SoulTaker

Wow, it's been a while I didn't visit but nothing change I see, still no neutral ground in this thread .

Why can't we just agree that rather being or not being good enoguh back then he just wasn't the type of player Mourinho wanted as his #10? He HIMSELF said it to the media ( link:: http://weaintgotnohistory.sbnation.com/2013/9/21/4754358/mourinho-oscar-is-my-number-10) this plus the William signing pretty much closed the door to both Mata and de Bruyne. What amaze me is that Mourinho didn't foresee what his own words could do Mata and de Bruyne spirit.

But anyway like I said when I last posted in this thread: If Mourinho made his choice back then, then fair enough; but to blame him/them when it's really Mourinho that sow the seeds is unfair. And if you can read further than that, he actually ( probably unintentionally ) acknowledged his mistake ( selling both of them ) by bringing in a creative player in Fabregas six months later.

As for the " flat track bully " I don't know, I didn't watch many lately and even less city game so I can't say much, but from what I saw combined to the stat ( I know stat doesn't means much outside of their context ) it looks more like a finishing problem with city away than anything. I mean 30 chances created at home for 10 assists is a normal conversation rate but 18 chances created away for 0 assists is definitely abnormal.

Lastly, ( reminder: I didn't watch many games lately ) I don't think de Bruyne would have changed much to the situation Chelsea is right now, don't get me wrong I'm not implying " He is not good enough to make a difference ", my point is that I fell the problem with the team right now is much deeper than just " We need more quality players ". The players are complete lost on the field and the team itself look just... well broken. First, well I really don't think Mourinho was the right coach for the crop of player the team had when he signed but more than that what I want to point is something I often see being laughed at when, I for one, believe is really important: club philosophy.

Club philosophy isn't just something there so you can say " Oh look our team always play nice attacking football " or stuff like that, the real point of a club philosophy is to ease the burden on the players when the club get a new manager, oblivously there will be less of an adaptaiotn needed if you go from a manager that like possession football to another one that like possession football than if you go from possession to defensive minded. This most likely also the reason why when Mourinho leave somewhere there's a lot of work to be done, after all he's just so different than other top managers. Simply said, it's easier to learn something than to forget " that " something

Now going deeper into what I wanted to say: Look at it, before Mourinho spell the players finally started to play some nice attacking football at the end of Benitez interim, then Mourinho came, broke that to rebuild from strach a more defensive minded side, which for the player means" forget everything and restart from the begining " and this time for a type of football that doesn't really suit them ( in my opinion ); And now, two and half a year later, need to forget all this again to rebuild something totally " new ". On a pitch you want the players to be able to play without having to think about what to do next but this process of changing the type of football they need to play just make this harder and harder to acheive, and they learned yesterdya is useless the tomorrow -> They're lost

It's pretty much the same problem ManU has gone through but for another reason... A way too long spell from SAF, his style was so much written deep into them that to change that it require to pretty much recreate the whole team from strach. You can look at Barcelona for the other side of the coin, they do change manager but neither too often nor too late, and they stick to one style of football and the result is there for everyone to see even under a new manager the players are never really lost on the field... That's continuity.

Sorry, that " lastly " ended up being like a novel.... Now, what I written is only my observation and opinion although I fell more like I wasted my time stating only the oblivious things everyone know anyway.and to be honest in the end I still hope I'm totally off the mark and the team manage to rebuild itself way fastes than what I'm expecting.


PS: In no way I'm trying to bash Mourinho or anything else like that in this post, I might not like his style but he doesn't deserve all the crap against him I've read, be it on some forums or in the media; And I also feel sympathy for him, he's like a square in a era of circle... Just different from the others.

I agree. I just pointed it out since the discusion keep going on weither de Bruyne was good enough or if he was willing to fight for his place, which is a bit stupid if there was no spot to fight for in the first place. And I'm not blaming Jose for it, Oscar was the type of player he was looking for, fair enough. But blaming de Bruyne saying he was unwilling to fight for his place is harsh... And in my opinion it's no coincidence his drop in form coincide in time with that comment.
ps: That comment was actually made in September.

I agree. I just pointed it out since the discusion keep going on weither de Bruyne was good enough or if he was willing to fight for his place, which is a bit stupid if there was no spot to fight for in the first place. And I'm not blaming Jose for it, Oscar was the type of player he was looking for, fair enough. But blaming de Bruyne saying he was unwilling to fight for his place is harsh... And in my opinion it's no coincidence his drop in form coincide in time with that comment.
ps: That comment was actually made in September.

I agree. I just pointed it out since the discusion keep going on weither de Bruyne was good enough or if he was willing to fight for his place, which is a bit stupid if there was no spot to fight for in the first place. And I'm not blaming Jose for it, Oscar was the type of player he was looking for, fair enough. But blaming de Bruyne saying he was unwilling to fight for his place is harsh... And in my opinion it's no coincidence his drop in form coincide in time with that comment.
ps: That comment was actually made in September.

Exaclty what most of us have been saying for a while. No support = no party.
Also, he again proved how dangerous he's when staying higher on a the pitch when opponent has the ball for a possible counter... But I guess people will still want him to become a left back when opponent has possession.

He just need options. When you don't have options you become predictable. If some think he can just get past players over and over again when they know his only option to create something is to do that and this on a consistent basis they're deadly wrong.

I miss his and Mata's link up play and natural understanding.

He just need options. When you don't have options you become predictable. If some think he can just get past players over and over again when they know his only option to create something is to do that and this on a consistent basis they're deadly wrong.

That is why people say we don't work on any attacking patterns and that they're non existent. These sort of things have to be coached into the team - when a creative player gets onto the ball - you need to make movements off the ball for him to find you or to find space for himself. Instead we're just relying on individual brilliance. It starts from the top.

I tried to stay cool but this is just too much. I might -and probably will- say too much myself and I'm doing it knowingly so I'll take any blame moderator think I deserve. I'm sorry about that in advance.

So WHO the hell are YOU to judge people ? People on any forum might hide behind pseudonym but in no way does it means that they haven't done MORE for the community and the world than anyone will ever do and even less does it means they do not deserve RESPECT. Stop acting like you know anyone just because they're some " anonymous " on the web.

People like you do more harm than any good they'll ever bring to Mourinho's name. As shameful as it could get from a supposed fan.

I tried to stay cool but this is just too much. I might -and probably will- say too much myself and I'm doing it knowingly so I'll take any blame moderator think I deserve. I'm sorry about that in advance.

So WHO the hell are YOU to judge people ? People on any forum might hide behind pseudonym but in no way does it means that they haven't done MORE for the community and the world than anyone will ever do and even less does it means they do not deserve RESPECT. Stop acting like you know anyone just because they're some " anonymous " on the web.

People like you do more harm than any good they'll ever bring to Mourinho's name. As shameful as it could get from a supposed fan.

I tried to stay cool but this is just too much. I might -and probably will- say too much myself and I'm doing it knowingly so I'll take any blame moderator think I deserve. I'm sorry about that in advance.

So WHO the hell are YOU to judge people ? People on any forum might hide behind pseudonym but in no way does it means that they haven't done MORE for the community and the world than anyone will ever do and even less does it means they do not deserve RESPECT. Stop acting like you know anyone just because they're some " anonymous " on the web.

People like you do more harm than any good they'll ever bring to Mourinho's name. As shameful as it could get from a supposed fan.

Well, while it's true that Hazard isn't more efficient than him right now their situation is also very different ( I already made my point in a previous post ). Now to say Schurrle is on par with Hazard is going a bit too far, don't you think ?


That's a lot of popcorn. But are you sure it'll last long enough ? It looks like the show isn't going to finish anytime soon.

I tried to stay cool but this is just too much. I might -and probably will- say too much myself and I'm doing it knowingly so I'll take any blame moderator think I deserve. I'm sorry about that in advance.

So WHO the hell are YOU to judge people ? People on any forum might hide behind pseudonym but in no way does it means that they haven't done MORE for the community and the world than anyone will ever do and even less does it means they do not deserve RESPECT. Stop acting like you know anyone just because they're some " anonymous " on the web.

People like you do more harm than any good they'll ever bring to Mourinho's name. As shameful as it could get from a supposed fan.

For me its a disgrace that we end the season without Mata, Hazard and Oscar future in doubt, while Mourinho is praising Ramires, Cahill and Ivanovic, and the attacking players Mourinho likes most is Willian, because of his defensive work rate.
Is this really happening?

You clearly haven't been reading what I've stated earlier. It was the club's intention to play a more attractive style of football. Hence they signed Hazard and Mata. Hazard even alluded to it when he signed his contract here, that he had spoken with Abramovich and he liked the way the club saw the future with the young attacking talent they were signed or just had signed. That was a major selling point of the club in trying to persuade him to opt for Chelsea instead of all the other suitors. After 1 year where Chelsea tried to employ this new philosophy it all has been thrown out of the door. Key players for that philosophy have been moved on and we're building again towards the same style. What style I prefer has nothing to do with it, and I don't understand why you even brought it up in the discussion.
A lot of supporters keep mentioning how far off the title Chelsea were last season and the CL failure as reason to discard that new path the club chose for. Well, Liverpool were even further off and this season the were able to turn it around while being admired for their style. I find it a real shame we gave the Hazard-Mata relationship on the pitch only a single season. A season were the squad clearly lacked a Matic and an undisputed manager which influenced the performances.
I tend to visit a lot of other football boards and last season rival fans were incredibly jealous of the trio Oscar-Hazard-Mata and looking at potential transfers to rival that trio in the future because it had them scared. This season you had to look very hard to find something positive about our play.
ps: I actually completely forgot about that Arsenal game, I can't even recall one goal..

Well, while it's true that Hazard isn't more efficient than him right now their situation is also very different ( I already made my point in a previous post ). Now to say Schurrle is on par with Hazard is going a bit too far, don't you think ?


That's a lot of popcorn. But are you sure it'll last long enough ? It looks like the show isn't going to finish anytime soon.

Well, while it's true that Hazard isn't more efficient than him right now their situation is also very different ( I already made my point in a previous post ). Now to say Schurrle is on par with Hazard is going a bit too far, don't you think ?


That's a lot of popcorn. But are you sure it'll last long enough ? It looks like the show isn't going to finish anytime soon.

Arsenal play attacking football - won fuck all for years.
Liverpool played great this season - probably win fuck all.
Everyone wants to see goals but, I would rather not see them flying in against us. We played great football the season we won the double but, look at the squad we had. Drogba played a huge part in the way we played, scoring goals and creating chances for others. We don't have that right now, if we tried to play attacking football this season it would be like the AVB season, conceding all over the gaff
I agree we could do better against the lower teams but, with no real threat up top and players that waste chances we don't have much hope. The ball distribution from the back to the other end is still way too slow

I don't really understand all the fuss about what he said really.

He surely could have used better words but did people REALLY didn't understand what he meant ? I geniunely hope for them it's not the case, after all -as human beings- it would be worrisome.. Anyway people fall into the traps of the media and play a part in this masquerade and then blame -insert name here-. I guess it's also Hazard fault if half the world lack common sense... Sad world indeed.

I think some need to chill down a bit, and let the football do the talking tommorow..
For me case allready closed 30 pages ago, moved on and hoping we still get that title..

What I think it's that it would not be surprising if Hazard is a bit frustrated at the moment but it goes way too far in the media and even here.

I keep hearing people saying : " In modern forward help defense ". Which is true and I won't argue with that but there's limit to everything, I've pointed out yesterday how the team lack collective right now and it's all the point. Try to imagine what you would feel as a forward if you were asking to work to oblivion to help the team in defensive duty but when actually doing your job as a forward you have next to no support ? It's a lack in the TEAMWORK. Chelsea right now is unbalanced and this is clearly Mourinho fault for emphasing too much on the defensive part of the game. I'm not saying he should throw away his approach but tweaking it a bit would surely help.

After a MotM perfomance for the best possible outcome .

What I think it's that it would not be surprising if Hazard is a bit frustrated at the moment but it goes way too far in the media and even here.

I keep hearing people saying : " In modern forward help defense ". Which is true and I won't argue with that but there's limit to everything, I've pointed out yesterday how the team lack collective right now and it's all the point. Try to imagine what you would feel as a forward if you were asking to work to oblivion to help the team in defensive duty but when actually doing your job as a forward you have next to no support ? It's a lack in the TEAMWORK. Chelsea right now is unbalanced and this is clearly Mourinho fault for emphasing too much on the defensive part of the game. I'm not saying he should throw away his approach but tweaking it a bit would surely help.

What a bitter end of season (not even bittersweet, plain bitter instead).
Instead of feeling proud - even if disappointed by the way things panned out in the EPL losses and the UCL elimination - we're taking sides between our most important player (at least in theory) and our manager.
I read somewhere the whole interview translated (many, many, many pages back in this thread there's the entire thing in French in video and printed) and at least the version I read Eden implied something about playing alone - which is ALWAYS a bad statement to do because I think it's very disregarding towards your teammates. I don't think it was a jab at Mourinho's tactics, but I think it's unfair to the rest of the team - IF that was the original statement at all, my French is too rusty for me to try to figure it out myself).
While I don't appreciate Mourinho for pointing out Eden made a mistake because seems like he's showcasing him alone (and we had a lot of problems that match), I won't make a fuzz about it. The same way I didn't about the 'my wife' comments, or the 'Chelsea don't play football - which should be translated with the ball' things. The media is trying to make a circus out of it and it's sad our own fans are buying it.
Hazard made a few mistakes in the match, so did many others, including in the goals. I do think the first Atletico goal was a capital one and why we lost, I do think Schurrle or Willian would have done better if they were at Hazard's position because they've been doing exactly that in the last few matches, including against Liverpool and the first leg in Madrid. So the kid made a mistake. Get over it, Terry also made one in the PSG first leg, so did Cech, Luiz, etc... Mistakes are part of football and we don't need to crucify the boy and I don't think Mourinho was crucifying him either. I do think though he could have handled it better. Mourinho bit the bait the media planted to him. They want to make a mess in out dressing room and I do hope Mourinho learned from the Spanish media gate. While the journos there are disgusting, Mourinho isn't a saint himself and although the main reason things got out of hand in Madrid was because of player power, he handled the media poorly.
So at the end of the day we lost a UCL SF in a frustrating way. We were outplayed, we had a shot when it was 1x0 for us, but we weren't good enough in the end. It's time to regroup and get over, but instead the media - at least in this forum and I hope that's not how it is inside the club - is successful in creating an unnecessary crisis. 30 teams were eliminated in the UCL. We were the last ones. It happens. Next year I have no doubts we'll be fighting for it again. No need to point fingers to our manager - who made mistakes; or to any of our players - who also made mistakes, when in the end collectively we just weren't good enough.
A bad atmosphere only makes this elimination worse than it really is and creates a lot of unnecessary issues.