robsblubot

The players who want him gone now have a proper timeline... just do whatever you are not doing for another 2 matches. Don't get me wrong, I don't understand why a fucking nobody like Potter got the job in the first place, but it's clear as day for me that the players don't want to play for him.

yeah that (my rosy prediction) one did not age well. 😅 There is indeed no comparison there with Conte.

We won't lose this. Win or tie. Despite our issues, and they have their own, we still have WAY more quality in every freaking position bar #9. Yes, Kane is dangerous and can score out of very little, but they are not a quality team.

Oh but then we value such a (workhorse) player very differently. Now, regarding wages, it's difficult to justify wages like the ones reported unless we are talking about a very very special player, and I agree Mount isn't one (even if he's still fairly young). I just feel that folks here don't realize that our players are (mostly) elite players who would walk into most starting XI barring a few (very known clubs). We have a lot of good players... they are all good players. We need more than good to improve and get better and it is difficult to improve on the already good. You often end up trading characteristics with the new signings, and that's what makes it challenging.

I definitely envy people who see a master plan at work, because I surely see none. 😅

Agreed. Midfield setup, but also the type of CBs as well as FBs. Hard to play 2 at the back if one of the 2 is David Luiz for example. Even the wingers matter too... can they defend, or or useless in defense? Can they press high? So many variables, and TBH, not sure the new crop of signings change any of that. Feels like we will be playing with 3 at the back for a while yet.

You are being nice... 😄 It's definitely his Achilles' heels. Or rather his playing style just isn't as effective in the CL.

Yeah I think Kai is the player who often enjoys this free role and does not really deliver in that position: neither goals nor creativity. That's one of the reasons I like him in the striker position. I fear that he's just not active/creative enough for the CAM position, and my last hope is that he adapts to the striker position well enough. I agree that we lack creativity, and the manager often plays Zyech on the right trying to fill that role. He's been a bust for us, so that won't work. The 2 new wingers so far look very FW-like to me, but I need to see more. Right now playing both + a 9 against any strong side would be suicide.

I don't get it. Why does Mount, and only Mount, needs to be that player? So, a team has 2 (maybe even 3) other positions to fill a role they lack in mid/attack. We don't even have an established right winger, and yet Mount *has to deliver the creative role*. There is nothing written anywhere that the left winger has to be the creative one... Hazard vibes?

Agreed. ☝️ Wages are always relative... they go into potential, nationality, shirt sales, long term business strategies, etc. It's hard to analyze that when you don't have all the info. I don't think the new signings are good options for Mount. Like I said, I'm OK if the club thinks he's not worth the effort/wages and let him go, but I don't see a viable option in the squad. I don't know if the new wingers can grow into this role, but they all look very attacking-minded to me, which does not bring the necessary balance to the team. My last bit is a cautionary warning 🎵: just like Kante, Mount could be a really really annoying player to play against. And he only has to reproduce what he *has already done* to become even more than just annoying. I, for one, would fucking hate to see him at another PL club. Same with Kante, or Reece, despite the injury issues.

Reece deserves money? for what not playing? I think that he's a very good player when on form, which lasts like 5 games (between the time he gets 100% and picks up a new injury). Same with Chilwell. Sure yes, and Mount is 24 (25 in the summer) and had more than a good season and a bit, like you said (plenty of stats to corroborate that). Perhaps he may still have a "good season and a bit" in him yet, which might be enough for another "minor" trophy? 😉 Dunno about you folks, but I like winning and I value players who turn up at the most important time. Regarding wages, it's all very competitive, so either his agent is playing hardball or he has options.

Yeah agree to disagree. I don't have any agenda or a desire to like Mount. I see what I see and think he's underrated here. BTW, don't Willian was that consistent -- became more consistent towards his 30s which is quite common for footballers.

I think there are two distinct aspects here: 1. intent and 2. application implementation (the better word) I agree that there was little we could see in the first season and +. That's absolutely expected especially in a drastic chance in style with the same players, some of which completely incapable of working in that system (e.g. Ozil and Auba). I'm actually surprised Xhaka has been able to adapt considering he's a bit on the slow side for that system. Regarding intent, I cannot imagine that Arsenal did not know the intent of what Arteta was going for. Everyone did.... I did and I cannot read minds. Evidently, that's what he learned and believed in after years working with Pep. Potter? I have no idea what the intent is and I don't see anything tangible on the pitch. I also don't see anything special at Brighton either. Good team, that plays competitively at that level and that's it. Seen a bunch of different clubs do the same over the years. heh, the clubs getting silverware are the ones backed by a lot of funds who buy the top players who are ready to play and compete at this level. They sprinkle that team with a couple of younger players, who are also bought for a lot of money. Sorry, I see youth systems as a good way to make/save money, but not a saving grace for silverware... not at this level. The top clubs use the whole World as a pool of players; because they can.

different roles... you all want him to be a creative type which is obviously not what he is. Had he played against us, instead of for us, at the CL final and I think City would have had a much better chance of winning it. That's how I see him. He's that 3rd CM who is sometimes employed on the wings (in the popular 4231 and its variations) to close down a channel and provide balance. He even produces creative moments like in the aforementioned finals... it's rare for a player in that role to produce goals and assists because they do so much else already. Oscar was that player for us. Willian then tried to be that player. The player in that role is never liked, but he's absolutely needed for silverware. I see that player in every team which wins. City often lacks that player and it costs them. PSG does not have that player and it costs them. There are perhaps 100 players who could slot in for Grealish without changing much, and another 100 who would improve City... Mount included. See it the way I see it, or not, his defining characteristic is work rate, which makes him excellent in high press systems; his work rate has been entirely absent for quite a while. I'm not claiming Mount is the only player who can do this role, but I am sure claiming that if we employ 2 creative wingers and a striker, we will lose more than win regardless of midfield setup.

I like him as a player and think he's excellent in the role he plays (one of the most important roles in football). Point me a successful team and I will point to a player who performs the same role. He's a good player who at the moment is not even average... with his current level of play he should not be playing at all. His ONE defining characteristic is nowhere to be seen. Sort out the contract situation or leave the team and move elsewhere (contrary to many here I think he would play in any top 4 PL team with ease), but right now he's clearly not contributing. Manager and team could be a contributing factor, but I suspect it's more of the former.

It's not exactly like that. Managers have their own style of play and they may or may not be a fit in a particular club. I couldn't see Mourinho coaching Barca, to your point, for ex. You cite very specific clubs and a handful of them. Not many clubs even take that approach of using a rigid system and style of play. Reckon that does not necessarily translate well to silverware as neither has been overly successful with the exception of City and only in the PL. Barca has been struggling for years... don't see anything seamless there--they play shit when they cannot sign the top player like anyone else. Bayern in particular is an overrated club that plays boring football in my book, but that's me. Arsenal had a very strong DNA under Wenger and wasn't that successful bar in a year or two. It's all relative. It's obviously fine you want that. The question remains: what has Potter done in football that indicates he's capable of not only leading a club like Chelsea, but also implement a particular style of play? do you see something in Brighton you want at Chelsea? because I sure don't. 🤷‍♂️ Nobody here would complain if we hired Pep and he turned us into the same passing machine City is. Potter couldn't be farther from Pep tho IMO. BTW, ironically I thought our team was playing in a very specific style under Tuchel and one that I very much like.

Different things right? the way of playing is indeed tied to manager AND players. In my view only perhaps 3-4 managers employ a particular style of play (some share similar/same style too), the most obvious one is Pep with the high line and 100% possession football. I think aside from these very specific managers, you won't get what you want and I cannot fathom why someone would think Potter would be able to deliver that considering there is nothing remarkable about his teams (like Brighton). Don't think Potter is that much more experienced than Lampard either -- they both have accomplished very little in football as managers. Literally ANYONE can make a group of good players perform well. The tricky part is always always winning! The ruthlessness we had, precisely with the constant pressure and sacking, was the *club's* DNA. Evidently not the one you like, but I personally, think there are many ways of playing and winning in football. And once again, I don't see why Potter has to be the chosen one to take us to wherever the new owner wants to go. They both look pretty lost to me.

Yeah I think there 2 main disagreements in this thread: One about whether Potter deserved the shot or not--I personally think he has not done enough simple as. The second, is that I don't think some folks here understand, or perhaps don't accept, what Chelsea (club) is these days. I hear folks talking about a long-term project as if Chelsea had the luxury of burning seasons in name of some way of play, of a philosophy, or conducting the business. These are acquired over years and years of consistent decision making. We DID have a DNA as a club under Abramovich. It may not have been the DNA folks wanted, but there was one. Now, think about sponsorships, prize money, the ability to acquire as well as *retain* talent... How can someone think a club like Chelsea isn't *constantly* under pressure to win is beyond me.

weird... mixed info this article in Brazil says he did not get it and mentions possible destinations there. https://ge.globo.com/futebol/times/vasco/noticia/2023/02/17/andrey-nao-consegue-visto-de-trabalho-e-deve-ser-emprestado-pelo-Chelsea-vasco-monitora.ghtml

I find the reasoning given by the club here a bit silly tbh. Andrey is clearly a u20 player and would never be deemed 'indispensable' in any PL club. 🤷‍♂️

I suspect it was because he hasn't done/accomplished enough to be granted one. They thought his u20 accomplishment would've been enough, but evidently that did not work.

Did not get the working permit -- will go out on loan likely to some club in Brazil.

I think the timing and circumstances around Potter appointment made it less likely to succeed even when it was always a bet like few others (as discussed above). Many of these players have won the CL. I know some here think that's not a big deal, a fluke, and I strongly disagree. It takes quality and a high level of discipline, which is what makes it so difficult a feat. Regardless, the point is that it also brings other things: increases the value of players, which leads to contract talks and inflated egos. And pretty much the same set of players are now managed by someone without any important accomplishment in football as well as coming from a much smaller club. If that does not play a part, then nothing will imo.

In an ideal world where the power had not shifted (heavily) towards players and agents, yes. I'm not claiming I like the way it is... just that that's what I see everywhere. Even smaller leagues are pretty much the same. Players finally realized that time is always on their side: win or lose they get their paycheck due to the long contracts they have, but the club and manager need the wins because the income does depend on some level of success (CL or not for ex)--not to mention fan/press pressure.

Wouldn't surprise me on bit if that actually did happen. You are ignoring one of the most important aspects of management in football: whether the manager has the backing of the players or not... esp the leaders. Like I wrote elsewhere, whether Potter will become (or not) a top manager in the future is pretty much irrelevant right now. however, it is intriguing to me at least, why he has so much support on this forum having done so little career wise. Kai, Mount, and Pulisic to name a few, have played better in the past under a different manager. We can attribute that to intangibles, or assume the current manager has failed to a) fit them where they perform best b) motivate them to perform at their best It's not easy to know which is which esp from out here.