Mikel vs Blackburn: Vertical Passes from the "Horizontal Man"

[Blue Armour 4,158]

If there's one thing Romeu does have over Mikel- its pace. This allows him to track back easily when the whole team goes out on the attack, and suddenly there's a counter. Also helps in bringing the ball out of defense a lot quicker.

Mikel pretty much covers everything else.

[LDN Blue 7,903]

Logic 101:

Just because someone says that a player is better than another player, does not mean that he is implying that the latter is shit/no-good. It's like saying: "Getting a PHD is better than just graduating college." ; That does not, by any means, insinuate that college graduates are stupid.

My point is, no one is bashing Mikel. This thread is made to praise Mikel. However, I believe that the point that was being made is that Romeu has put in great performances every time he set foot on the pitch, and has showed he has the ability to play at a higher tempo (I don't mean he has more pace) than Mikel. So maybe he has a earned the right to a chance to prove himself at a higher level in the form of a couple of PL matches starting position.

Bravo, brilliant post

[blue out west 27]

You seriously think he's one of the best in his position?, well sorry but that mystifies me, Mikel rarely tracks players and hasnt got the pace to break up play, Romeu has, and how do you know that?, how do you know Romeu would of looked lost?, put your crystal ball away for a second. Obviously no one is invincible, somethings happen which cannot be controlled, it's basically just really good football, but Valencia were taking a dump in our half and Mikel couldn't do anything, Romeu could of at least done something and had the pace too, it would of at least kept some control in the team and confidence. Mikel in my opinion is too slow. I'm not talking about he should stick in DM, i think he's wasted there and could of been a better central midfield player, rather than being a defensive midfielder. His passing is something we are missing out on, but it's my opinion and fair enough if you think Mikel can do a better job than Romeu.

Well Mikel does do a better job than Romeu, its not really my opinion. Valencia was one game where he could've been better but he didn't exactly get a lot of help either. He still probably made less mistakes in that first half then Romeu did in stoppage time vs Blackburn. Where is his pace anyway? If Romeu is faster than Mikel the difference is quite small.

How many better players than Mikel @ DM?

@ CHOULO19

...and I'm not saying Romeu is shit because Mikel is a better player. I wonder what "great performances" you're referring too... I thought he had a mature and very effective game vs a weak visiting Genk side... Romeu is and will continue to get time in PL games but when you come on @ 90' in a 1-0 game and immediately concede a dangerous FK its not the greatest way to make your case. Concerning the whole tempo issue people have with Mikel, they'd be well served to rewatch his games this season and compare that to the role he played for CA and JM. Also, I'm sure AVB is asking the same of Romeu and Mikel tactically and he's simply playing who's best for the role. If there's chalkboards to compare their passing I'm sure they look pretty similar in terms of horizontal vs vertical.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Well Mikel does do a better job than Romeu, its not really my opinion. Valencia was one game where he could've been better but he didn't exactly get a lot of help either. He still probably made less mistakes in that first half then Romeu did in stoppage time vs Blackburn. Where is his pace anyway? If Romeu is faster than Mikel the difference is quite small.

How many better players than Mikel @ DM?

@ CHOULO19

...and I'm not saying Romeu is shit because Mikel is a better player. I wonder what "great performances" you're referring too... I thought he had a mature and very effective game vs a weak visiting Genk side... Romeu is and will continue to get time in PL games but when you come on @ 90' in a 1-0 game and immediately concede a dangerous FK its not the greatest way to make your case. Concerning the whole tempo issue people have with Mikel, they'd be well served to rewatch his games this season and compare that to the role he played for CA and JM. Also, I'm sure AVB is asking the same of Romeu and Mikel tactically and he's simply playing who's best for the role. If there's chalkboards to compare their passing I'm sure they look pretty similar in terms of horizontal vs vertical.

Actually I meant his great performances in the carling cup (each a 120 mins), during which he showed tactical awareness and passing abilities way beyond his age. I can get why you think he's not ready to start PL matches if you haven't watched these two performances. I felt the same way before them as well.

Now if you look at the stats here: (which by the way only include PL matches). You can actually see clearly that Romeu has a much higher successful forward passing percentage than Mikel, but more importantly you can see that he has the highest interception per 90min ratio in the entire Chelsea squad, which in my opinion would make him a great success with our high-line defending.

Again, I'm not saying that Romeu is better than Mikel, he has no where near as much experience as him. I just think that with the performances he's put in, it is worth a risk to start him in a few PL matches instead of Mikel.

Same goes for Rayan Bertrand imo as well.

[The Big Drog 1,110]

I'm not a fan of Mikel in the DM role. Too many times midfielders find their way into our box without Mikel tracking them, too many times he looks slow and lumbering in midfield, too many times he slows down our play when he is on the ball, too many times games just pass him by ala Michael Carrick. imo he is a poor replacement for the man who used to play in holding midfield for us, Claude Makelele, and I also think Essien is far better in that position than Mikel also. Id much rather see Romeu given starts in the Premier League than Mikel.

[madalista 30]

Actually I meant his great performances in the carling cup (each a 120 mins), during which he showed tactical awareness and passing abilities way beyond his age. I can get why you think he's not ready to start PL matches if you haven't watched these two performances. I felt the same way before them as well.

Now if you look at the stats here: http://forum.talkche...s-october-2011/ (which by the way only include PL matches). You can actually see clearly that Romeu has a much higher successful forward passing percentage than Mikel, but more importantly you can see that he has the highest interception per 90min ratio in the entire Chelsea squad, which in my opinion would make him a great success with our high-line defending.

Again, I'm not saying that Romeu is better than Mikel, he has no where near as much experience as him. I just think that with the performances he's put in, it is worth a risk to start him in a few PL matches instead of Mikel.

Same goes for Rayan Bertrand imo as well.

looking at the table in detail you find out that romeu has not attempted a single long foward pass to date....it mostly short passes that romeu attemps. in my opinion when we hit our stride itll be good to give romeu time aganst the leagues weaker teams...but at the moment we are finding it hard to beat the weaker teams. its not the right time to play him ahead of mikel.

[GodZola 630]

Romeu, the guy who coming on in just for stoppage time made more mistakes than Mikel did through 90. So sick and tired of the Mikel bashing. There is nothing Romeu does better, people are just on his nuts because he's from La Masia.

I suggest you take a look back at Mikel's cameo against Utd this season before you judge Romeu for a brief introduction - its never easy to come off the bench.

[blue out west 27]

Actually I meant his great performances in the carling cup (each a 120 mins), during which he showed tactical awareness and passing abilities way beyond his age. I can get why you think he's not ready to start PL matches if you haven't watched these two performances. I felt the same way before them as well.

Now if you look at the stats here: http://forum.talkche...s-october-2011/ (which by the way only include PL matches). You can actually see clearly that Romeu has a much higher successful forward passing percentage than Mikel, but more importantly you can see that he has the highest interception per 90min ratio in the entire Chelsea squad, which in my opinion would make him a great success with our high-line defending.

Again, I'm not saying that Romeu is better than Mikel, he has no where near as much experience as him. I just think that with the performances he's put in, it is worth a risk to start him in a few PL matches instead of Mikel.

Same goes for Rayan Bertrand imo as well.

I don't think he's not at all ready for the PL but I wouldn't say he would be a top DM in the PL on the back of 2 good CC outings (where he had almost zero pressure) and 1 good home game vs Genk who is even weaker than the CC squads used by Everton and Fulham.

As for those stats Romeu has a really small sample size against poor opposition in some of the least consequential games that we've been involved in. In those those games he hasn't really been under consistent pressure at any time, whereas Mikel was the motor that kept us in control vs QPR with 9 men. On the subject of forward passes you should look at the chalkboards and also remember how those games were. Forward passing success rate from a DM is highly affected by the kind of pressure and formation being played by the defense.

You really want to see Bertrand play over Ashley? Are you mad? I can understand playing Bertrand and Romeu over Ashley and Mikel for squad rotation purposes against weaker opposition but seriously... that's crazy.

I suggest you take a look back at Mikel's cameo against Utd this season before you judge Romeu for a brief introduction - its never easy to come off the bench.

Comparing Utd to Blackburn... Kean > Fergie? Heh. Seriously thats a pretty funny post.

[robdog 2,084]

You really want to see Bertrand play over Ashley? Are you mad? I can understand playing Bertrand and Romeu over Ashley and Mikel for squad rotation purposes against weaker opposition but seriously... that's crazy.

LMAO. Hell I even seen some people post they would rather have Josh start over Supa Frank Some of the things our own fans say

[blue out west 27]

LMAO. Hell I even seen some people post they would rather have Josh start over Supa Frank Some of the things our own fans say

Too true, and look at what the youngsters have done for Arsenal. I'm happy we have smart managers who make selections based on the real world and not back pages. Back on topic I've been waiting for years to see Mikel's passing and other attacking traits utilized. He's so strong you naturally want to see that strength deployed in the best part of the pitch but AVB has found a good system to make use of both his athleticism and technique.

[robdog 2,084]

Too true, and look at what the youngsters have done for Arsenal. I'm happy we have smart managers who make selections based on the real world and not back pages. Back on topic I've been waiting for years to see Mikel's passing and other attacking traits utilized. He's so strong you naturally want to see that strength deployed in the best part of the pitch but AVB has found a good system to make use of both his athleticism and technique.

I don't if you read this article from The Chels a few of months back, but it talks about the some same topics you hit on. I like this vid to showcase some of Obi Wan Mikel's talents. Talents that we are so used in seeing, we think it's easy:

[The Big Drog 1,110]

I don't want to sound like Im making Mikel some kind of devil figure, he isn't. He has a good attitude, he does his best and he has made improvements in his game the last few years, however all of the tribute videos in the world wont change what we already know. We see Mikel play week in, week out, we know what kind of player he is and we know what standard of player he is. He is a decent squad option, handy if we ever have an injury crisis in midfield but he should not be the first choice holding midfield player for the reasons I've previously outlined in the thread and no amount of tribute videos will convince me otherwise.

[robdog 2,084]

I don't want to sound like Im making Mikel some kind of devil figure, he isn't. He has a good attitude, he does his best and he has made improvements in his game the last few years, however all of the tribute videos in the world wont change what we already know. We see Mikel play week in, week out, we know what kind of player he is and we know what standard of player he is. He is a decent squad option, handy if we ever have an injury crisis in midfield but he should not be the first choice holding midfield player for the reasons I've previously outlined in the thread and no amount of tribute videos will convince me otherwise.

That's kewl. You can keep your opinion & I can keep mine. The video that I posted was some proof that the many articles that are on the net that shows what type of player Obi Wan is. I guess that is why we call this a discussion board & we can discuss this right??? We are discussing & IMHO Romeu has not surpassed Obi Wan now. Maybe in a year or two, but not at this moment in time.

[The Big Drog 1,110]

Im not saying Romeu has, I am saying that Im amazed that a club our size has relied on Mikel as the main holding midfielder for such a long time and it is one of the great examples of the problems our club has encountered with the constant changes in management that no manager has had long enough to put their mark on the team long enough to buy a better holding midfielder than Mikel. That or they all have a hell of a lot more faith in Michael Essien's knees than they should.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

I don't think he's not at all ready for the PL but I wouldn't say he would be a top DM in the PL on the back of 2 good CC outings (where he had almost zero pressure) and 1 good home game vs Genk who is even weaker than the CC squads used by Everton and Fulham.

As for those stats Romeu has a really small sample size against poor opposition in some of the least consequential games that we've been involved in. In those those games he hasn't really been under consistent pressure at any time, whereas Mikel was the motor that kept us in control vs QPR with 9 men. On the subject of forward passes you should look at the chalkboards and also remember how those games were. Forward passing success rate from a DM is highly affected by the kind of pressure and formation being played by the defense.

You really want to see Bertrand play over Ashley? Are you mad? I can understand playing Bertrand and Romeu over Ashley and Mikel for squad rotation purposes against weaker opposition but seriously... that's crazy.

That exactly was my point. Of course I don't want to see Romeu and Bertrand start at the Emirates or Old Traford, but maybe at home against Swansea or Wigan or Aston Villa so they can get some well-deserved PL experience.

Again, I'm not saying that Romeu is better than Mikel, he has no where near as much experience as him. I just think that with the performances he's put in, it is worth a risk to start him in a few PL matches instead of Mikel.

Same goes for Rayan Bertrand imo as well.

Concerning how good (or not good) Romeu is, I guess it's a matter of opinion, every one is entitled to his own.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Im not saying Romeu has, I am saying that Im amazed that a club our size has relied on Mikel as the main holding midfielder for such a long time and it is one of the great examples of the problems our club has encountered with the constant changes in management that no manager has had long enough to put their mark on the team long enough to buy a better holding midfielder than Mikel. That or they all have a hell of a lot more faith in Michael Essien's knees than they should.

Well done. :goodpost:

[GodZola 630]

Comparing Utd to Blackburn... Kean > Fergie? Heh. Seriously thats a pretty funny post.

If you had half a brain cell then you would of understood my post, if you weren't such a comedian then I would explain! If Mikel is as good as you make him out to be then would he not perform against the likes of Man Utd too, no?

[blue out west 27]

If you had half a brain cell then you would of understood my post, if you weren't such a comedian then I would explain! If Mikel is as good as you make him out to be then would he not perform against the likes of Man Utd too, no?

Mikel is selected in most big fixtures soooo