Radamel Falcao

[CHOULO19 24,332]

1. You rarly seen him creating his own goals? you havent seen him enough.

2. That sentence with Drogba playing LB at Camp Nou.... what? thats realy isnt something to think about when you're buying a striker.

3. Any decent striker would have won us the CWC, but thats it? winning CWC means something? we should have a striker who is good enough to win us the CL, the leauge, not just a striker who is "Better than Torres". Because Torres is so awful alot of you just want to change him for anyone, for January its ok, but in the longer term we should get someone in the highest level because thats the team we want to be.

My post was was an answer to another post on specific points, you kind of took it out of context.

First, yes Falcao rarely creates his own goals. How often have you seen him receive the ball with his back to the goal and manage to turn and score? Or cut out the ball from the defender and go on to score? Falcao is a poacher, he thrives on his teammates' cervice, on crosses and through ball. There is nothing wrong with that, it's just the way he plays.

Second, my reference to Drogba at Camp Nou was in reply to the claim that Falcao is a big game player like Didier. My point was that Radamel still has a long way to go to be as much a big game player as Drogba was because what Drogba offered to the team in big matches was much more than just goals. In big matches Drogba raised his performance in attack, leadership, defense and much more that he even played at LB at Camp Nou.

Third, I said that any decent striker would have won us the CWC because the post I replied to was stating that Falcao would have won is the CWC.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Why doesn't he suit our style? We need someone who stretches the play by playing on the last man. We need a guy who can run the channels and finish chances. That is Falcao. He also seems available and willing to come, as well as being particularly admired by the guy who our owner wants as our manager in six months time.

Majority of teams won't be playing a high line in order for Falcao to be on the last man all the time. We're transforming into a possession based side - teams will sit deep against us. It'll be harder to find Falcao in the box where he is most lethal.

We don't want him to run the channels and stretch play - that's not what he's best at at all. Everyone knows Falcao is the most lethal in the box and the way our team is being set up at the moment (unless we're going to transition into hitting the ball early to our striker, which I doubt - personally I think that it's just a temporary thing to accommodate Torres) I think we could do with a striker who is great at bringing others into play whilst also being a threat in the box himself.

[The only place to be 11,313]

My point was that Radamel still has a long way to go to be as much a big game player as Drogba

He's not played in as many big games. But in the Europa League at Porto, he scored the winner in the Final. For Madrid, he scored TWO in the final of the same competition and in the Super Cup he scored THREE.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Majority of teams won't be playing a high line in order for Falcao to be on the last man all the time. We're transforming into a possession based side - teams will sit deep against us. It'll be harder to find Falcao in the box where he is most lethal.

We don't want him to run the channels and stretch play - that's not what he's best at at all. Everyone knows Falcao is the most lethal in the box and the way our team is being set up at the moment (unless we're going to transition into hitting the ball early to our striker, which I doubt - personally I think that it's just a temporary thing to accommodate Torres) I think we could do with a striker who is great at bringing others into play whilst also being a threat in the box himself.

Well that first point makes no sense - there's always a least man no matter where the line is. What he does is stop defenders from being able to step up which creates more space in midfield.

There are also channels to be run even if you dominate possession. Look how many chances we've created from wide where Torres simply isn't in the right spot. He actually managed to do it against Sunderland for his first goal but that was the exception rather than the norm. If we had a guy who did that in every game, we'd be in a much stronger position.

Look at Barcelona - they dominate possession yet this is how Messi scores goals

His most common ‘method’ of scoring is to take possession within the 18-yard box, either by running onto a through ball, or by finding space to collect another type of pass or pounce onto a rebound. Of the 234 goals, 145 were scored this way, or 61.97 per cent. These 145 goals include all his 12 headed goals.

That's what we need.

[nadavTKL 1,787]

How often have you seen him receive the ball with his back to the goal and manage to turn and score? Or cut out the ball from the defender and go on to score? Falcao is a poacher, he thrives on his teammates' cervice, on crosses and through ball. There is nothing wrong with that, it's just the way he plays.

A lot. You dont realy know him and you havent seen him enough, thats what i think. He's not just a poacher who waits for crosses and through balls, thats realy ridiculous for me to read. Seems like you built a profile for him but it realy doesnt suits the reality. Everyone who saw him regulary for the past 3-4 seasons will tell you that Falcao is a phenomenon, give him the ball in the box/a bit outside the box/on counter, and there is a very good chance he will score or at least test the keeper. Making him a poacher like Inzhagi or Gomez is just so foolish.

[The Skipper 20,593]

Well that first point makes no sense - there's always a least man no matter where the line is. What he does is stop defenders from being able to step up which creates more space in midfield.

There are also channels to be run even if you dominate possession. Look how many chances we've created from wide where Torres simply isn't in the right spot. He actually managed to do it against Sunderland for his first goal but that was the exception rather than the norm. If we had a guy who did that in every game, we'd be in a much stronger position.

Look at Barcelona - they dominate possession yet this is how Messi scores goals

His most common method of scoring is to take possession within the 18-yard box, either by running onto a through ball, or by finding space to collect another type of pass or pounce onto a rebound. Of the 234 goals, 145 were scored this way, or 61.97 per cent. These 145 goals include all his 12 headed goals.

That's what we need.

What I'm trying to say in my first point is that it won't matter whether Falcao stays on his last man when a team plays deep against us - simply because he will rarely have space to run into. Of course there's more to Falcao than that so he will definitely score goals, but I think that the overall impact another striker in the mould of a Cavani, Ibra or RVP (basically strikers who are excellent outside the box) would be more justifiable than just having a striker who's main attribute is being a predator in the box.

Again, from what I have seen from Falcao, he isn't really the sort of striker that runs into channels IMO. The Messi analogy is interesting but I don't think it's relevant to Falcao's case either - Falcao isn't the sort of player who can take the ball from deep and breeze past players like Messi does. Barcelona style of play also includes loads of intricate passes and through balls so its natural Messi will score from those positions - Falcao's case is different though as he (usually) clearly thrives on being fed the ball in or near the box, not like Messi who can take the ball from anywhere, drive to the 18 yard box and score. You can't compare Messi + Barcelona to anyone.

What CHOULO and I are trying to say is that even though Falcao would score goals for us as he is a great player, but someone like Cavani could have a greater impact on the team.

I certainly wouldn't be disappointed if we signed Falcao but I'd be happier if we got Cavani.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

Did you know that Dider scored more than 16 goals only in 2 seasons during his 8 years at Chelsea? and I'm not talking about PL goals, I'm talkin about the goals in all competitions combined. Thats right, in the other 6 seasons he never scored more than 16 goals.

I expect Falcao, if he comes here, to have slightly better figures than Drogba. BUT What Didier brought to the team is much much more than just goals. Falcao only brings goals. I would take a young Drogba over 3 Falcaos any day of the week.

No one is thinking that only Falcao is the right man, but you are suggesting that the squad is so good to create chances, that only a decent striker better than Torres would do the job. Sturridge was also considered this decent striker we needed, but when he played as CF he was a shit as Torres if not worst.

Well, you dont think EL finals are big games, but how can Falcao be scoring goals and winning big matches when he never played in UCL? And yes, as said before, only a retard would buy a striker thinking about how good he would play as a CB or as LB.

So we have to buy a cheap striker, because a cheap and decent striker is good enough for Chelsea.

Well, a team full of young players with no balls and a "cheap" striker up front. New Arsenal or what?

I think one area that we are NOT suffering in is chance creation. When did Sturridge get his chance at CF? Last season at Wigan (where btw he did score our only goal of the match)? Or against Manu in the Capital One Cup with Piazon and Bertrand behind him (again he managed to score and should probably have had a hat-trick with slightly better finishing)? But that is not the point I was making, the point is: Is the goal difference between Falcao and a 15-20m Striker like Lewandowiski or Llorente worth the extra 30-35m? To me the answer is no.

I never said EL final is not important, just that it comes no where near what Drogba does in finals. I'm not saying that Falcao can't do it in the UCL, but rather that he has not done it yet. And the part about Drogba playing at LB was completely taken out of context as I explained to Nada above.

Finally, since when is 15-20m cheap?! 20m is still expensive but reasonal price to pay for a good striker. 50m is just naive.

[Hutcho 8,443]

I expect Falcao, if he comes here, to have slightly better figures than Drogba. BUT What Didier brought to the team is much much more than just goals. Falcao only brings goals. I would take a young Drogba over 3 Falcaos any day of the week.

I think one area that we are NOT suffering in is chance creation. When did Sturridge get his chance at CF? Last season at Wigan (where btw he did score our only goal of the match)? Or against Manu in the Capital One Cup with Piazon and Bertrand behind him (again he managed to score and should probably have had a hat-trick with slightly better finishing)? But that is not the point I was making, the point is: Is the goal difference between Falcao and a 15-20m Striker like Lewandowiski or Llorente worth the extra 30-35m? To me the answer is no.

I never said EL final is not important, just that it comes no where near what Drogba does in finals. I'm not saying that Falcao can't do it in the UCL, but rather that he has not done it yet. And the part about Drogba playing at LB was completely taken out of context as I explained to Nada above.

Finally, since when is 15-20m cheap?! 20m is still expensive but reasonal price to pay for a good striker. 50m is just naive.

No its realistic... You won't buy a striker with falcaos record and goalscoring talent for much less. How much do you think cavani would cost. I guarentee it would be over 40. Especailly if we were trying to buy him.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I expect Falcao, if he comes here, to have slightly better figures than Drogba. BUT What Didier brought to the team is much much more than just goals. Falcao only brings goals. I would take a young Drogba over 3 Falcaos any day of the week.

I think one area that we are NOT suffering in is chance creation. When did Sturridge get his chance at CF? Last season at Wigan (where btw he did score our only goal of the match)? Or against Manu in the Capital One Cup with Piazon and Bertrand behind him (again he managed to score and should probably have had a hat-trick with slightly better finishing)? But that is not the point I was making, the point is: Is the goal difference between Falcao and a 15-20m Striker like Lewandowiski or Llorente worth the extra 30-35m? To me the answer is no.

I never said EL final is not important, just that it comes no where near what Drogba does in finals. I'm not saying that Falcao can't do it in the UCL, but rather that he has not done it yet. And the part about Drogba playing at LB was completely taken out of context as I explained to Nada above.

Finally, since when is 15-20m cheap?! 20m is still expensive but reasonal price to pay for a good striker. 50m is just naive.

And which £20 million striker can we sign in January? :banghead:

And strikers who 'just score goals' actually don't just score goals. They are a constant threat that defences have to mind which keeps them honest and creates space for players in behind.

And Sturridge also had a chance against West Brom. In fact he had two great chances to score and fluffed his lines. Top strikers can't do that I'm afraid.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

A lot. You dont realy know him and you havent seen him enough, thats what i think. He's not just a poacher who waits for crosses and through balls, thats realy ridiculous for me to read. Seems like you built a profile for him but it realy doesnt suits the reality. Everyone who saw him regulary for the past 3-4 seasons will tell you that Falcao is a phenomenon, give him the ball in the box/a bit outside the box/on counter, and there is a very good chance he will score or at least test the keeper. Making him a poacher like Inzhagi or Gomez is just so foolish.

I've watched the vast majority of Radamel's matches at Madrid (mainly to watch Thibaut) and I don't remember any goal where he cut out the ball and went on to score. give me some examples and i will go watch the goals, although statistics seem to back my claim because he only has 0.1 interceptions per game this season.

What does Falcao being a poacher have anything to do with whether or not he is a "phenomenon"? It's not an insult if someone is a poacher. Falcao is the best poacher striker in the world right now and that is saying something.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

No its realistic... You won't buy a striker with falcaos record and goalscoring talent for much less. How much do you think cavani would cost. I guarentee it would be over 40. Especailly if we were trying to buy him.

My answer is this brilliant post by @laura90, :

Didier Drogba. That is 50 mil striker.

- you don't buy pure goal scorer for that money unless you really have no other option. Because they are not worth that much. Top all around strikers are, however, worth that much. Drogba scored bunch of goals, especially in the finals. But he was also excellent all around player, able to defend, assist, motivate, make the right moves, keep defenders busy, carry whole team on his back when things got tough. Even when he didn't score, he was often very usefull and contributed massively. And that makes striker worth 50 mil

- even though we have perfect attacking midfielders able to supply any striker (especially Falcao), they are still talented players who will improve at some point. When they do, they will try to score as well, not only to assist. Meaning, despite our creators, we are not going to play around striker, like they did in Porto and Atletico for Falcao. He will have to adapt his game in the team that doesn't play to his strenghts and completely around him. We have too much quality in the attack for any striker to enjoy that kind of luxury.

- I know it sounds strange, but being striker in Chelsea is hard. Partly because of price tag, and partly because of press who just wait opportunity to crucify you. That is why I have an impression we need striker with strong mentality, whose self - confidence comes from his capabilities rather than his past achievments (ok. preferably both). I really fear those strikers who are called greatest for long time, because in tough times ( potential crisis) that doesn't make them stronger, rather more vulnerable.

- I'm sure there is a striker who complements and fits our game perfectly that doesn't cost that much, but it would be too much for our board to find him. In that case, Falcao makes sense, even though i prefer Cavani. I would also splash much cash on a central/defensive midfielder able to retain ball properly, because it's central midfield where we have been outplayed against strong teams, especially in CL.

[The only place to be 11,313]

Oh, now I get Choulo's point.

We need to buy Didier Drogba again. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[Hutcho 8,443]

My answer is this brilliant post by @laura90, :

And how often does a Didier Drogba come along? Not very often. We have to be realistic about what's available... And the fact of the matter is we are desperate for a striker. If we don't bolster our attack we may not make top 4 and that would do more damage to the club than paying a bit more for a player who is undoubtedly quality.

[Hutcho 8,443]

Oh, now I get Choulo's point.

We need to buy Didier Drogba again. :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

Yeah exactly, if that was an option then ok. But the fact is he has gone and we won't be buying him back so matter how much value dider possessed it has no impact on our future purchases.

[CHOULO19 24,332]

And which £20 million striker can we sign in January?

The ones I mention in a reply to your post a few mins ago.

And strikers who 'just score goals' actually don't just score goals. They are a constant threat that defences have to mind which keeps them honest and creates space for players in behind.

Yes but some strikers are capable in addition to that of hold-up and link-up play as well as assisting (regularly) and defending and Falcao is not. And just so no one quotes this post and takes it out of context I am merely replying to your post, this is NOT why I don't want us to get Falcao.

And Sturridge also had a chance against West Brom. In fact he had two great chances to score and fluffed his lines. Top strikers can't do that I'm afraid.

The striker who had played next to no football in the previous 6-7 months missed a couple of chances? Hardly shocking. But the point is he got those chances by making runs and movements that any decent striker does and that, with the likes of Mata and Hazard behind you is enough to get you goals here. But I don't want to move the Sturridge discussion here, we are going off topic.

I feel we are now arguing just for the sake of arguing. We keep going in circles and repeating the same things over.

[The only place to be 11,313]

I feel we are now arguing just for the sake of arguing. We keep going in circles and repeating the same things over.

To be honest, I'm not entirely sure what point you're trying to make. You say we shouldn't buy him because there are better options (like a 2004 vintage Drogba) and Falcao 'just scores goals'. I think we should sign him because he's the best option available in January and he 'just score goals'.

We don't need someone who does other things because the team we're trying to be doesn't need what we had 8 years ago. People need to stop living in the past and look at what we're trying to build and who we're trying to get to build it. Look at our reserves and youths to see the type of team we're looking to be - that requires someone more like Falcao than Drogba.

[xPetrCechx 13,563]

We will not buy drogba....

[CHOULO19 24,332]

And how often does a Didier Drogba come along? Not very often.

True, and that is how often we should pay 50m for one player.

And the fact of the matter is we are desperate for a striker. If we don't bolster our attack we may not make top 4 and that would do more damage to the club than paying a bit more for a player who is undoubtedly quality.

Yesterday EUFA banned Malaga from all European competitions for breaking FFP rules, so paying 50m might keeps us out of Europe as well.