closed Chelsea 3-0 Leicester

[Polo7 3,496]

On 15/10/2016 at 10:06 PM, Barbara said:

Definitely our best performance. We dictated things for most time and while at the beginning of the second half we gave them the ball, we still looked well posted in defense and midfield and they didn't really threaten us.

Kudos to Conte and the players, right attitude, good positioning and execution. We were sloppy in our finishing and we could certainly have won by 2-3 more if we were more efficient on that, but that's not a complaint, just an observation.

I don't see either Oscar or Fabregas playing in this team right now because there isn't space for them in midfield (while not being fantastic as he was two seasons ago, Matic improved a lot as the season went on) and I hope they stay in the bench.

I really wish we had a better player to play by Hazard and Costa side in the attack. I don't think Pedro is cut for it, and while Wililan and Moses have their qualities, they are far from what we could have there. Even Schurrle would be better suited for this role than the two of them, but let's see how they fare.

Oscar came back from international break, but then the club released him back to Brazil because one of his close relatives is really sick... for those asking why he wasn't even in the bench.

Moses was at wing back and he played really well. I think you are forgetting how infuriating Schurrle was, nostalgia blinds us all.

[Captain Ahmed 528]

pic of that game

[Johnnyeye 7,510]

On 16/10/2016 at 4:50 PM, BlueLyon said:

The game is changing obviously and all these CBs who are versatile, makes them better players, but not neccessary better defenders. 

A CB should still first and foremost be good tackler and tactician to position well. Passing, shooting comes second.

And IMO those you mentioned Ramos and Hummels are the same example I was making. Very good CBs, but still questionable in defending. However media sees them as world class because they can pass and score. I find it funny. Hummels is incredibly slow and Ramos has to be one of more overrated defenders because his every second challenge results in faul. His timing is way off and his agression is too high. 

Litteraly the same thing with Luiz, but he is getting stick for a while now. Is he such great CB to be worth 40m? Never. But he is good allround player who happens to be a defender. 

Football loves this generation of versatile players, but I still think a CB should be first and foremost good defender. 

A prime Vidic would always find a place in my team, while I doubt I would place someone like Hummels or Ramos even if they were rated higher because of their versatility.

Its all great when CB can defend brilliantly and on top of that, passes well too. But when media talks of someone like Ramos as world class defender because he scores alot and makes top passes, but has number of flaws in defending, thats beyond me.

Luiz for example is good footballer for a defender, but average defender for footballer on this level.

Only world class CBs out there today are Boateng, Godin, Barzagli and Chiellini. Maybe Silva and Bonucci. Then come the likes of Hummels, Ramos, Pique, etc who replace the defensive flaws with brilliant footwork.

Perhaps Kante needs to work on his shooting if he is to be our b2b, but as long he makes good tackles and supplies forwards, there is nothing else I would demand from him to consider him top midfielder.

Terry is a great example of how a defender should be first, but just imagine for a second ,Terry with Luiz´s skill on the ball, eventough Terry at his prime wasnt really great with the ball at his feet, but he was a no nonsense defender who could pick up a great pass, shoot on goal at every opportunity, great header of the ball and with his feet too, very solid at the back, great tackling, blocking, positioning and anticipation but age catches up with you unfortunately and so do the mistakes in the game, but i bet we would have won a lot more titles for sure if he had a Pique type of player alongside him for many years, no doubt, because of all defenders who have played alongside him, Carvalho was clearly the best, shame we couldn´t really replace Carvalho after he left, but thats my opinion. Cheers

[BlueLyon 9,359]

1 hour ago, Johnnyeye said:

Terry is a great example of how a defender should be first, but just imagine for a second ,Terry with Luiz´s skill on the ball, eventough Terry at his prime wasnt really great with the ball at his feet, but he was a no nonsense defender who could pick up a great pass, shoot on goal at every opportunity, great header of the ball and with his feet too, very solid at the back, great tackling, blocking, positioning and anticipation but age catches up with you unfortunately and so do the mistakes in the game, but i bet we would have won a lot more titles for sure if he had a Pique type of player alongside him for many years, no doubt, because of all defenders who have played alongside him, Carvalho was clearly the best, shame we couldn´t really replace Carvalho after he left, but thats my opinion. Cheers

Well he had Carvalho in his prime years and Riccy was one great CB that Terry couldnt wish for a better partner.

But Im not exactly sure what you are pointing at tho

[Johnnyeye 7,510]

1 minute ago, BlueLyon said:

Well he had Carvalho in his prime years and Riccy was one great CB that Terry couldnt wish for a better partner.

But Im not exactly sure what you are pointing at tho

i was just stating my view on the subject since you were talking about defenders nowadays

[Essien19 1,415]

On 16.10.2016 at 5:50 PM, BlueLyon said:

The game is changing obviously and all these CBs who are versatile, makes them better players, but not neccessary better defenders. 

A CB should still first and foremost be good tackler and tactician to position well. Passing, shooting comes second.

And IMO those you mentioned Ramos and Hummels are the same example I was making. Very good CBs, but still questionable in defending. However media sees them as world class because they can pass and score. I find it funny. Hummels is incredibly slow and Ramos has to be one of more overrated defenders because his every second challenge results in faul. His timing is way off and his agression is too high. 

Litteraly the same thing with Luiz, but he is getting stick for a while now. Is he such great CB to be worth 40m? Never. But he is good allround player who happens to be a defender. 

Football loves this generation of versatile players, but I still think a CB should be first and foremost good defender. 

A prime Vidic would always find a place in my team, while I doubt I would place someone like Hummels or Ramos even if they were rated higher because of their versatility.

Its all great when CB can defend brilliantly and on top of that, passes well too. But when media talks of someone like Ramos as world class defender because he scores alot and makes top passes, but has number of flaws in defending, thats beyond me.

Luiz for example is good footballer for a defender, but average defender for footballer on this level.

Only world class CBs out there today are Boateng, Godin, Barzagli and Chiellini. Maybe Silva and Bonucci. Then come the likes of Hummels, Ramos, Pique, etc who replace the defensive flaws with brilliant footwork.

Perhaps Kante needs to work on his shooting if he is to be our b2b, but as long he makes good tackles and supplies forwards, there is nothing else I would demand from him to consider him top midfielder.

It depends on the style of play you'd want to see. If you want to involve as many players as possible in attack, you'd better go with ball playing lads at the back. If you want to have more defensive stability similar to Leicester last season, you'd choose a different type of player, as simple as that.

Isn't a tackling the last resort? 'If I have to make a tackle then I have already made a mistake' (according to Maldini). Still remember how we tried to hold the lines in training, that was fun.

The current generation of ballers is a bit overrated compared to the likes of Maldini, but for me Pique is up there with Godin. Hummels had inujury problems and tends to make a mistake (has regressed over the last years), i agree with you. I have rarely seen Ramos make a mistake in a big game when it was still open. Sure he tried too hard against some minnows, but when the going gets tough, he leads by example. Nowadays i rate him highly. All of them have in common that they have some sort of positional sense which Luiz has been lacking, he needs to be consoled for most of the time, imo.

Maybe despite playing for a different side, this Bailly lad will get your attention. He's strong (reminds me a bit of the aformentioned Vidic) and when it comes to playing it out from the back he's solid, traits of JT. No bullshit.

Personally i appreciate a defender who knows what to do with the ball at his feet.

[BlueLyon 9,359]

2 hours ago, Essien19 said:

It depends on the style of play you'd want to see. If you want to involve as many players as possible in attack, you'd better go with ball playing lads at the back. If you want to have more defensive stability similar to Leicester last season, you'd choose a different type of player, as simple as that.

Isn't a tackling the last resort? 'If I have to make a tackle then I have already made a mistake' (according to Maldini). Still remember how we tried to hold the lines in training, that was fun.

The current generation of ballers is a bit overrated compared to the likes of Maldini, but for me Pique is up there with Godin. Hummels had inujury problems and tends to make a mistake (has regressed over the last years), i agree with you. I have rarely seen Ramos make a mistake in a big game when it was still open. Sure he tried too hard against some minnows, but when the going gets tough, he leads by example. Nowadays i rate him highly. All of them have in common that they have some sort of positional sense which Luiz has been lacking, he needs to be consoled for most of the time, imo.

Maybe despite playing for a different side, this Bailly lad will get your attention. He's strong (reminds me a bit of the aformentioned Vidic) and when it comes to playing it out from the back he's solid, traits of JT. No bullshit.

Personally i appreciate a defender who knows what to do with the ball at his feet.

Bailly is good yes. Realy fast and no nonsense player. 

Ramos did improve alot, but to me he is still suspect in defense. He is brilliant leader and character, no doubt, but when I watch him, he always makes late challenges, and better players take advantage of it. 

Ramos is widely regarded best CB in Real, but truth is Pepe was by far more reliable past few years when it comes to defending IMO. He had, like Ramos, agression issues, but since Carlo he was ever reliable and underrated.

Its good to have a CB who knows what to do with the ball indeed, I always hate it when they just hoof the ball away. But they should not be rated how they pass, but how good they defend.

[Essien19 1,415]

24 minutes ago, BlueLyon said:

Bailly is good yes. Realy fast and no nonsense player. 

Ramos did improve alot, but to me he is still suspect in defense. He is brilliant leader and character, no doubt, but when I watch him, he always makes late challenges, and better players take advantage of it. 

Ramos is widely regarded best CB in Real, but truth is Pepe was by far more reliable past few years when it comes to defending IMO. He had, like Ramos, agression issues, but since Carlo he was ever reliable and underrated.

Its good to have a CB who knows what to do with the ball indeed, I always hate it when they just hoof the ball away. But they should not be rated how they pass, but how good they defend.

It's amazing that if you're physically gifted you can bail yourself out a lot of times, just take a look at that 'highly' rated lad of Arsenal's 'Bellerin'. Pace has become so much more important for defenders, but you can still compensate (a bit) with brain, this United lad Blind would be my prime example these days.

Anyway, sure that Pepe on his day is a top notch defender. I remember Mourinho more or less binning him in favor of Varane. With Ancelotti there came a change of dymanics and Pepe got back into the starting lineup and showed what he's made of. I didn't watch many 90 min. matches of Real Madrid in the league, but i kept hearing from a lot of people that back in the day Pepe was their top dog in defence. I can only say that when the stakes were high, i for one found Ramos almost always convincing, but that doesn't take away what Pepe did, he never let his team down. His problem is that he's still paying for losing his cool against Getafe in 2009. Again, in the Euros he was very important for Portugal.

What i want to say is that it's all fair and square to have one defender like Pepe in your team, but having someone who can do something with the ball has become more important, imo. Looking forward to seeing more from the partnership Boateng and Hummels. Normally you see a partnership of Stones & Otamendi, Pepe & Ramos, Pique & Mascherano: meaning one ball playing defender and one pure defender.

What i disagree with is that personally i include the attacking potential in my assessment of a defender. These days, the benchmark of an attacker is also based on his tracking back. Fair's fair, i guess.

[blueblood22 50]

On 10/15/2016 at 7:22 PM, blueblood22 said:

i think that costa was angry on conte that he shouted to him to pass the ball to the right (chalobah) and he passed to the left to hazard, after that costa shouted if you don't like what i do you can sub me, and because conte is smart and didn't want to make a drama he didn't get michy inside,but if costa wouldn't do all this story michy had played, because you saw RLC was not suit to play there and the formation looked very odd. hope michy have patience.

i'm the only one that think like that? because i saw an article today about the accident in the match between costa and conte and they are saying the same, that costa couldn't stand the criticism from conte any more.