Hkibou

Most fouled player in Ligue 1 for two years in a row before joining Chelsea. His last season in Ligue 1 (2011-2012), he was the most fouled player in Europe, Messi being 2nd.

If I have to put up with such mean - and let's call it what it is - idiotic commenting about the players, just because of "the mood following a result", even a frustrating one... Then I feel totally in my right to express my mood and my frustration, as a fan of a club with 21 points in his homegrown league, reading such comments from what I genuinely see as spoiled children. No one bothered to mention that it was Costa's first boxing day experience, first time he'd play two games in 48h... His adaptation time to the BPL was non-existent, which already is to me a miracle by itself, the team couln't have hoped better from Costa. But still, some show no indulgence to him when not scoring in such new, and extreme conditions ! You would think 2 years of Torres would have brought back some people down to earth, them and their messie-esque expectations for every single talented player (no matter his style of play - cf Hazard).

It's not about criticizing or not criticizing, it's about the way some people criticize. Saying so categorical things with so exaggerated and mean words, like "abysmal", "useless", "shitty". I swear sometimes reading this forum you would think you are speaking with Leicesters supporter. Damn. Chelsea is first in BPL, on its way for a 92 points season, I don't think there is any place for useless or shitty players in such a team. But yet, some people on this forum find nearly as many reasons to complain about the team than reasons to praise it. It's unbelievable in my opinion, and sooooo disrespectful of fans of smaller teams who would die to have the shitty players some people shit on day after day. Yes, even Schurrle and Obi Mikel who sound like, if we listen to what's being said on this forum, the shittiest footballer you can find in the whole world. That's what I call acting like spoiled brat. As for Costa particularly, actually I don't care if he has scored 13 or not, that's what I was saying. I kind of despise the people reacting epidermically to every one of his games, the only criteria for analysis seemingly being whether he has scored or not. It doesn't show much football intelligence for those people, in my opinion. It's no coincidence I used in my last post twice the word "absolutely". Because some people say he is "absolutely abysmall at hold-up play" for example. Well that's completely crazy... "Absolutely" means impervious to time... But those same people who say he is "absolutely" abysmall will say a few weeks later, if he scores a hattrick, that Costa is a top striker. It's ludicrous.

You guys are unbelievable. If he scores, then he's one of top 5 strikers in the world, absolute gem etc etc. Two days later, if he doesn't score, then he's back on being absolutely useless and shitty. Sometimes you really act like spoiled brats on this forum, it's quite annoying.

Costa :(

Lol Costa giving the ball to Willian for a shot, what did he expect ?? ^^

Ivanovic is awful today

Yep, he was good to go. Really good collective performance, but Costa and Hazard were particularly in form I thought.

I'm surprised you even know his name, that's how underrated he is ! Great to see that some people know him How do you know him ? You watch Lille's games ?

I've been following Chelsea since 1999/2000, but I must admit not as a "fan" per say until recently, more as a guy who loves football in general. I like the 4-4-2 formation with a dense but very technical midfield, and depth on the wing provided by the fullbacks. _______________Cech_______________ _Iva_____Desailly_____Terry______Cole_ ______________Makelele_____________ ________Essien________Lampard______ ______________Hazard______________ __________Drogba___Zola____________ Bench : Courtois, Azpi, Carvalho, Ballack, Joe Cole, Fabregas (or Juan Mata), Costa

I'd like to see this team. _____________________Courtois_____________________ _Ivanovic________Cahill_________Terry___________Luis_ ______________Fabregas_____Matic__________________ __Rémy_______________Oscar______________Hazard__ ______________________Costa______________________ Luis instead of Azpi to have more depth. Rémy (or Schurrle) instead of Wilian to gain in verticality, and better support for Costa for counter attacks.

I don't get why, Pogba and Matic are two completely different players. Pogba is light-years away from Matic's defensive awareness and positioning. But the french is way better at dribbling and finishing than the serbian. In Mourinho's current system, I think Pogba would do good if he had the role of Fabregas or Oscar. Not Matic. I think one of the best buy Chelsea could do next summer to have a proper substitution for Matic is Lille's current best player : Idrissa Gana Gueye. He has all the same qualities as Matic and same style of play. He's not at Matic's level yet of course, but could be if he went to a club like Chelsea to further his development. Unlike Pogba, he would have no problem being a substitute at first, he's very professionnal, and humble. And it's a bargain, being at Lille he is waaaaayy underrated at the moment, you could have him for less than 10 million pounds, and trust me, he would be worth every penny. I reckon in a few years he will be worth 30m.

Unfortunately this is not how cloning works. Having the exact same genetics doesn't mean becoming the same person. We see this with twins who can become very different persons over the years, because some genes "activate" or not in reaction to a specific social environment. To clone Matic or Mourinho in order to have exact same player/manager, it would be extremely difficult because it would mean having to monitor the environment of the clones during their whole lives so that it is the exact same environment in which the original Matic and Mourinho grew up. It's very possible that a cloned Matic wouldn't be interested in football at all for example.

As for Belgian wonderkids, you can add to your list the two youngest of the 3 Ivanov brothers, great prospects from Genk who were transfered to the LOSC formation center last summer. Tyron Ivanov (1997) is in the U19 LOSC team, plays in midfield/attacking midfield Douglas Ivanov (2002) is in the U14 team, also midfield. He seems to be the most technically gifted.

Origi clearly has a very high ceiling. Physically, he's impressive for someone this young. His pace is phenomenal, with good decision making he would be lethal in counter attacks. He's tall, which means he can be strong and good in the air. But it's not the case, he is still shaky in the duels he has to work on this. He is also admirably gifted technically. Good dribbling skills, ball control, power shots, and really good crosses. But he's very poor tactically. It's very frustrating to see him play for the moment, because he's wasting all the talent he has by very, very poor decision making. Generally due to selfishness and tactical unawareness. Kind of like Balotelli ^^ He's very young so he can work on that, and if he does with success he's gonna have it all to become world class.

Hazard did play all the games with Lille and he seemed fine with it. But Rudi Garcia subbed him quite often around the 80th minute when the lead was confortable and the match practically won. Also, he didn't have as exhausting defensive duties as he has with Chelsea. By the way he has improved in that aspect in a way I would never think possible before, he's less reluctant to put the foot in and steal more and more balls from the opponent's feet. That's very good, but it has to have an impact on his offensive play, especially at the end of the match when he's more tired. I also hope Mourinho either rotates him more (Schurrle, Rémy, Salah can also do the job) either frees him of some of his current defensive duties. He has not the stamina and i doubt he will, to do what Mourinho asks of him, 90 minutes week in week out, without any drops throughout the whole season.

Imo it would be completely useless to loan him to Vitesse, which is equivalent to Rijeka's level in terms of club and league they play in. In fact the Dutch league may be the less relevant league to send young but already confirmed strikers such as Kramaric. It's a league where it's sensible to send young strikers who haven't known anything else than youth teams yet, so that they can work on their technique and boost their confidence (and market value). But Kramaric would put 30 goals in that league, so what ? What would he have learnt with such weak defenses and tactical mayhem that is the dutch league ? If Mou wants him to work on his strentgh, stamina, and tactical abilities he has to go BPL mid-table or Ligue 1 or Serie A. Only in the last three seasons you had John Guidetti (23), Alfred Finnbogason (29), Luuk De Jong (25), Jozy Altidore (23), Wilfried Bony (31), Grazziano Pelle (27), Bas Dost (32), Sanharib Malki (25) which makes a total of eight different players having reached 23 goals in the league. Guidetti is nowhere to be found, Finnbogason (53 goals his last two seasons) still hasn't put one in the net with the Real Sociedad and is now on the bench. De Jong failed so much in Gladbach that he came back to netherlands. Sunderland's competition is too much for Altidore, and Bas Dost have miserably failed in Wolfsburg and is now a bench warmer - behind Bendtner in the hierarchy, it says everything !! And Malki is a complete nobody whom I just learnt the existence by checking if I hadn't forgotten anybody, looking at his carreer it seems he has discovered how to score goals at the age of 29. Now struggling in some turkish club (6 goals in 34 matches). So out of the 8 only Bony and Pelle made the cut in a stronger league after reveling in netherlands. But only Bony really, because Pelle is older and had tactical awareness thanks to his time in serie A... Not to mention it's way easier to confirm at Swansea and Southampton than Chelsea. So unless Kramaric scores 50 goals next year with Vitesse, his statistics will really give no clue if he can make it or not at Chelsea. It will mean much more if he scores "only" 20 in a Ligue 1 club, for instance. And many Ligue 1 clubs better than Vitesse would be happy to have Kramaric for a year, trust me.

Drogba did not come to Marseille as a first choice, he had competition like in any bigger club. He simply put goals and became first choice. So many goals that he only stayed one year was bought by Chelsea. If Chelsea got Kramaric this winter for cheap, loan him to Marseille 1 year (or equivalent club), and Kramaric blossoms during his loan so that he comes back as a confirmed striker on the verge of becoming world-class, it would virtually be the exact same situation as what happened with Drogba. Only difference is, Roman would spend only a few millions on Kramaric, instead of the 30 he put for Drogba.

Not like it was under the last six months with Rudi Garcia and the LOSC though. Having seen him being outstanding in that role for six months makes me see how underused/ill-used he is if indeed Mourinho's main objective is to build the team around Hazard and make him shine. So let me rephrase the question then, do you think the current 4-2-3-1 is the best way to make Hazard shine ?

Hello, I was thinking about Hazard's recent form. Paradoxically, while he doesn't score or assist that much, he has found some consistency being close to his best level every game and throughout the 90 minutes, whichever the opposite side or competition. We'll see how he performs during the entire season but it very likely means he has recently taken a huge step further in his evolution. If indeed Hazard has gained consistency and delivers worldclass performances week in week out like Messi and Ronaldo, would'nt it be the wisest thing to do for Mourinho to build his team around the best n°10 in the world, as well as he built Madrid's style of play around the best winger of the world ? Guardiola surely would agree as well. Of course, Hazard having a very different set of skills than Ronaldo, and Messi to a less extent, but more importantly a very different mentality than both of them, it would result in a very different team than Guardiola's Barca or Mou's Madrid. But it could very well turn out in another type of match winning machine able to dominate European football very soon. In fact I think the best examples of how a team could be built around an Hazard-type player are Ajax/Pays-Bas with Cruyff and Juventus/France with Platini. Belgium manager Marc Wilmots has declared from the very beginning that he wants to build the team around Hazard as a n°10, without outstandingly good results so far but Hazard has just found his consistency and Wilmots is tactically a worm compared to Mourinho. So, what do you think ? What should be Chelsea's evolution next few years : built around Hazard, a Barça like team ; or all collective and balanced like the Bayern ? For me if Mourinho decides to build the team around Hazard like Barca for Messi or Ajax for Cruyff, he should try this system : __________________________Courtois (Cech)__________________________ Ivanovic/Azpi____________Cahill (Azpi)_____Terry (Zouma)____________Luis (Ake) ______________________________Matic (Mikel)_____________________________ _________________Fabregas (Ramires)______Oscar (Wilian)__________________ ______________________________Hazard (Wilian)___________________________ ______________________Costa (Drogba)__Rémy (Schurrle)____________________ I really think it's what's best suited if the priority in to give Hazard the keys of the team and the perfect environnement to thrive. It may be also the fastest way to turn the team into a match winning machine, even in CL ? Of course in this system it's all a question of balance. The defense is very solid thanks to the quartet Courtois - Cahill - Terry - Matic who focus entirely on keeping the team solid and compact at all time. Without forgetting the full backs and two central midfields whe get their share of defensive tasks as well. But for the fullbacks, it means less defensive work as in the current 4-2-3-1. They would have to act as "old" wingers, eating their lines to stretch the other team, and be the main offensive forces on the flanks. That's why I think Aké would be a better replacement than Azpi on the left, and why I think Iva and Azpi would be on par on the right flanks, because of Iva's tendency to be attracted towards the centre. And a majestic trio in the midfield : Cesc, Oscar, Hazard who would roam between the lines, never really far from each other, and construct all the actions and dictate the game, with Hazard as the main chief of orchestra. It would mean practically freeing him of his defensive duties contrary to Oscar and Fabregas. Up front, the duet of strikers would be compatible and clinically effective. The strengh of Costa/Drogba, the speed of Rémy/Schurrle, all four having more than decent finishing skills. Wilian and Azpilicueta would be the main victims of this hypothetical new system. They would still get lots of playing time though, as first replacement to two positions each.

Debate around Hazard : http://forum.talkchelsea.net/topic/19282-debate-building-the-team-around-eh10-if-yes-how/

Have you ever heard of argumentation ? It roughly means providing logical reasoning and material evidences to support your claim/opinion. You should try it, it's very useful to communicate with people, so that they can see what you mean, maybe even agree with you. Because even if someone's agree with any opinion without hearing any arguments before, then he's a fool who rely on other's fragile and so faillible opinions to build an even more fragile and faillible one. Logical conclusion, if you never give proper arguments to your statements, you will soon be surrounded by fools, they're the only one who will be willing to speak with you. Then again, if you are a fool yourself, where is the problem right ? Problem is, if, being a fool, you are surrounded by fools, your situation has no chance to get better. But if you at least try to follow the footsteps of the scientific method, maybe then you will catch the attention of less stupid people, and use them to climb the ladder, step by step. But for this you have to try. Also don't get yourself trapped in the delusion that merely saying "he's 24 in january" is a proper argument. That's the thing with arguments, and their complexity : when you get down that road you have to be coherent with yourself up until the end. So when you are thinking of an argument to support your claims, what you are doing (or should do) simultaneously is considering all the counter-arguments that can weaken the first argument. And if there are too many of them, it means the first is too weak to be considered a proper argument, because it ultimately means nothing. It doesn't mean you should give up your opinion entirely (maybe it does), but that you have to search for stronger arguments that actually mean something. In this case for example, it takes only 10 seconds of reflexion to think of dozens of counter-arguments to the one that claims that football players are doomed to stagnate past their 24. So come back again when you actually have facts and reasons with you to support your claims please, until then your words will mean as much as emptiness.

You don't get to say what's appropriate or not, you are definitely not the center of the world (it can't be because it's already me), so you don't get to say what people should or should not want to read on the forum they like. Gifs you seem to hate for example can be very funny, which is at least one usefullness, more than I can say about the posts i've read from you (but to be fair i've read two... didn't make me want to read more).

I agree too, but I feel it is not only based on sheer intuition but one would have reliable empirical basis for this theory. For those who follow Hazard since before Chelsea and I reckon Stingray is one of them, they can remember that his last year in Lille, for the 2011/12 season, he was replaced by Rudi Garcia as the n°10 of a 4-2-3-1 due to the disappointment of Gervinho's replacement Dimitri Payet and the loss of Cabaye our main playmaker who hadn't been replaced at all. It was revolutionnary for Garcia who had always used the 4-3-3 formation with Cabaye as n°8/playmaker and Hazard and Gervinho as the two wingers, with a preference for Hazard occupying the left wing, but permuting a lot during the game. His last season with Lille, around november of 2011, Rudia Garcia decided to switch to 4-2-3-1 and then really gave the keys of the game to Hazard who was the n°10. That's when Hazard's talent was the brightest in his career, ending the season with 20 goals 16 assists, 85% of them after the tacticals changes of Garcia. It seems to me also, but belgians will be more able to confirm or infirm, that Hazard really struggled with the red devils under Leekens who played him "just" as another winger of the team, and it's been really better under Wilmots who decided to use Hazard as a playmaker and build the team around him, better both individually for Eden and collectively for the team.

That is the most important thing, his mentality. I mean, the kid has it all already, physically, technically, tactically. His mind just has to be set on the right mode at the particular moment of the game, and throughout its 90 minutes. Him putting goals or not is really not the question as there are plenty other ways to weigh on a game, and when he's set on the right mode he will weigh on the game, and highly increase probabilities to win no matter he's scoring or not. And that's what's happening. You think Chelsea keeping on winning and Costa keeping on scoring is due to who ? Eden's last few months average game : He's gonna be constantly marked by two opponents, often requiring the attention of one other, creating space for his partners. He's gonna provoke 6 corner kicks, be fouled 10 times most of them in dangerous areas... Hell maybe a penalty created out of anywhere also. He's gonna succeed 10 times a dribble, creating space and confusion among the opponents' defense. He's gonna endorse alternatively the roles of a winger and a playmaker, both with success, making him one of the most influential tempo maker of the team. He's gonna use his masterous skills at link-up play or conservation of the ball in order to keep the ball in dangerous areas and create actions when Chelsea is laying siege while the opponents are parking the bus ('cause they can't get the ball of the f** feet of that damn belgian). He's gonna succeed 3 key passes. He's gonna track back a lot and help building Chelsea's game from very low in the pitch. And most important, Chelsea is gonna win. So yeah let's blame the guy for not being decisive enough !