The only place to be

True....but if players want to leave then it is hard for the clubs to keep them most of the time, unless you're a United. We may well pay over the odds for him but this kid could be around for the next decade or so. Soxxy, Cole, Shaw....that's not bad going for a 15-20 year period.

That is fairly unbelievable for some reason, but he's been with us for almost a decade. Not sure if there's been such an amazing player who is still perhaps under-appreciated by a lot of supporters, myself included. If he gets maybe 5 more seasons here then you're definitely looking at the greatest Premier League keeper of all time and then you're talking about one of the greatest of all time.

Good performance last night statistically. 92% passing accuracy with 6 of 7 long balls accurate and he also made 4 interceptions and 3 tackles which were a team high. That's the fourth game in a row that he's had a passing accuracy of higher than 90%. What seems to happen is that he and Ramires have issues in the first-half which are remedied during the half-time break, which isn't surprising considering that the whole team is still very much a work-in-progress. I don't really see a reason to make changes for the City game - let's be honest, throwing Mikel in against Toure is no guarantee of a more defensively-strong performance from the pivot.

Spot on. If you don't get dropped after that type of performance then when do you? Hopefully he responds well if he's brought back in against City, which I expect he would because it's a 'big game'. This is perhaps why he has detractors. His mistakes aren't a result of a lack of skill or ability, but switching off and that's something fans will never forget. It's almost dishonest to not give everything you can in every match and he does show signs of that against 'smaller opposition'. If he's a realistic contender for skipper then he's got to cut that out right now or Jose will drop him.

Didn't realise it was quite so long ago. A proper Chelsea supporter at a time when we needed them and a very decent bloke from what I've heard.

There's not a fear of disagreeing with Mourinho, but a few people do consider him to be far more knowledgable about football and the players that he handles on a day-to-day basis. Not me though...I'm very much of the belief that Mourinho comes on this forum, looks at my views and acts accordingly.

4) Wine with José Mourinho … and his transfer failures There is warmth from Ferguson in his chapter about José Mourinho and it is clear that the pair do enjoy a good relationship, despite what Sir Bobby Charlton, the United director, said about it essentially being a marriage of convenience. Ferguson likes younger people with a bit of devil in them and he smiled to himself when he saw the manner in which Mourinho first announced himself at Chelsea as the "Special One". Ferguson even admits that he went too far in his criticism of Mourinho after United had met his Porto team in the Champions League last 16 first-leg in 2003-04; Ferguson had been infuriated at Porto's diving but, in truth, he was more angry about how Roy Keane had got himself sent off. When Porto knocked United out in the Old Trafford return, Ferguson found a way to congratulate Mourinho and they shared a glass of wine, which became something of a post-match tradition. Ferguson writes that he found the wine appalling at Stamford Bridge and he told Roman Abramovich so. The following week, he took delivery of a case of Tignanello from the Russian. But the chapter veers away from Mourinho, as Ferguson discusses a range of topics from George Best to the desire of Nemanja Vidic to enlist for the Kosovo conflict and his personal transfer market errors, chief among them Kieran Richardson, Eric Djemba-Djemba, William Prunier and Ralph Milne. There had been the expectation that Ferguson would discuss why he did not advance Mourinho as his Old Trafford successor. There is no mention of the subject in this chapter. DH http://www.theguardian.com/football/blog/2013/oct/22/sir-alex-ferguson-autobiography-10-things-we-learned-manchester-united

And maybe people are forgetting that Azpi got the same level of stick about his crossing last year too. In fact I remember it because I defended him by saying that his crossing wasn't actually that bad, but that he very rarely had a target to aim for. The same applies to Ivanovic. His crossing isn't as bad as people make out, but who exactly is he supposed to aim for? We don't have a a Drogba anymore. Conversely Ivanovic provides a massive threat at set-pieces, and already has one match-winner to his name. It's not just as easy as saying Azpi crosses better ergo we should play him. Why make changes in one area where it doesn't necessarily need it as much as others? Why not maintain consistency in one area whilst you're working on others and then look to make these smaller changes when the team is more settled?

I agree that some people do seem to think Azpi would be a better selection, and that seems to be because he hasn't been playing ergo his deficiencies that people were moaning about last year magically disappear. Personally I think that when you have areas within the team that you are trying to work on (the midfield and the attacking four) then you should try and maintain consistency where you can. Messing with areas that are working (and Ivanovic has been a consistent performer) is fine when you're writing predictions for the team on a forum but when you're trying to win matches because that's what you get paid to do then it's a little trickier. Azpi is a fine young right-back but he needs to win that position and in the small chances he's had, he really hasn't grabbed it with both hands. Against Swindon he was poor - Torres on the other hand took that chance and won a spot in the next game against Spurs. That might sound unfair but that's how top level sport is.

Sorry if you misunderstood but people sometimes misunderstand things like that for personality in the same way they mistake Di Canio and his screaming for 'personality'. I don't think it 'died with the beginning of that sentence', I just think you might disagree. For whatever reason, Luiz didn't really turn up for that performance and it's not the first time. Even against the smallest teams like Brentford he seems to thrown in completely airheaded moments for little or no reason. He needs to realise that each time he's playing, he's wearing our colours and our badge and that he should give 100% each time.

There's not much to discuss. Azpi is a good player who has become even better by not playing and had his deficiencies excised. In limited minutes he's looked a little poor, but that might just be rust whereas Ivanovic has been a dependable presence if somewhat unflashy. He's also scored one winning goal and his tactical flexibility has enabled us to make in-game adjustments like the one against Norwich which saw us win the game. It's not a position we need to change at the moment but when the fixtures start to pile-up then Azpi will get his chance having gotten to know Jose's system better. The rest of the stuff in the thread is the result of a poster doing things they shouldn't and other posters being sucked in.

I'm not discussing this matter further in threads. Banter is one thing - disclosing private information that someone hasn't agreed to make public is another.

I wasn't aware I'd made that information public. In fact I haven't, whereas you have linked to your Twitter account thus making certain information public. I'm not going to discuss this further in this thread.

Someone's been talking to WHS haven't they Nour. And you bringing up something private that I sent to another member in private is 'not bringing anything personal into the discussion'. Why are you bringing up things other members have sent to other members in private? Is that part of the Ts and Cs now? Is that what other admins are going to do?

So your definition of world-class is being 'miles ahead' of Lee Cattermole, John O'Shea, Philip Bardsley et al??

:lol2: Ah keyboards....is there anything they won't allow you to type nowadays?

Who is Jake? If you're going to make up a name for me can it be something a little cooler, like Lazer Thundercrotch? I think it pertains to your views on Azpi and Ivanovic, and why you're expressing them. Not to start a whole new debate but I think you're adopting certain positions for certain reasons that are less than sincere. Either way, let's just agree to disagree. At the end of the day we're all Chelsea supporters. Indeedy. I love American comedy. I love Australian comedy too....Dame Edna's fantastic. But this is a Chelsea forum. You've got to expect the same type of stuff that you'd get with Chelsea supporters haven't you? Ultimately this is the internet though and if people don't want information about them mentioned then why make it public? You're not going to get shirty because someone calls you a bogan are you? (that's not a serious insult is it? If it's a lyric in a song then it can't be that offensive).

Maybe it's a cultural thing but having a little bit of banter is what being a football supporter is about...God knows what his response would be like if he actually turned up in the pub before a game. I imagine he'd try to start banning people at the bar (see, that's a bit of banter too. If it's unacceptable then I apologise. It's tough to know who you can have a laugh with or not sometimes).

I don't think he has the least natural ability, but I also don't think it matters because of the work he's put into his game. I think people look at his body shape and expect him to be awkward on the ball, but he quite simply isn't. I'm not a child thank you very much (very respectful there Nour ). Here's a little tip for the internet - if you don't want people mentioning things about you, don't put them on Twitter and then link to your Twitter account. You WANTED that information out there which is why you put it on a public forum. Don't then get uppity when someone points out that you support other teams. Be proud of your allegiances. :cfc: (the trollface is the closest I could get to the black and white of Juve....ironic).

It's confusing to me too. Ivanovic has been fantastic all season and a reliable fixture in the team. Cole is out so why you'd want more disruption in the backline I don't know.

Were you upset when Juve sold him? Is he that big of a miss?

I've seen enough football in my life to know what natural ability is, but I've also got a high regard for those players who work at it. David Beckham didn't have 'natural ability' but he worked fucking hard at it. The same could be said for Frank Lampard although his instincts were perhaps beyond learning. I don't know if you've played much sports or been around sportsmen, but natural ability is only the start. Hard-work and dedication are often ten times more important and no-one exemplifies that as much as Ivanovic does. It's why he's been getting the nod. Excuse me? Are you seriously going to feign offence at a comment which is true? I know you don't like me and you're looking at every opportunity to ban me but you state in your Twitter profile that you support other teams. 99% of the people on this site support one club - if what I said is untrue then I will take it back and apologise to you right now.

Complete and utter tosh. I know you have other teams to follow but pay attention to our matches perhaps. He's been fantastic for us this season and doesn't deserve half the stick he's getting on here, whilst by the same token Azpi isn't nearly as perfect as some are making out. In fact Azpi's crossing ability was often cited as being in need of work, yet now it's exactly what we need when the problem actually lies with the lack of a real target man in the box. We have problems in this team but right-back isn't one of them at the moment. This whole discussion is very reminiscent of the one about Gary Neville which went on for years because he wasn't a flashy 'Cafu-type' of full-back. You don't always need that, sometimes you just need dependable types in those positions and in Ivanovic we have probably the best one around so far this season. The half-a-dozen goals a season he can chip in with (which already include a winner at home to Villa) are just a bonus.

Except he has been though. He's the form right-back in the league for me and the first name on the team sheet at the moment. Azpi is a good player but I think you're over-exaggerating a tad. Or it means that he sees tactical versatility in using Ivanovic - but are those extra points we got at Norwich really all that important? And there are plenty of people who will rub their hands with glee when it happens, but right now he's been a rock for us. He doesn't stop working for the team and he provides an extra danger at set-pieces. Again, this seems to be based on the premise that Azpi is the better right-back. I'm sorry but not everyone agrees with that.

We finished 6th and 3rd and got eliminated at the group stage of the Champions League. Yes we won the Champions League but Mata was fairly anonymous in both the final and the semi-final. Apart from the stats you've pasted in there, I don't think a single word of that is true. I don't think any supporters give a fuck whether or not a player is their national team's star man or whatever. Mata is a great player but he can blow hot and cold sometimes and he can disappear in matches. Oscar is always working hard for the team and that's what a lot of people appreciate - he also happens to be scoring goals and providing bits of magic in each game.