robsblubot

Fair points, but let me remind you all that Torres not being good enough does NOT make Lukaku good enough (much less Ba). If we start Lukaku against top teams and he goes missing, I am NOT one to come to these forums and write that Lukaku is not that great and so on. He is what he is: a very promising young player who is probably ready to see a few games, but we should not put pressure on him - at least not any more than necessary. Torres makes the big bucks so he must be the one to receive all criticism when things don't work out, not a 20 yo youngster. Yes, I would like Torres to move on, it might even help him regain some confidence if not form (it certainly would help Chelsea though). However, the situation is that Torres is still our player.

Wonder if what Mourinho said about players needing to be playing to feature in their national teams was really meant for Rooney... We don't seem to be able to move many players; might have something to do with high wages.

It was a good result only if we beat them at the bridge. Well it will also depend on how both teams are doing in the league then, so another draw might be another good result or a terrible one.

No shots on goal. No assists. Nah he was ineffective as usual and as expected.

The whole team was good defensively. The defense, playing very deep, did not have to handle one-on-ones very often and certainly not with spaces behind. Of course, attacking then got the short end of the stick. Sorry, just have a problem with this notion of self-contained sections in a football team -- something that does not exist unless we are talking about the American kind.

A lot better than Torres!

agreed. The whole team defended very well, but even Mourinho mentioned that the transition going to attack wasn't very good; I reckon neither Cahill nor Terry can really contribute much going forward in open play because they lack mobility. Still good performances all around, though Welback did have a clear cut chance to score (thank god it was him!) and we did concede a PK, which should've been called in my view (lamps).

Sure and I know Ramires has been left out because of the miscommunication with CBF. However, my point was about the strength in depth that Brazil consistently display. Even when we don't have that strong starting XI, a second team with different players could still be contenders. Yes, it varies, but more so for the quality of the starting XI. Yeah, the fact papers make money when making stuff up is just all incentive they really need. Mata would indeed improve United, but he also takes away. For example, United are very strong defensively, and on occasion can even pressure the opposition in their own half, which they did against us @ the bridge. If Mata is on, that becomes more difficult. Still, Mata may very well be the price we need to pay to get Rooney, and I'm not a big Rooney fan; think there are better options out there.

He prob already has a pre-contract with Munich though. He'd be my very first choice...

agreed. I think behind the scenes Mata, after a great season backed by solid numbers, asked for a huge raise and Mourinho does not seem to regard him as highly (for the asked key player role). Mata is an excellent player no doubt, but I think I see what Mourinho dislikes in him: he lacks intensity which is showcased by his very poor defensive ability. Perhaps Mourinho does not believe in making concessions for Mata and would like to employ more rounded players. It's his prerogative, of course. Like I wrote many times, I have my doubts one can accommodate both Mata and Hazard behind a striker. It's just too many attacking minded players and not enough defending. It can work on occasion when players give that extra effort, but cannot be made work in a long comp like the premiere League (plus the parallel comps). BTW, just to be a bit more on topic, William does have the intensity. And don't focus so much on the Brazil NT... Brazil produces a high number of quality players. They could field a very competitive second team in the world cup. Even our own Ramires isn't on the team for example.

There is really no other way to interpret the recent events other than assuming Mata will be sold or involved in an exchange. Personally I don't think United would let Rooney go unless a player of Mata's caliber is made part of the deal.

JT is absolutely dominant in the air-no surprise there. The irony is that Brazil use Luiz as the aerial cb because Thiago is just too short. Gonna repeat myself just because I'm so righteous: JT and Luiz make the best CB pairing in the world. ^^ On the road - haven't watched the game just yet.

Have to agree on Ba; he had a good game and even that wasn't good enough in my book. Still, thought the link up for Lampard goal was the obvious easy one-it was all lamps really. My problem with both Ba and lukaku at the moment is the lack of finesse in their play. They also squander many attacks by misplacing a pass or a bad first touch or even making a bad run, while Torres seems physically weak. Like u said Lukaku has time to develop though We just can't wait a season or two until he becomes (or not) the finished product.Well we will find out soon enough...

That depends... On requirements. For a team like Barcelona for example David would have to be considered top5 and I reckon #1. Many very solid defenders would never work in a high defense line setup for example. David was also a lot better than thiago silva in the conf cup against strong sides.

I was not far from where Hazard was making those wonderful runs in the second half (against Roma). It's just not pace, his short dribbling is quite phenomenal. He's cold and determined individual, and these types of players usually become very good at finishing eventually. BTW, finishing to me isn't just putting the ball in the back of the net; to a wide player finishing may well be providing an assist, and that's what he did today against Roma. I want to see more of that actually.

agreed. All players aim to get the best deal they can get and that's why they pay an agent to begin with. David may like playing for Chelsea, and I honestly think he does, but if he is being offered a key player position at Barca with matching wages, and he is unable to get that here, say Mourinho tells him he will be rotated, then he is gone and I would not blame him. There are just too many unknowns. However, right now he is a chelsea player. Just watched him live and it's funny how his technique oozes from him. His first touch, his passing, are of special players. People are just not used to seeing a player with that much ball control playing defense. Don't think he was 100% since he was wearing those muscle tape though.

Just came back from RFK. The game was OK, decent as friendlies go. I actually broke a rule of mine by attending this match... "if the players don't give a damn I sure as hell don't either... " still, not many opportunities to see the players in action. JT and Luiz still make a wonderful pairing. They were the only thing holding Chelsea together in the first half because the midfield vanished. Essien has moments that remind us of the player he once was, but he was lost most of the time. Mikel was the usual Mikel, simple passes, no risk, no carrying the ball, and a few tackles... nothing horrible and nothing great... I just expect more from our starting holding mid. I was not impressed at all by KDB, and for me the difference between him and Oscar became very clear in the second half. KDB was just not helping enough in the middle which caused Roma to dominate in the first half. Shirley had another poor game, but I still see more potential in him than Moses. I'm sorry I just don't see enough technique in Moses and have seen too many players doing what he does, and some a lot better than him. Second half was far more interesting. We had a midfield in the second half. And we had a player, in Hazard, beating his marker and creating chances. Oscar did very well by always getting involved in the play, defense too. Ramires, the usual extremely high work rate and a good performance. Nice to see some variation in tactics with 2 FWs and Ramires in the RB position. Very attacking-minded and interesting for the right occasion. Still very worried about the striker position.

heh easy to say Anderson is a bad signing now, but back then he was hot commodity! Regular Brazil international, very solid passing, and even had moments of Brilliance; though tey become rarer as time passed. He's the showcase of stagnated development, which proves that potential is just that, "potential." I reckon there is either something wrong with his body or his head, because a 23-24 year old cannot, or I guess should not, be as unfit and as injury-prone as he is now. BTW, Alexandre Pato is shaping up about the same. He's been having a terrible time in Brazil, BUT he at least seems to have managed to remain fit.

Well, it may be that he just does not posses the skill to not back away in such situations. I don't know, but I wouldn't assume it's just a mentality thing. He doesn't strike me as a very rounded player and can't really turn his body that quickly and sprint, which is something you have to do if high up on the pitch.

all good players no doubt... none world class. JT used to be, but he barely played last season. United have better and City have a lot better. Yes, that's an important question. We ought to be asking whether we want to do OK in the BPL or if we are shooting for the CL.

Well, you are barking at the wrong tree... I'm not too fond of Rooney's current form. Would have signed him a couple of years ago, but not right now. And Rooney's not #1 striker for United -- even his Manager said so -- while Luiz is our absolute best CB; I think his CV/resume is already kind showing that, for club and country.

It won't be shattered, but our defense would look a bit pedestrian with very simple CBs. All our rivals (always except Arsenal) would have better options than us. What is really scary to me isn't us losing him - life goes on - but Barcelona getting him. He would solve all their CB problems and they would go back to being the best side in the world IMO. Their biggest problem recently has been that they did not have a CB who could make the defense to midfield transition (hello David!), so they've been employing midfielders in teh CB position which hurts them when they actually have to defend in the box. David is the perfect player for them.

The big question to me is: would we be able to use the 40M (whatever currency) we receive for him to fix the problem that selling him will surely create?

Thought Fellaini had a release clause around 25m, so all Moyes has to do is really to agree terms with the player. He will improve United and himself - good move for all but Everton.

He might be out for Saturday too as risking a muscle injury in preseason would be silly.