The only place to be

I'm still waiting for Cherno Samba to live up to his billing of the next Shearer.

I'm not saying we can't have a playmaker alongside Fellaini/Mikel. In fact I'd be inclined to stick Oscar in there, and I don't think he's too weak. He's got a certain amount of bite about him and isn't afraid to get stuck in. The wild card in this whole discussion is what happens with David Luiz. I have serious doubts about his ability to play in midfield but it seems like Rafa could try him there.

He would have the opportunity here to build something truly special. Guardiola's hero status is cemented there for life. All he has to do is avoid coaching Real Madrid and he'll be fine. The most glaring point in your post is about the youth. They might have El Shaaraway, but we have Oscar. And Hazard. We also have a youth academy beginning to bear fruits, some of whom play football the right (and by that I mean Barcelona) way. In fact I'd say we have some of the brightest young talents in Europe waiting for someone to take them to the next level. He would be treated completely differently from the likes of AVB. He would have more control over almost every aspect of the club than any manager has had since maybe Hoddle. As for Mourinho, I honestly don't know what people see his 3-5 year plan being. I don't know what they've seen in his past that says to them that the team right now is ready for a Mourinho. Their thinking to me seems to be based entirely on 'it was great when Mourinho was our coach in 2005, let's do that again'. I love the guy but for the life of me I don't see how he is the best choice for our club right now. He's a legend here but that doesn't mean he fits into the club's plans now. Right now the best fit by a country mile is Guardiola and that's based on what the situation that he came into Barcelona was like and what the guy actually wants to do with his footballing career going forward.

Unfortunately, this is exactly my criticism of Mikel. The guy is often a passenger in the team and lacks the ability to impose himself on games. When we're playing well, he gets carried along but when we're struggling he's often one of the first heads to drop. I've brought it up before but the Juventus second goal sums him up to a tee. He loses the ball and gives up. No-one can defend that because for a top-level sportsman in that position, it's indefensible. I'm probably harsh on him because I've been so lucky to see players like Makelele in the flesh gracing Stamford Bridge. He was a one-off but you could just learn so much from watching him - his positional sense was out of this world and he almost redefined that position. Now Mikel is asked to do something a little different and more akin to Busquets at Barca at times, especially when we're in possession, but he simply isn't up to it when we're under pressure. He's also one of the most lackadaisical players I've ever seen. When he's caught out of position (something that happens far too often for my liking) there's usually a distinct lack of hustle to get back. I also question his mentality and attitude with regards his discipline on the pitch. A couple of times he's got into yellow card trouble for arguing the toss with referees. This is a guy who has played about 200 games for the club yet still acts like a petulant kid at times. Also, despite all those games I've never seen a player so viewed with apathy by the supporters. His fans will say 'they don't understand his worth to the team' or some other unutterable bullshit, but these same fans revered Makelele. They've witnessed some of the greatest players ever to grace pitches yet they simply can't judge this one players worth??? Bull and indeed shit.

I kinda agree, but my biggest reservation about any big-name striker coming in is what the new manager will want from that position. It's all very well spending £40 million on someone but six months down the line who knows what we'll want. It's why I'm more inclined to go for the PL proven cheaper guys like Ba and even Bent because they'll still have value in the market 6 months down the line.

I really don't know what else to say. It's part of the game in this country. Football fans are used to it and most of them laugh it off. All managers can indulge in it if they wish. Mourinho has done it, Moyes has done it, Wenger has done it......FFS it's football. Crying about it and calling it 'blackmail' like a hysterical old woman is just pathetic.

It's not about agreeing or disagreeing with my subjective views - it's about people talking complete bollocks about somewhat objective facts. People who don't seem to know what position Fellaini actually played just two years ago or how well-regarded he was, yet still try and offer an opinion is just utterly pointless to any debate. You can rely on stats and misrepresent them as much as you like, but try watching a bit of football and then maybe you won't say such complete bullshit. The fact that you haven't addressed a single point but have thrown the toys out of the pram is a little much isn't it? In my opinion, we don't need someone who can pass it long from that position. What we need is someone reliable who can get the ball off quickly to one of the creative players and who doesn't give up. That's it. There's a reason why people like De Visser have been high on him for years and it's why we have been linked with him for almost two years now. The truth is that he wasn't mediocre when he was deployed in that position at Everton. He was one of the best players in the league at the age of about 22/23. Now he's been moved further up the pitch partly because Everton lost Cahill and partly because he's just so damned effective there, and people want to rewrite history.

So you're equating managers making comments in order to influence the game, with racism? I think you just need to untwist your knickers and smile when Fergie does shit like this. I don't know how to explain this type of things place in the game because it's always been there. Managers will make comments and funnily enough, they'll try and gain a competitive edge from it. I think it stems from their desire to win games and remain in gainful employment. Refs are human. If you point something out to them then there's a chance they might pick up on it in a game. Captains do it too - do you get so sad when Terry has a word in the ref's ear? What do you think he's saying to him? How's your week been? How are the kids? How's the wife (actually, this one isn't that unlikely )? No, he's saying 'oi ref, watch soandso in the box' or 'he's going down a bit easy today isn't he?'. It's simply part of the game and in tight matches it can be the difference between a win and a loss. It isn't cheating, it isn't blackmail, it isn't close to the same ballpark as racism. It's football.

No it isn't cheating. It's simply part of the game. It's been part of the game for years and it won't change. It's part of what makes football, football.

He isn't cheating or bending the rules. I do agree that some of the other things surrounding Fergie (like the way certain refs don't get United games if they give decisions against him) is highly suspect, but stuff like this is just part of the game.

Scare. Threaten. Blackmail. It's gamesmanship. It's part of the game.

I think that's a gross mischaracterisation of Guardiola and sounds like the type of thing opposing fans used to say about Mourinho. Personally I found Mourinho's footballing philosophy fascinating and exhilarating to watch and I think the same about Guardiola's. To me, it's just the most brilliant yet simple form of football. You dominate possession making the ball do the work which conserves energy whilst tiring the opposition. But when you lose possession, you work extremely hard in the first few seconds when the opponent is in transition which maximises your chances of getting the ball back and also creating chances for yourself. It's beautiful to watch in my opinion. Klopp is also a very promising manager but I think he's unlikely to want to come here based on his recent comments. Roman has identified Guardiola as his guy and we need to hope he gets him because he's the only manager likely to get the time needed to build something here.

I've not been here long but judging by the nominees and the winner from last month, it helps if you write long posts.....doesn't matter if it's complete bollocks or not (in fact it may well help). Some decent posters on here but they seem to not get much recognition or 'likes'.

I like how you've taken stats from seasons when he was being played in an advanced position because that's what Everton required of him. It's like criticising Gareth Bale by using the stats from when he was being played at left-back by Spurs. The problem is that you're simply wrong about a number of things. He wasn't a mediocre DM in the slightest. He was actually one of the best in the league in around 2010 but he suffered an injury that wrecked his season. He wasn't 'miscast' there - it was the fucking position he grew up playing. :D The fact that he's had success as as more attacking midfielder isn't a negative either - it shows his ability to adapt to new things even if he's not particularly keen on it. Just recently he reiterated his desire to move back into the DM position in future and it is there that I think he could have a good future for us. I don't mind arguing the merits of players and their potential worth to Chelsea but it's fucking frustrating having to keep make the same point over and over to people whose knowledge of football seems to extend to Drogba's penalty hitting the back of the net in Munich.

I'm not going to even bother reading past this because it's absolute rubbish. Sorry. When he was at Liege, he was a DM and he was scouted by many, many top teams. Everton getting him was a brilliant coup in that sense. We became interested in him again after he showed some outstanding performances in the DM position at Everton but we went in a different direction with our transfers. To say he was 'mediocre' as a DM is just untrue. I don't know if you didn't watch his games for Everton in that position, are simply misremembering or if you're flat out lying but you're totally incorrect. It's actually laughable how wrong you are about this.

If it's £3.5 million and his wages aren't too bad then it's probably worth a punt. Him and Ba for around £10 million (or one-fifth of a Torres) wouldn't be bad business.

He's an attacking midfielder RIGHT NOW. He's playing there because that's where Everton need him. He sees himself as a DM, when Everton bought him he was a DM and when the club first started looking at him he was a DM. It's getting fairly tiring explaining the same point over and over again. In fact on a forum that's supposed to be full of football supporters, it's somewhat laughable if I'm being honest. The 'massive weaknesses' you alluded to are wrong in my opinion too. I saw little wrong with his defensive positioning when he was playing that DM role. In my opinion, he would replace Mikel in the team because he offers a lot more in terms of passing ability, defensive strength and as I've said before, I like his attitude. I think he has something about his personality that Mikel doesn't. He's stepped up and done a job for Everton this year.

You do realise that Mikel didn't contest the charge don't you? As for the Clattenburg incident, we may never know what exactly was said but we know what could be proven and that's really all that matters. You have absolutely no evidence to suggest Clattenburg did anything wrong. What Mikel did, regardless of the extenuating circumstances, was wrong. You can't go and confront refs in their rooms after matches. It's one of the most important things in the game in my opinion and any player doing so should be punished heavily. Three games was light. As for the options you mentioned, you left out the idea that Ramires misunderstood something Clattenburg said to Mikel.

Some people like to cling on to things like this.

He 'had to have said something' did he? You don't know that for fucks sake. Players can't do what Mikel did and he's fucking lucky to have just got three games if we're being totally honest. As for Clattenburg, the authorities found he had no case to answer and the club accepted that. Keeping on implying that he did say something when you've got absolutely no proof is just stupid.

It's funny because we both agree on what the problem is. We differ in that I see Fellaini as being someone who could possibly be an answer to it and you don't. However you were telling me a few posts backs that he wasn't a DM so I'm not entirely sure you know anything about him.

Reading some of the suggestions in this thread makes me wonder how many people have actually played sport and know what a captain should be like. We've been lucky to have a great leader in Terry and some of the suggestions (Luiz for fuck's sake) are frankly an embarrassment. Right now, if Terry and Lampard weren't around then it has to be Cech. The captain has to be a definite starter and ideally the first name on the team sheet. That is Cech. He also has to be well-respected by the players. That is Cech. He has to be mature and someone that the coaches trust to be that leader on the pitch. That is Cech. It isn't Mikel (which is worrying considering the position he plays in the team and the number of games under his belt now). Ideally he'd be articulate, and able to communicate well with referees. That is Cech. The only other person in our team I could imagine fulfilling all of these criteria is Mata. He's a great role model for every player at the club and a cerebral, thoughtful man. But he can be a little softly spoken at times, and isn't a naturally forceful personality which some may see as a negative. Cahill could maybe do it but he simply doesn't have that 'puffed chest' demeanour of Terry (we're really been spoilt having him as our captain for so long). What this whole thread has shown is a distinct lack of leaders in our team. Chalobah could certainly be one in the future but that's at least 5 years off. Whoever comes in this summer could do a lot worse than looking for an imposing centre-half with the personality required to skipper this team.

Oh you have. Okay. You can probably understand why I wasn't sure. But this is ultimately down to personal perspectives on the player. I think he's shown not just the technical and physical qualities that we need in that position (I love the way he moves the ball on quickly) but also the mental attributes and attitude that we desperately need. I think the ability to go forward and get a goal if we need one is an added bonus. You obviously disagree on at least one of those points having seen him play apparently.

I know it's annoying, but could you post the sources for those quotes. When he said them, who he said them to etc. Yes. Everything is geared towards securing the services of Guardiola in the summer. It's the biggest open secret in football. The reason Benitez was appointed was partly due to his relationship with Torres (whether we like it or not he's a £50 million investment), and partly because he was the best available manager who would accept what was essentially a six month contract. Can you think of a single better manager who was available and a realistic target (and let's remember that Roman didn't want Robbie in charge so that's a no-go)?