Barbara

Why, Chelsea, why? I don't get some of the business we do. Welcome to the boy but we don't need him at all and imo he adds nothing that we already don't have in our youth... moving on...

I think it's fair to pay homages to Mata, but I don't expect anything against Mourinho. We went from being reliant on Mata to being competitive without him. There's nothing to complain about maybe except him going to ManUtd, but not sure how much of a saying he has on it. He did say few weeks back Mata wss free to leave if he wanted... Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Note 4G using Tapatalk

I do hope we're going for Diego Costa instead. We have a few youngsters to play AM and they're coming of age in the teams they've been loaned to. We don't need Salah at all. Shaw can wait and it makes no sense to just save that money or waste it in second level players.

based on what? A player didn't show in the pitch what his manager wanted or needed from him. He's got benched, then another club came and signed him. What's there to have a bad reputation? Do you have any idea how many times that has happened in the world of football? At RM, Barça and other huge forces that still have players offering themselves to play there?

didn't realize they were so close to Liverpool. Well, I still believe Mata won't fix ManUtd - which was my primary point. It requires magic to do as such. He'll improve them, but they're still awful. And let's not forget the clueless guy bossing them. I'm not even sure Moyes knows how to maximize a player like Mata or simply use him at all.

and we're supposed to believe Mata will fix that team and get them a top4 spot? I know we call him a magician all the time, but I thought that was a figure of language. #InMoyesWeTrust

not to nitpick and all, but go see which of the two was playing when we lost and draw most matches this season... or when we conceded the most... or when we allowed the most shots against Cech. Nobody here - as far as I know - has ever said Oscar creates more chances than Mata, but that he works better in the team and in the system, which he does, he has the numbers to show as much. Also I don't blame Mourinho if Mata didn't fit. Were we supposed to keep giving him chances if we kept offering our midfield to opposition? The problem was never how much he offered or not in the attack (although he didn't much in those many matches he's played), but how much he's compromised our midfield and how he didn't recover possession sufficiently (especially in the attacking third) enough. Of course he won't play if he doesn't contribute to the team and I think it's his right to ask to leave because he wants to play more. As for this being a good move for Mourinho and Mata. I disagree on both to some extents. For Mourinho this represents nothing. He doesn't care (and recently got a lot of backup from media and more fans agreeing he shouldn't play Mata) nor does it affect his team or work. As for Mata I consider a clear step down on his career. ManUtd need a few more players to be back at the level of competitiveness they were. He's going to a weakened side, that is currently a mess, with a clueless manager, and probably won't play Europe. It's a bad career move imo, but I'm not sure how much of a voice he's had about where to go. On the other hand, maybe he's focusing only on having minutes. He'll get that just fine.

I'm for real, K. Some people are really sad, I'm positive some will or did drop a few tears, I wasn't being ironic at the first part, just at the service, which was a joke.

but weren't people saying he deserved to go somewhere else? I get whoever is pissed at him going to United I'm sort of pissed too (I'm just not completely pissed because I'm positive Moyes doesn't know how to use a player like him any better than a neanderthal knows how to use an iPad)... but then it's because of wherever he's going. Where are all the people saying he should go somewhere because he doesn't deserve the bench? It seems it merged into one big group pissed he was sold - regardless of where - with a few exceptions of people being mad because it was sold to United...

can this thread be indefinitely closed once it's moved to the ex-blues board? It's going to be a a field day Let's have a service #MataWidows

= Diego Costa release clause. Problem solved.

so does it mean Oscar and Hazard are next? Then I'll collapse.

I'm sure he already is more useful because he's more versatile and more tactical. He's also more complete. Mata is a hell of a footballer, so I wouldn't be as bold as saying Oscar is already better (even if they're different), but I can see why some may think so. Different profiles, both top class, but I think Oscar has a very high ceiling, so it's sort of only a matter of time before him being better (or at least considered as such by more people).

that I was allowing my nationality to tint my glasses, which I don't, hopefully. I've criticized our players plenty of times, so in that case, I apologize for misunderstanding you. I don't blindly defend our Brazilian players, I hope I'm unbiased enough to address their limitations and weaknesses. Especially if they're NT players. For the first time in many years I'm supporting Brazil in a World Cup, so I'm going to be the one to criticize brazilian players the most simply because I want them to be at the top of their game when the WC is here. Normally I'm much more patient with our players (Chelsea players, not Brazil players) especially if they're young like Oscar, Schurrle, Hazard. I criticize just fine, but I'm a firm believing of giving players free passes in some matches where they just had a bad in the office and give them time to mature. It's not in my nature to badmouth players exhaustively unless they come from a streak of many bad matches and lack of form.

he's 22!!!!! I haven't even heard much of Mata when he was 22. Of course he won't be as consistent as a 25yo guy. But that 22 yo is a key player in Brazil NT something that Mata was never capable of being in Spain, even if he's 25. Yeah, we don't have as much talent in the position as Spain has, but do you think, regardless of how bad the other options are, it's easy to step into Brazil's #10 position? You guys have no idea what Brazil NT is for Brazilians in general. The boy showed a lot of character doing it at age 21 and OWNING our midfield, even if he didn't do it offensively. He didn't need to do that when Neymar and Hulk were down on the flanks running the show (not much Hulk ofc). But he's dictated our tempo, controlled the midfield and killed oppositions. That's no easy feat. I'll agree with anyone who says he's inconsistent ( I just liked a couple of posts saying as much), but how much do we expect from a 22yo that got transferred to European football only 18 months ago? Let's not allow our expectations to be higher than they should. He'll never be as creative as Mata, I'm positive of that, but he might end up being a better football player...

I'm not questioning you as a chelsea fan, I just wouldn't expect a chelsea fan who knows oscar to call him a diver because he clearly isn't one. That's innacurate and therefore unnecessary. if you think so, that's your problem, never said you were a bad chelsea fan or wasn't one to start with, just that other teams' fans out of spite or for not knowing our players as well as we do would call him that, but not a Chelsea fan. if you believe he's such a bad passer, has such horrible vision and is selfish, go complain with one of the best managers in the world, who has chosen him as his #1 guy in the midfield (I feel Eden is the #1 guy in the team, and more in an attacking way). Also go discuss with the coach to Brazilian NT who's put him in the same position and saw his untrusted team beat the world champions, not only beat, smash them. While you are on that, also go see how many matches we've won with Oscar in the team this season and how we were when he was absent or clearly still recovering from injury last month. You may also want to take a look at numbers such as shots allowed by the opposition and clean sheets. As for being a Brazilian, very proud of it, thank you very much. Come back to me when you have as many WC titles, as many sensational football players from your nation throughout the years and have teams fighting for them. If people are going to insist to use my nationality against me, I might as well be as cocky as fuck about it.

I think (at least in the matches I've watched) Ramsey had a much bigger impact on Arsenal than Ozil did. Ozil had a lot of quiet matches and now that Ramsey is out injured other guys such as Wilshere (or Carzola like last match) are winning them matches. About ManUtd you're right, they're such a mess that building a team around Mata wouldn't be the problem, thing is most of those players have been there for years and with the exact players they have now Rooney is more likely to play centered rather than Mata. So unless Rooney is coming for us (don't think he is), I don't see Moyes being stupid enough to change the one guy that has been carrying his team and move elsewhere. They have Robin, so unless he's injured - and he does stay injured a lot - and Rooney steps into his role and plays as their main striker, Mata is very likely to play in the wing or at least taking turns with Rooney in the middle. If he can't succeed in the wing here - as all of you say he can't - then why would he succeed in a much worse side such as ManUtd? I do agree about trends being short-lived, which is why I think two years down the road there will be a new emerging trend. That's very fast, but my point stands and you may want to answer it: would he play in any of those top 5 times I've mentioned? Does he fit their style or would those teams afford to move whoever plays as a #10 or as a CAM or as a false 9 to accommodate Mata in the team? My answer remains being 'no'. As for how big Mata is, we simply disagree. In our CL title he's had a corner for Drogba goal and a couple of really good matches, but that was it, all his other matches were good, some of which he completely disappeared. Many people don't agree he should have been the POTY, instead it should have been Cech or Drogba (I don't have an opinion in that season because I don't even care much about it, a team isn't about one player, so I couldn't care less who we pick as our POTY. Last season I would have given to Eden simply because he's left my mouth on the floor when he's started playing for us and also at the end of the season). At the end of the day we disagree about our evaluation of Mata. While I think he's a great player, I don't think he's as good as some Chelsea fans believe. He'll have a chance to prove me otherwise, although as you said it yourself, Utd is a really average side right now, a quality player such as Mata should step in and improve them (as I believe he will). I just don't think he's the answer to their many problems. We can settle for disagreeing

and I'm not sure if you have sight problems. One isolated episode where he's expected the contact and therefore jumped before it happened (more like a trick to win a penalty - which makes it just as bad as a dive - but not exactly a dive) and the absurdity of calling such a team player as Oscar as selfish. Unnecessary (and inaccurate) contribution, especially coming from a Chelsea fan... Anyway, I came here to post this: http://eplindex.com/48278/willian-manchester-united.html Also take a look at Eden and Oscar's numbers (especially regaining the ball in the attack) and see why Mourinho has found this three AMs. Amazing numbers by all three, especially considering Hazard and mainly Oscar didn't have that much of a great match and still have good numbers. But Willian was just immense.

Did I miss something or currently are journalists that announce transfers instead of the clubs? How many times in the summer we've read players had a done deal with clubs and they've never got transferred? Slow down people, it may be confirmed by the clubs in 5 minutes from now or in 5 days... the same way it may never happen just because a guy said it was a done deal...

you may have a point, I just don't see Mata stepping into ManUtd that easily and being the player that can give as many assists and score as many goals - especially as much as last season's - when there isn't a system built around him. No top5 team in the world currently would build their teams around Mata because he isn't that pivotal or deciding enough and if they don't have enough dividends why invest doing him that guy? The only way imo for Mata to have last season's stats is by having plenty of freedom (as he did) and such freedom means building the team around him. And you're right, all my posts about him I come from a place where I assume he isn't suited for United, the same way I don't think he's suited for those 5 best teams in the world because I think the latest 'trend' in modern football doesn't particularly highlight his attributes. Meaning he could be THE GUY in second tier teams - such as an emerging Atletico or an Italian 'giant' (if we could even call any team in Italy big these days, in terms of competitiveness), but he can't be the main star in teams such as Chelsea, Bayern, Barça, Real Madrid, Dortmund, ManUtd. Second strengths such as City, Arsenal, PSG and Juve wouldn't build teams around Juan Mata either. Not even Liverpool would. That's for sides like Napoli, Inter, Atletico, Monaco, Milan - if not lesser teams, simply because Mata doesn't give back enough for teams bigger than this to change a whole system and afford the exposure he brings mainly because he's way too slow, likes to play with the ball on his feet instead of receiving it on the run. I think Mata's career would be much easier and he'd have much more success if he was about 5 years older. He would have enjoyed a period in modern football where clubs were building their teams around #10s. Nobody does that these days. Even Messi that's started as a #10 evolved into something else... When was the last time a #10 was a Balon d'Or finalist? The guy that played out of their mind and was undoubtedly one of the best in the world? I remember Wesley Sneijder 4 years ago. #10 are by definition slower players who are very creative and the rub where most all balls in the attack go through. They distribute balls like no others. Thing is high pressing isn't something Mourinho came up with. It's part of modern football these days. Football is much more based on speed, directness than it was a few years ago and in getting the ball back in the attack in a way to quickly shoot on goal instead of building from behind, slowly and calmly. That's the latest trend that teams like RM, Bayern and Dortmund brought. It was the answer to Barça's tiki taka the same way something else will be the answer to high pressing a couple of years down the road.

but most of those players are way better suited for ManUtd than Mata is. If they decide for Mata over them, then good for us twice, not only we'll get a lot of money for him, but ManUtd won't even improve as they could going for really fast players, that play their best in the wing - where ManUtd have been building their system for many years now. Mata is technically better than those guys imo, but way less fitting to ManUtd system, so if selling Mata to them will prevent them from getting Reus, Draxler or di María, it'd only give me more reasons to ship Mata there. And that's coming from someone that isn't that comfortable selling them any players...

It's a blessing and a curse But hey, take a look at my latest posts, there are a lot of them with at most 3 paragraphs. Gimme some credit. Also I'm a writer, I write articles and books, so yeah... getting carried away is way too easy.

this thread has been hilarious in the last 20+ pages I just caught up with. It's funny to call our board, our club, our manager all kind of names based on a rumor or something that is likely to be only us paying back for the Rooney summer gate. Right now it's a bunch of knee-jerk reactions that shows how some fans are so willing to say shit about this club and the people working on it so quick for so little. Can't even wait until all those things actually happen? Let's see if he will indeed leave, if he will indeed go to ManUtd and if Rooney won't indeed come before we call our club, manager and board all names in the book. It's one thing to say we'd be really stupid to let him go to ManUtd, another is to say 'Fuck Chelsea' as I read... Then there are the funny parts. Go back to this thread a hundred pages back (probably more) and see people saying how having 6, even 5 AMs was going to destroy our locker room (which has not happened as so many here predicted, Kevin left in a very peaceful way) or how it's impossible to manage even 5 players for 3 spots and have them happy and make it work. Now people are crying that having 4 AMs + Rami and Lamps who can also play in the position (in addition to Moses coming next season), isn't enough so that's why we shouldn't sell Mata. I mean, if 5 AM for 3 spots is too much and 4 is too little, the ideal is 4½? I'm confused My instance on this is, I wish Mata was given more time to see if he can adapt. For me the only way for him to still play for us is adapting to the system and while I don't think he has the tools to do it, I can't say for sure he can't, so I'd be willing to wait and see. I don't care about his career at all (or any other player's), so I don't mind seeing a player like him in our bench and if he's useful for us, I'd rather keep him even if we only use him sporadically. Once proved he's useless to the system, then I think goodbye is appropriate, and I'd wish we'd get as much money as possible for him. I'm just not sure we've given him enough time (not exactly minutes, but time on training) to adapt to what Mourinho needs on the system. But in the case the board sees fit for him to leave, my best wishes. While I don't particularly think it's great business to sell him to ManUtd I really disagree about people saying he's going to solve all their problems, that he's what they need, or that Mata will make them competitive for the top 4 again. I think it's delusional to think as such. They need much more, starting with the person who sits in their dugout. Mata isn't even the kind of player they need imo, if I were Moyes I would have some other priorities now. They have good prospects for the position in their current squad. There's some lack of ability to manage their prospects that created their AM problem, not the lack of players. How does Mata fit perfectly a 4-4-2? Isn't Adan the answer to all their problems? Don't they already have a #10 in Kagawa that they don't know how to use? I can see the struggles continuing for both Mata and ManUtd as he goes there. It wouldn't be a walk in the park for either. I can see a lot of similarities between ManUtd/Mata deal and Chelsea/Willian deal. Not what they really need, something that could work, could improve them, but not the key to their success. Can we even say ManUtd have a system these days? If they do, I don't think Mata is the answer, although he'll improve them some. It's flabbergasting to think a player of his caliber wouldn't improve a side, of course he does, but I don't think said improvement will do much for them as they'll still look very frail in other zones and they'll overload a zone they have enough players (doesn't it sound really familiar to you?). Is Chelsea better now because of Willian or because of a new working system from a top class manager? And even the comparison must be done cautiously because I think we had much less weaknesses and deficiencies in our squad when Mourinho arrived than ManUtd have now. We've had top class players in: Cech, Luiz, Eden, Oscar, Mata (even if Luiz and Mata couldn't keep their level from previous seasons). Working hard players such as Ramires and Azpilicueta. Solid players such as Terry and Ivanovic. Useful players such as Lampard and Mikel. We had striker issues and pivot issues and we could use some reinforcement in our back 4, but we basically had only two detracting issues: pivot and striker. Look at ManU's squad. They have issues - and not only welcoming reinforcements - in basically all positions. Their best players are too injury prone, and the reason why both aren't playing currently. Their defense is aged and the players are facing their best days in the rear mirror. Mata will improve them, for sure, but won't be the answer to their problems, just like Willian wasn't to ours, although improving us. Kevin or Schurrle would have filled his shoes in different circumstances just fine, maybe not as good, but not to the point where we wouldn't be where we are now because we didn't have Willian. I agreed with a lot of things here, but it's really funny how discussions go a 180 in only a matter of months. It's hilarious to read now that 4 AM players for 3 spots is too thin when so many people were yelling their lungs off when Willian was signed saying 5 was already challenging to manage. The most common post back in those days were that 4 AMs + Moses coming back or at our beck and call was more than enough. Hindsight is a blessing.

never lost a match

He's said to ESPN Brasil that he's still finding this feet and that he was a bit lost when he first arrived. He told them that he was struggling and that it took him a little while to get where he is, that things were a bit hard for him at first. This guy will be immense for us and his quality really is unbelievable, but let's not forget the adaptation ain't easy for him. He's confessed he felt it a lot at the start and it's only now 'getting' it. It's almost like he was completely lost at first and only now he knows what he's doing, but still has a long way to actually make it.