Is it too early to put Diego Simeone in the top bracket off managers?

[Tomo 21,751]

I ask this because I was having an interesting debate about this yesterday.

For me the top bracket of managers are Jose, Pep, Fergie. All 3 just have that special something that separates them from the next tier down which bring us to the likes of Wenger, Rafa and Ancelotti, all good managers who have won trophies but have a few weaknesses (for example all 3 tend to take too long to react and change when things aren't going there way) and simply aren't on the level if the first 3. Hiddink and LVG are probably somewhere in between the two groups.

Which brings me to Simeone, his work at Leti is in human, he's created a brilliant side with a group if players playing in a system that works and furthermore he did it in two and a half years as he took them over when they were in mid table.

He is spot on tactically (when was the last time someone outsmarted Mou quite like he did, Mou basically took what he's been dishing out for over a decade), great man management, would defend his team and players to the death. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Leti challenge again and there is only one answer I can think why and that's Diego, the guy is a genius.

So is it to early to put him in the top bracket of managers in the world? or no?

I think one thing we all can agree on, if he gets Atletico challenging with two teams who have single players costmore than his squad again, then this won't even be debatable. Simeone achievement goes to show that you can compete with more expensive rivals with the right structure and management and proves that Wenger using us and United money as an excuse for not competiting all these years is just that, a poor excuse.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

I'd put Simne and Klopp somewhere below Jose and Pep (mind you, Pep himself has his glaring weaknesses) but certainly above Ancelotti and Rafa. For me it goes like:

1. Jose

2. Pep

3. Klopp

4.Simone

5. Wenger

6. Ancelotti

7. Rafa

...etc.

[Madmax 9,219]

I think he's pushing that barrier. I tend to rate managers based on league exploits as in my opinion the sustained nature of the competition is a better barometer for defining 'success'. As you said, he'll be right up there if he can emulate his La Liga achievements of last season. That would put him level with Rafa - who's criminally underrated. For me Ferguson and Mourinho are at the very top and it's just about impossible to separate the two. Ferguson's squad building (and re-building) and his longevity is unparalleled, as is Mourinho's versatility and they're both unique in those aspects. Guardiola rounds off that top bracket simply because he revolutionized world football for ~5 years.

And from your list, I'd have Klopp definitely above Carlo and Wenger (who's more of a coach) in my books, fwiw.

[Spike 12,049]

1. José

2. Jürgie

3. Cholo

4. Pep

5. Conte

Best managers in Europe right now. Pep while very amazing as a manager has only reached his visions at clubs that allow him to financially. Not too mention in his earlier days Pep was atrocious at buying players. What seperates him from the three above him, is that they have achieved success in constraining ways. José at Porto, Jürgie at BVB and Cholo at Atléti. I'll knock Pep up a few places if he can transform a club like Inter or A.C. Milan into a behemoth without having the funds to throw at players like Benatia and Chygrynskiy.

Conte I rate very highly, while not astute as the others has a drive and charisma that makes players run with the hearts on their shoulders. The Italian national team has all the tactics it needs in coaches, but now they have a man that will make the players die on the field for a victory. I expect Italy to be among France and Germany come 2016.

[Jype 6,398]

1. Mourinho and Guardiola in the top bracket.

2. Klopp, Simeone and Conte close to that. Haven't yet proven enough to belong in the first category but probably will sometime in the near future.

3. Ancelotti, Wenger, Benitez, Pellegrini, van Gaal etc. some distance behind.

[TheOneChan95 225]

I think it is a bit early and I'd place him somewhere near Klopp. If he wins the league again then I think we can say he is something special.

Out of curiosity, how come people don't rate Carlo as high? I think he's a great manager and knows how to work with people. 3 CLs is definitely not a fluke too. Is it due to his poorer league record?

[Tomo 21,751]

I think it is a bit early and I'd place him somewhere near Klopp. If he wins the league again then I think we can say he is something special.

Out of curiosity, how come people don't rate Carlo as high? I think he's a great manager and knows how to work with people. 3 CLs is definitely not a fluke too. Is it due to his poorer league record?

Partly, I took his tenure with us into account aswell, he's definitely a really good manager but not in the Jose category, he can take teams to a good competitive level but he isnt the type of manager that will have a team dominanting. Also he can be quite predictable tactically and with his subs, there were times with us were I could tell what he was about to do before he did.

[stroey 2,525]

I think it is a bit early and I'd place him somewhere near Klopp. If he wins the league again then I think we can say he is something special.

Out of curiosity, how come people don't rate Carlo as high? I think he's a great manager and knows how to work with people. 3 CLs is definitely not a fluke too. Is it due to his poorer league record?

Carlo has only won 3 league titles in 19 years, that's not enough to be qualified as a world class manager. He had one of the best AC Milan teams ever and just won 1 serie A title with it in 8 years.

[Sidzeret 2,257]

Mou and Fergie could work magic. Tops the list defo. You can rarely see th get tactically beaten.

Pep is a good manger but I think we worked out an effective system and had the best players to implement it at both Bayern and Barca. He never had a difficult situation in the players department unlike Jose who won the CL with Porto and Fergie who built that treble winning United side.

Ancelotti comes just below. Even though he had an almost perfect career so far- 3 CL, League titles at Europe's top leagues ( La Liga this year, maybe?), he lacks the tactical masterclass to outsmart someone like Jose or Pep.

It's too late to consider Simeone up there, but I genuinely feel he's the one with the potential to emulate the success of the previously mentioned mangers if he has the right financial resources, having already proved his worth with a not-so-big club in Atleti.

Rafa and Wenger- scum sucking bottom dwellers.

[iseah100 5,612]

Like most on here said, Mou and Fergie are on another level. A notch or 2 below them are Klopp, Simeone and Ancelotti. I hate Pep.

[Nike 373]

I prefer Pep over Jose...

Jose to me is lacking primarily in 2 areas. Long term and offensive football.

[Tomo 21,751]

I prefer Pep over Jose...

Jose to me is lacking primarily in 2 areas. Long term and offensive football.

Correct, maybe our next manager will do things like smash the goal record in Spain and get a team to score 6 against Arsenal and Everton.

Also Pep lacks long term so far, infact he admitted he wasn't going to stay at Barca for long because players would get bored of his methods and only signs rolling contracts, he's hardly a walking stability model is he?

[Nike 373]

Correct, maybe our next manager will do things like smash the goal record in Spain and get a team to score 6 against Arsenal and Everton.

Also Pep lacks long term so far, infact he admitted he wasn't going to stay at Barca for long because players would get bored of his methods and only signs rolling contracts, he's hardly a walking stability model is he?

Jose team doesnt have an offensive flow to them. They score goals through individual brilliance, not because of Jose tactics.

Pep stayed with Barcelona for a long time with juventile a and first team combined. In addition, pep left because of internal conflict with barcelona VPs at the time and their unethical dealings that came to light after Pep left.

Jose man management only allows him to stay short term, especially in a bigger club. If he stays in chelsea longer than 3 years, I will be surprised.

[iseah100 5,612]

Jose team doesnt have an offensive flow to them. They score goals through individual brilliance, not because of Jose tactics.

Pep stayed with Barcelona for a long time with juventile a and first team combined. In addition, pep left because of internal conflict with barcelona VPs at the time and their unethical dealings that came to light after Pep left.

Jose man management only allows him to stay short term, especially in a bigger club. If he stays in chelsea longer than 3 years, I will be surprised.

Everything you said about Jose is so far off. Wow.

[didierforever 7,349]

I prefer Pep over Jose...

Jose to me is lacking primarily in 2 areas. Long term and offensive football.

what has pep done to show long term work at a football club. also, does not jose hold the record for the highest number of goals in la liga despite PEP's out of the world attacking barca?

[didierforever 7,349]

jose, carlo, pep, simeone and klopp are the best managers in the world right now without a doubt.

also why are people putting carlo in the same bracket as FSW and wenger!!!!! thats a SLAP on his face.

[TheOneChan95 225]

Partly, I took his tenure with us into account aswell, he's definitely a really good manager but not in the Jose category, he can take teams to a good competitive level but he isnt the type of manager that will have a team dominanting. Also he can be quite predictable tactically and with his subs, there were times with us were I could tell what he was about to do before he did.

True, he can be a bit predictable, and his league record is definitely a blemish in his CV. While I think that he isn't mou, pep or SAF level, he should probably be just below that just based on his cup record. I'd definitely take him over Wenger or Rafa

Another question just popped into my head, do you think some managers are better suited to certain clubs? I think that Mou and Simeone really suit an underdog club that is not expected to win. The mentality that "it's us against the world" just seems to fit.

On the other hand I get the feeling that people like Carlo and Pep slot into "big" clubs with superstars quite well. Maybe they benefit much more from a stable club.

[Viper22 2,418]

Everyone here forgetting about Capello? His England tenure doesn't immediately make him a bad manager.

He's won Serie A 5 times with 2 different clubs, the Champions League, La Liga twice and the Italian Supercup 4 times.

[Viper22 2,418]

If you include Ferguson and Heynckes seeing as they've only just recently retired... These are the top 18 in the world right now IMO:

1) Ferguson

2) Mourinho

3) Capello

4) Ancelotti

5) Louw

6) Heynckes

7) Klopp

8) Guardiola

9) Lippi

10) Wenger

11) Trapattoni

12) Simeone

13) Del Bosque

14) Lucescu

15) Hiddink

16) Conte

17) Bielsa

18) Pellegrini

EDIT: So in answer to your question, yes I think Simeone is in the bracket of top class managers.

[Tomo 21,751]

If you include Ferguson and Heynckes seeing as they've only just recently retired... These are the top 18 in the world right now IMO:

1) Ferguson

2) Mourinho

3) Capello

4) Ancelotti

5) Louw

6) Heynckes

7) Klopp

8) Guardiola

9) Lippi

10) Wenger

11) Trapattoni

12) Simeone

13) Del Bosque

14) Lucescu

15) Hiddink

16) Conte

17) Bielsa

18) Pellegrini

EDIT: So in answer to your question, yes I think Simeone is in the bracket of top class managers.

Capello did a good job with England despite the WC in SA, 100 times better than Roy Hodgson who frankly makes me cringe with embarrassment.

And Wenger above Simeone?