LDN Blue

Haha yeah fair game on that one! But my point remains (though less credible now )

Haha yeah! I love how Liverpool fans talk of the Champions League triumph as amazing and all that but give no credit to the man who led them there - Rafael Benitez (heck they don't even credit their keeper who won it for them Dudek! )

Let the thread die Shane

I was actually thinking about the loanee thing while I was typing that. But there-in lies the problem. Because this is the only player who is available and who is a good match we don't have a choice. It's either buy and sell later - or let him go and look elsewhere. There's no point in bringing in a loanee from abroad because there's no time for them to adapt. The likes on Mancinenne and Cork won't be recalled either. If I read Tottenham had signed him but agreed to loan him to us, I'd be delighted. It'd be the best solution. Like what Genoa did. They bought K.P. Boateng from Pompy, then loaned him out to AC Milan - Also giving them an option to buy. It'd be a great sort of deal for us.

Max I don't think that was aimed at you, or anyone I think he was just saying that now we have fans in the Abramovich era they should stick with us even if he decided to pack up and leave one day. It applies to everyone

And of the current Real squad - It might be noted

It really is sad how Ronaldo's career was cut so short - Always makes me sad to see how that generation of Brazilians are gone. However with Ronaldinho back in Brazil the 3 of them shall meet very soon. I'm sure it will be emotional for them

I understand that view. Hardly anyone was impressed with that deal. However in terms of how this season is going - This is perhaps an intelligent deal. Pienaar has demonstrated his quality this season, he's ready to go, there's no need to "adapt". He can come straight into the team and do that job at hand. I don't see him lasting longer than 3-years though. He may even be gone by next January.

In the 80-90th minute He is basically like Drogba - Will only truly give a fuck in closing stages of a game. The total opposite to Lampard who gives it everything for 90minutes, and creates every single game.

That's exactly what I was thinking. He's already attempted the threats on benching him, now he's using reverse psychology (in a sense)

But Lampard outshines those players. Which is a credit to him. Gerrard takes a back seat to players like Benayoun, Xabi Alonso ect. definitely not. You construct your debates in a much more detailed way. Badboy gives a few lines Agreed

Hmm.. We don't know that for sure though. Media speculation would be easy to drive up that as an excuse. Everton have already said Pienaar's not been allowed to be in talks with Tottenham. It's anyone's guess whether he's done it or not. This is perhaps the best way to sign him. Certainly this way it's a 2 horse race as opposed to fighting off competition from as up to 5 other clubs.

I personally believe that's a penalty. Gerrard's through on goal, Gattuso's clearly pulled him back by the shoulder, from behind. Whether Gerrard was going to unleash the shot at that moment or not is irrelevant. Gattuso is experienced enough to know if you touch a player like that, when it's him vs the keeper, the benefit of doubt it always with the striker. (or midfielder in this case )

Exactly. Lampard, every season, stands out for Chelsea. A club with some of the best talent in the world. He's able to outshine players like Essien, Drogba, Ballack, Deco, Joe Cole ect ect. Gerrard was outshined by Benayoun last season!!

And you don't think Lampard would be in the box in a situation like that? He'd have been there, at the right time, in the right position to head home - I guarantee that Gerrard is driven, yes I'll give you that. But the example of the 2006 final I think is unfair to say Lampard would've not done the same. Gerrard's goal came in injury time, so all the players would've done the same. Lampard, in a cup final, would've been demanding the ball.. He would've been running tirelessly to get a goal (or set one up). The circumstances are different. Gerrard will not be involved for 90minutes. There are long and frequent times where Gerrard, like Drogba, will just ghost through a game. Providing moments of energy and inspiration. Lampard will be present for the full 90. He will be operating the midfield, demanding the ball and distributing it in all the right areas. He's the type that looks to create (which is actually more effective than going for glory all the time.)

What?! Gerrard can only play when he's got a striker ahead of him. His combination with Torres is the only reason Liverpool win games (99% of the time). When Torres does not play, Gerrard doesn't perform. Same thing with England, an England without Rooney = A quiet Gerrard. Lampard's got the ability to drive into the box, with the ball and strike it home for a goal. His free-kick ability outshines Gerrard too, hitting the target every time he steps up (for England). The argument about Sunderland is wrong too. Lampard would provide genius, innovation and simplicity. He wouldn't try and go for glory when things aren't going his way, he'll be smart. He'll look up, within a second he'll identify who's he's passing too, how he's passing it, the weight needed. If he's going to shoot he'll decide, within the second, how far does he need to be, where does he need to (positional wise) and is it the best option He's also someone that will be in the box supporting the man with the ball. So if someone shoots and if rebounds off the keeper, 90% of the time, you'll see Lampard ready to fire home. For a cross it'll be the same, he'll be in the box, ready to head home.

I do think it's a bit harsh to deny him of that night in Istanbul. I thought the whole team was magnificent that night, I don't recall Gerrard diving for the penalty. A truly legendary night of football - The whole team were heroes, not just Gerrard.

Problem is, in 6-months all clubs will come running. Tottenham & Inter Milan. Then it will become a war of wages, which we will almost certainly not take part in.

I don't think so. Gerrard's movement on the pitch is as good as Lampard, he's very predictable to play if the opposition does their homework. His vision is nowhere near as clear as Lampard, where Lampard excels is, he knows exactly what he's going to do before receiving the ball. He knows where everyone is, where the weak links are and who's making the runs. Gerrard takes a while, he receives the ball, stops, looks and then provides the ball. If defenders are smart, they'd close him down instantly. What's more is Gerrard is a massive sulk. When things don't go his way, when he's dispossessed and all that, he pulls a sulk and starts moaning at everyone. Lampard has the coolest head on the pitch. His composure is next to none.

I never doubted Ivanovic wouldn't leave. The big question remains about Bosingwa.

That whole paragraph is exactly why Lampard is better. That last line in particular is one point I made too, very well put by SC though.

Gerrard's shots are more powerful, but Lampard's are more accurate. Also, Lampard has the ability to create something out of nothing. Gerrard needs the players around him to create something, be it Torres or Xabi Alonso. I don't think he's as "incredible" as you make him out to be - I'd also argue Lampard's a better passer than Gerrard is. Gerrard's control is better, but long balls? Lampard wins. As for leadership - Well we've got John Terry

Drogba still has the potential to do something like that - He should take notes.

I'll have a go Badboy.. Yes Gerrard inspires, but that's only in the 80th minute when the team has lost all hope. He's like Essien (of late), when hope is losing out he'll make the drives forward and inspire others. However Lampard, will find you the goals. He's the one who's got the awareness and genius to be in the right place, at the right time. Be it in the box, to poach in a goal, or on the D to drive in a powerful shot which it 99% to be a goal. Gerrard doesn't stick to his position. Example; during the World Cup complaints were "he's being played on the left, out of position". When Fabio moved him to just behind the striker, he went off the left he was totally out. Like Anelka, no sense of position.