Ossie the King

That's the only reason I think we have a chance at a result in this game. Palace at home are a tough team to go to at the best of times so I think us winning there would be an unlikely result.

Why would you ask that of a fellow Chelsea supporter?

They also didn't retain the league though. So what you're saying there's an acceptable level of failure when it comes to underinvesting in a team? We underachieved this season. If you think that sacking Jose and replacing him with another coach next season whilst failing to support him in the same way will lead to greater success/less failure, then I hope you're right. Personally I think we're doomed to make the same mistakes. Should be entertaining to watch though.

It's a contributing factor. The league is hugely competitive and small percentages matter. We got that wrong this year and fell, whilst Leicester got everything right and are top of the league. Over time though you would expect both teams to return to their proper levels, unless you genuinely believe Leicester are a top team and not simply overachieving? But it's this whole 'entertainment' thing you're talking about. Firstly it's a very narrow definition of the word entertaining because some might find just as much entertainment in a defensive performance as an attacking one, but most importantly there's not much more entertaining than winning. That's what the matches are played for, to determine the winner. It's why we have goals and not judges on the sidelines scoring the performance. And I agree that we have an issue with developing youth, but that's at every team in the league. If you want to talk about Barcelona and their young players, you have to acknowledge that almost every homegrown player played for another team before Barcelona - Barcelona B. In fact Pep Guardiola started his coaching career there too. We don't have that type of finishing school for youth players and that is a huge issue facing English football, not just Chelsea. In fact youth development as a whole needs reforming not just at this club but at every top English club, and one coach isn't going to change that. But that's a massive discussion and it's far easier to blame Jose.

Character is absolutely the word I'd use. This team to me is lacking players with character. Lampard and Terry were flawed young kids, but when it came to their football they worked relentlessly on it. They'd stay after sessions, they'd keep their fitness during the summer (JT still does that to this day) and they'd make themselves the best players they could be. They weren't the most naturally talented but they had that drive to outperform what their talents would allow. We don't have that in our key players now. Eden Hazard has more talent than both but leaves training as soon as possible and lets his fitness go over summer. That is unacceptable to me but it says a lot about the current crop of players that we have. What we need is players with the character required and that's what Jose wanted to bring in this summer. I think you're right that we had a total disconnect between what the board wanted and what they hired, and when push came to shove they simply didn't back him. I hope Pep embarrasses Roman again and I almost hope we get Rodgers too, because Roman needs it shoved right in his face just how much he's fucked up. And if that doesn't wake him up then I hope the CPO do.

Hard to say who exactly were his signings and not. Salah fits into that 'young players' mould you described earlier, and we made a profit off of him. As for the football, clearly the players we had couldn't maintain it for a whole season which is why we needed to add to the squad. In the summer we simply didn't. We replaced players with inferior players in most cases and didn't actually add a single additional player to the squad, in my opinion. That's criminal. I can remember Fergie making some laughable statements at times, but Jose did take it a step further and we're all aware of his personal problems with his father. You may think that saying he's human is a poor excuse but I think the older you get, the more you're aware of people's limitations and breaking points. It's not a sexy thing to talk about in sport and it doesn't fit into 140 characters but we're dealing with humans here and they will err. And yet we sell out every week. If the crowd are unhappy with winning 1-0 every week then I'd get your point, but that isn't evident is it? Bayern have a good youth system, but they also have a stranglehold on German football such that they can acquire almost any young talent in the league that they want. You might say that he's more adaptable but that's something we need to see in practice isn't it? I actually think City have gone about laying the foundations for his arrival perfectly which is why he'll end up there in my opinion. What's with the snark? We're all Chelsea supporters so why throw in comments like that?

A friend for Papy?

Seems a fairly obvious transfer in a way. Highly rated, young and fits the team Jose was trying to build well.

Yet Jose didn't hire himself. He didn't give himself a contract. You need to look at the people running this club. The thing is, I've seen us play attacking football under Jose in both of his spells here. This notion that he can't let his teams off the leash is asinine. Football is about attack and defence, but it's ultimately about winning. He did that. But Guardiola was working with kids from La Masia who had spent a decade learning how to play the way Barcelona wanted. You want to play like Barca then you build your academy in that mould. We haven't. You watch the youth team and you know what you see? Jose's style of football and by that I mean strong, powerful teams who attack with pace often on the counter. Jose's DNA goes right throughout this club and has done since 2005. You want THE classic Jose performance (although Barcelona 4-2 and Arsenal 6-0 are also Jose classics that people won't remember)? MUNICH 2012, 5 years after the guy was sacked. I meant off the pitch....in the boardroom. You don't see through someone's flaws. I believe that in life and in business. What you do is acknowledge them, accept them if you can and work on the ones you can't.

So there you're perfectly describing muddled thinking at BOARD LEVEL. Personally I think we were targetting young, appreciating assets because it's financially beneficial. Let's not forget that we also signed Lukaku who isn't what I'd describe as a technically gifted player. Again, muddled thinking. Also three years ago we hired Rafa Benitez after sacking Robbie who finished 6th in the league after taking over from the guy we sacked before - this was not a stable club by any means. That's very close to a 'what have the Romans ever done for us?' line. 1) Not sure I agree with that considering I could predict quite easily what team we'd be fielding EVERY week under Robbie and Rafa. In fact if we go back and look at the teamsheets from each week I'm sure we'd find little in the way of rotation. Our squad depth has been off for a while. 2) See this is where talking in absolutes isn't helpful. We were wonderful to watch at times up until the Swansea game in January, then we fell apart. We didn't have the players to maintain that style and we needed reinforcements which we never got. Again, far bigger problem than Jose. 3) The drama comes with him and it increased as the pressure increased. Like you say, we all know that's him and yet we still hired him. It did go overboard though and I think that external pressure played a massive factor but he is human at the end of the day. We've all been there and if you haven't you will. 4) Apart from the core of Hazard, Courtois and Zouma, it's been disappointing. We have a youth problem at this club and whilst I'd have loved to have seen Loftus-Cheek play more, it never seemed like the right time. From going into the run-in for the title when every point mattered to the start of the season when we were scrapping for points, you're looking at two highly pressurised situations and Jose is a safety-first pragmatist. He needed his established stars to recapture their form rather than gamble on youth players coming good. It's a catch-22 and he'd have been castigated either way by some. I agree. But blaming that all on Jose is really taking a narrow view of things. You need to look at who hired him and who was running the club over that time.

What direction was that? Become Barcelona by buying young talent and then hire Pep? Then when that fell through we went to Jose and told him to win the league...and he did. It might just be our owner doesn't have a clue what he's doing but has a massive chequebook. He needs to be honest that he doesn't know what he's doing and hire people who do. We're lucky the geezer didn't try designing the new stadium with his kids crayons.

Pep has never managed anywhere that didn't already have a philosophy of how it wanted it's teams to play so I'm not entirely sure what people are expecting were he to come in. Barca played similarly before he came and very similarly after he left. We need someone to come in to start the whole process and get it going at youth level. Interestingly, the youth teams have played like Mourinho teams for about as long as I've watched them. I understand the 'loyalty' argument with Cech, but the club (specifically Roman) undermined Jose's authority and made his job harder. I think the club's first loyalty should be to it's coach, not it's back-up keeper. You might say that Cech isn't just any keeper, he's a legend and he earned it. Well my response would be that Jose is a legend too, and he's definitely earned it.

Give the lad a go here. For years we've said young players could benefit from a loan to a team in the bottom of the Premier League....well WE'RE that team now.

Leicester are just in a remarkable run of form and they're getting all the bounces going their way. It happens. But what also tends to happen is that the tide turns and a few bad games knocks the confidence. Vardy is the same which is why I don't understand the stories about him going to a big team for £20 million. Good player in great form, not the other way around. What it does show is how the quality of this league has taken a massive nosedive since it dominated Europe 7 years ago, and also how competitive it is. With all the TV money coming in, any team that stands still for a moment will be mowed down. If they make top four then it's a massive achievement but there's a long way to go.

We need to appoint leaders first mate.

I love that I'm apparently a Mourinho cultist. Makes me wonder what I was doing before he arrived at the club. Would it be fair if I called you an Emenalo cultist. Does your support predate his time here I wonder? Actually don't answer that. It's not worth talking to someone who is disrespectful to fellow Chelsea supporters. How very cynical of you. But I think it's a distraction. Why now? Why not 6 months ago?

Always thought it would be JT or lamps, not Drogba.

The issue is the person doing the targeting. Truth is that to get the real problems out of this club, we might need to go through relegation and spend a long-time rebuilding.

There's no 'cultists', just Chelsea supporters. It's a little odd to use that as an insult when you're one of those people who feels the need to have an Emenalo avatar to fit in with others. That's not a criticism because you may well not be mindlessly following the crowd in doing that and sincerely want to celebrate the man for what he's done. You'll also notice that it's not just Emenalo, but the entire board AND Mourinho who are receiving criticism. It would probably be those you might label 'cultists' who are looking at the situation in a more holistic manner than those who would call Mourinho 'the architect to this nightmare...'. It's widely agreed that when you win the league, you need to improve the squad isn't it? You'll hear the 'two or three world class additions' point thrown around, to stop the club from stalling. That's just to retain the title, without looking at going further in Europe. The club didn't do that. They didn't match the ambition of the coach and it's quite clear they didn't back him in a number of ways. The Cech situation is the obvious one where they went against his express wishes and sold him to a rival. You can't look at that situation and say they backed him, because they quite clearly didn't. It's quite absurd for a club to not only not strengthen the squad in a summer transfer window, but to actually STRENGTHEN a direct rival in a position they've been struggling in for almost a decade. They undermined his position within the club and they made his job harder. As for the thing where you take the focus off the summer transfer window by looking at average spend over five windows, I honestly don't think that will work with many Chelsea supporters. They know that the squad wasn't strengthened and that there were no REAL additions to the squad, only like-for-like changes. Now none of that means we should've been in the position we were, but they are quite clearly factors and not 'crap' and they will be factors for the next coach, and the next coach, and the next coach unless something ABOVE the coaching position changes. That's not the opinion of a Mourinho cultist, but a fellow Chelsea supporter just like every other poster in this forum is.

Thought he showed flashes of getting back to his best, perhaps because he had some help in midfield from Mikel. He seemed to grow as Ramires was introduced too, looking far more comfortable on the ball than he has done in a while. Still some ways to go but we need him to regain his form.

Rodgers is attacking and plays youth players. He's a shit coach but I'm just getting you prepared for the inevitable defence of his hiring.

We definitely aren't getting Pep. Simeone is a longer shot and would require a reorganisation of certain responsibilities at the club The problem is that EVERY club in the league is getting richer, which is why Everton could reject our overtures to John Stones. You have teams like West Ham buying talent like Payet as well, so the whole marketplace is becoming inflated. The whole 'long-term future' thing is a little overplayed. Yes we amassed a lot of decent, appreciating talent but that doesn't give you a team. What you need is someone to build that team and Jose did that. He made us league champions and then we stopped giving him the backing he needed. He was undermined when it came to Cech and he was let down when it came to Stones and other targets. It's why I'm pessimistic because I don't see any of that changing whilst the current board are still in charge. They've stumbled their way to success and benefitted from their massive buying power for much of the last decade, but we can't do that anymore. City can (and do) outspend us and have a far better team in place, and United won't be paying off interest forever. Now is the time for us to rebuild right from the top down, but we won't because the biggest obstacle to that is Roman himself. That's where my lack of optimism comes from.

Guus might just think this is his best side. It would be funny if he actually came to the same conclusions as Jose and played a similar team.

The issue is that if we sacked Mourinho then appointed someone who does the same, what's the point? As for the Sunderland game, yes we played well. So why not stick with Stevie Holland? Why go to Romans mate? Tell me one thing that Guus has done in the time Jose won four titles and a champions league that makes him the man for this job. Fact is we've got rid of one of us and appointed another of Romans yes men. Guus will sit there like a kitten having his belly rubbed whilst Emenalo and granovskaia go about acquiring players for Brendan Rodgers. Is that what you're happy with or did you think when you called for Jose to be sacked pep guardiola would be on the first flight from Munich?

The issue for me is that you guys have got what you wanted. Jose is gone and what's left? Another of Romans mates in charge who doesn't seem to have a clue about the squad and has achieved not very much in the last 6 years. And who's in charge of transfer targets in January? Another of Romans mate and heir to Avram's throne. Now if you feel more connected to the club since Jose left then I envy you. For me I don't have any faith in any of these people and I genuinely think relegation might be the only way we change things. Otherwise we appoint Rodgers or Pellegrino and repeat the same mistakes for the same decade. That's what most of us have been saying that it goes beyond just the coach, and I'm pretty sure those guys who sang Joses name in the stands today probably agree on the whole.