrelevant since we replaced him with a far superior player) and it's incorrect about Luiz.

Fair point....I'd have to say if Barca came with a bid of 30-35 million....it would be tough to refuse that sort of deal.

My only question is...who would take Luiz's position as the 2nd/3rd choice CB? Zouma or Kalas...

[CHOULO19 24,332]

You said "everyone in the world" How does the opinion of Chelsea fans on this forum represent that of everyone in the world? I have never seen a neutral fan that holds or ever held Luiz in such high regard. Not a single neutral/unbiased fan never mind everyone in the world.

Fine that was an exaggeration, just like you saying that no neutral fan holds him in high regards is an even bigger exaggeration. You can't deny that Luiz was very highly rated in the summer and was wanted by the likes of Barca and Bayern for a reason. He's having a below average season, but for all we know he could finish this season the way he finished last, as by far the best CB in England, and everyone would be saying that they wouldn't sell him for 40m again.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

150 pages ago

The song remains the same. Three years in and what has he actually changed about his game apart from hoofing the ball out a bit more?

How has he LEARNT from his mistakes?

Mine was actually about a game where he played at CM and I think a couple of others are as well. But the funny part is, here was your reply to my post:

OMFG.....we need to close these threads after players have one bad game etc.

Thought Luiz had an okay game today. Didn't think he was any worse than anyone else on the pitch and I still think it's him and one other as the centre-back pairing going forward. I've had reservations about him in the past but he's been a solid performer over the last few months and become someone fairly dependable.

I'm not denying that Luiz can be error prone at times, and I get why some people want him gone, but the guy has also showed that he can be absolutely world-class and he perform at the highest level. My point is, let's not insult each others intelligence by calling him an awful CB.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Fine that was an exaggeration, just like you saying that no neutral fan holds him in high regards is an even bigger exaggeration. You can't deny that Luiz was very highly rated in the summer and was wanted by the likes of Barca and Bayern for a reason. He's having a below average season, but for all we know he could finish this season the way he finished last, as by far the best CB in England, and everyone would be saying that they wouldn't sell him for 40m again.

No he wasn't. In fact I doubt if you'd get consensus on what his best position was, let alone him being the best in England. Also I doubt you could find 3 members who wouldn't have sold him for £40 million.

I'm not denying that Luiz can be error prone at times, and I get why some people want him gone, but the guy has also showed that he can be absolutely world-class and he perform at the highest level. My point is, let's not insult each others intelligence by calling him an awful CB.

I knew you'd bring that response up and it perfectly captures the point I've made throughout his time here. He CAN be world class. He CAN be the best defender in the world.....but never consistently. There's always a catch with him, a brainfart around the corner and that inconsistency is what'll kill you.

He was fine for 87 minutes yesterday. Then he fucked up. I want a defender I can trust for 90 minutes, not 87 minutes. So does Jose which is why he has only selected him as a CB TWICE before yesterday's game in THREE MONTHS.

That's what's so maddening about him. The conversation never changes. He's got the same faults he always did, just like Mikel. We replaced Mikel.....we'll replace Luiz.

[lionsden 4,689]

Fine that was an exaggeration, just like you saying that no neutral fan holds him in high regards is an even bigger exaggeration. You can't deny that Luiz was very highly rated in the summer and was wanted by the likes of Barca and Bayern for a reason. He's having a below average season, but for all we know he could finish this season the way he finished last, as by far the best CB in England, and everyone would be saying that they wouldn't sell him for 40m again.

Highly rated by biased and overly sentimental chelsea fans: yes and there's no concrete evidence that the Bayern and barca interests were legitimate.

As for the bolded, not sure if serious.

[bababoom 4,478]

Yes, the guy who's helped his teams win many trophies including two European trophies and the CONFEDs, the main CB for one of the best NTs in the world, the guy who, just in a few months ago in the summer, everyone here was refusing to sell him to Barca and Bayern for 40m and who everyone in the world considered in the top 5 if not top 3 CBs in the world is "an awful CB"

We drop two points and suddenly everyone turns into a hormone-crazed pregnant women!

please tell me who considered him one of the best CBs int he world? Jesus Christ... do people just forget how much of a liability he is at the back? it's funny when you slate Luiz people always come back with excuses, if that doesn't work they say 'look at how many mistakes Cahill/Terry made', Yes, everyone makes mistakes, but there's a difference between making a mistake every once in a while, like Cahill/Terry, to being a repeat offender like Luiz.

He's one of the most overrated players I've come across in a long time. He's not even top 10 best defender in the PL ffs.

Another thing, lets be honest, is his passing that good? i hear many people on this forum say he's vital because he gets the ball to our attacking players meaning we can play from the back... i disagree, in fact how many times does he just hoof the ball up to no one? his passing is better than most defenders but it isn't great.