The loan market

[Naked Mole Rat 437]

What about we stop all this nonsense with loans and start giving players who are doing well in the reserves a chance? Loans always involve risks, whether they are to lower league clubs or to foreign clubs, and players can never go on loan and still succeed. Look at Barcelona. Do they ever send anyone on loan? (real loans, not Fabregas, Romeu sort) As far as I'm concerned, neither Pedro, Busquets nor Alcantara ever went on loan and they do just fine. Of course, they probably have better players than we do, and the system in Spain is better than the English system, but surely we could have given Borini a chance when he was capable of scoring five goals in a game for the reserves and we should probably let Lalkovic have his first team debut when he's been impressive in the reserves for quite some time now.

[francozola 2,040]

What about we stop all this nonsense with loans and start giving players who are doing well in the reserves a chance? Loans always involve risks, whether they are to lower league clubs or to foreign clubs, and players can never go on loan and still succeed. Look at Barcelona. Do they ever send anyone on loan? (real loans, not Fabregas, Romeu sort) As far as I'm concerned, neither Pedro, Busquets nor Alcantara ever went on loan and they do just fine. Of course, they probably have better players than we do, and the system in Spain is better than the English system, but surely we could have given Borini a chance when he was capable of scoring five goals in a game for the reserves and we should probably let Lalkovic have his first team debut when he's been impressive in the reserves for quite some time now.

That's the thing though. Their B league is so much better than the utter joke that is the English Reserves league.

I do agree though, certain players definitely should have been given a chance: Sinclair, Borini, Lalko instead of the useless Malouda etc

[BlueLion. 21,491]

Don't think the club could have predicted how badly Bolton would be doing this season, Coyle is still a good man-manager. I suppose his loan was unfortunate in the sense that Bolton were in need of form and weren't prepared to play a loanee with little premier league experience.

I'm still getting my head around PvA's disaster however, don't see why we'd have loaned him to Wigan if they were prepared to play Figueroa at LB anyway. Again, may be due to the fact that they had a bad start to the season and weren't prepared to risk it.

Of course we could loan players to lower league clubs, but if you consider Bertrand, we now have an extremely talented, experienced left back who is unable to get any chances in the first team, and too experienced to go back on loan to anywhere but a top-10 club.

Turns out our club is making correct development/progression of youth talents more difficult than they should be.

Great point about Bolton. Last year they were doing quite well (I honestly believe they are missing Holden, he is an influential player for them), and as a result Coyle wants to play the most experienced and strongest eleven possible to get victories where he can. That is the exact same thing AVB is doing - so we can't really blame Coyle for limiting Kakuta's chances. I'm just excited to see what Gael can do with a prolonged number of matches under his belt.

[eldo 868]

What about we stop all this nonsense with loans and start giving players who are doing well in the reserves a chance? Loans always involve risks, whether they are to lower league clubs or to foreign clubs, and players can never go on loan and still succeed. Look at Barcelona. Do they ever send anyone on loan? (real loans, not Fabregas, Romeu sort) As far as I'm concerned, neither Pedro, Busquets nor Alcantara ever went on loan and they do just fine. Of course, they probably have better players than we do, and the system in Spain is better than the English system, but surely we could have given Borini a chance when he was capable of scoring five goals in a game for the reserves and we should probably let Lalkovic have his first team debut when he's been impressive in the reserves for quite some time now.

Don't you understand that reserves here are not good for their development. Players don't play regularly and it's not much of a improvement in comparison to u18. Players get used to it quickly and begin to stagnate, that's why the gap between first team and reserves is huge.

All those Barca players were playing for their B team, even our Oriol. They play from fourth division to second, so yes it's like a loan.

Don't you think we would see an improvement in our youth developing (not just us but many clubs in England), if reserves are allowed to make their way up the lower leagues?

[EskWeston 696]

For me a bigger problem than loans is the reserve set up - the 18 - 21 age bracket, crucial development time for players and this is where we are failing in this country. We need proper competitive football for these young players to be tested week in week out, at the moment they play very sporadically and in an environment that has very little challenge. This is what needs to be worked on and i beleive we would see better results with loans as well.

Loans are working something like 4 times out of 10. With Sturridge it was obvious he just needed game time, and his loan was clearly a successs. With Kakuta i feel the club has made mistakes with him, for his first loan to go to the Premiership was a massive gamble and one that was never going to work imo, in the reserves it was clear he needed more games and confidence, he should have gone to a Championship club last season or even this to play plenty of games and get his confidence up before trying a Premiership club. PVA just seems to have been badly managed by Wigan, played well at the start of the season and then just dropped.

Ryan Bertrand is a good example of the loan system working, stated off in the lower leagues and gradually worked his way up to top Championship level and now is first team back up (even though he should be getting more minutes), this is how it should work, now he competes for a first team place. Young players will not just have a loan spell and then come back and be starting 11, Sturridge is a rare example, and he was helped by our very limited options on the wings.

In an ideal world we would have B teams, but that is not going to happen for many years if at all, work on how to help the development of 18 to 21 year olds and bridge the gap to the first team.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

AVB claims English football's structure needs a revamp... or the national team will suffer

Read more:

http://www.dailymail...l#ixzz1jxAeTxpb

and

http://www.telegraph...generation.html

The man makes some great points. It's interesting that he pointed Nathan Ake, Adam Nditi and Lucas Piazon out of the youth team.

[EskWeston 696]

The man makes some great points. It's interesting that he pointed Nathan Ake, Adam Nditi and Lucas Piazon out of the youth team.

Certainly interesting he mentioned Nditi, not one of the real talents in the current squad IMO.

[Naked Mole Rat 437]

Don't you understand that reserves here are not good for their development. Players don't play regularly and it's not much of a improvement in comparison to u18. Players get used to it quickly and begin to stagnate, that's why the gap between first team and reserves is huge.

All those Barca players were playing for their B team, even our Oriol. They play from fourth division to second, so yes it's like a loan.

Don't you think we would see an improvement in our youth developing (not just us but many clubs in England), if reserves are allowed to make their way up the lower leagues?

Well, yeah, I did mention that the Spanish system's better, and you're right with the current system in England being inadequate for youth development and that situations can be improved by incorporating the reserves league with a lower division, but that's irrelevant. My point was that instead of having players go through a cumbersome process of: 1. do well at youth level, 2. do well in reserves, 3. do well in a lower division, 4. have a storming loan spell at a reasonably strong team, and then finally saying "Ok, looks like you've developed well enough, and your presence in the first team no longer threatens the existence of this club, so it's now okay for you to play for us", we should right away give first-team opportunities to those who perform well in the reserves.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Certainly interesting he mentioned Nditi, not one of the real talents in the current squad IMO.

I think Feruze is probably the best talent in our youth team. Whom do you think is most likely to make the first team?