Callum Hudson-Odoi

[Vesper 30,095]

4 hours ago, Jason said:

 

Sarri is a fucking bellend

[Clockwork 1,794]

2 hours ago, Robchels said:

Zola is correct when he refers to big clubs like Chelsea. No not many 18yo, who don’t dominate games like Mbappe did at this age, play for top clubs. 

Then you add the pressure that our managers are constantly under, and they have little incentive to take additional risks.

ironically many folks here who want cho to play more, are also asking for sarri’s sacking, which will just keep the vicious circle going.

a legit question on Twitter: if cho is leaving anyway, so we still play him? Some here will say yes, but I’d say no or even a does not matter/up to the manager. 

The club seems to think he will leave regardless of minutes given and if that’s the case he just does not add enough at this time to justify all the moaning here.

Sarri at Napoli was highly criticized for not playing youths, so his attitude toward youths is a long standing criticism.

So I disagree keeping Sarri will not break the vicious youth policy at Chelsea, to break that you need to hire managers who will give youths a chance.

A manager as rigid and stubborn as Sarri does not in any way represent that.

[robsblubot 3,595]

26 minutes ago, Vesper said:

We are nowhere near a top 10 club atm, so you cannot count us technically as a big club (given your ultra narrow definition)

moots the whole CHO minutes at big club discussion

and there ARE 15 or so teams on that list who could (some more likely than others) smash us atm

also its madness to cut out superb teens like Ibrahima Konaté, Nicolò Zaniolo, Arne Maier, João Félix, Sessegnon, etc just because of the clubs they play at, as they would all get way more minutes than CHO has here at even your defined 'big' clubs

 

Going in circles again here. You think my definition of big club is narrow and I think yours is wrong.   Agree to disagree.

A lot those players play in tiny little leagues, which are not comparable to the pl. and/or play in smaller teams with a lot less pressure against a manager and players. If they lose a few games it’s all good! Big clubs == pressure... so for me you leave out the most important factor when analyzing players!

once again, if he’s not going to stay regardless of playing time, he’s simply not good enough to justify the outcry. Esp if we know our managers are always under additional pressure. 

will be the same again with the next manager.

either folks criticize sarri signing, wasn't a fan myself, at the time or it’s silly to criticize it now. His lack of wins hasnt changed since, then had it? @Clockwork my point exactly - that was known at the time we signed him.

[MoroccanBlue 5,375]

6 minutes ago, Robchels said:

gardless of playing time, he’s simply not good enough to justify the outcry. Esp if we know our managers are always under additional pressure. 

 

Think the majority fear another Salah or KDB situation. 

Myself included. 

[robsblubot 3,595]

8 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Think the majority fear another Salah or KDB situation. 

Myself included. 

Sure! I'd be totally on your side if I knew there was a possibility he would stay if given more minutes. However, all the evidence I have (certainly not as much as the club has), points to him wanting to leave pretty much like Eden. Though the conclusion is that we don't really know for sure, which makes the outcry a bit much too. Maybe Sarri sees CHO in practice and he does not look into it?

[Vesper 30,095]

3 minutes ago, Robchels said:

 

A lot those players play in tiny little leagues, which are not comparable to the pl. and/or play in smaller teams with a lot less pressure against a manager and players. If they lose a few games it’s all good! Big clubs == pressure

 

that's simplynot true at all

 

CB Matthijs de Ligt  at Ajax

AMF/SS  João Félix at Benfica

RMF Abdülkadir Ömür at our new sister club Trabzonspor 

 

those are literally the only 3 who play in smaller leagues

as Alphonso Davies was purchased by Bayern, and Haidara by RB Leipzig since I posted that back in November

 

de Ligt and Felix will cost you around £200m

Liverpool, Barca, Juve, Bayern all were sniffing around Ömür, who will cost over £30m when he is sold, tipped as the next Turkish big star, he is an AMF

 

 

[Nicco 927]

17 minutes ago, MoroccanBlue said:

Think the majority fear another Salah or KDB situation. 

Myself included. 

He will never come back in the league if he turns out good unlike those 2

[Vesper 30,095]

25 man roster off those players

 

GK Gianluigi Donnarumma  
GK Alban Lafont 

CB Matthijs de Ligt

CB Ibrahima Konaté

CB Boubacar Kamara  

CB Malang Sarr

CB Dan-Axel Zagadou 

LB Ryan Sessegnon

LB Stanley N'Soki (added him as he has 8 starts for PSG, 6 of them League games, 8 and half times as many league minutes as CHO)

RB Trent Alexander-Arnold 

RB Achraf Hakimi 

DMF Arne Maier 

DMF Declan Rice

CMF Houssem Aouar 

CMF Amadou Haidara  

AMF  João Félix

AMF Nicolò Zaniolo

LW Kylian Mbappé

LW Vinícius Júnior 

LW Ismaïla Sarr   

RW Jadon Sancho

RW Christian Pulisic  

CF Luka Jovic 

CF Patrick Cutrone 

CF Matheus Cunha  

 

Only players we currently have who make that team for sure

Kepa

Rudiger (maybe, and de Ligt is already far superior, and Rudiger might be soon be passed up in terms of quality by multiple others and off the team in a few years if we are talking about those CB's 3 years or so from now)

Amapdu I would sneak in there over Malang Sarr, just on pure potential he has

Kante (as a trad DMF)

Hazard (and Mbappe would have to move to RW)

 

Jorginho is not a lock at all IF the manager is not Sarri, as he is only good (and that is debatable) as a DH DMF (which is why Ancelotti tossed him)

 

I would instantly trade our side for that one, especially with Hazard leaving

the only massive loss would be Kante and sorta Kepa, by those 2 GKers are also pretty class

that side is insanely better at winger, far better at CF, better at AMF already and both of those could be top 5 in world AMF someday, far better at fullback and far better at CB, Maier and Rice both have huge potential as trad DMF's as well (not saying Kante level, but still more than adequate)

 

 

 

[robsblubot 3,595]

1 hour ago, Vesper said:

that's simplynot true at all

 

CB Matthijs de Ligt  at Ajax

AMF/SS  João Félix at Benfica

RMF Abdülkadir Ömür at our new sister club Trabzonspor 

 

those are literally the only 3 who play in smaller leagues

as Alphonso Davies was purchased by Bayern, and Haidara by RB Leipzig since I posted that back in November

 

de Ligt and Felix will cost you around £200m

Liverpool, Barca, Juve, Bayern all were sniffing around Ömür, who will cost over £30m when he is sold, tipped as the next Turkish big star, he is an AMF

 

 

Just to clarify, that when I disagree with your assurances about players and/or leagues (and I do), I'm not saying we shouldn't make a move, even when (in my view) they play in smaller leagues/clubs under a lot less pressure. I can tell you for example, that Brazilian players will only really catch scouts eyes when performing well in libertadores, not Brasileiro. Where their perform, and against who,are the most important factors in accession what they will be able to do against the strongest opposition. Precisely why I rate Eden Hazard less than most folks here (Willian consistently outperformed him in CL!). Some of them have the quality and deserve a shot. Personality and other factors may help selecting which would likely succeed abroad.

However, with the current managerial situation, betting on such players may be unwise. They would not be given too many opportunities to succeed, and could end up becoming eternal subs, even if underserved.... see AC who is a good player in my book (just a bit green for CB).

CHO is not of Sarri's making -- that is my main disagreement even when I couldn't care less about Sarri. Thought Napoli was entertaining to watch even if a bit gung-ho, like a team who would lose to pragmatic Jose 9 out of 10 times in single elimination games.

 

[Yeboii 1,844]

2 hours ago, Vesper said:

and some of those teens would be starters OR get big minutes at big clubs, which is why I put them on there

Then why aren't they?

Also, some of those players on the list are over 18

Zola was talking of the situation RIGHT NOW. Not how things should be or will be.

[Vesper 30,095]

1 minute ago, Robchels said:

Just to clarify, that when I disagree with your assurances about players and/or leagues (and I do), I'm not saying we shouldn't make a move, even when (in my view) they play in smaller leagues/clubs under a lot less pressure. I can tell you for example, that Brazilian players will really catch scouts eyes when performing well in libertadores, not Brasileiro. Where their perform, and against who, is the most important factor in accession what they will be able to do against the strongest opposition. Precisely why I rate Eden Hazard less than most folks here (Willian consistently outperformed him in CL!). Some of them have the quality and deserve a shot. Personality and other factors may help selecting which would likely succeed abroad.

However, with the current managerial situation, betting on such players may be unwise. They would not be given too many opportunities to succeed, and could end up becoming eternal subs, even if underserved.... see AC who is a good player in my book (just a bit green for CB).

CHO is not of Sarri's making -- that is my main disagreement even when I couldn't care less about Sarri. Thought Napoli was entertaining to watch even if a bit gung-ho, like a team who would lose to pragmatic Jose 9 out of 10 times in single elimination games.

 

I just put together a 25 man roster off those players (added another teen at LB so I had two) that blows our current squad away already at their current ages

I would trade my squad I made for ours instantly, especially with Hazard leaving

you vastly overrate the EPL IMHO in regards to the other Big 5 leagues, especially in terms of the cream of the crop top young players who are lurking out there

look at our team now

almost all are from leagues or teams you say are small time, some of ours are from truly shit leagues (Ukraine for example for Willian)

we just truly rate talent differently

I like my track record over the years

have almost no true bombs (I fully admit on Bakayko, so frustrating)

and have called many shit buys as such when they went down (Morata, Drinkwater, Bats, Zappacosta, Emerson (due to injury) Alonso as a FB, etc etc etc)

and went cray on some of our sales (KDB, Salah, Felipe Luis, Tiago (wayyy back, after the superb 2004-5 season, he was one of my favourite player as a 12,13yo, I cried like a baby, lolol Mourinho still talks about what a cock-up it was selling him) now CHO, etc etc)

 

 

[robsblubot 3,595]

10 minutes ago, Vesper said:

I just put together a 25 man roster off those players (added another teen at LB so I had two) that blows our current squad away already at their current ages

I would trade my squad I made for ours instantly, especially with Hazard leaving

you vastly overrate the EPL IMHO in regards to the other Big 5 leagues, especially in terms of the cream of the crop top young players who are lurking out there

look at our team now

almost all are from leagues or teams you say are small time, some of ours are from truly shit leagues (Ukraine for example for Willian)

we just truly rate talent differently

I like my track record over the years

have almost no true bombs (I fully admit on Bakayko, so frustrating)

and have called many shit buys as such when they went down (Morata, Drinkwater, Bats, Zappacosta, Emerson (due to injury) Alonso as a FB, etc etc etc)

and went cray on some of our sales (KDB, Salah, Felipe Luis, Tiago (wayyy back, after the superb 2004-5 season, he was one of my favourite player as a 12,13yo, I cried like a baby, lolol Mourinho still talks about what a cock-up it was selling him) now CHO, etc etc)

 

 

Quote

I would trade my squad I made for ours instantly, especially with Hazard leaving

I'm not sure what this means... if that is indeed my squad, then  I'd put money on them against your random list or youngsters (who haven't done nothing yet) any day of the week and twice on sundays. I'd suggest looking into stats regarding the number of youngsters starting in top clubs' senior squads and their success rate... It suggests one must be very careful in employing too many youngsters. 

Hint: the teams playing the CL final are usually NOT on the younger side.  

[Vesper 30,095]

10 minutes ago, Yeboii said:

Then why aren't they?

Also, some of those players on the list are over 18

Zola was talking of the situation RIGHT NOW. Not how things should be or will be.

If you look, I clarified that is was a historical list, including players who are now 20 or so, BUT got big minutes as teens at their clubs, it is from a November 1st post

and WATCH all of those players

most everyone is going to be at huge clubs or already are

the real (actual price to buy) market value of just the 25 man roster I chiselled out is already NOW around £1.5 BILLION quid

[robsblubot 3,595]

4 minutes ago, Vesper said:

If you look, I clarified that is was a historical list, including players who are now 20 or so, BUT got big minutes as teens at their clubs, it is from a November 1st post

and WATCH all of those players

most everyone is going to be at huge clubs or already are

the real (actual price to buy) market value of just the 25 man roster I chiselled out is already NOW around £1.5 BILLION quid

how can't you see that

Quote

and WATCH all of those players]

is subjective and merely one's opinion is beyond me. 

[Vesper 30,095]

5 minutes ago, Robchels said:

how can't you see that

is subjective and merely one's opinion is beyond me. 

Doubt me, bookmark and watch as they are sold.

Market valuations that translate into real sale prices are not subjective, there is an easily quantifiable record to track.