CHOULO19

Hold on, he wasn't "great". He had a couple of excellent games and a few awful ones as well. Overall he was average, which is why Juve didn't try to sign on a permanent basis. Wait, Salah is still here?! Could've sworn we sold him last season..

Not contradictory at all if you look at the history of the region. US has inherited British policy of supporting right wing religious groups in the middle east against secular nationalists. There are exceptions, of course, but the rule generally holds true in the past 200 years or so. In this particular case there is no great difference in ideology, and I doubt the US cared. That is true about Turkey and Russia, but the relation went sour, as I'm sure you know, when the Russians intervened in Syria then reached a post-WWII low with the infamous downing of the Russian jet by the Turkish military. They didn't see eye to eye in Syria...but they are starting to, and that leave the US out of the equation.

@johnnythefirst @cosmicway By all the indicators so far, and we've had a few days no for the dust to settle now, the attempted coup in Turkey does NOT look like it had anything to do with secularism. Or at the very least it wasn't carried out by pro-secular forces. Instead, all the clues are pointing towards Fathallah Gulen, who, if anything, is more religious and extremist than Erdogan. That would obviously mean US and CIA involvement, but it does leave a question about the timing of the attempted coup. After all, it's not like they just NOW realized what an awful authoritarian Erdogan is, and by any means his supposed replacement was unlikely to be any better. Here is my analysis of it: The attempted coup came after a couple of weeks of Turkish-Russian 'flirting' and courting coinciding with the redrawing of previously perceived 'internationally agreed lines' in Aleppo. THAT is dangerous to the US' interests in Syria because the US sees Turkey as its bargaining chip in Syria as they themselves do not hold any real power on the ground. All the so called US trained/backed groups in Syria (real and imagined) have very little power without the support of the Turkish army and the supply routes from within Turkey. Indeed, after getting a lot of publicity a couple of months ago, their role has visibly decreased since the start of the Turkish-Russian coming together. So theoretically, and probably practically as well, a Russian-Turkish-Assad agreement could well be effectively implemented on the ground in Syria since Turkey still maintains a better relation with (or rather a strangle hold on) the radical Islamist groups in Syria than any one else; meaning a solution could actually be implemented on the ground in Syria without taking into account the interests and demands of the US (and KSA). That, in my mind, is the most likely explanation, and if true, we should be seeing more Erdogan-Russain closeness, and more radical change on the ground in Syria which there has already been signs for.

56 civilians killed in just one airstrike by US led coalition in Syria today. I'm sure THAT will help a lot in the fight against terrorism...

@Spike watch this before it gets taken down:

But THAT is what it is actually about. If you say "I saw you taking my chocolate bar" And I reply "How can you know when what you see is simply your brain's interpretation of your flawed senses and truth cannot be obtained by humans" It doesn't mean I'm suddenly interested in a discussion of epistemology with you, it just means I'm trying to hide the fact that I stole your bloody chocolate! Because the point is not about Micah, it's about the rage of black people and the reasons behind it and you making incredibly irrational arguments about his motivation that were objectively clear, to me, indicate an underlying bias and a refusal to accept the main point that a lot of black people are angry to the point where they want revenge. Because that is where irrationality usually comes from: ignorance or bias. And you clearly are not ignorant about this matter. So let's stop going in circles and address the main point: You correctly state that you did not say that black people are upset enough about police brutality to commit violence in return and that they want revenge for all the senseless killings, but do you or do you not agree with that? Because if you do, then we are basically in agreement about the main point in all of this, and if you don't then unfortunately we go back, imo, to bias and trivializing the plight of oppressed people. Either way I feel that I have nothing left to reply on this particular point, so you can have the last say on this if you wish.

That is not what I said. Your refusal to accept that black people could be feeling upset and desperate enough to commit violence against cops is you trivializing their plight. You bringing up of all that history that is largely irrelevant to the situation right now (in a sense that it changes nothing now, of course it is relevant in a historical sense) in response to a simple point about the attack being revenge for decades of racial abuse is a distraction from that factual point. THAT is what I said. And I really hope you listen to some of those accounts and reactions of black people to systematic racism mate. We could be arguing over this for days here and not get anywhere but at the end of the day the key is empathy and the only way that can be achieved is through listening to the people suffering.

1) Brainwashed by the media? What media are you talking about? The vast majority of powerful media outlets are openly biased for cops and against resistance movements like BLM. How many BLM people do you see in interviews on TV vs how many pro cop 'experts'? How much coverage did the daily demonstrations all over the country against police brutality get? How often do news outlets smear black victims by digging up old criminal records? How often do incredibly stupid and easily debunked talking points like "more white people get shot by cops" go unchallenged on TV? You have some incredibly warped view of reality if you think that black resistance movements control the media! 2) All the reports and investigations that have been leaked or made public so far have consistently stated that the Dallas shooter had no contact with any group and that he was acting alone. You can do you psychoanalysis all day, but there are facts in the end, and the facts don't fit your theories one bit. 3) It's rich of you to call oppressed people ignorant immediately after coming up with two ridiculous conspiracy theories. This condescending attitude is why I hate liberals more than anyone in this world. The majority of oppressed people are more aware than most, simply because they have to. . It's usually the middle class fuckers who write the history books who have no idea what the fuck is going on. 4) Are you saying that's okay for the police to kill 'weak' people because that has always been the case?! I rest my case.

Those are interesting to read and discuss if you are majoring in history or have a knack for it, but for the current times and current discussions they are mostly irrelevant. Whether you realize it or not you are not bringing in those points to enrich the discussion, but merely to distract from the main point. Slavery is still alive in the US in another form through laws specifically designed to target black lifestyles, coupled with overt and systematic racism both in the police and the media, helped by mandatory minimums and implemented by privatized prisons through free labor. What you are saying indicates an underlining bias against black people because you keep trivializing and playing down their current suffering. Just take some time and listen to the people who are suffering: There are hundreds of those on youtube. Just hear them out for once. These are just racist points because they try to blame the powerless victims for their plight. The issue most certainly isn't the culture of black people. The issue is systematic racism and police violence against black people. And until the vast majority of people can say that clearly with no ifs or buts, the violence will most likely continue.

Thanks for proving my point.

You are disagreeing with what the shooter himself said was his motivation. Now who's assuming from nothing and clutching at straws?!

Of course it is more complex, I didn't state so because it is goddamn obvious! The original point I made which you then tried to refute was literally "motivated mainly by police violence". Not that that it was the only reason. That it was the MAIN MOTIVATION. So, when you argue against that with those quotes I can only assume that you are trying to deny that. Also, if you agree that police violence was the main motivation then all the original points I was trying to make about this violence being in retaliation and cannot be equated with the original police violence are all valid.

Because he said so himself to the police? Chief Brown said: “He said he was upset about the recent police shootings. The suspect said he was upset at white people. The suspect stated he wanted to kill white people, especially white officers.” http://www.nytimes.com/2016/07/09/us/dallas-police-shooting.html You are literally trying to deny reality and saying that I'm trying to grab at straws. Just stop and think about what you are trying to argue for a moment. And I'm not asserting anything about the shooting in Baton Rouge which is why I said 'likely'. If it makes you feel better, replace it with 'maybe'. I also tried to make most of my post about Dallas since the details are now known.

I don't think Conte will play Fabregas in an advanced position AT ALL. Unless he completely throws away both his Juve and Italy tactics, I can almost guarantee that that won't be the case.

Why did the guy Dallas want to kill? Why did he say he wants to kill white people? Why did he only want the blood of cops? Are you SERIOUSLY trying to say that he was not motivated mainly by police violence? Saying he just wanted to kill is to refuse to understand and address the obvious real motivation behind the shooting and thus to create tens more of the Dallas shooter. He wanted blood because change didn't come, and doesn't look like coming, not nearly quick enough. The shooters in Batton Rouge today most likely wanted blood because Alton Sterling was murdered by cops for selling CDs and no one was or will be sent to jail for it, just like no one was sent to jail when cops did a drive by and killed a 12 year old playing with a toy gun within 2 seconds. So yeah, violence like in Dallas, and likely today, should have been expected and are a fairly normal reaction when people are being killed daily and peaceful means are not yielding results and until people start trying to understand the motives of such violence and addressing it instead of just screaming at it, it will most likely continue and expand.

BLM? What do they have to do with this? People can oppose police oppression and not be part of BLM, you know... Also, because the media plants the idea in their heads, people keep making the false equivalency between police violence against black people which is rooted in racism and classism, to retaliatory shootings like Dallas, and possibly this in Batton Rouge. They are NOT the same. One is the act of oppression by a tool of the powerful, the second is an act of desperation by those oppressed. You can oppose violence against police and not equate it to violence by police.

I REALLY doubt that Conte would play Cesc in advanced position. The mobility of the forwards are usually key for Conte, both in attack and defense. Also, a midfield 2 of Kante and Matic seriously lacks a creative spark. I don't think it's about selling Matic but rather whether or not he'd want to stay. The thing with Fabregas is that unless you play with 3 central midfielders he's going to leave you with an obvious weakness, be it deep or, imo worse. in an advanced role. But he is still a key player for us, and probably our only top class player along with Eden. I understand why he needs to be in the team despite his weaknesses.

Just wanted to let you know that I read your posts in Donald Trump's voice...for some reason they always seem to me like something he'd say

I read somewhere yesterday that Conte said he wants to ply with 2 central midfielders. If true, then surely that means that Matic is gone because the 2 starting central midfielders will no doubt be Fabregas and Kante, likely with Mikel and RLC as back up.

That's nothing to do with this match though, does it? The market is still open for some time, and there will most likely be a lot more changes and as someone said, most of the players who played today will not be key players for us next season and probably more than half won't even be here. Also, suck cock? Really? Read someone said cancer a few pages back as well. I guess that's the general football culture now, but I honestly can't help but cringe, sorry.

I came here to see people seriously criticizing the performance in a match meant for nothing other than building physical readiness. I was not disappointed

I admit I'm very excited about this signing. Hopefully he fits right in.

Like I said, there was no imaginably way that this would have ended well. Either way, the scarce remaining signs of democracy in Turkey were going to get destroyed.

Fair play to the Turkish people and opposition political parties for standing up bravely to the military coup. Unfortunately there was no way this would end well. But if Erdogan was a power mad paranoid authoritarian before, I shudder to think of what he turns into now...

1) I wasn't sure you did which is why I said so at first. 2) 'Justification' for suicide is a weird concept. But being poor is definitely a factor that makes suicide more likely, especially in a society that teaches you to value your life based on what you own. 3) You literally said it was a mental illness 4) Don't disagree there at all but how traumatic gender reassignment has a lot to do with not just the lack of acceptance of transgenderism in society but also how much weight we put on genders and the distinctions between the two. I think that can and should change. 5) Sorry for assuming you did but it did look an awful lot like you were, tbf.. To clarify, I hope that I'm not simplifying the struggle of transgender people; I certainly don't mean to. The original point, if you remember, was how laws excluding queer people from civil rights such as marriage legitimize bias and discrimination which in turn contributes to (not solely causes) the high harassment and suicide rates among them. Was listening to democracy now yesterday and they literally introduced him as "Johnson, the new UK foreign secretary who is known for offending foreign people" Tbf, given the reputation British politicians have, it's probably a good thing he didn't end up working near children! It's such a joke that I'm half expecting it to be revealed as the most elaborate prank of all time. Even the name 'United Kingdom' is starting to sound sarcastic!